Simple but brilliant LRL

[Infamy]

Originally Posted by WM6

Hi infamy

I dont understand you. Are you PRO or CONS LRL?

Short answer, you have a problem if that is a serious question.

Those that pedal LRL should be fitted with concrete boots and dumped in the gulf of Mexico. Alternatively they could be ramped into that leaking oil pipe out there and help to save what little natural environment there is in the USA.

[Funfinder]

Originally Posted by Geo

Hi.
Outside of my Lab i have a refrigerator.
When the "motor-compresor" works, i locate the wire from 3m far. If it don't work i locate it from 20...30 cm. This is electromagnetic field and not electrostatic. As antenna i use a round coil 20cm diameter.

Highvoltage AC creates a very fast changing electrostatic field so we can detect those power lines from a far distance, but usually static means stable and the term is used for highvoltage DC current fields.

Yesterday I made a test outside - a small and light plastic-bag could be detected with the 20cm plate at around 30-50cm distance.

Geo, please can you put some ca. 30 to 40cm light plastic bag outside somewhere in the grass (without specially charging it before by rubbing somewhere!) and test from what distance you can detect it?

Because first we have to find out if the electrostatic is useable as LRL at all and how sensitive our detector has to be. Perhaps we also have to use much larger or better antennas!

[fenixdigger]

This is a little off the hook ,but it may be what is needed.
If you cut a spiral into a flat sheet of plastic, you can stretch it into a cone shape. The material will bend to form a type of parabolic concentrator. This shape has been used to make solar collectors, directional antennas for both transmitting and receiving signals. The further the stretch the more concentrated and the narrower the area it can scan. May be cool to try an adjustable one to get it tuned to the application. LT

[Geo]

Originally Posted by Funfinder

Highvoltage AC creates a very fast changing electrostatic field so we can detect those power lines from a far distance, but usually static means stable and the term is used for highvoltage DC current fields.

Yesterday I made a test outside - a small and light plastic-bag could be detected with the 20cm plate at around 30-50cm distance.

Geo, please can you put some ca. 30 to 40cm light plastic bag outside somewhere in the grass (without specially charging it before by rubbing somewhere!) and test from what distance you can detect it?

Because first we have to find out if the electrostatic is useable as LRL at all and how sensitive our detector has to be. Perhaps we also have to use much larger or better antennas!

I will try it today or tomorrow.
With who version of your detector you locate the static of the bug??? with the 3130 or with fet???
I have some coins buried 20years ago. If my electrostatic detector will not detect the bug then i will construct your detector and i will try it at the place with the coins.

[Funfinder]

@ fenixdigger
thx for the good idea. It is just the question how many antennas we have to incorporate into the final one detector. We could use some parabolic reflector as electrostatic antenna and the coils or ferrites in front are for the metal.



@ Geo
I have the FET version - it has a better audio-signal throughput. btw. that bag was from the greek restaurant, and it is very lightweight.

Yesterday I built the antenna you can see below with a size around 40cm, but it has only around 30% gain concerning the distance compared with the 20cm diameter one.

I think the easiest and most lightweight solution would be simply to stick some sheets of alu-foil onto a stable cardboard that has a size of ca. 1m. Connecting this in my case with a cinch (RCA) plug I would have the best portable and even foldable solution (as long as it isn't windy outside! )

btw. The very lightweigh alu-pipe-circle has around the same gain as the 38x22cm sat-receiver case-cover.

It detects the 1,5m long 220v electricity cable (2 wires unshielded) of a hanging lamp from ca. 1meter. If I switch on the variable capacitor and turn it to fully 180 pF I can reduce the distance to just 15cm (as it would be without any antenna).

But yet it's more important getting better sensitivity.

[fenixdigger]

I've seen mylar glued to plastic with spray adhesive after the spiral was cut for solar. the transmit /receive ones were alum. sheet.

What if you wrapped copper wire around a cone, then wrap the wire with something w/ adhesive to hold it in place, and then put it inside the cone?

That would seem to restrict the input to a narrow area but still give a lot of surface to receive signals just like the spiral. LT

[WM6]

Originally Posted by Funfinder

But yet it's more important getting better sensitivity.

Very nice construction Funfinder indeed. Like small Large Hadron Collider.

Try rotating to 13.7 degree nach Ost.

[goldfinder]

Originally Posted by Funfinder

Highvoltage AC creates a very fast changing electrostatic field so we can detect those power lines from a far distance, but usually static means stable and the term is used for highvoltage DC current fields.

Yesterday I made a test outside - a small and light plastic-bag could be detected with the 20cm plate at around 30-50cm distance.

Geo, please can you put some ca. 30 to 40cm light plastic bag outside somewhere in the grass (without specially charging it before by rubbing somewhere!) and test from what distance you can detect it?

Because first we have to find out if the electrostatic is useable as LRL at all and how sensitive our detector has to be. Perhaps we also have to use much larger or better antennas!

Funfinder,
You are going thru what I researched many years ago. The thing to have the detector "look" for are ions. Ions have a specific electromagnetic radiation pattern when they discharge. If the LRL circuitry is set up to look for that pattern then you will have something.

Electrostatic by itself is a waste of time. I stated this in a previous note herein.

Goldfinder

[fenixdigger]

Isn't this back to OKM's units? I hear some people swear by them and others swear at them. After all the non treasure I have dug (a mountain) compared to the treasure (a small bucket) due to misfires with mfds and the associated variables, It makes sense to me that the ions would the way to go.
Very good point Goldfinder.

[J_Player]

Originally Posted by goldfinder

Funfinder,
You are going thru what I researched many years ago. The thing to have the detector "look" for are ions. Ions have a specific electromagnetic radiation pattern when they discharge. If the LRL circuitry is set up to look for that pattern then you will have something.

Electrostatic by itself is a waste of time. I stated this in a previous note herein.

Goldfinder

Wasting time can be a good teacher of deeper truths and wisdom for some people.
Besides, this antenna can be used as a toroid top-load on a Tesla coil if it fails to work for locating treasure.

Best wishes,
J_P

[goldfinder]

Originally Posted by J_Player

Wasting time can be a good teacher of deeper truths and wisdom for some people.
Besides, this antenna can be used as a toroid top-load on a Tesla coil if it fails to work for locating treasure.

Best wishes,
J_P

Many paths to top but view from top is same!

[Geo]

Yesterday i tried my electrostatic lrl to detect the static of a plastic bug WITHOUT results. After it i went to the place where i have mercury burried and i tried the lrl again. I took some random signals near to the mercury but i am not sure if they are from it. One of the next days i will try again with other lrls. Also i will try to make the detector of funfinder so to see if it detects the mercury or some coins burried before 20 years.

[nelson]

Hi Funfinder.
Can you please post the frequencie of this divice.
May be i can help with my expirence on modeling and constructing antennas.
Regards
Nelson

Originally Posted by Funfinder

@ fenixdigger
thx for the good idea. It is just the question how many antennas we have to incorporate into the final one detector. We could use some parabolic reflector as electrostatic antenna and the coils or ferrites in front are for the metal.



@ Geo
I have the FET version - it has a better audio-signal throughput. btw. that bag was from the greek restaurant, and it is very lightweight.

Yesterday I built the antenna you can see below with a size around 40cm, but it has only around 30% gain concerning the distance compared with the 20cm diameter one.

I think the easiest and most lightweight solution would be simply to stick some sheets of alu-foil onto a stable cardboard that has a size of ca. 1m. Connecting this in my case with a cinch (RCA) plug I would have the best portable and even foldable solution (as long as it isn't windy outside! )

btw. The very lightweigh alu-pipe-circle has around the same gain as the 38x22cm sat-receiver case-cover.

It detects the 1,5m long 220v electricity cable (2 wires unshielded) of a hanging lamp from ca. 1meter. If I switch on the variable capacitor and turn it to fully 180 pF I can reduce the distance to just 15cm (as it would be without any antenna).

But yet it's more important getting better sensitivity.

[Funfinder]

@nelson
The frequency depends on the Hertz of the nearby higher voltage AC-current and is audible in the whole spectrum for human ears.

If there is no strong AC voltage field, it has only switch on or off.

To make this device much more sensitive I'll try to find a way to inject some threshold power into the antenna (FET Gate) so it just would take a very small plus of energy to make the FET switch on (or even off, if kept in balance between on or off).


@ goldfinder
Yes, the ion patterns will be the next big project, but still I think even with electrostatic you can detect metallic distortions in the EM-field because I tested this already with that silver ring. In this case was the metal between strong current field and static-detector; but the natural field has some special current - so the detection is more difficult, and especially variable by the ground conditions.

[Funfinder]

There should be a way to calculate the detectable electrostatic distance:

variables:
s=sensitivity of JFET or MOSFET integrated circuit
e=size of electrostatic detectors antenna
c=transmitter object size (lenght of power line etc.)
v=voltage
a=ampere
h=humidity in air
i=irritaton (ground, sun, ionosphere etc.)
b=blockades (mineralized stones, trees, soil etc.)

[WM6]

Originally Posted by Funfinder

There should be a way to calculate the detectable electrostatic distance:

variables:
s=sensitivity of JFET or MOSFET integrated circuit
e=size of electrostatic detectors antenna
c=transmitter object size (lenght of power line etc.)
v=voltage
a=ampere
h=humidity in air
i=irritaton (ground, sun, ionosphere etc.)
b=blockades (mineralized stones, trees, soil etc.)

L=LRL users bias (conscious or unconscious)

[nelson]

Ok Funfinder, i got the idea, so i will sum to the friends who are building and testing this divice, to allow me to share expiriencies.
Regards
Nelson

Originally Posted by Funfinder

@nelson
The frequency depends on the Hertz of the nearby higher voltage AC-current and is audible in the whole spectrum for human ears.

If there is no strong AC voltage field, it has only switch on or off.

To make this device much more sensitive I'll try to find a way to inject some threshold power into the antenna (FET Gate) so it just would take a very small plus of energy to make the FET switch on (or even off, if kept in balance between on or off).


@ goldfinder
Yes, the ion patterns will be the next big project, but still I think even with electrostatic you can detect metallic distortions in the EM-field because I tested this already with that silver ring. In this case was the metal between strong current field and static-detector; but the natural field has some special current - so the detection is more difficult, and especially variable by the ground conditions.

[Funfinder]

@ Geo
Thank you for your test. You also can rub a plastic ruler somewhere to get a pure electrostatic field.


@ nelson
The best would be you construct it on a still changeable test-basis if we will find further improvements.


@ all

There is two diferent sistems in working LRL devices :

1- The ABSORBTIVE -it absorbs the electromagnetic fields produced by LTA buried metals. It is scientific information that every buried metal(hig conductive) generates an anomaly in the electric and magnetic field of the Earth,iron not produce because its magnetic material,imagine the planet is one gigantic magneto.This diference we can detect with absorbtive Pistoldetektor device.

2-The Ionic/Electrostatic-it detects the electric field of the Earth,it measure and detect the anomalies produced by LTA buried metals generated in the eletric and magnetic field of the Earth.Some people say there is some negative ions or stactic charges around LTA buried metals,this is associated with the phenomena.

Afaik Esteban wrote this - the 2nd point concerns electrostatic.
So is somebody here with some lta buried object in garden who can test it with a electrostatic-detector?


btw. if the FET recognises electrostatic only from higher voltages would it be a good idea using a transformer coil like used for kV in TV units?

Usually transformers only work with AC but maybe for only switching the FET on or off also a DC current field could be transformed (0.1V into 100V - transformation factor 1000). Do Tesla coils have such a high factor?

The final construction would consist in a large plate or magnet-coil antenna (I guess the "around the PCB antenna" of Mineoro also is magnet-coil style) that is connected to the transformer coil for getting higher better recognisable voltages - finally attached to the JFET or MOSFET.

If we have the experimental proof there really is an usable electrostatic potential with LTA treasures we can perfectionate that kind of detector, otherwise we have to switch to the next one.

[detectoman]

caution funfinder, not came you fried your babys whit these
cuidado funfinder no vaya usted a freir sus ninos con eso
de perdido ponga alambrada de puas

[detectoman]

f.f, cual es la utilidad de ese complejo? solo visual? wowwwwwwww may be flyes electrocutation

[WM6]

Originally Posted by Funfinder

.... otherwise we have to switch to the next one.

yes, would be better to switch to next one ...

[Funfinder]

Instead just making comments like some others here now I build a nice large antenna, using the both top-covers of two old DVD-players.

The size is about 47x50cm and for transportation just 25x50cm. Weight incl. detector ca. 1kg.


It's crazy - it already recognises if I move my fingers while holding and beeing near some electricity-cable!
Those now get detected from 1,5m.

And if I'm leaving the detector there it recognises when I'm coming near from around 50cm distance.

I'm curious what outside tests will show.

[WM6]

Originally Posted by Funfinder

now I build a nice large antenna, using the both top-covers of two old DVD-players.

Dr Best send you compliments on this smart antenna. Me too.


Please dont destroy all kitchen appliances!

[J_Player]

Originally Posted by WM6

Dr Best send you compliments on this smart antenna. Me too.


Please dont destroy all kitchen appliances!

I remember Dr. Best got excellent results locating gold with his advanced pyramidal logarithmic quadro spiral antenna, using carbon litz technology.
But of course, his detectors were not simple static field detectors. They depended on ion migration.

In this application, it is easy to see that success for detecting static charge is improved by the size and shape of the detecting element. The formulas for a static field strength are well known for different sizes and shapes of conductors. For a 2 dimensional plane, size matters. The bigger, the better.

Scavenging parts from electronic enclosures or appliances to make a large antenna element will quickly reach a point where no further improvement can be made due to limited size of available appliances. For truly improved results I would suggest that you remove the roof of a car. This will make a large dished antenna element guaranteed to outperform any electronic enclosure or kitchen appliance parts for detecting static charges.

Best wishes,
J_P

[Qiaozhi]

Originally Posted by Funfinder

Instead just making comments like some others here now I build a nice large antenna, using the both top-covers of two old DVD-players.

The size is about 47x50cm and for transportation just 25x50cm. Weight incl. detector ca. 1kg.


It's crazy - it already recognises if I move my fingers while holding and beeing near some electricity-cable!
Those now get detected from 1,5m.

And if I'm leaving the detector there it recognises when I'm coming near from around 50cm distance.

I'm curious what outside tests will show.

I've heard that this type of construction is called "steampunk".
.
.