Seeking desperate solution to impossible problem

[desperate warriorprincess]

Hi

I am not sure whether I am posting in the right section of the forum.

I think my name sums up pretty well why I am on this forum.

I have sought the assistance of "dowsers" to try to locate whether two precious sentimental objects, one thrown out by my brother, a 1974 hardcover diary and the other by my sister, an oil painting on corkboard, c. 1965, both originally belonging to them, are in landfill. Neither of them realised how much I treasured these things and neither have been recently discarded. I know if they were, they are probably not recoverable. I have had "mixed" readings, mostly saying the items are not there, but one weird one from a guy in U.S. claiming one was in one of the landfills marking the map I sent him with an "X", which was really useful and paying $200 at least, for the privilege.

I am a postgraduate trained scientist and no fool, but when science can't help, because these objects have no geophysical signature that would distinguish them from the background, one is prepared to turn to the "dark side" as it were. I could continue consulting dowsers, sending them enlarged maps of the landfills, emailing them google maps of the landfill sites and my brother and sister's residences, as I have done and am currently thinking of restarting, but I could see myself doing this until the day I die frankly, and they could say anything they wanted (most are generous souls who haven't charged me, by the way) because the onus is not on them to prove it to me. This is the case even with a lady who is located in Sydney, where I live, who dowsed the map together with her friend.

I am SO tempted to start dealing with Rangertell, but I have read such bad reviews and I know the science is just pseudoscience. To may to buy this device and not have it work would be to just add insult to injury in my case. I don't have mathematical capability or talent, but I was looking into doing calculations of sorts as a thought experiment. The problem is that the landfill authorities do not give out any information about the size (depth, height, width) of the landfill, the rate of filling, the depth of topsoil applied each day, the location of filling each day, week, year) and I don't even know what other parameters I would need. It would probably require the mathematical resources of sending man to a distant planet and more!

I also know that paper degrades, but I have read that sometimes it doesn't in a "dry" landfill.

Can anyone help please? Yes, I am extremely desperate.

I know this doesn't compare to people who wish to locate beloved missing and dead persons or pets, so I am not insensitive to their plight.

Thank you sincerely for reading.

[J_Player]

Originally Posted by desperate warriorprincess

Hi

I am not sure whether I am posting in the right section of the forum.

I think my name sums up pretty well why I am on this forum.

I have sought the assistance of "dowsers" to try to locate whether two precious sentimental objects, one thrown out by my brother, a 1974 hardcover diary and the other by my sister, an oil painting on corkboard, c. 1965, both originally belonging to them, are in landfill. Neither of them realised how much I treasured these things and neither have been recently discarded. I know if they were, they are probably not recoverable. I have had "mixed" readings, mostly saying the items are not there, but one weird one from a guy in U.S. claiming one was in one of the landfills marking the map I sent him with an "X", which was really useful and paying $200 at least, for the privilege.

I am a postgraduate trained scientist and no fool, but when science can't help, because these objects have no geophysical signature that would distinguish them from the background, one is prepared to turn to the "dark side" as it were. I could continue consulting dowsers, sending them enlarged maps of the landfills, emailing them google maps of the landfill sites and my brother and sister's residences, as I have done and am currently thinking of restarting, but I could see myself doing this until the day I die frankly, and they could say anything they wanted (most are generous souls who haven't charged me, by the way) because the onus is not on them to prove it to me. This is the case even with a lady who is located in Sydney, where I live, who dowsed the map together with her friend.

I am SO tempted to start dealing with Rangertell, but I have read such bad reviews and I know the science is just pseudoscience. To may to buy this device and not have it work would be to just add insult to injury in my case. I don't have mathematical capability or talent, but I was looking into doing calculations of sorts as a thought experiment. The problem is that the landfill authorities do not give out any information about the size (depth, height, width) of the landfill, the rate of filling, the depth of topsoil applied each day, the location of filling each day, week, year) and I don't even know what other parameters I would need. It would probably require the mathematical resources of sending man to a distant planet and more!

I also know that paper degrades, but I have read that sometimes it doesn't in a "dry" landfill.

Can anyone help please? Yes, I am extremely desperate.

I know this doesn't compare to people who wish to locate beloved missing and dead persons or pets, so I am not insensitive to their plight.

Thank you sincerely for reading.

Hi desperate,
As a scientist, you know there is no likely way to recover your lost treasures using real scientific instruments. You have also read the debates between technically trained people and long range locating enthusiasts. I am sure that as a person with scientific training, you know there is no basis to believe you can find your lost treasures using pseudoscience that nobody is willing to demonstrate actually working in front of a group of skeptical witnesses.

But because you have a strong emotional attachment to your lost treasures. You are willing put aside logic in the hope of a miracle. This seems ok to me as long as you are not spending a small fortune to see if you can recover your treasures. The problems come when you need to keep spending money for methods that don't work.

You said you would like to try a Rangertell to find your treasure. Today may be your lucky day. I happen to have a new Rangertell Examiner Deluxe model on loan that you can use for free without cost to locate your lost treasures. I will be happy to let you read the manual so you will know the method to find different materials, and even different colored canvases (or painted cork). I will even assist in locating your treasures. The only thing... I am located in the Los Angeles area. If you are somewhere near, send me a PM and make arrangements to come and get your hands on a new Rangertell Examiner to find your lost treasures.

Keep in mind, nobody who has tried this Examiner has had any luck finding treasure so far. Also, when you put aside the empirical data for Rangertell recovery rates and look at the circuitry inside, you will see there is no educated electronic engineer who believes this circuit does anything useful at all. It doesn't look very hopeful, but maybe you will be the first to make a successful recovery using this Examiner. If so, then I will be sure to take notes on the pertinent information and document the event so we will know more about how it works.

And if it doesn't work, then you will lose nothing.
Send a PM if interested

Best wishes,
J_P

[desperate warriorprincess]

Hi J_P

Thanks for your response, but unfortunately, I am not in L.A., but in Sydney, Australia. I understand you are looking for people willing to disprove the device works, but I am sure there are easier ways of going about that and letting the people who are gullible enough to pay for it know. But I guess people who want miracles don't want to listen to naysayers, right?

I am really looking for people to help me to construct an algorithm. In my spare time, I am combing the literature, but am really lost! I don't even think a crack team of Stanford Superscientists could even solve this one!

Thanks again though for your reply!

[J_Player]

Originally Posted by desperate warriorprincess

Hi J_P

Thanks for your response, but unfortunately, I am not in L.A., but in Sydney, Australia. I understand you are looking for people willing to disprove the device works, but I am sure there are easier ways of going about that and letting the people who are gullible enough to pay for it know. But I guess people who want miracles don't want to listen to naysayers, right?

I am really looking for people to help me to construct an algorithm. In my spare time, I am combing the literature, but am really lost! I don't even think a crack team of Stanford Superscientists could even solve this one!

Thanks again though for your reply!

Hi desperate,
I think you have the wrong understanding of what I am looking for. I am not trying to prove or disprove anything. I am simply looking for people who want to try a Rangertell Examiner to see what kind of results they get. My interest is to build up a database so we can know something about averages. But I am also looking for people who are successful, so we can learn the technique they use. If we can see a successful technique, then maybe we can find a way to help all people find success using an Examiner. It may be possible we can find some common factor from those people who are successful that could be the key to the correct usage of the Examiner and similar locators.

Getting back to your treasure hunt, Most of the locators in this forum are specialized for finding metals, and more often for treasure metals such as gold and silver. Canvas and paper is a less common treasure for which fewer locating devices have been dedicated to.

It would seem the greatest help in locating your treasure items will depend on the research you can do to trace back what happened to them after they were last seen. This could help narrow down the possible limits of where they are located. As far as locating machines you can buy to find them, I can see no commercial locators that state they can find paper or canvas paintings. But there are a few locators sold that people believe will find them even though there is no claim they will work to find anything.

One example is the Dell Winders Omnitron product line, which appears to be dowsing rods connected to electronic signal generators. In some cases there is no electronics involved. http://www.omnitron.net/del_prod.htm When you look at his products on this page, we see he says Archaeologist, Anthropologist, Geologist, Mining Companies, and Treasure Hunters buy his Omnitron products. We also see some great testimonials from two customers who say they find paper money using the X-Scan. But I don't see where Dell Winders (the manufacturer) says his products will find treasure. The only claims I found for finding treasure is where Dell says "The PRO-4 has yet to prove it's merit with a recovery".

This makes me wonder what these people who bought Omnitron products have been doing with them all these years since that page was put up in 2003. You will see there are no claims that any Omnitron product can find treasures, only stories that people used them when they were treasure hunting. Then we read some of these same products that Carl-NC tested and took apart. Carl tells us he acquired the Omnitron products from dissatisfied customers who wanted to sell them at a discount because they don't work.

What to believe? Who knows?
It seems likely most of what I have seen does not work. Or maybe it could work if someone who knows something about these locators that I don't know was to use them. One thing I do know is if a product works, then the seller should be willing to demonstrate it working. If you decide to buy a locator, then why not ask the seller to show you it finding a notebook or painting that you hide, just to make sure it works before you spend your money?

I hear the Rangertell factory is much closer to you than most other manufacturers of long range locators. Maybe you could find someone locally to demonstrate an Examiner working to find a hidden diary or painting before you buy one.

Best wishes,
J_P

[Mike(Mont)]

I would suggest a good dowser might be able to give you the direction of the book. As for you trying to learn to dowse for it yourself, expect several years practice and then you still might not be able to disconnect the emotional connection you have with the items. But it can be done. Now if you want to go to a psychic, well that's probably not going to be as accurate. Then again, some people really can read past events. I know it's hard to comprehend that time is not real. We have been trained to think of it as being linear (in a line) but really time doesn't move. Not only is the past still here, so is the future.

[Qiaozhi]

Originally Posted by desperate warriorprincess

Can anyone help please? Yes, I am extremely desperate.

You have already answered your own question in the thread title:
Seeking desperate solution to impossible problem

As a scientist you should know that logically your items are now lost for ever. Short of laboriously sifting through the landfill by hand you have virtually zero chance of ever locating them. I'm surprised you would even entertain the ridiculous notion of map dowsing. You could get the same results yourself by throwing darts into the map while blindfolded.

[Götz von Berlichingen]

The real Problem is your Attachment to these old, long lost Items.
A Dowser or a LRL willl not be able to help, but a Psychiatrist should do.

[Saturna]

Originally Posted by desperate warriorprincess

Hi

... but one weird one from a guy in U.S. claiming one was in one of the landfills marking the map I sent him with an "X", which was really useful and paying $200 at least, for the privilege.

I am a postgraduate trained scientist and no fool,...

These parts are contradictory.

[fenixdigger]

Don't waste any more time on the LRLs. If one is a working model, it will be on an atomic level and ANYTHING with the same or similar molecular signature will register. A landfill will drive you nuts.

A good map dowser MAY do it. But, I have had them put me right on top of targets with similar properties also.

Good luck

[Jim]

Originally Posted by fenixdigger

Don't waste any more time on the LRLs. If one is a working model, it will be on an atomic level and ANYTHING with the same or similar molecular signature will register. A landfill will drive you nuts.

A good map dowser MAY do it. But, I have had them put me right on top of targets with similar properties also.

Good luck

Ah yes....."swimming in a delusional sea of false ideas"

[fenixdigger]

We can't fault you for that. After all you are a diver

[Jim]

Originally Posted by fenixdigger

We can't fault you for that. After all you are a diver

Alternatively, we can fault you for being a sociopath

[fenixdigger]

Each to their own. We all have our little paths according to Freud. Don't we???

I still recommend Gestalt. I think it will help you, and I would enjoy knowing you were getting it.

[Jim]

Originally Posted by fenixdigger

Each to their own. We all have our little paths according to Freud. Don't we???

I still recommend Gestalt. I think it will help you, and I would enjoy knowing you were getting it.

Yes. I think all of your personality's are on different paths. It appears your sociopaths problems are beyond any help from Freud*.

*Manipulative and Conning - They never recognize the rights of others and see their self-serving behaviors as permissible. They appear to be charming, yet are covertly hostile and domineering, seeing their victim as merely an instrument to be used. They may dominate and humiliate their victims.

[fenixdigger]

*Manipulative and Conning - They never recognize the rights of others and see their self-serving behaviors as permissible. They appear to be charming, yet are covertly hostile and domineering, seeing their victim as merely an instrument to be used. They may dominate and humiliate their victims. [/quote]

I see you took my advice and phoned a friend. Good job

Now maybe you will stop and think of others before you belittle them for having a different view and demanding they fortify their beliefs with poof you won't accept.

My thanks to your friend

[Jim]

Originally Posted by fenixdigger

I see you took my advice and phoned a friend. Good job

Now maybe you will stop and think of others before you belittle them for having a different view and demanding they fortify their beliefs with poof you won't accept.

My thanks to your friend

I've carefully reviewed my posts, and nowhere did I mention "phoned a friend."

I see you are back to being your pathological lair* self

*Pseudologia fantastica, mythomania, or pathological lying is one of several terms applied by psychiatrists to the behavior of habitual or compulsive lying.It was first described in the medical literature in 1891 by Anton Delbrueck. Although it is a controversial topic, one definition of pathological lying is the following: "Pathological lying is falsification entirely disproportionate to any discernible end in view, may be extensive and very complicated, and may manifest over a period of years or even a lifetime."

[fenixdigger]

Yes, you should look at your posts very closely. Remember what Art said about projecting your problems???? Look that one up Jimmy.

Especially the one about over a period of time, like over 10,000 posts on forums.

Believe it or not, I'm trying to help you. It's obvious to everybody but you. Look that one up too.

[Jim]

Originally Posted by fenixdigger

Yes, you should look at your posts very closely. Remember what Art said about projecting your problems???? Look that one up Jimmy.

Especially the one about over a period of time, like over 10,000 posts on forums.

Believe it or not, I'm trying to help you. It's obvious to everybody but you. Look that one up too.

this guy fits the profile of the Sociopath to a tee*

*Shallow Emotions - When they show what seems to be warmth, joy, love and compassion it is more feigned than experienced and serves an ulterior motive. Outraged by insignificant matters, yet remaining unmoved and cold by what would upset a normal person. Since they are not genuine, neither are their promises.

[fenixdigger]

Skipped the real ones did we?

Forgot to mention this one that you really need help on. You have more posts than almost ALL of the administrators put together.

Obsessive behavior.

When someone posts opposing views, you immediately ATTACK them,
obsessive compulsive.

When you put them all together, you really have your hands full.

The first step is to recognize you do have a problem. A LOT of other people on other forums have mentioned this to you many,many times, even first time posters from other countries.

It's for real dude. Sorry

[Jim]

Originally Posted by fenixdigger

Skipped the real ones did we?

Forgot to mention this one that you really need help on. You have more posts than almost ALL of the administrators put together.

Obsessive behavior.

When someone posts opposing views, you immediately ATTACK them,
obsessive compulsive.

When you put them all together, you really have your hands full.

The first step is to recognize you do have a problem. A LOT of other people on other forums have mentioned this to you many,many times, even first time posters from other countries.

It's for real dude. Sorry

There ya have it folks. A internet diagnosis done by someone who believes a pocket calculator can track down precious metals by entering certain keystrokes.

This has been a rather unproductive banter for the OP...however, I am thrilled everybody else got a chuckle at the sociopath

[fenixdigger]

If you would take the advice seriously it would be productive.

[Don Jose de La Mancha]

Goiod evening Desperate: Frankly I doubt that any LRL would help you. While it does lie within their theoretical range of operation, they are not that advanced yet by far.

For your project you would probably have to turn to a competent dowser, That in itself may turn out to be a difficult task since the majority of them have mistaken Shibboleths as fixed as the so sceptics - a self proclaimed scientific group -- have on LRL's.

I suggest for a basic reference that you look up "Henry Gross and his downing discovery of three, fresh water, high producing wells on the Island of Bermuda. This was done after the Royal Hydroligists had confirmed their many years of multi stated theory and studies that fresh water would never be found, a few brackish pools yes , but not a heavy enough, series of free flowing wells that would eventually provide Bermuda with all of her needed water.

This, may I remind you, was done only with a map of Bermuda. He had never set foot on the Island until 'after' he had dowsed the wells.

Dowsing of this class defies conventional thinking, but still remains a 'proven fact' according to the gov't records on Bermuda.

Heck, even Carl has admitted that he can do it to an extent.

Luck Desperate luv, but I would never pay anyone an advance, most good dowsers will not charge you for their service.

Don Jose de La Mancha

[detectoman]

ok my very dear desesperate, may be only hung can help you, he is the imprediscible miracle man lrst whit ready solutions
in count for instance today very dear esteban is separated on these extrange things
not problem only await to majors winds , embraces lrsts and too all