VARIATION OF MORGAN'S PISTOL

[Esteban]

Originally Posted by Fred

Hi Robert,
All info about ferrite is in the "...492 feet" thread.
Anyway by adjusting the gap you can slightly change permeablility, thus
frequency.Maybe you could get them in antiphase and obtain a perfect null?

Robert, i cannot understand you: in precedent messages you told us making an antenna for VLF would take thousands of meters of wire, now you give the recipe to make one , and more, a good one ,small enough for our purpose ???
Regards,
Fred.

Of course, you tune at 455 or 500 Khz with light and few wire and some picofarads... Tune is a thing, wave length is another thing. With his philosophy, you will need tons of wire for to tune at 12 Khz a metal detector...

[roberts]

Both of you;
just as i didnt read "492..." thread, since a most of the posts there are to anoying, same was with you - you didnt read carefully my posts.
Either you didnt cared to read and understand my posts, either i didnt sayed it on proper way. It is to anoying now, me to list all the pages and look for some sentences. Also it is anoying me to explain here about "electrical" and material lenght of an antenna. Why should i explain here this? What should be my motif?? Whatever i do, jokes like esteban will always come here to negate my claims without proper reading at all and without elementar understanding of anything i could say here. I suggested to some people to return to learn basics, didnt i?
So if you want to accept my hint - fine. If you dont - fine also.
With that gap..how you just explained...nothing will be adjusted - NOTHING.
Totall nonsence! Frequency...????? WHAT A NONSENCE !?!?!?
Only ignorants like esteban can come here a say such huge nonsence!!!

[Fred]

Originally Posted by roberts

Both of you;
just as i didnt read "492..." thread, since a most of the posts there are to anoying, same was with you - you didnt read carefully my posts.
Either you didnt cared to read and understand my posts, either i didnt sayed it on proper way. It is to anoying now, me to list all the pages and look for some sentences. Also it is anoying me to explain here about "electrical" and material lenght of an antenna. Why should i explain here this? What should be my motif?? Whatever i do, jokes like esteban will always come here to negate my claims without proper reading at all and without elementar understanding of anything i could say here. I suggested to some people to return to learn basics, didnt i?
So if you want to accept my hint - fine. If you dont - fine also.
With that gap..how you just explained...nothing will be adjusted - NOTHING.
Totall nonsence! Frequency...????? WHAT A NONSENCE !?!?!?
Only ignorants like esteban can come here a say such huge nonsence!!!

Robert,you are again going back to your bad habits.
Just forget Esteban post if you are smart enought, you both are just doing that from the beginning.This is not constructive.You should be both used to it by now
About the ferrite stuff, no i didnt understand why you talked about thouthands of meters of wire,anyway it is not so important, as i posted there i already know an antena can be buit for any frequency with any size.
(You should be abe to accept critics, this is a signal of intelligence )

And coming back to our circuit , yes if you change gap you will slightly change permeability and consequently frequency of oscillation.
Now, if by doing this you can achieve a good nulling i am not sure .YOU should be able to tell.
Hope you will keep going with the circuit interpretation.
Regards,
Fred.

[Fred]

Not exactly RS related , but an interesting document about diferent tecnhologies and much more:
http://www.itep.ws/pdf/metal_detector_handbook.pdf
(3Mb)
Regards,
Fred.

[michael]

Hi ,
Thanks a lot Fred for the link, I was looking for this so much. You made a favor man.

[roberts]

Listen, some things are not to be generalized, the way usually laics do. And i ment mostly on Esteban's way. Now, this time i am serious, i do not mean to provoke Esteban with this or to say he is ignorant. This time i am very serious and like to point on usuall Esteban's generalization and simplification of some things, he probably saw or heared somewhere or loearned on wrong way.
Ok Esteban, you also, if you want to be constructive than do not feel offended with this, you simply can not generalize all the things here.
If you saw somewhere in some radio an RF choke with ferrite core screwable and it was used to fine redjust some frequency - this doesnt mean EVERY possible ferrite core have same function. No, not at all. RF chokes with ferrite screw inside usually do have simillar function, mostly to adjust small coil to be resonant on some incoming/outgoing signal. Best example would be TOKO type cores for AM/FM etc.etc. Yes in these cases man can usually adjust some frequency with those.
But using plain ferrite rod as sort of antenna with resonant coil wounded over it is quite another case. Moving core more in/out of windings doesnt automatically mean you gonna readjust some frequency. Mostly it means adjusting level of induction - amplitude of induced current.
So i would rather say; if that gap makes any sence than its role should be to adjust amplitude of induced (in this case received) signal from nearby coil. Is it nearby? I really dont know? I havent seen orientations yet. But logically i am presuming ferrite rod must be in some logical conjuction with other coils?
Otherwise i really do not understand rod's role at all here?
So let;s say i guessed right; operater can adjust amplitude by dealing with gap. Ok.

[roberts]

About wavelengths, antennas...etc.etc..
Theoretically antena with zero lost is antena with ideal Q factor. Antena with ideal Q factor is usually fulllenght antena. (Now i am generalizing here but ,when talking to laics man have to become laic).
So if you want 100% efficient antena you better use full lenght antena. Not possible in these purposes. So logically Esteban is right, in this purpose antena must be much shorter than physical wavelength.
Taking any turns for any frequency will result in catastrofic reception. So some rule must be respected.
If you remeber i suggested 455kHz receiver design earlier!? Do you?
You know why? Just because i wanted to make your (and my) life much less complicated in future when design step in practical phase. Instead discovering "hot water", i would further sugest just ordinary ferrite rod antena taken form some scraped radio....simple as that.
But no...my suggestion was never accepted properly, just cose same reasons as here...smart asses usually do not read and try to understand but usually listen only own voice and read own words...others...who cares??
You must understand me, it is damn hard for me to be at same level of thinking with you (again i am not trying to offend). But those are elementar and real basics....you have to learn at least that to be able to understand further things...Without that elementary knowledge you are wasting my time here (reffered to Esteban mostly).

[Esteban]

Originally Posted by roberts

About wavelengths, antennas...etc.etc..
Theoretically antena with zero lost is antena with ideal Q factor. Antena with ideal Q factor is usually fulllenght antena. (Now i am generalizing here but ,when talking to laics man have to become laic).
So if you want 100% efficient antena you better use full lenght antena. Not possible in these purposes. So logically Esteban is right, in this purpose antena must be much shorter than physical wavelength.
Taking any turns for any frequency will result in catastrofic reception. So some rule must be respected.
If you remeber i suggested 455kHz receiver design earlier!? Do you?
You know why? Just because i wanted to make your (and my) life much less complicated in future when design step in practical phase. Instead discovering "hot water", i would further sugest just ordinary ferrite rod antena taken form some scraped radio....simple as that.
But no...my suggestion was never accepted properly, just cose same reasons as here...smart asses usually do not read and try to understand but usually listen only own voice and read own words...others...who cares??
You must understand me, it is damn hard for me to be at same level of thinking with you (again i am not trying to offend). But those are elementar and real basics....you have to learn at least that to be able to understand further things...Without that elementary knowledge you are wasting my time here (reffered to Esteban mostly).

Thanks professor!!! I'll follow your advices!!!

[Fred]

Robert,
You think you are so smarter than everybody that you stopped learning long time ago .But evolution continues around you,carefull or you will become a fossile.
Don´t be offended, it´s a frienldy advice.
And it´s the last one, it´s so hard to pull me up to your level to write to you that i´m definitevely exhausted already.

Fred.

[roberts]

Originally Posted by Fred

Robert,

Originally Posted by Fred

You think you are so smarter than everybody that you stopped learning long time ago .But evolution continues around you,carefull or you will become a fossile.
Don´t be offended, it´s a frienldy advice.
And it´s the last one, it´s so hard to pull me up to your level to write to you that i´m definitevely exhausted already.

Fred.

Oooh! Does it look like i am???
Of course i dont think i am smarter than everybody!!!! Of course i am NOT!
I do radio for living, therefore i do expect to know more than ordinary electronic enthusiast. Other hand i dont know much about other electronics.
I stopped learning....well yes, you are almost right here. Not because i learned all, but because my everyday routine left not time for learning new things oftenly. Besides....after 20-30 years i feel a bit tired of all.
You exhausted...??? From what?
But you are not exhausted from wathching funny photos here and reading funny, lunatic claims, about detecting item at "492 feet..." coin at 8 to 40 meters....what was else??? Help me? I cant even remeber all the nonsences posted here!?
Am i tired of "fighting" here with lrl proponents evryday? No i am not! It is a sort of hobby for me! Habbit! Everyday routine also!Amusing! Adiction!



Think what ever you want to think. How can i stop you doing that? No way!
Arguing with Esteban here is relaxing hobby for me. Thanks a lot Esteban, for giving me such a pleasure!

So,so....finally all masks droped! Ego is point here! Not real knowledge! Ha!
I have to admit - am a bit disapointed..

[Fred]

Hi Robert,

You take everything too seriously!
Can´t you see when i am ironical ? come on, ego thing?
I have the knowledge that i have and you have yours.I wish i could know more,everytime a want to learn more.the more i learn the less i seem to know.When i don´t know something i have no shame in asking or else i will never learn more...born in 61,you´re older than i am
We should go back to the ferrite circuit: BTW, there is no oscillator there, did you notice ?
Yes, i´m ironical again.that´s me...
regards!,
Fred.

[roberts]

Originally Posted by Fred

Hi Robert,

You take everything too seriously!
Can´t you see when i am ironical ? come on, ego thing?
I have the knowledge that i have and you have yours.I wish i could know more,everytime a want to learn more.the more i learn the less i seem to know.When i don´t know something i have no shame in asking or else i will never learn more...born in 61,you´re older than i am
We should go back to the ferrite circuit: BTW, there is no oscillator there, did you notice ?
Yes, i´m ironical again.that´s me...
regards!,
Fred.

Because it is used as "back-up" receiver or direct reciver ( as i named it earlier). It's role is to "sniff" some signal and comutate it with rx part of coil.
Again assuming.

Yes i am older, '65 !!! Do i look older?
I am tired for sure! All my life i've being doing something, without a rest. That's maybe why you got impression i was much older..?!
At age 43, i think is time , me to take long holliday from this things! Money is saved...so Hawai, here i go!
Chicks wait for me!
Oooh! I shouldnt say my real age! Esteban will torture me even harder, knowing that i am much younger than he is!

[Fred]

Originally Posted by roberts

Chicks wait for me!

Go for it! And bring pictures back

Originally Posted by roberts

Oooh! I shouldnt say my real age!

Yeah, right


Fred.

[J_Player]

Originally Posted by Roberts

At age 43, i think is time , me to take long holliday from this things! Money is saved...so Hawai, here i go!

Hawaii ? ... You spend your holiday in Hawaii when you could go to Brazil south of Rio to visit the Mineoro factory? There's millions of hot chicks in the world, but there's only one Mineoro factory. Just think, you could meet the Mineoro factory workers and they will give you a live demonstration of the Mineoro LRL finding treasure right in front of your eyes! You can take photos to see them dig up the treasure, you can even hold the shovel in your hand! This is a once in a lifetime opportunity. If you make an appointment in advance, maybe even Damasio and Alonso will meet you to show you their finest treasure machines.

When you are done for the day counting your treasure and polishing your gold statues, they have fantastic food there. And the hot chicks at the Brazil beaches are the most beautiful in the world. Just be careful avoid Copacabana beach unless you're prepared.

You really sure you want to go to Hawaii?

Best wishes,
J_P

[Max]

Originally Posted by roberts

Agree. But to know that, we must first analyze it properly. First things comes first.
Ok, diodes here bugging me a lot! Are you sure on their right orientation?
It is quite obvious why gremanium diodes must be used here. I would suggest AA119 here.
But their present orientation are confusing me!
Are you sure on this?

Hi Robert,
why do you think is wrong ? To me seems ok.

Of course, I'm not sure of original components markings... if for example the color band is anode instead of catode (sometime happens with old stuff) but seems to me just a common voltage doubler there.

If you use AA119 you sure will find them still today and about easy in some shops...and are about the same stuff... the 1N60 is really obsolete thing now (maybe from year 1950 ?).

Anyway... let me know your thoughts about.

Kind regards,
Max

[Max]

Originally Posted by Fred

Nice work ! keep going!

Yes you are right about diodes.
Anyway this ferrite circuit seems to be disconnected when the detector is in normal operation.but there is many doubts about the switch connection.
regards,
Fred.

Hi Fred,
also you think that diodes must be reversed ? Why ?

If you reverse them you'll get same effect with 180° turn on phase at transistor base.

Am I wrong?

Kind regards,
Max

[Fred]

Originally Posted by Max

Hi Fred,
also you think that diodes must be reversed ? Why ?Max

Hi,
Maybe i made some confusion about Robert diagrams, i didn´t verified and assumed the right side one is the corrected one.
I cannot think straight lately
regards,
Fred.

[Max]

Originally Posted by roberts

Because it is used as "back-up" receiver or direct reciver ( as i named it earlier). It's role is to "sniff" some signal and comutate it with rx part of coil.
Again assuming.

Yes i am older, '65 !!! Do i look older?
I am tired for sure! All my life i've being doing something, without a rest. That's maybe why you got impression i was much older..?!
At age 43, i think is time , me to take long holliday from this things! Money is saved...so Hawai, here i go!
Chicks wait for me!
Oooh! I shouldnt say my real age! Esteban will torture me even harder, knowing that i am much younger than he is!

That's why I'll never write here my real age !
Maybe the age of 1N60 diodes there... is double or more my actual age!

But what's really important is "menthal" age: I know of people of 18years that seems already boiled by age like old elctrolitic capacitors (but actually cause of other stuff... like abuse of PS2/PS3 and other things ) and of someone 65/68years old still really smart and fast thinking ! Lifestyle can give incredibly different results on this.

Kind regards,
Max

[Max]

Originally Posted by J_Player

Hawaii ? ... You spend your holiday in Hawaii when you could go to Brazil south of Rio to visit the Mineoro factory? There's millions of hot chicks in the world, but there's only one Mineoro factory. Just think, you could meet the Mineoro factory workers and they will give you a live demonstration of the Mineoro LRL finding treasure right in front of your eyes! You can take photos to see them dig up the treasure, you can even hold the shovel in your hand! This is a once in a lifetime opportunity. If you make an appointment in advance, maybe even Damasio and Alonso will meet you to show you their finest treasure machines.

When you are done for the day counting your treasure and polishing your gold statues, they have fantastic food there. And the hot chicks at the Brazil beaches are the most beautiful in the world. Just be careful avoid Copacabana beach unless you're prepared.

You really sure you want to go to Hawaii?

Best wishes,
J_P

Hi,
Prepared ? Means you need an RPG inside your truck before go there?

I think he just need some tons of condoms there...

but problem will be at custom declaration... they could think at him as an unauthorized importer...

Ops... this thread seems now a travel guide !

Kind regards,
Max

[Esteban]

Prototype's inside:

[J_Player]

Hi Esteban,
Prototype looks good - real electronics inside. Not like Ranger Tell with 5 non-working components and calculator.

Best wishes,
J_P

[J_Player]

Originally Posted by Max

Prepared ? Means you need an RPG inside your truck before go there?

Hi Max,
Prepared means he must be prepared when visiting Copacabana Beach. The people there will love him.

Best wishes,
J_P

[Max]

Originally Posted by Esteban

Prototype's inside:

Hi,
now voltage is 27volt ? Or the extra battery used for other stuff ?

Best regards,
Max

[Max]

Originally Posted by J_Player

Hi Max,
Prepared means he must be prepared when visiting Copacabana Beach. The people there will love him.

Best wishes,
J_P

Hi,
yes I know... that's why I suggested him instead the tons of stuff... there...

(too many girls and too many sex-ual transmitted diseases)

Kind regards,
Max

[Esteban]

Originally Posted by Max

Hi,
now voltage is 27volt ? Or the extra battery used for other stuff ?

Best regards,
Max

Is like Morgan's pistol, except here is used infrared.

Regards

Esteban