A Few of the LRLs I've Tested

[Theseus]

Just a very small sample of the many L-rods and LRLs I've tested. (Not counting probably 50 different pendulums of all varieties) Much of my data was collected and recorded before I had a digital camera, so no pics exist of those, and the data is stored in 3-ring binders.

Not shown here, were E-scopes 201 and 301, 5 different versions of Don Darnell Chemical Rods, 2 models of Carl Anderson rods, a Sam "Lobo" Wolfe rod, a cavity-tuned LRL rod and 4 different prototype LRLs that I cannot name because of the Non-Disclosure Agreement I signed.

Not all testing was specifically to prove or dis-prove "signal lines" but some of it was.

Based on the evidence, I personally collected, and the devices I tested; I can say for sure I found NOTHING to substantiate the claim (by dowsers and LRL users) that "signal lines" exist in the real physical world.

The bulk of my testing was concluded years ago, however, if new "convincing" evidence was presented today, I would certainly be compelled to look at it, and adjust my conclusions --if need be.

Say.... how do you like your crow anyway? With a little salt and pepper, perhaps some BBQ sauce.

[Theseus]

This is the cavity-tuned LRL that I tested some years ago. It was tested under double-blind protocol specifically to determine how the tuning mechanism would influnce the response of this very sensitive swivel-handle type of LRL. The manufacturer was present during the bulk of the testing and agreed to the test environment and the test methodology.

The protocol involved "full-view" testing, followed by double-blind testing, followed by "full-view" testing. Each phase of the test was monitored and data recording was done by a disinterested third party, chosen by the manufacturer and agreed to by myself.

Neither the manufacturer or myself knew the results of any of the tests until after all the tests were completed. A single test consisted of several "trials" wherein the LRL was either operated by the manufacturer or under his direction. Tests were repeated over a span of several hours, in daylight and artificial light, and over a period of three days; thus eliminating as many environmental factors as was thought to be possible.

One claim was; a cavity-tuned LRL established a "signal line" (also called an "energy line") between the chamber of resonance within the LRL and the sought-after target the LRL was tuned to. It was also claimed; the LRL would lock in to the closest viable target, thus eliminating signal lines which may have been present from more distant targets. The manufacturer had a "special" proprietary method for cancelling a signal line once a target was recovered. (I am not at liberty to reveal how that was accomplished)

The results of the tests were pretty much as I expected. In all cases, both the manufacturer and myself were looking for "statistically significant" data to positively support the claims as I iterated above.

The full-view testing was 100% accurate with only one single exception. (In my opinion, the operator merely forgot where he saw the target had been secreted)

The DB testing was statistically the same as if the operator had merely "guessed" at a target location. In other words, using the LRL produced nearly the same correct location idendifications as would be expected from pure guessing. In about 4 of the tests the results were worse than guessing and in 2 of the tests the results were slightly better than guessing. In essence the claims were not validated by the test results.

At least in this one particular instance, and device, there was no observable evidence the device created a "signal line", as was claimed.

It was my understanding the manufacturer was ready to place this device on the market, but wanted some hard data and test results before doing so. To this date, I've never seen an LRL device of this particular design introduced to the consumer market, nor have I seen any devices offered by this particular manufacturer. (Though he may have under some other name I'm not aware of)

You didn't say, Graham.... how do you like your crow? ...well-done, with a touch of hot sauce.... or medium rare with all the feathers!

[Geo]

Hi Theseus.
You make a BIG Mistake.
Lrods are not metal detectors.
You must be a very good dowser so to make a Lrod to work.
And you are not a dowser because you don't believe to it, Or....... you are dowser

[goldfinder]

Since dowsing in primarily a mental/emotional/subconscious phenomenon the a so called double blind test is worthless. The person who hides the target knows where it is even though the next two layers of the double blind don't.

The mind field in worldwide so a dowser who is any good can get the location subconsciously. The real test for dowsing is to find something that no one alive knows where it is as in a long buried treasure or mineral like gold nuggets. That is the real test!
Goldfinder

[Theseus]

Originally Posted by Geo

Hi Theseus.
You make a BIG Mistake.
Lrods are not metal detectors.
You must be a very good dowser so to make a Lrod to work.
And you are not a dowser because you don't believe to it, Or....... you are dowser

You are very wrong!

I never claimed that L-rods were metal detectors, so I'm not sure what your problem is.

Also, I've been told by many other dowsers that one DOES NOT have to "believe" in dowsing for it to work. In fact, most say dowsing is NOT a belief system, that it works because of external forces, yet to be discovered by rational science.

The subject of this thread are examples of LRLs and similar devices I have tested. I'm not the inventor, merely reporting the evidence and results as I personally observed.

That's all.....

[Theseus]

Originally Posted by goldfinder

Since dowsing in primarily a mental/emotional/subconscious phenomenon the a so called double blind test is worthless. The person who hides the target knows where it is even though the next two layers of the double blind don't.

The mind field in worldwide so a dowser who is any good can get the location subconsciously. The real test for dowsing is to find something that no one alive knows where it is as in a long buried treasure or mineral like gold nuggets. That is the real test!
Goldfinder

I respectfully disagree.

If what you are saying were true than dowsers are capable of reading the subconscious minds of people located anywhere else in the world. That would be quite a feat, and I know of NO evidence to suggest such a thing is happening. Can you show any evidence for your claim?

[goldfinder]

Originally Posted by Theseus

I respectfully disagree.

If what you are saying were true than dowsers are capable of reading the subconscious minds of people located anywhere else in the world. That would be quite a feat, and I know of NO evidence to suggest such a thing is happening. Can you show any evidence for your claim?

It all depends on the level of the dowser. Many dowsers do operate pretty much on a subconscious level when they dowse, they let their subconscious guide them. The few really advanced ones I've met realize the dowsing rods are simply a method for them to get a physiological response. The few really advanced ones don't really dowse they can sense directly what they are "tuning" in to.

The subconscious is the same as the emotional body. This is why it is very difficult for dowsers to find a treasure as they are emotionally involve in what they are looking for. To dowse properly, the dowser needs to be totally passive and have absolutely no opinion as to what they are dowsing for.

A clairvoyant, one who sees on the Inner Planes of manifestation, can actually see into the ground, or wherever, or whenever. True clairvoyants are few and far between. Most I have known have no need to interface in such situations.

As to proof to what I say. I have stated elsewhere in this forum I have no need to prove anything to anyone. Having proven these things to myself through many years of study, meditation, and experience it is of no interest to me to prove anything to anyone. I do think that exposure of these ideas is of great benefit to others. And educational forum if you please. You may take them anyway you choose. You could prove it to yourself; however, if you really wanted to. The path to do so would require you to expand considerably beyond your current state.

Onward!
Goldfinder

[Theseus]

Originally Posted by goldfinder

It all depends on the level of the dowser. Many dowsers do operate pretty much on a subconscious level when they dowse, they let their subconscious guide them. The few really advanced ones I've met realize the dowsing rods are simply a method for them to get a physiological response. The few really advanced ones don't really dowse they can sense directly what they are "tuning" in to.

The subconscious is the same as the emotional body. This is why it is very difficult for dowsers to find a treasure as they are emotionally involve in what they are looking for. To dowse properly, the dowser needs to be totally passive and have absolutely no opinion as to what they are dowsing for.

A clairvoyant, one who sees on the Inner Planes of manifestation, can actually see into the ground, or wherever, or whenever. True clairvoyants are few and far between. Most I have known have no need to interface in such situations.

As to proof to what I say. I have stated elsewhere in this forum I have no need to prove anything to anyone. Having proven these things to myself through many years of study, meditation, and experience it is of no interest to me to prove anything to anyone. I do think that exposure of these ideas is of great benefit to others. And educational forum if you please. You may take them anyway you choose. You could prove it to yourself; however, if you really wanted to. The path to do so would require you to expand considerably beyond your current state.

Onward!
Goldfinder

Making claims, such as you have, is all very interesting. Certainly it is your choice to back up your claims with valid evidence, or not. But claims without any sort of evidence whatsoever, must remain in the category of personal opinion.

[Qiaozhi]

Originally Posted by goldfinder

A clairvoyant, one who sees on the Inner Planes of manifestation, can actually see into the ground, or wherever, or whenever. True clairvoyants are few and far between. Most I have known have no need to interface in such situations.

In fact, so few and far between as to be nonexistent.

[Geo]

Originally Posted by Theseus

You are very wrong!

I never claimed that L-rods were metal detectors, so I'm not sure what your problem is.

Also, I've been told by many other dowsers that one DOES NOT have to "believe" in dowsing for it to work. In fact, most say dowsing is NOT a belief system, that it works because of external forces, yet to be discovered by rational science.

The subject of this thread are examples of LRLs and similar devices I have tested. I'm not the inventor, merely reporting the evidence and results as I personally observed.

That's all.....

Hi.
I wrote that Lrods are not metal detectors. I mean that it is not so simple as a metal detector. Any person can work a metal detector but not a Lrod.
LOOK.... i had the same opinion with all you the sceptic here!!!! and i had not the ability to work a Lrod. But, when i saw a Lrod to work and the person "teacher" told me what to do then i found many objects with it. From these time i changed my opinion about dowsing.
But as goldfinder said..."no need to prove anything to anyone". The person that wants to learn how to dowse, finds the suitable person and learn it!!!!

Regards

[Qiaozhi]

Originally Posted by Geo

Hi.
I wrote that Lrods are not metal detectors. I mean that it is not so simple as a metal detector. Any person can work a metal detector but not a Lrod.
LOOK.... i had the same opinion with all you the sceptic here!!!! and i had not the ability to work a Lrod. But, when i saw a Lrod to work and the person "teacher" told me what to do then i found many objects with it. From these time i changed my opinion about dowsing.
But as goldfinder said..."no need to prove anything to anyone". The person that wants to learn how to dowse, finds the suitable person and learn it!!!!

Regards

In that case you should apply to James Randi to prove him wrong and takes his $1M.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rMtuWymUzz4

[Geo]

Originally Posted by Qiaozhi

In that case you should apply to James Randi to prove him wrong and takes his $1M.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rMtuWymUzz4

I was tired to write the same and the same

[Theseus]

Originally Posted by Geo

Hi.
....Any person can work a metal detector but not a Lrod.

Regards

I'm glad you are happy with your dowsing results.

Of course, I would have to wonder just what sort of testing procedures you have tried to establish that your dowsing is "really" working.

It has been my experience that those who are convinced their dowsing "works" for them; have really not subjected it to rigorous controlled testing procedures. This is especially true for those who always employ a MD along with their LRL, or who constantly utilize their dowsing in placer environments and known Gold-producing areas.

[WM6]

Everyone can earn wages, but not everyone can hit the Lotto.

L-rod is only a Lotto, nothing else, with the same (or even worse) results and usually much bigger investment.

[Geo]

Originally Posted by Theseus

I'm glad you are happy with your dowsing results.

Of course, I would have to wonder just what sort of testing procedures you have tried to establish that your dowsing is "really" working.

It has been my experience that those who are convinced their dowsing "works" for them; have really not subjected it to rigorous controlled testing procedures. This is especially true for those who always employ a MD along with their LRL, or who constantly utilize their dowsing in placer environments and known Gold-producing areas.

Hi Theseus.
All are very simple!!!. Better tets are the buried objects that i can find with LRLs, then why to make other tests???.
I don't try to make the other persons believe to LRLs. I am not a lrl constructor or dealer, so i am interested only for myself. When i find a buried coin, i am sure for another time that the dowsing working for me.
Regards

[Geo]

Originally Posted by WM6

Everyone can earn wages, but not everyone can hit the Lotto.

L-rod is only a Lotto, nothing else, with the same (or even worse) results and usually much bigger investment.

.... and with much more gain than other ways because with a metal detector there is not way to find a deep treasure!!!!. So we play Lotto and every time one person gain.
So if you want to gain.... you must play!!!!!!