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#1
03-30-2013, 02:16 AM
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Analytical LRL Display
I'm really start to hate posting here,
because persons that refuse to give useful info while just love to play childish secrecy-keeper games don't deserve any good info at all! But, well, I have to give you some hints how it has to made correct instead of "fooling around" !!! The first thing is: You really have to forget about your signal mess up detectors! Either each EM-field-structure has its own visual oder audible output or you can throw your detector away! Don't fool yourself! Per instance you will not be able to detect radioactive stuff on a trustworthy level if your device at the same time also beeps because of electro-smog sources! Next: For each of the shown EM-field structures a variable range input must be adjustable! You can't detect varying earthmagnetical field changes if your detector is preset to an out of range level! And if you really think, that you will receive gold or metals at a certain long wave frequency, the detector has to be adjustable to this frequencies, by sensitive digital PLL tuner that contains a signal level meter! The electrostatic thing may be not work at all, because even if you lift one foot while walking you get already a huge kilovolt per meter difference. If have tested this already. If you look at the diagram sqares of course they are on a 2 dimensional LCD or LED display but you have to imagine them as half-sphere-shaped. Because only this is the correct display relation of the location you are walking around. The meter is by digital meter bar display output in diferent colors but also a numerical output is possible. What's important is that the treasure-hunter will have a fast and direct overview at what direction the signal level gets weaker or higher! With primitive EM-field-mix-up beepers nobody can work seriously! Of course this needs professional development first, and if you are not willing to help I can't help you! I say it loud and clear: I am no longer interested in the unprofessional work that is going on here! Either you are start to work cooperative and professional or you can keep your stuff for yourself! And in 20 years I'm laughing if I see that here is still no progress at all! Apropos 20 years - the best example about "standing still" already is the work of Mineoro. Do they really have improved their passive receiver stuff over 30 years or do they are selling unreliable crap where evil tricks and bagsplayer-tricks are needed to rip 10.000 of dollars out of the pockets of betrayed treasure hunters ??? If you like to put your footsteps into the tracks of Mineoro, go ahead and walk the same dilettantic and criminal way as they do. But without me! This is one of my last warnings - either the cooperational level here will raise or I may leave this forum finally and forever! 
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#2
03-30-2013, 04:42 AM
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Funfinder, you're threatening to leave the forum if LRL tinkerers don't combine their wisdom to produce something that actually works for you? Dell and I disagree on a lot, but I bet he thinks that's just as funny as I do.
******************************** Meanwhile, I found your drawing rather interesting, since it's a crude representation of things that have been available commercially for years. Real underground long distance locaters are manufactured by a number of companies. Because they work, nobody here refers to them as LRL's, that term being reserved for fraudulent apparatus. Price tag typically in the $1K - 5K range. They come with factory warranties of the sort you expect for equipment that actually works. Not only can they be tested, they can be "raced" against one another. There are even organized competitions where users of underground locating equipment pit their equipment and skills against each other, with prizes being awarded. Carl hasn't dangled a $25K prize just to see one work. All totally unlike the LRL industry. Some more recent models have antennas arrayed in multiple axes and are equipped with visual display readouts. For example the Fisher TW82 (which runs at 82 kHz and has a transmitter that outputs 1 watt) has a visual display to read out azimuth orientation, left-right distance, I think it's about $1500. Some of our competitors have even fancier readouts, at a higher price of course. It's got everything you need except that one thing that would make it an LRL: a fairy tale that it magically detects buried gold coins ten miles away, while ignoring the gold ring on your finger and all the other gold in between. But what the heck, you could buy a TW82, supply your own fairy tale, and then ya got the LRL you just drew a picture of! All for less than the price of an Electroscope Gravitator. You could even add accessories, for instance you could glue a dowsing rod to it as a vertical axis misalignment indicator. And a $10 compass for indicating the azimuth of DC magnetic fields. --Dave J. EDIT: Most underground locating apparatus of the sort you walk around with operates in the LF frequency range or lower, and is based on measuring magnetic fields. However some geophysical prospecting apparatus also includes an E-field receiving antenna to use as a phase reference for demodulating the magnetic signals-- if that makes ya feel any better. Last edited by Dave J.; 03-30-2013 at 04:52 AM. Reason: additional info
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#3
03-30-2013, 03:29 PM
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 However, I did note that you left yourself a way out of this dilemma: "This is one of my last warnings - either the cooperational level here will raise or I may leave this forum finally and forever!". Looks like a "definite maybe" to me. 
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#4
03-31-2013, 04:13 AM
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@ Dave
> leave the forum if LRL tinkerers don't combine their wisdom to produce something that actually works for you? Works for me, are you serious? Ridiculous! *lol* They can keep their "wannabe-miracle-stuff" if they need to work on such a cheap level! How our LRL tinkerers ever can proof it will work at all? They can't. But what has to work is the scientifical working method and not just for me, for everyone!!! And most of our LRL tinkerers are far far away from that, that's why I'm not much longer interested to let my intellect insult by such an useless activtiy as it can seen here in this forum! Like little kids that wanna built castles in the sand just to destroy it afterwards. Nothing real useful and worth-creating is going on here. The only think I can see here is some sort of impostors, the make big words but have no proofs at all! The whole situation is the same stupid as if members make big words in a numismatic forum about having the blue mauritius or other rare stamps but they can't prove or show it, all they can do is just babbling. Meanwhile we have our pro LRL tinkerer conspiracy that sits around the fire of "unfamous" Alonso passive receiver and we have the contra LRL tinkerer called Qiaozhi that refuses to proves his contra-position because he prefers to sell books instead of working cooperatively in an open forum or really counterproofs that the "Alonso Game Play" doesn't work. btw. If I really would like to see this TOTeM circuit I just would need to ask someone w ho has this book (which I never would buy anyway because of pesonal reasons that started by kicking me out of the conspiracy PDK forum without any reason by Qiaozhi and his further incooperative behaviour here - if he needs to create incooperativity or hostility by unfair behaviour, he get the results) to mail me a jpg of the schematic and the parts-list - BUT: I don't care about it, I don't waste my time for such useless stuff and for shure I will not built it, because I don't waste my time for such meaningless things. The output in this forum can be seen on the same level than hogwash rumors compared with hard scientific evidence! Next thing - Dave, you might be correct that there are indeed some "medium longer range" detectors available, but not all of them are working. If someone hears your advice he might think that Mineoro or OKM Bionic are proven working LRLs because the companies and the designs also look pretty professional. OK, you told about some product like Fisher TW82, I will take a closer look of its capabilities. And you wrote about an important point: because the world we are living in is 3 dimensional, of course multi-dimensional antennas must to be used for best possible direction-location. We know this will never be happen here in this forum. I better should have listened to WM6 in the beginning - the whole LRL-thematic as it is served here in this forum is a huge joke and nothing more!  Hung wasn't able to give reasonal infos and the rest of our tinkerers and members of the "alonso PDK conspiracy group" make the same mistakes.  Sooner or later no serious thinking person will remain here to waste his precious lifetime for the worthless pompous-*ss LRL bla bla bla thats going on in this forum over and over again. 
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#5
03-31-2013, 05:30 AM
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Yeah, that's it what you would like.... You are also very funny, Qiaozhi, creating fancy "trick of the mind" schematics to counterproof that LRLs don't work, BUT this extremly precious counterproof only is available for your book-buyers... I really hope noone buys this book just because of this worthless TOTeM stuff, even the name already is stupid. Better start to cooperate here on an useful scientifical level or you are not much better as all those mysterious-chandlers with their wannabe top secret alonso pdk clone conspiracy crap! If you want it that this forum will became a place for lunatic freaks and unwordly LRL fanatics just just move on - I'm only hoping that no seriously thinking and real knowledge seeking person ever will waste his time here no longer !!! Here at this ridiculous playground of knowledge refusers and destroyers and progress thwarters! The forum suggests that real interesting info could be found here but thats a lie. The censored info here in this forum is worth nothing and only is a camouflage for persons who wanna play "the big important guys" while in reality they have nothing useful to give! Either you guys here start to provide real scientifical proofs or I only will laugh about your fairy-tales and wannabe-LRLs! Wake up or dream on forever, LRL-tinkys!  LRL-dreamers with a huge need to make themselves look important by posting unbelievable claims and completly unreal fantasy-stories! Have fun in your crazy little world, sometimes you'll get what you deserve...
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#6
03-31-2013, 04:00 PM
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#7
03-31-2013, 04:17 PM
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Secondly, if you consider this information to be "meaningless", then why do you seem so desperate to get it?
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#8
04-01-2013, 03:17 AM
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> only available to buyers of ITMD. Why do you think you deserve this information for free?
Deserve for free? Are you think you are the expert that only is able to teach the world that LRL scientifically does not work? Do we need experts that show us proofs that DVD players really work or not? No. Some information should be no matter of free or not, it's the basis for a working business or society. Only here in this LRL forum the pro and contra LRL skeptics refuse to give clear information because of ther own greed and unclearity of their doings and claims etc. And if you are the creator of this TOTeM circuit, why should providing it here in this forum should be illegal? Do you have forgotten to keep your rights of your part of the book so now other people can decide if you are allowed to show us your circuit? bw. you are wrong, I don't wanna desperatly have this TOTeM circuit, absolutly not. As I told already I have better things to do to waste my time with stuff that doesn't lead any further. May other interested persons play and experiment with it. And I will decide if the content of the ITMD book is of use for me or not, at the moment it's not the case. btw. you have not the slightest idea how many books I have readed already, it would take your whole life to read them. The membership thing argument "other wouldn't have liked my attitude" is a cheap excuse and intrigue thing but I don't care no more about this. Just another pure waste of time forum with no scientific counting output. Almost the same crap that is going on in the public LRL forums since a long time. OK, lets forget about these old problems for now, I'm not interested to chew it again and again. BUT: Fact is, that if this forum will further refuse to work on a public accepted basis, and the public is interested in prooven reliable information, it only will lead to even more mistrust of the whole LRL topic! After a short look into this forum no rational thinking person will risk to lose his money for OKM, Mineoro or Crypton etc. devices. Why such an interested person should risk to spent his money for "dubious stuff" where even in explicit topic forums like this here noone can give a clear and proven answer?! This forum is very good to scare away people to buy LRLs but it also will destroy the work and credibility of persons who wanna think that their LRLs are really working like Andreas. And for treasure-hunters that wanna have a clear proven yes or no if this or that available LRL detector is really worth the money this forum is completly useless, the only thing they find here is the some "better buy it not"-info as 5 years ago, but without scientific conclusions and explainations. I am not related with Andreas and his Crypton OBMD-1 etc. detectors in any way but if he really should have built a working detector (otherwise he would be the same fraudster or selfbetrayer than other LRL-producers), this forum must be a real pain in his *** because if people look for reliable info if LRLs could work at all and try to understand why, the only result is a huge confusion and insecuring. Comparable with the question: Can somebody catch HIV just by kissing? If this question cannot clearly answered the result is that persons will stay away from kissing because they don't wanna risk a thing. And so the result of this forum will be also to stay away from all kind of LRLs because no clearly and proven info is available. But this is not my problem, if I wanna buy such a LRL detector i would test it personally and with many different parameters to check. like different regions, weather and much more. No cheap "in front of the factory field" demos. Perhaps the "results" of this forum just mirrors the dilettantic behaviour of the OKM, Mineoro and other LRL-providers itself. The same unscientifical and untrustworthy output. And, Qiaozhi, personally I don't care what you wanna achieve, but if I would claim I could counterproof by a circuit that LRL is a huge selfdelusional thing etc. I would prove it to the public and not just to the readers of my book. But we will see the outcome of this anyway, we have already some TOTeM homebrewers here in this forum and we will see how convinced they will be. I doubt they will be convinced at all, because how should they can be shure this TOTeM has even the sligthest relation with other LRLs? If you can't prove this relation they will think that this certain circuit only creates misleading-signal-outputs, but other circuits or devices may not. To make a long story short - this forum only leads to misinformation, confusion and suspecting completly every LRL detector as not working! Be shure, all those LRL interested treasure-hunters shurely will be very happy after reading here, so they know less as before, and also all those LRL tinkerers like Morgan, Geo and Andreas who look like suspicous story tellers, but perhaps this is also their own problem if they can't or don't want to proof that their DIY-boxes really work. If you guys here are not able to give clear and scientifical provable information, you will get the results I have told already. I repeat: * making LRL tinkerers untrustworthy * scaring away interested treasure hunters from buying such stuff * make this forum look like an unworldly, esoterical platform * feeding the conviction that all available LRLs are fishy and fraud * make the members of this forum look silly because they waste their time with such an "unprovable" crap Carl was absolutly right to source this long range locators forums section out and way from geotech, because the unscientifical and therefore worthless stuff that is going on here only would have made look the other forums the same obscure, unreliable and inprofessional! No real useful info can be found here on "LRL", not pro LRL and not contra LRL, only just pseudo-evidence, small talk, decribitions of unimportant things and a fancy wannabe LRL detectors picture show. Damned, what I'm just wasting so much time for still writing here, it's useless anyway! This forum here is cheap entertainment for persons who don't really care if LRL can work yes or no, anyway! Useful scientifical work will never took place here. It's no wonder that big firms who built LRLs never would start to write here, because all what they contribute here would be worth nothing. Instead of an asphalt road with clearly definded proven data and electronical facts this forum is the morast and mud of uncertainty and unscientifical bla bla bla. A waste of time.
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#9
04-01-2013, 11:38 AM
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Anyway, I am not your enemy. Chill out man, and accept the fact that the LRL forums are essentially a playground for a lot of unscientific thinking. This is the simple reality. Learn to live with it.  And finally, you need to understand that TOTeM was not conceived as a method of proving that LRLs don't work. In the past, the skeptics have been accused of rubbishing LRLs without any practical background in the subject. The retorts have often been that you need to build an LRL and test it in the field, and only that way will you be able to experience the "phenomenon". So, with an open mind, I designed and build TOTeM. Goldmaxx (and others) are now replicating the project, and I suggest that you monitor their efforts carefully (and patiently). Wait until the results are in, and published, before you post your views on the subject. Later, we can discuss whether any successful treasure recovery was due to a trick of the mind, or the "phenomenon" really exists. At least no-one will have spent any serious money on a fraudulent LRL that cannot even detect the gold test sample that is shipped with the device.
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