Bob Yocum

[Carl-NC]

Just got an email from Bob Yocum, who manufactures & sells LRLs. I s'poze he read my report on the Omni-range Master he sells.

Email 5/1/2006

I have noticed that you are on the internet slamming our tehcnique in looking for and finding ore bodies and treasure.

I will now challenge you and your equipment as to performance, discrimination, accuracy, distance, penetration ability, and also the ability to track a moving target.

This will be a public contest between you and your equipment and mine. It will be held here in the Gardnerville/Minden, NV. area.

This is a PUT UP or SHUT UP situation. I would welcome any other metal detector dealer who wishes to challenge me to enter this contest with you.

The number I can be reached at is 1-775-782-6664.

Regards,

Bob Yocum, President
Prospector & Treasure Hunters
U S A

My reply:

Email 5/1/2006

Hi Bob,

I don't manufacture or sell any equipment of any kind. However, I do offer a $25,000 prize for anyone who can successfully demonstrate an LRL in a simple randomized blind test. Details of the challenge are on my web site.

Also, I own one of your Omni-range Master (I guess you saw my report!), so I already know for a fact that it cannot detect gold. But if you have another LRL that "really works" then let me know, and we can draw up a contract for the test.

Regards,
Carl

Maybe Bob has a new LRL that does more than just put money in his pocket. We'll see...

- Carl

[Carl-NC]

From 5/7/2006:

Bob,

I'm a little disappointed that I did not get a quick reply from you accepting my $25,000 challenge. It is a serious offer, and I am willing to travel to Gardnerville for the test. You are not required to put up any funds whatsoever, so you have absolutely nothing to lose providing, of course, you have an LRL that can truly detect gold from a distance. If so, then my $25,000 prize will be phenomenally easy to win.

I look forward to working out the details of the challenge with you, and finally seeing an LRL that can do more than just wallet mining.

Regards,
Carl

$25,000 Challenge: http://www.thunting.com/geotech/reward.html

[Carl-NC]

From 5/17/2006:

Bob,

Since you haven't replied to my last two emails, I decided to go ahead and propose a test for my $25,000 challenge. Actually, I will propose three different challenges, and you can pick any one.

For your "Omni Range Master" LRL, you specifically claim that "the Range Master will accurately locate 61 different minerals including many gemstones and 5 gravities of crude oil with 100% discrimination." Also, "accuracy of 1/32 of an inch from 50 feet to over 8 miles."

I challenge your Omni Range Master, with YOU as the operator, to successfully and repeatedly locate a 10-ounce 0.999-fine gold bar in a standard randomized double-blind test. This is the same test described on my web site, which uses 10 marked locations, involves 10 trials at a distance of 10 or more feet, with a repeatability of 70% or more, all of which are substantially easier than your claims. If you are successful in at least 7 of the 10 attempts, I will pay you $25,000, plus give you the gold bar.

As an alternate challenge, I will bury the 10-ounce gold bar, and a 10-ounce 0.999-fine silver bar, in an area of 1 square mile (640 acres). You will be allowed up to 12 hours (all in a single day) to locate them, using ONLY the Omni Range Master... no metal detector, or any other device, since you claim the ORM has such phenomenal accuracy. If you are successful, I will pay you $25,000, plus give you the gold & silver bars.

Finally, you state that "all frequencies, electronics, technique, and units are patented." If you can provide documented evidence that all your frequencies, electronics, techniques, and units are legally patented with a recognized national patent office (e.g., the USPTO), then I will pay you $25,000.

I hope you will find one of these challenges acceptable. They directly address specific claims you have made of your products and, if your claims are true, I'm sure you will be eager to back them up and take my money in the process. I think you'll agree that I have now "put up."

In the unlikely event that you are unable or unwilling to substantiate your claims, I hope you will have the courtesy to reply to that effect, and I will not bother you any more with this matter.

Regards,
Carl Moreland
Geotech

[Carl-NC]

From 5/18/2006:

Carl, I am not interested in your $25,000 or your testing area!

My challenge to you is free. I will prove the following to you, as I have to many customers:

1. 100% discrimination against all other metals or elements other than the one the unit is set on.

2. Distance of 8 miles with 22 grams of Uranium or a 50-calibre bullet, small meteorite, 10 grams of Tantalum, Rhenium, Hefnium, Europium, Nickel, Silver, Gold, and any member of the Platinum/Palladium group.

3. Place a piece of gold (fly-speck size) between two bags of lead shot (25 lbs each). Put the Omni on the gold frequency and the Omni will pick up the gold and ignore the lead.

4. The Omni-Range Master will track an Emerald, or any of the elements listed previously, by having the target carried around in a circle by another person.
a) With regard to the live 50-calibre bullet, the Omni-Range Master will track it on Copper, Zinc, Sulphur, Carbon. I do not have the frequency for nitrates yet. The accuracy of 1/32 of an inch will still be applicable.

5. If you have the balls to come here for a demonstration on the above, it will be held in a public park approximately 1-1/2 miles from my office.

6. In addition to the above, I have found many meteorites with this equipment using different frequencies. They vary from 1/2 to 100 lbs.

7. Also, who or what is "Geotech"? Is it a word invented by you, a corporation, or a legitimate testing company?

You have cost me a ton of money with your false, negative advertisements on the Internet. I did not know that you were at the bottom of all of this until a customer in Alaska sent us a copy.

I repeat, if you or any metal detector company wish to stand up and challenge me, I will arrange a public demonstration/challenge here in a park in the Minden/Gardnerville area.

Regards,
Bob Yocum

[Carl-NC]

From 5/18/2006:

Bob,

I will gladly come to Gardnerville. However, any demonstration of the Omni-Range Master would need to be performed under blind conditions; otherwise there is no way to tell if the device is working, or whether you are intentionally steering the rods based on what you see and know.

So, if I place a small piece of gold (I'm willing to make it larger than fly-speck sized) under a randomly chosen paper plate out of 10, completely unknown to you and anyone else, can you determine which paper plate it's under? Can you do this at least 7 out of 10 times? That's basically what I require to win my $25,000. And, yes, we can do it in the public park you referred to, since I can easily conceal the gold in such a manner that not even witnesses can tell where I've placed it.

So far, not a single LRL I've ever seen (and I own quite a few) has the ability to detect gold or anything else of value, even when supposedly "expert" users are tested. And, so far as well, not a single LRL manufacturer has been willing to take my challenge. I truly hope you will be the first.

Regards,
Carl

[Carl-NC]

From 5/23/2006:

Bob,

I will assume, based on your silence, that your LRL equipment is unable to actually locate gold, or anything else worthwhile (with the possible exception of a buyer's wallet!), and would therefore utterly fail in scientific testing. If that is the case, I am not surprised. All dowsing-rod-based LRL equipment is bogus, and nothing but an excercise in self-deception, or possibly outright fraud.

I will leave open my offer to come to Gardnerville and let you take a shot at my $25,000, whenever you might feel confident that your equipment works better than guessing.

Regards,
Carl

[Carl-NC]

Kelly's "challenge" was set up in such a way that cheating was possible. I tried to propose changes that we both could agree to, but Kelly wouldn't budge an inch. A mutually agreeable protocol is an absolute must; I'm very flexible with my own challenge, as long as good scientific protocols are preserved.

Did you know that Mike Tune (Kelly's partner) and I have completely worked out a contract for a test of the Treasure Tracker? This is for the whole $25,000. Mike and I went through several rounds of changes, and I made quite a few concessions.

Did you know that earlier this year, Kelly came within 30 miles of my house, and did not bother to contact me? This was after Mike and I completed the contract, and I had already made it clear to Kelly that he could use the same contract. Apparently, he had the time to take money from a "client" (and what was surely much less than $25,000), but no time to take my money.

If this Treasure Tracker can so easily win my challenge, why are these guys avoiding it?

- Carl

[hung]

Carl, Kelly's challenge had nothing to do with your own.
I've read every post regarding it and could see how you accepted at first and then when you perceived that the device could be for real, you started to twist what you had already accepted. Remember the 'greyhound annoyance'?

With all respect, what would be of you if the Treasure Tracker or Mineoro or whatever proves to find gold?
What purpose would have all your campaign and other's skeptics to keep existing? What role would you play in forums after that?
This is my answer to your queston. Simple as that. Did you get it?

Exactly like the weapons of mass destruction US was expecting to find in Iraq. If wasn't for that there would be 999 other left for the invasion...

[Carl-NC]

Originally Posted by hung

Carl, Kelly's challenge had nothing to do with your own.
I've read every post regarding it and could see how you accepted at first and then when you perceived that the device could be for real, you started to twist what you had already accepted.

Yes, I know it was a separate challenge. But do you believe that a challenge should be fair? That's all I asked for. Personally, I believe the intention of his "challenge" was to set up conditions that I would not possibly accept, so when I declined, he could then beat his chest and say ol' Carl backed down. I found the premise of the challenge to be acceptable, and had he agreed to a minor change, I would have gone out there in a heartbeat. But, as you know, he would not even discuss it.

Apparently, you did not know that I wrote up a full contract for these guys, that we both agreed was fair. Would I have done that if I was the least bit concerned that the Treasure Tracker was "for real"?

And, what does it tell you, when Kelly comes right by my house (oh, yes, he knew it!), and doesn't bother to contact me? Does that sound like a man who is confident that he can win my challenge? Or someone who wants to avoid me?

With all respect, what would be of you if the Treasure Tracker or Mineoro or whatever proves to find gold?
What purpose would have all your campaign and other's skeptics to keep existing? What role would you play in forums after that?
This is my answer to your queston. Simple as that. Did you get it?

I'm not sure why you would be concerned about all that. If someone came along with a locator that Really Works, and they took my money, then, well, I will have found a locator that Really Works! And that's one of the purposes of my challenge... to flush out the Real Deal.

But, so far, all I see are false claims and outright fraud. I own 20 (maybe more, not really sure) LRLs, and not a single one of them will locate gold. At all. I am well-versed in electronics and physics, and I understand that the claimed concepts behind LRLs are just as bogus as the devices themselves. I also understand how "demonstrations" can be manipulated to give "positive" results. And that's the other purpose of my challenge... to flush out the frauds.

Yocum understands that he could not hope to succeed in a real, scientific test. You can see that in his reply, where he wants complete control over the "test" conditions. (And, he's not interested in my $25,000!!! Boy, have I heard that one before! Nobody wants easy money!) All of the other LRL manufacturers -- Mineoro, Dell, Afilani, Fitzgerald, Kellyco, etc -- understand this as well. As does Kelly Brown, Bill Floto, and others who offer "LRL services".

So, ya, one day I might lose my money. But you shouldn't worry about that. I sure don't.

- Carl

[hung]

Carl,

I just talked to Kelly. He told me one of your friends saw him detect several targets. This guy warned you about that. Also Kelly claims the prize is just an excuse for your clear attempt to see how it works and try to reverse engineer it.
This is really a major concern and not even a million dollar would be worth if this happens.
I don't want to discuss this with you as it will lead to an endless empty debate as you have your one position of what happened for this challenge not suceeding and Kelly has his.
I think the relevant factor is that Kelly knows his detector is for real and he's recovering things in the field for contractors. He never wanted to sell it because he wants to be the only one to use it.
I have my detector and I also know that Mineoro is for real. You have an early PDC. Alhtough was the first of the series, it worked as I already told you my partner in my team owned one and found the 1832 gold coins with it. If you could not make it to work once you opened it and ruined some mechanism or indeed tried to copy it, I don't know.
All of the items found by Mineoros are reported by the people who did not want to be anonimous.
There are dozens who remains so.
Damasio is not worried about your back engineering possibility but as I also said he is also concerned of legal issues this might lead. Mineoro is not a small corporation as many of these LRLs seem to be. So.. we hit a dead end here.
No need to discuss this.

Maybe Bob Yocum is too busy right now recovering things with his detector. Maybe he's worried just as Kelly of a possible reverse engineering attempt.
Time will tell.

[Carl-NC]

Originally Posted by hung

I just talked to Kelly. He told me one of your friends saw him detect several targets.

Right... I'm told nothing was dug up, or recovered. No treasure.

This guy warned you about that. Also Kelly claims the prize is just an excuse for your clear attempt to see how it works and try to reverse engineer it.
This is really a major concern and not even a million dollar would be worth if this happens.

I would not be able to do that, as I would not have access to the device. In fact, one of the clauses I added to the contract, at Mike's request, is that I not be allowed to touch the device. So Kelly's claim is bogus.

Since this excuse already had been dealt with in the contract, why would Kelly NOT try to take my money, when he was right here?

I think the relevant factor is that Kelly knows his detector is for real and he's recovering things in the field for contractors. He never wanted to sell it because he wants to be the only one to use it.

I'm told that he has not recovered any treasure.

I have my detector and I also know that Mineoro is for real. You have an early PDC. Alhtough was the first of the series, it worked as I already told you my partner in my team owned one and found the 1832 gold coins with it. If you could not make it to work once you opened it and ruined some mechanism or indeed tried to copy it, I don't know.
All of the items found by Mineoros are reported by the people who did not want to be anonimous.
There are dozens who remains so.
Damasio is not worried about your back engineering possibility but as I also said he is also concerned of legal issues this might lead. Mineoro is not a small corporation as many of these LRLs seem to be. So.. we hit a dead end here.
No need to discuss this.

OK. When Mineoro can demonstrate their LRL in a fully objective test, then we can discuss it.

Maybe Bob Yocum is too busy right now recovering things with his detector. Maybe he's worried just as Kelly of a possible reverse engineering attempt. Time will tell.

Or, maybe his LRLs don't work.

- Carl