mineoro experiments (pdc205-pdc210)

[Morgan]

Originally Posted by digital logic

Dear morgan,
Please don't forget the vlf activity.
Please you must try to fint a vlf receiver with s-meter and do the tests when the signals are stronger.
We waiting for news.

Hello

This test will be for me the final prove about Mineoro LRL devices.
I promise to tell only the true about Mineoro performace on this gold field.
I hope to find something who change my opinion about LRL...

Best regards

[hung]

Originally Posted by Morgan

Hello

It doesnt matter who i am or where i live.
A clever and sucessfull TH should stay like this...
I was in Brazil not in December 2005.
I´m disapointed with my LRL Mineoro ,because i already make enough tests and my conclusion mineoro is an useless device,anyway next week i will try again mineoro devices, in gold mine,the weather its fantastic,the humidity ok,so its just to make shure about i´m rigth and mineoro wrong.We will see if i find some nuggets or not,with Mineoro...
Each device will be tested ,and signals marked.Each LRL will work 3 times in the same place,to make sure not give randomic signals. In the end i will chek all this spots with my SD2200D.We will see if Hung are rigth or wrong about Mineoro performance to find gold...Some years ago i was there and find some nuggets with my PI MD,i´m sure there are much more...

Regards

Yeah, maybe not in december as this person went there twice, probably on an other date. But I know you are yes.

Also, you are awfully mistaken on this. It's not a matter if I'm wrong or not. There are dozens of Mineoro users who are sucessful and you know that. I personally know several of them and I can provide you email and telephone contact if you ever desire to talk to them. If you haven't suceed so far, is it the detector's fault? For many times I found nothing with Minelab alone during hours of search. Is it the detector's fault?

As it seems you know Alonso, you probably also are aware he found a tiny gold nugget in a mine at the time he was still testing the FG80, at a depth no other regular MD his team had could detect.
I found many gold veins in my last trip to central region of Brazil, even at night time. In fact, finding gold veins in this region is done almost a regular daily basis as the atmosphere is highly ionized and the weather is optimum.
You probably don't know anything about it as you don't live here.

So with all respect, your report will be absolutely useless to me due to the reasons and the users I mentioned above. Maybe useful for people here who do not know the detector. And for these people, if you don't suceed, your negative feedback could probably mean the detector failed alone, but in reality som many variables could have been present, including there was no gold where the detector was used, don't you agree?

This is funny. A friend of mine when wishing to buy a particular garret model, went to a MD forum and when he saw only one negative feedback of a user who still had not had sucess with it yet, he got insecure.
People are like that.

PS. I have absolutely no conection to Mineoro. Be this comercial or financially.
I wish I had tough. It would be a really welcome extra money.
Iit's up to you believe it or not.

[Geo]

Originally Posted by Fred

Hi Geo,

I dont agree completely,
i think if someone advertise and nobody tells it is all lies, any visistor here will think it is true.
It is too easy that way.
Regards,
Fred.

Hi Fred
I Agree with you simply I spoke for the opposite case where we speak and speak for the same subject certain years now.
Finally maybe it is clearly subject of personal perception
Regards

[roberts]

Originally Posted by Fred

Hi Geo,

Originally Posted by Fred

I dont agree completely,
i think if someone advertise and nobody tells it is all lies, any visistor here will think it is true.
It is too easy that way.
Regards,
Fred.

Ehm, Fred, you were'nt here in the past. At the time a i used "RObert" nick. I posted so many posts on that subject. First few posts were calm and polite. Later when i faced rude offends and disrespect from "some" people i started also to give back to them same way. Even more. I "loudmouhted" arround and posted offends,funny pictures and various things...just to bug "then" more and puch them either to stop with nonsences and crap advertisements, either to strart saying more truth here...
And, you know how that ended?
I was banned for good. No more RObert here. After a while i was pushed (by administrator) to accept to act polite here and stop with nonsences. He gave me last chance to come here again (under this nick) and stay as member.
So i accepted.
One thing i cant resent to Carl is the fact that he also fought much against same evil here. Of course on his,more polite and democratic way.
So you now have me (rude,unpolite,undemocratic,dictator) on one side and you can take Carl (polite,pretty democratic,to silent)...We both fought on our own ways against same evil and gained.......nothing! Evil is still here. Even more powerfull than it was. You have Max and Quiaozhi. They have more "scientific" approach when dealing with evil. Yet without succes...
So i gave up. My efforts gave me nothing more than certain antagonism from some mebers here with Carl in front of all of them...I lost at the end.
Best way to deal with THE EVIL is to discregard it and PAY NO ATTENTION on it AT ALL.
Regards!

[Qiaozhi]

Originally Posted by roberts

Ehm, Fred, you were'nt here in the past. At the time a i used "RObert" nick. I posted so many posts on that subject. First few posts were calm and polite. Later when i faced rude offends and disrespect from "some" people i started also to give back to them same way. Even more. I "loudmouhted" arround and posted offends,funny pictures and various things...just to bug "then" more and puch them either to stop with nonsences and crap advertisements, either to strart saying more truth here...
And, you know how that ended?
I was banned for good. No more RObert here. After a while i was pushed (by administrator) to accept to act polite here and stop with nonsences. He gave me last chance to come here again (under this nick) and stay as member.
So i accepted.
One thing i cant resent to Carl is the fact that he also fought much against same evil here. Of course on his,more polite and democratic way.
So you now have me (rude,unpolite,undemocratic,dictator) on one side and you can take Carl (polite,pretty democratic,to silent)...We both fought on our own ways against same evil and gained.......nothing! Evil is still here. Even more powerfull than it was. You have Max and Quiaozhi. They have more "scientific" approach when dealing with evil. Yet without succes...
So i gave up. My efforts gave me nothing more than certain antagonism from some mebers here with Carl in front of all of them...I lost at the end.
Best way to deal with THE EVIL is to discregard it and PAY NO ATTENTION on it AT ALL.
Regards!

Hi Roberts,

I can understand you becoming disillusioned in the battle against evil, but you are not alone. We must continue in our quest to rid the world of this pseudoscientific nonsense. In fact, there are more skeptics here than proponents, so why should it be hard to disagree with these cr*p advertisements. Most of them are an insult to even an idiot's intelligence.
How we are expected to simply accept these outlandish claims about detecting gold from miles away, just beggars belief!
Whenever some nonsense is posted here, we should all respond, otherwise the wallet mining will continue unabated.

[J_Player]

Originally Posted by Roberts

They have more "scientific" approach when dealing with evil. Yet without succes...
So i gave up. My efforts gave me nothing more than certain antagonism from some mebers here with Carl in front of all of them...I lost at the end.
Best way to deal with THE EVIL is to discregard it and PAY NO ATTENTION on it AT ALL.
Regards!

Originally Posted by Qiaozhi

We must continue in our quest to rid the world of this pseudoscientific nonsense. In fact, there are more skeptics here than proponents, so why should it be hard to disagree with these cr*p advertisements. Most of them are an insult to even an idiot's intelligence.

I must disagree to some extent. Any educated tehcnical person with a normal mind can easily see the folly in these fraudulent pseudoscience claims. For the majority of the readers in this forum, The stupid postings of uneducated non-technical pseudoscientists makes for good entertaining reading. How often have we had a good laugh at the likes of hung, when we discovered he made up fake data to try to make it appear that Carl's tests are wrong, while Myron Evans' crackpot theories are correct? How often have we demonstrated that his Mineoro claims were false and made him back-pedal and eat his words? The average educated reader in this forum is capable of determining the difference between made-up fake data, mythical stories of fake testing, and real scientific testing that can be backed up and demonstrated repeatedly. It is my opinion that there is no threat that the belief in stupid science theories contradicting known and proven electronics and physics will ever destroy the progress that has been made by the brilliant scientists of this century.

The fact is we need some stupid ideas that don't work in order to provide a background to contrast brilliant ideas that do work. This is how we determine what is good and what is bad. By having some half-baked crackpots and their diatribe, we can easily compare the relative value of the technologies that excel. This applies not only to crackpot theories, but to the field testing as well. The physical results are the final proof of the pudding.

The only real danger of what you are calling "evil" is that many readers are not technical people and they may believe the rantings of people who try to make it appear they are surrounded by respected physicists and engineers. These readers cannot be blamed if they are deceived by the technical-sounding facade. If they actually believe these pseudoscientists are giving them workable solutions, many may spend large amounts of money they cannot afford to buy expensive apparatus that will not find treasure for them. How many people have you seen post that their expensive LRL does not work, and they wish they never bought it, and can't get their money back? These are the people who are really hurt by the misinformation propagated by a few individuals who make false claims about these expensive contraptions.*

I suspect that for every member who posts a message in this forum, there are maybe 10 non-members reading these posts just to try to learn what works and what does not. These are the people who most need to hear the opinions of the educated electronics and physics scholars who know better than to believe fake testing that never happened, and fake theories that violate the basic laws of physics and electronics.

And this is the reason it is important not to ignore claims that are obviously false, made by people who refuse to back up their claims in a way that can be verified.

Best wishes,
J_P


*Not all LRL proponents make false claims about their apparatus. Most have given very honest field reports. There are only a very few who knowingly exaggerate or lie about their LRL experiences, with emphasis on promoting a particular brand of LRL.

[Fred]

Originally Posted by roberts

Ehm, Fred, you were'nt here in the past. At the time a i used "RObert" nick. I posted so many posts on that subject. First few posts were calm and polite. Later when i faced rude offends and disrespect from "some" people i started also to give back to them same way. Even more. I "loudmouhted" arround and posted offends,funny pictures and various things...just to bug "then" more and puch them either to stop with nonsences and crap advertisements, either to strart saying more truth here...
And, you know how that ended?
I was banned for good. No more RObert here. After a while i was pushed (by administrator) to accept to act polite here and stop with nonsences. He gave me last chance to come here again (under this nick) and stay as member.
So i accepted.
One thing i cant resent to Carl is the fact that he also fought much against same evil here. Of course on his,more polite and democratic way.
So you now have me (rude,unpolite,undemocratic,dictator) on one side and you can take Carl (polite,pretty democratic,to silent)...We both fought on our own ways against same evil and gained.......nothing! Evil is still here. Even more powerfull than it was. You have Max and Quiaozhi. They have more "scientific" approach when dealing with evil. Yet without succes...
So i gave up. My efforts gave me nothing more than certain antagonism from some mebers here with Carl in front of all of them...I lost at the end.
Best way to deal with THE EVIL is to discregard it and PAY NO ATTENTION on it AT ALL.
Regards!

Hi roberts,

As in every conflict, if you use the same (or worse) behaviour than you oponent´s, you become "criticable" too, and loose respect from everybody.

If we have enought tecnhical knowledge not to buy crap,whe can decide to keep quiet and not tell others, but when i see stupid individual wanting to steal money, i do my best to give my opinion about the devices they sell.I respect any indiviudual,i am no one to decide what other should do or not, but i will continue to say the truth about tecnhical facts or phrases or people when i can.
And yes i have read posts from a banned RObert , i wondered why you were so different . Dont you think your posts have more weight now that they are polite?
Best regards,
Fred.

[roberts]

Yes. All 3 of you have good points here. Very true and right.
Very important thing i forget to say is that i really,really have nothing personally against Hung,Dell,Esteban and few others. I swear on this.
But i do have a lot against most of their claims here, a lot!
Just as you noticed, i do beleive that 90% of members here are fullly capable to distinguish between true and false. Yet persistent,resident posting same old nonsences, really can brake man nervs, from time to time. Do they take us for idiots, for real???
After all this is only a forum,based on a good will. Not most important thing in my life. I took it very seriously from the beginning - my mistake.
Regards!

[Qiaozhi]

Originally Posted by roberts

Very important thing i forget to say is that i really,really have nothing personally against Hung,Dell,Esteban and few others. I swear on this.
But i do have a lot against most of their claims here, a lot!

Yes - I agree with this. It is the claims that we disagree with, although (quite often) the LRL proponents do take it as a personal attack. Of course, when someone takes it personally, it usually means they have been caught telling a lie. If I owned an LRL that actually worked, I certainly wouldn't for one minute care what anyone here thought. I'd be too busy finding gold. Even if I was a manufacturer of such a tool, I still wouldn't care, because it's ability to find gold would speak for itself.

Originally Posted by J_Player

I must disagree to some extent.

I'm not quite sure what you mean. Are you saying that we should encourage this pseudoscientific gobbledygook to be posted here, purely for entertainment purposes? I must admit that most of it is very amusing.

[J_Player]

Originally Posted by Qiaozhi

I'm not quite sure what you mean. Are you saying that we should encourage this pseudoscientific gobbledygook to be posted here, purely for entertainment purposes? I must admit that most of it is very amusing.

Of course pseudoscientific gobbledygook is welcome here. This is a forum for anyone in the world to post their ideas -- extraterrestrials too, I believe. Carl's intro post cautions people to be prepared to back up your claims if you make an extraordinary claim in the remote sensing section, so there is no harm in telling "tall tales" and trying to pass them off as reality. There will always be intelligent people who will laugh and challenge the "extraordinary claims". In the end, only the claims that can be backed up by repeatable demonstrations will be believed. The rest of the fake BS will fall into the category of "more amusing idiots playing around".

I don't think we should encourage pseudoscientific gobbledygook, but let's look at it for what it is. It is a fascinating form of entertainment that opens our eyes to how some people cling to superstitions, much as early tribal members believed in the science of witch doctors. Today's version is riddled with pseudoscience rather than potions and tales of evil spirits (with the exception of Sharky's concern for jins who move treasures in the ground). The people who try to pass off pseudoscience as an explanation to convince others to buy expensive junk electronics have been invariably exposed as frauds. If Carl were to ban pseudoscience posts from the forum, then these perpetrators would seek other forums to fool their victims rather than coming here where there are ample educated technicians to debunk their deception. But the biggest reason to allow these idiots to post their diatribe is for the amusement factor sought out by the majority of the readers here.

Best wishes,
J_P

[Qiaozhi]

Originally Posted by J_Player

Of course pseudoscientific gobbledygook is welcome here. This is a forum for anyone in the world to post their ideas -- extraterrestrials too, I believe. Carl's intro post cautions people to be prepared to back up your claims if you make an extraordinary claim in the remote sensing section, so there is no harm in telling "tall tales" and trying to pass them off as reality. There will always be intelligent people who will laugh and challenge the "extraordinary claims". In the end, only the claims that can be backed up by repeatable demonstrations will be believed. The rest of the fake BS will fall into the category of "more amusing idiots playing around".

I don't think we should encourage pseudoscientific gobbledygook, but let's look at it for what it is. It is a fascinating form of entertainment that opens our eyes to how some people cling to superstitions, much as early tribal members believed in the science of witch doctors. Today's version is riddled with pseudoscience rather than potions and tales of evil spirits (with the exception of Sharky's concern for jins who move treasures in the ground). The people who try to pass of pseudoscience as an explanation to convince others to buy expensive junk electronics have been invariably exposed as frauds. If Carl were to ban pseudoscience posts from the forum, then these perpetrators would seek other forums to fool their victims rather than coming here where there are ample educated technicians to debunk their deception. But the biggest reason to allow these idiots to post their diatribe is for the amusement factor sought out by the majority of the readers here.

Best wishes,
J_P

Hi JP,

OK - I see what you're getting at now. Of course, we don't actually want to ban people posting their outlandish theories here, but they do need to be prepared to back up their claims. As I've said before - extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence.

[gold24h]

I have had no experiance with mineoro so i do not know if they work or not.I have tested three other commercial locators and they did not work for me.I truely beleive the equipment that esteban built and uses works,he has given a lot of clues in his posts and i know how to build the first part and i am building it now,the last stage of the electronic circuit i do not know how to build,i know what it is supposed to do but i do not have enough knoledge to build the circuit,maybe some day he will tell how to build the last part.

[putrechigi]

Morgan hello thanks for the contribution they bring to the forum, of course you are not as a person who has been realized that the bales and said he stopped scrivare the discussion that had opened the first ............ ...................

[Morgan]

Originally Posted by digital logic

Initially thanks for invitation.
For mineoro experiments we suggest at first a small modification at the free loop around the electrostatic chamberon the board of the machine.
We have seen in that when you replace the resistor and the capacitors at the ends of the loop with a variable capacitor 10-60 pf the reaction of the machine is sharper.
Using a garage telecontol transmitter tuned around 390 mhz we tune the capacitor until mineoro beeps.
This will help the rf sensitivity of the machine.
We have noted that successful target identification comes when three parameters are pressed.

• VLF activity monitored by a vlf receiver between 20-70 khz must be hi.(not storms or whistles, but radio frequency hi propagation and signals).
• Humidity around 35 % .
• Electrostatic electricity on the atmosphere at max. (Cloudy sky before rain. Some sunny days that electrostatic charges are foul. E.g north wind for some hours and then stops).

At these conditions mineoro always works.
The most important parameter is the vlf background .
Somebody says that: when the atmosphere electricity increases comes simultaneously with vlf better level signals.
We also have connected a large (1000 turns 1m diameter) coil to oscilloscope above the target.
The result was a noisy figure.
When some repeatable sparks were appeared on the screen the mineoro detected the target.

Maybe the concept is as follows:
Around the target is constructed by the years a cold electrostatic foam of plasma.
This normally is neutral. Any cosmic ray or hot neutron or any strong radiation disturbs the balance and produces Coulomb explosion.
The coulomb explosions generates alpha ,beta- (SPARKS) and positrons emissions. The positrons are non-stable and they are transformed in a two-photon emission in very short time.
We have detected small targets at the above conditions .
When the machine stopped detecting We checked the manufacturers
antenna rod .
Seaking the antenna rod above the target the machine products beeps synchronus
to the antenna movements at a distance of ten meters.
Generally in Greece we have low vlf signal levels and the machine works for short periods and for a lot of days it may be dead.
We have tried an additional coil of six turns around the external box of the wood ,no were connected. It increases vlf reception and the distance reaction but it destroys the directional ability of the machine.
We have not found a bigger and deeper target. All targets were small and near the surface (coins and jewellery).
That’s all for moment.

Best regards
Digital logic

Hello

Hello my friend,i´m sorry to disapoint you with mineoro lrl tests near gold mine.
All devices dc2006,2008,fg80,pdc210 give randomic signals in all the tests and never in the same place,only randomic siglals,all cheked with metal detector sd2200d pulse induction.
The pistoldetektor beep two times in the same place and we found gold nugget but only 2m distance 10cm deep.
I would like to present people in this forum with shematic of this device,maybe someone here help me to give more power to this circuit...

Kind regards

[Morgan]

Originally Posted by gold24h

I have had no experiance with mineoro so i do not know if they work or not.I have tested three other commercial locators and they did not work for me.I truely beleive the equipment that esteban built and uses works,he has given a lot of clues in his posts and i know how to build the first part and i am building it now,the last stage of the electronic circuit i do not know how to build,i know what it is supposed to do but i do not have enough knoledge to build the circuit,maybe some day he will tell how to build the last part.

hello

i have the complete shematic of Esteban device. I want to share this with all forum members.
this device works but at short distance...

Kind regards

[Morgan]

Originally Posted by Geo

Morgan, can you give us photo of the LRL??
The Russian detector is LRL or MD. Because 10m for a ring is long distance for MD.

hello
i have a look inside russian device and most of electronic components are painted,and its impossible to have acess to the antenna interior without damage it.With this device its possible to find not less than coin sized objets,so its useless for little nugget hunting.
By the way,this pistoldetektor works ok,we find gold nugget 2m distance 10 cm deep.
only with Esteban permition i will put schematic here...

Kind regards

[gold24h]

Hello Morgan,i would really like to see that schematic,if Esteban does not want you to post it maybee you could send it to my e-mail,i will not post the schematic if esteban does not want it posted.I live about thirty miles from two well documented treasures,one i narrowed down to a one square mile area.If i could find either one of the treasures my dream woud come true.