Action of the Earth in solenoids

[Esteban]

In a French book of Physics (translate to Spanish) by J. Langlebert, doctor in Medicine and professor of Nature Sciences and Physics, of 1911, you can found the action of the Earth in solenoids, page 394. This is, when you connect to the batteries a solenoid wich pivots in a receptacle with mercury (for to stablish well contact), the extremes "watch" one to North and other to South.

The pole wich "watch" to the North is called austral and the pole wich "watch" to the South is called boreal.

Ok, this acts as a compass.

Well, in the same way you can design a system wich can "watch" to desirable target...

I inform about this experiment to Alonso and he rapidly understand the theme. He design a LRL wich consist in a movable electrical pendulum with 5,000 ohms in coil and some other things inside. Once, was found a gold ring at 105 m distance and buried 50 cm depth, approximative. This is an example.

When you are near the target you put on a microvoltmeter based on the internal solenoid of the pendulum and you move the pendulum in the place. The exact point is confirmed when the pendulum move (with his coil, the sensor) a motor and the antenna...

The system also uses a 1,000 V, HV (inside pendulum).

So, is not impossible to build a "divining modern rod".

[hung]

Esteban,

One important factor also is that the metal buried acts as a voltage stream concentrator.

We have surveys that show around 10-¹² volts at location, but when metal is buried, this rises up to 1000000000 volts.
All voltage streams are redirected to the metal.

PS. My friend is being sucessful in replicating your ferrite circuit we discussed. He enhanced it even more, by implementing a spectrometer software program to the detector linked to his laptop.

[Qiaozhi]

Originally Posted by hung

We have surveys that show around 10-¹² volts at location, but when metal is buried, this rises up to 1000000000 volts.
All voltage streams are redirected to the metal.

You are a comedian.

[Fred]

Originally Posted by Qiaozhi

You are a comedian.

...in search for an audience.

Hung , i may be wrong of course, but i think there is just one zero too much.

[Rudy]

Originally Posted by hung

......
We have surveys that show around 10-¹² volts at location, but when metal is buried, this rises up to 1000000000 volts.
All voltage streams are redirected to the metal.
........

From 1 picoVolt to 1 TeraVolt ??? Ha Ha Ha

Hung, you have blown whatever credibility you had left.

[hung]

Originally Posted by Fred

...in search for an audience.

Hung , i may be wrong of course, but i think there is just one zero too much.

Yes Fred. You are correct. I made a mistake. There's one zero too much.

Also it's not volts, it's mho/m! 100,000,000 mho/m. That's what we found.
Ha,ha,ha,ha,ha. I begin to appear like Ozzy with the paper bag in his head above.

In fact, I remember that I came to know once of a scientific study conducted about the dowsing subject where a map of electric condutivity of the region/area where the test was performed was measured. With no metal buried, it was an average of 10-³ mho/m. These values were not enough to make the rods move as there was no significant changes in the electric condutivity.
But when a conductive metal was buried, some large gradient of electric condutivity was estabilished. The current moved towards the mean of higher condutivity. So for a metal of say 1 000 000 mho/m this provided more than 1 billion mho/m of difference, being sufficient to generate a DOP which made the rods move, aligning with the surface as a short in the 'conection'.

[Qiaozhi]

Originally Posted by hung

Yes Fred. You are correct. I made a mistake. There's one zero too much.

Also it's not volts, it's mho/m! 100,000,000 mho/m.

You need to be more careful when you cut and paste other people's words from the internet.
Perhaps your paper bag is blocking the view.

[hung]

Originally Posted by Qiaozhi

You need to be more careful when you cut and paste other people's words from the internet.
Perhaps your paper bag is blocking the view.

There was no cut and paste from our above survey Ozzy, as this phenomenon is even known by Mineoro for a long time.

But you are right. I should be more careful not making dumb mistakes anymore otherwise my posts will be just like your PD schematics, full of errors.
Thanks for pointing that up.

[Fred]

Originally Posted by hung

Also it's not volts, it's mho/m! 100,000,000 mho/m. That's what we found.

What is mho/m ?
Do you mean Mohm/m ? (MΩ/m = 1.000.000.000 mΩ/m, i have found where all your zeros come from )
Was Kafka one of you parents?

[hung]

Originally Posted by Fred

What is mho/m ?
Do you mean Mohm/m ? (MΩ/m = 1.000.000.000 mΩ/m, i have found where all your zeros come from )
Was Kafka one of you parents?

No Fred, it's a conductivity unit.
I thought Siemens and wrote voltage. But mistaking conductivity for resistance... ouch.

[hipopp]

Hung, the sniping on this site re the LRL's is very entertaining. I was outside just before doing some gardening and I had a think about all this stuff about dowsing...are all the sceptics here admitting that dowsing is an accepted phenomena? Are thay saying that i can use my mindpower to twist a long aerial? This is unbelievable for a scientific forum!!! How many people on this site believe in this mind over matter???can we have some reponses please??

[Qiaozhi]

Originally Posted by hipopp

Hung, the sniping on this site re the LRL's is very entertaining. I was outside just before doing some gardening and I had a think about all this stuff about dowsing...are all the sceptics here admitting that dowsing is an accepted phenomena? Are thay saying that i can use my mindpower to twist a long aerial? This is unbelievable for a scientific forum!!! How many people on this site believe in this mind over matter???can we have some reponses please??

Dowsing is a "trick of the mind". People who believe in dowsing are being self-deluded, because the act of dowsing can be quite compelling.

I suggest that you look at this website to learn the ugly truth ->
http://sites.google.com/site/dowsingtruth/

[Fred]

Originally Posted by hung

No Fred, it's a conductivity unit.
I thought Siemens and wrote voltage. But mistaking conductivity for resistance... ouch.

Hung,
Why are you using a conductivity unit (siemens) in air , wich is one of the best isolator, instead of resistivity ?
That´s strange...i could not think of air as a conductor

[hung]

Originally Posted by Qiaozhi

Dowsing is a "trick of the mind". People who believe in dowsing are being self-deluded, because the act of dowsing can be quite compelling.

See Hipopp? This is one example of the 'pearls' the 'I wannabe scientist' stunts fire once in a while about subjects they completely ignore.

Excuse the inconvenience.

[hung]

Originally Posted by Fred

Hung,
Why are you using a conductivity unit (siemens) in air , wich is one of the best isolator, instead of resistivity ?
That´s strange...i could not think of air as a conductor

The measurment was not done in air. It was done in the ground.
The vector current (I) was used as conductivity for electric field intensity. Affected also by tellurics, when a metal is buried, the streams run towards the metal, increasing the flow of electric current, hence the difference in value.
For a resistive object, it flows around it.

[Qiaozhi]

Originally Posted by hung

The measurment was not done in air. It was done in the ground.
The vector current (I) was used as conductivity for electric field intensity. Affected also by tellurics, when a metal is buried, the streams run towards the metal, increasing the flow of electric current, hence the difference in value.
For a resistive object, it flows around it.

More gobbledygook by pseudo-scientist Hung.
Fantasy land physics combined with do-nothing electronics = wallet mining.

[Fred]

Originally Posted by Qiaozhi

More gobbledygook by pseudo-scientist Hung.
Fantasy land physics combined with do-nothing electronics = wallet mining.

Really those explanations don´t make any sense

[Qiaozhi]

Originally Posted by Fred

Really those explanations don´t make any sense

Exactly...

[Morgan]

Originally Posted by Qiaozhi

Dowsing is a "trick of the mind". People who believe in dowsing are being self-deluded, because the act of dowsing can be quite compelling.

I suggest that you look at this website to learn the ugly truth ->
http://sites.google.com/site/dowsingtruth/

Search with Dowsing Rod´s can be deception or sometimes one treasure or valuable coins can be found with this instruments,its allways impossible to say if it works 100%. Anyway i found and saw other people finding many interesting coins&jewelry with Rod´s...
One normal Dowsing Rod follow your intuition and if correct can be your lucky day I respect Dowsing,I understand why many people use Dowsing Rod´s in TH.

[Fred]

Actually this is interesting , dowsing rods could be a way for your mind to express itself, kind of a translator, so logical (real world) clues about a possible treasure location could be expressed.
That would also explain why one needs practice, the more you dig empty holes the more you learn where to dig to avoid digging empty holes .
And also explain a more than average rate of success on real terrain, but zero on planted targets, where such clues don´t exist.

Lets get back to real (electronic) detectors

[Steve in MS]

That has to be a metaphysical side to dowsing and whether it works or not,
is not my concern. I simply don't believe in it and don't think I could get it to work for me.
There seems to be a definition problem with LRLs, that is the kind that has a mechanical part. The makers of them claim they are not dowsing rods while some skeptics believe all these devises are dowsing rods.
Here's where I have a problem with these mechanical types, if they don't have a power supply, what causes the movement?
Can these supposed movements be subjected to repeated tests with the same results?
All this about the human body being the power supply has its roots in dowsing, plain and simple, there is no way around it.
Now meta-physics and para-normal activity cannot be subjected to scientific testing since it is out of the boundaries of the physical universe.
Now are mechanical LRLs dowsers or not?
Lets take a poll.

[J_Player]

Originally Posted by Steve in MS

Here's where I have a problem with these mechanical types, if they don't have a power supply, what causes the movement?
Can these supposed movements be subjected to repeated tests with the same results?

According to most skeptics, movement is caused by ideamotor response, ie: muscles cause the rod to move depending on an idea in the user's head which may be conscious or subconscious. But according to LRL proponents, some little-known principles of science cause the LRL to move.

Little-know principles of science that cause LRLs to point to treasure:
1. Carrier signal lines that are shot and returned to the LRL
2. Frequencies emanating from a calculator to match the subatomic resonance of metals
2. Frequencies emanating from a circuit to match the subatomic resonance of metals
3. Electricity in the ground
4. Capacitive properties of the user's biological cells
5. Precious metal ions in the ground and in the air near where treasure is
6. Magnetic-electric effects along a signal line
7. Radionics

Many combinations of these little-known principles of science will cause the LRL to move and point to the treasure according to some LRL proponents.
But an interesting question comes to mind: Why is it that the treasure direction is alligned with the axis of the telescoping antenna? Most devices that use telescoping antennas are omnidirectional, and get their best reception when the antenna is turned upward, not pointing in the direction of a transmitting tower. Could it be an advertising gimmck to help make a prospective buyer feel like he has a pistol in his hand that points the direction of the target like a Buck Rogers pistol? Or is the little-known science different than regular science which dictates setting the antenna vertical for correct polarization?

Well, putting aside that curious aspect of the antenna, how can we test to see if these LRLs are different than dowsing? It seems that if the movement is caused by the user's muscles (dowsing), then gravity plays a part in supplying the force to move the device. ie: If the user's hands cause the LRL to tilt so its axis is no longer vertical, then gravity will exert a force that causes the heavy end of the LRL to move to the low side of the axis. So, if we have an LRL that is claimed not to be dowsing, then it will move due to the above little-known proinciples of science, rather than the user's hand tilting the vertical axis of the swivel handle.

Now, this can be easily tested by two different methods:
1. Attach a counterweight on one side of the LRL to balance it, so it does not swivel when its axis is tilted.
2. Attach a circular level vial on the LRL to indicate when the LRL is perfectly level, thus indicating when the operator is holding it in a perfectly vertical axis.

Then test the LRL with a known target that gives a good signal to see if it responds when gravity is not permitted to allow the user's hand to cause it to swivel. While using these test methods, if the LRL stops working then it would seem it is a dowsing device. But if it continues to work even when gravity cannot cause it to swing any direction, then it must be working by a little-known principle of science.

Best wishes,
J_P

[Steve in MS]

Ah, but J, remember inertia of movement and inertia of rest would come into play also while walking around with a mechanical LRL.
I understand you would like to conduct a test to eliminate gravity, balance and such but we can't even confirm a find with these LRLs.
Conventional detectors can be proven to be effective with a simply test in the front yard, heck, just throw something out there and it will beep when the coil passes over it.
Even pinpointing with an LRL...I have read many times about the user having problems zeroing in on a signal, doesn't it stand to reason the signal will get stronger the nearer he approaches?......that doesn't make sense to me, is the target a mile in this direction or the other, since I can't pinpoint?
Even the old forked stick dowsers use to find water, don't they point directly over the water hole?
LRLs can't be subjected to any kind of reason or logic it seems.......
Hmmm, guess this makes me one of those skeptics....
Believe that they work against all logic or reason.......
Now that is a hard sell .
What power do these LRLs have over their owners?

[Qiaozhi]

Originally Posted by Fred

Actually this is interesting , dowsing rods could be a way for your mind to express itself, kind of a translator, so logical (real world) clues about a possible treasure location could be expressed.
That would also explain why one needs practice, the more you dig empty holes the more you learn where to dig to avoid digging empty holes .
And also explain a more than average rate of success on real terrain, but zero on planted targets, where such clues don´t exist.

Lets get back to real (electronic) detectors

I think Fred has hit the nail on the head.

A dowsing rod is simply the equivalent of an executive decision maker. When you're out with your trusty metal detector (you know, the one with some real electronics inside, and not the fantasy-land stuff) the problem is where to start searching. No problem, use an LRL or dowsing contraption to make the decision for you. Like the executive decision maker, it's only guesswork, but at least you've made a decision.

Of course, the dowsing / LRL contraption has one advantage over the executive decision maker, as the user's unconscious mind can "control" it via the ideomotor effect. So, in this way, clues in the landscape, hidden desires, etc., will influence the decision. In this way the result may be slightly better than guessing when used in the field, simply due human intervention. But it's still guessing.

[Theseus]

Originally Posted by J_Player

According to most skeptics, movement is caused by ideamotor response, ie: muscles cause the rod to move depending on an idea in the user's head which may be conscious or subconscious. But according to LRL proponents, some little-known principles of science cause the LRL to move.

Little-know principles of science that cause LRLs to point to treasure:
1. Carrier signal lines that are shot and returned to the LRL
2. Frequencies emanating from a calculator to match the subatomic resonance of metals
2. Frequencies emanating from a circuit to match the subatomic resonance of metals
3. Electricity in the ground
4. Capacitive properties of the user's biological cells
5. Precious metal ions in the ground and in the air near where treasure is
6. Magnetic-electric effects along a signal line
7. Radionics

Many combinations of these little-known principles of science will cause the LRL to move and point to the treasure according to some LRL proponents.
But an interesting question comes to mind: Why is it that the treasure direction is alligned with the axis of the telescoping antenna? Most devices that use telescoping antennas are omnidirectional, and get their best reception when the antenna is turned upward, not pointing in the direction of a transmitting tower. Could it be an advertising gimmck to help make a prospective buyer feel like he has a pistol in his hand that points the direction of the target like a Buck Rogers pistol? Or is the little-known science different than regular science which dictates setting the antenna vertical for correct polarization?

Well, putting aside that curious aspect of the antenna, how can we test to see if these LRLs are different than dowsing? It seems that if the movement is caused by the user's muscles (dowsing), then gravity plays a part in supplying the force to move the device. ie: If the user's hands cause the LRL to tilt so its axis is no longer vertical, then gravity will exert a force that causes the heavy end of the LRL to move to the low side of the axis. So, if we have an LRL that is claimed not to be dowsing, then it will move due to the above little-known proinciples of science, rather than the user's hand tilting the vertical axis of the swivel handle.

Now, this can be easily tested by two different methods:
1. Attach a counterweight on one side of the LRL to balance it, so it does not swivel when its axis is tilted.
2. Attach a circular level vial on the LRL to indicate when the LRL is perfectly level, thus indicating when the operator is holding it in a perfectly vertical axis.

Then test the LRL with a known target that gives a good signal to see if it responds when gravity is not permitted to allow the user's hand to cause it to swivel. While using these test methods, if the LRL stops working then it would seem it is a dowsing device. But if it continues to work even when gravity cannot cause it to swing any direction, then it must be working by a little-known principle of science.

Best wishes,
J_P

Speaking of tests and testing commercial LRLs.... what's the latest progress, or news, of the RT Examiner test that you are supposed to be a witness to? Anything going on towards bringing that little episode to fruition?