Lrl from Italy

[toorani]

hi dear franco
now with Touch antenna,out put tr5 10mvolt Increases,Is that right?

with decrease c2/c3/c4 From 1.8p to 1p ,out put voltage Decreases(3.8 volt),Is that right?

with decrease c1 From 560p to 370p,out put voltage Increases(5.2 volt),Is that right?

also antenna through L1 connected to ground,as a result,The shield and antena Are connected,Is that right?

Thank you so much.

[FrancoItaly]

hi dear franco
now with Touch antenna,out put tr5 10mvolt Increases,Is that right?

with decrease c2/c3/c4 From 1.8p to 1p ,out put voltage Decreases(3.8 volt),Is that right?

with decrease c1 From 560p to 370p,out put voltage Increases(5.2 volt),Is that right?

also antenna through L1 connected to ground,as a result,The shield and antena Are connected,Is that right?

Thank you so much.

The important thing is that touching the antenna the signal at the output (TR5 emitter) changes, usually decreases.
The antenna is connected to ground through L1, therefore only to direct current, while for RF signals it must cross an impedance, so it is not true (and should not be) that shielding and antenna are connected together.

[afshin]

Thanks dear franco
When I adjust threshold then the led goes slowly to be on and l have to adjust threshold again.(there is not enough stability)while there is not self oscillation in circuit.(when I remove crystal the output voltage is 0 volt).what is that reason in your opinion?

[FrancoItaly]

Thanks dear franco
When I adjust threshold then the led goes slowly to be on and l have to adjust threshold again.(there is not enough stability)while there is not self oscillation in circuit.(when I remove crystal the output voltage is 0 volt).what is that reason in your opinion?


The body affects the threshold, bringing the hand closer to the lrl there may be a change in the threshold. If the DC output (TR5 emitter) is stable then everything is ok.

[afshin]

Very thanks mr franco
I measured TR5 emitter voltage, it goes slowly down and is not stable.
What is that reason mr franco?

[FrancoItaly]

Very thanks mr franco
I measured TR5 emitter voltage, it goes slowly down and is not stable.
What is that reason mr franco?

The proof of stability must be done outdoors, as there are too many sources of disturbance inside. If the fault persists there is probably a self-oscillation superimposed on the quartz oscillator. If you have made my double-sided PCB (one for the sensor stage), the self-oscillation can occur due to the excessive gain of TR3 / TR4. Change R10 and R12, from 1K to 1.5K and increase the total value of C1 / C2 / C3, put 1pF or more to have about 4-6V on the emitter of TR5.

[toorani]

hi dear franco
-I Detached the quartz ,votage out put is 0 and with Connected quartz ,voltage out put is 5v but with Touching antenna , voltage out put 10mv or 50mv Increases,In your opinion Why increases? and Is this important hess?

-Is the underlayer Must connected to pin - battry? and Is shild must connected to pin - battry?
http://s8.picofile.com/file/8319667300/photo_2018_02_19_20_32_40.jpg

Thank you so much

[FrancoItaly]

hi dear franco
-I Detached the quartz ,votage out put is 0 and with Connected quartz ,voltage out put is 5v but with Touching antenna , voltage out put 10mv or 50mv Increases,In your opinion Why increases? and Is this important hess?

-Is the underlayer Must connected to pin - battry? and Is shild must connected to pin - battry?
http://s8.picofile.com/file/8319667300/photo_2018_02_19_20_32_40.jpg

Thank you so much

When you touch the antenna output voltage must change, usually it decreases, but the important thing is that there is a change and this means that all the sensor stage is ok.
If there is not change it's possible that the stage is self oscillating or the stage works with overload (to much gain).

Pin - battery must be connected to sensor stage ground (upper side) and to shield (lower side of PCB)

[afshin]

Very thanks mr franco
And three questions:
1-Is it may that the ambient temperature affects the threshold stability?
2-what is the advantage of double side circuit comparatively to the one side?
3-what is the best voltage for output of the sensor stage?(TR5 emitter)

[toorani]

When you touch the antenna output voltage must change, usually it decreases, but the important thing is that there is a change and this means that all the sensor stage is ok.
If there is not change it's possible that the stage is self oscillating or the stage works with overload (to much gain).

Pin - battery must be connected to sensor stage ground (upper side) and to shield (lower side of PCB)

hi dear franco
Should the box shield be connected to the pin- battery too?

[FrancoItaly]

Very thanks mr franco
And three questions:
1-Is it may that the ambient temperature affects the threshold stability?
2-what is the advantage of double side circuit comparatively to the one side?
3-what is the best voltage for output of the sensor stage?(TR5 emitter)

1- threshold stabilityt is very little influenced by the ambient temperature. This is because the
DC amplification is not very high.

2- the advantage of double side PCB is that the lower side is a shield that prevents self
oscillating.

3- the best voltage for output is in the range 3 - 6V. This voltage depends on gain sensor
stage (TR2/TR3/TR4) and on signal amplitude of quarz oscillator (C2/C3/C4) and there are
many combinations that determine the same output voltage. For example I could have a
signal of 2mv at the base of TR2 and a gain of 3000 and then a signal at the output of 6V
or a signal of 1mV and a gain of 4000 with output of 4V. In the second case we have a
lower output signal but a greater gain (a condition that is preferable).

[FrancoItaly]

hi dear franco
Should the box shield be connected to the pin- battery too?

box shield must be connected to pin-battery or to ground PCB (sensor stage or power stage)

[toorani]

box shield must be connected to pin-battery or to ground PCB (sensor stage or power stage)

So Antena is connected to Box Shield,Is that right?

[FrancoItaly]

So Antena is connected to Box Shield,Is that right?

NO the Box shield is connected to ground= pin - battery, antenna is connected to L1/C9/10 not to ground, if you connects antenna to ground also the phenomenon goes to ground and you have no usefull signal at output.

[toorani]

NO the Box shield is connected to ground= pin - battery, antenna is connected to L1/C9/10 not to ground, if you connects antenna to ground also the phenomenon goes to ground and you have no usefull signal at output.

hi dear franco
I mean, Antenna connected to the Box shield through L1,Is that right?(Conductively Are connected)
http://uupload.ir/files/owfh_capture.png
http://uupload.ir/files/08rl_photo_2018-03-12_18-18-13.jpg

[afshin]

Thanks mr franco
Is the lower side of the double side PCB connected to the ground of the circuit or not?

[FrancoItaly]

hi dear franco
I mean, Antenna connected to the Box shield through L1,Is that right?(Conductively Are connected)
http://uupload.ir/files/owfh_capture.png
http://uupload.ir/files/08rl_photo_2018-03-12_18-18-13.jpg

Yes you can also consider this way, but the fact remains that it is connected to the mass only through L1 and I do not understand why the thing interests you so much.

[FrancoItaly]

Thanks mr franco
Is the lower side of the double side PCB connected to the ground of the circuit or not?

Yes the lower side of the double side PCB connected to the ground of the circuit.

[afshin]

Very thanks dear franco to answer my questions and other members.

Best regards

[Merlin]

Sir FrancoItaly, Thanks for your LRL!
You are a good man!
I decided to make this your LRL - Sensor:

https://i.imgur.com/UL8gIJV.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/XZUNwd1.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/aR4MDsN.jpg

And this is my PCB:
https://i.imgur.com/q8H6c84.jpg

Final appearance without Quartz:
https://i.imgur.com/VZUCEJU.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/2TyfYx1.jpg

However, I have a problem! :frown:
The voltage on the R5 Emiter is 6.09V without the mounted Quartz.
When I R1 sampled from 33K to 27K - the voltage is stable 5.27V.
The same voltage is when I mount the Quartz, however, the voltage is not reduced when I touch the antenna input.
Please help me with a voltage of 0V!
What should I do??? :shrug:
In advance, thank you very much for your reply! :)
Merlin

[FrancoItaly]

Sir FrancoItaly, Thanks for your LRL!
You are a good man!
I decided to make this your LRL - Sensor:

https://i.imgur.com/UL8gIJV.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/XZUNwd1.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/aR4MDsN.jpg

And this is my PCB:
https://i.imgur.com/q8H6c84.jpg

Final appearance without Quartz:
https://i.imgur.com/VZUCEJU.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/2TyfYx1.jpg

However, I have a problem! :frown:
The voltage on the R5 Emiter is 6.09V without the mounted Quartz.
When I R1 sampled from 33K to 27K - the voltage is stable 5.27V.
The same voltage is when I mount the Quartz, however, the voltage is not reduced when I touch the antenna input.
Please help me with a voltage of 0V!
What should I do??? :shrug:
In advance, thank you very much for your reply! :)
Merlin

Maybe you did not read what I had written on the PCB, the components must be soldered from the copper side (as smd) and it would be advisable to use a double-sided PCB with the bottom face connected to the ground as a screen. Your PCB can not work (if you have perfectly copied mine) because for example the emitter / collector pins of all transistors are inverted.

[Merlin]

Maybe you did not read what I had written on the PCB, the components must be soldered from the copper side (as smd) and it would be advisable to use a double-sided PCB with the bottom face connected to the ground as a screen. Your PCB can not work (if you have perfectly copied mine) because for example the emitter / collector pins of all transistors are inverted.

Thanks for your reply sir FrankoItali! :)
I will make the PCB as you suggest, so I will place the result here on the forum.
I hope it will work. :D
Please - just one more question:
I do not understand whether it's a mistake or not, but on your assembly scheme, the C5 and C7 сapacitors are labeled as electrolytic, and this is not the case in the circuit diagram.
My question is:
- What are the condensers: ceramic, block, tantalum or electrolytic?
I am very grateful for your response in advance!
Merlin

[FrancoItaly]

Thanks for your reply sir FrankoItali! :)
I will make the PCB as you suggest, so I will place the result here on the forum.
I hope it will work. :D
Please - just one more question:
I do not understand whether it's a mistake or not, but on your assembly scheme, the C5 and C7 сapacitors are labeled as electrolytic, and this is not the case in the circuit diagram.
My question is:
- What are the condensers: ceramic, block, tantalum or electrolytic?
I am very grateful for your response in advance!
Merlin

C5/C7 are ceramic as other capacitors, only C6/C8 are electrolytic.

[abdou2014]

I made my latest version of franco LRL with some modification, and I had different results, this version does not react to the television or the electric devices, except that is very sensitive to the FM waves , I try them with a small FM transmitter and it detect it to ten meters, I want to have the opinion of Franco on these results?

[FrancoItaly]

I made my latest version of franco LRL with some modification, and I had different results, this version does not react to the television or the electric devices, except that is very sensitive to the FM waves , I try them with a small FM transmitter and it detect it to ten meters, I want to have the opinion of Franco on these results?

I think the answer can only be found on a real field.

[zakari]

Hi All
I test the francos lrl that is not receive the fm waves
You must chang the resistorse to receive the fm wave
Abdou the fm transmitter not good respon
I tested that not have good effect
You must modulate kilo hz wave to fm transmitter
Best regad
Zakari

[abdou2014]

I told that I have an excellent reception of FM waves , and I detect a small FM transmitter from more than 10 meters . it's your LRL that needs repair 8)

[Dubulumach]

I cannot help you, there is no particular frequency of operation, my lrl works in the FM range, about 90 - 130Mhz but it is not linked to any radio broadcaster, Esteban said that even an FM receiver (not tuned to any station) could work as lrl.

Hello Francoitaly

Esteban cabrera Grinok also had shown us how to simply stumilate "FM receiver", better word RF-sniffer.

May i ask you whay you haven't used freq.offset for main 'Halo 4046 chip' ?. For example sweep working freq, in some LF freq, range of interest.? Why did you have used only fixed (semi-variable) VCO voltage ? Main 'Halo chip' should search and lock 'Halo signal' at any particular frequency where phenomenon was occured not at fixed freq. It is soon impossible to find correct 'Halo-positions' of five 20-turns potentiometers manually. Honestly I know a man who can do it even with 6 potentiometers in same time. :)
Also why you haven't used some sort of AGC to regulate fine amount of reference signal, because 'Halo-signal' is variable in time and space.

Also there is a simple trick to going on mV range 'Halo-signal' of amplitude demodulator or even going on uV, trying to dig out very tiny 'Halo-signals' from the background noise floor, and reconstruct detected useful signal analogue or digitally. You as ex-EE sure know how.

I've forgot to say maybe the most important stuff, which is all real working lrls are detectors (active or passive types) ) of Second Magnetic Field Phenomenon, (not derivation of primary vectorial field), which is in natural essence Shock-Wave or better had great Tesla said, Sound-Wave of Aether. Simply to understand kind of compression/decompression waves, which under special circumstances even could be a standing-waves, a Magnetic standing waves. Mathematical apparatus already has written but.... everything must be at the right time and righ place for the Renaissance.

Best regards
Dubulumach

[FrancoItaly]

Hello Francoitaly

Esteban cabrera Grinok also had shown us how to simply stumilate "FM receiver", better word RF-sniffer.

May i ask you whay you haven't used freq.offset for main 'Halo 4046 chip' ?. For example sweep working freq, in some LF freq, range of interest.? Why did you have used only fixed (semi-variable) VCO voltage ? Main 'Halo chip' should search and lock 'Halo signal' at any particular frequency where phenomenon was occured not at fixed freq. It is soon impossible to find correct 'Halo-positions' of five 20-turns potentiometers manually. Honestly I know a man who can do it even with 6 potentiometers in same time. :)
Also why you haven't used some sort of AGC to regulate fine amount of reference signal, because 'Halo-signal' is variable in time and space.

Also there is a simple trick to going on mV range 'Halo-signal' of amplitude demodulator or even going on uV, trying to dig out very tiny 'Halo-signals' from the background noise floor, and reconstruct detected useful signal analogue or digitally. You as ex-EE sure know how.

I've forgot to say maybe the most important stuff, which is all real working lrls are detectors (active or passive types) ) of Second Magnetic Field Phenomenon, (not derivation of primary vectorial field), which is in natural essence Shock-Wave or better had great Tesla said, Sound-Wave of Aether. Simply to understand kind of compression/decompression waves, which under special circumstances even could be a standing-waves, a Magnetic standing waves. Mathematical apparatus already has written but.... everything must be at the right time and righ place for the Renaissance.

Best regards
Dubulumach

Hi Dubulumach,
What you say is interesting but it is beyond my knowledge. But as I see it, it is not necessary to elaborate in this direction, I leave this task to others, certainly more competent than me. My lrl works in the range of 2.5Mhz to 10Mhz frequencies and with an input frequency in the 80Mhz - 120Mhz range. In this frequency range there is no particular that allows a greater sensitivity or some discrimination. The version with CD4046 was designed to achieve some discrimination and in the original (unpublished) version the phase changes were compared with the amplitude variations, but I did not get positive results and so I decided to post only the part related to the phase changes. I have always recommended the version with the quartz oscillator because it is easier to make and the sensitivity is practically the same. Finally I want to add that it is not practical to increase the sensitivity too much otherwise the compass effect appears and this makes the tool very difficult to use.
Best Regards.

[Geo]

Hi Franco.
Now for us the years gone :(.
It is time for the new members :lol:

Regards

[FrancoItaly]

Hi Franco.
Now for us the years gone :(.
It is time for the new members :lol:

Regards

I Geo,
In Italy it is said in the old barrel there is good wine ...
Certainly it takes some new idea but not only theory but also work in the laboratory and on the real ground.
Best Regards

[Dubulumach]

Hi Dubulumach,
What you say is interesting but it is beyond my knowledge. But as I see it, it is not necessary to elaborate in this direction, I leave this task to others, certainly more competent than me. My lrl works in the range of 2.5Mhz to 10Mhz frequencies and with an input frequency in the 80Mhz - 120Mhz range. In this frequency range there is no particular that allows a greater sensitivity or some discrimination. The version with CD4046 was designed to achieve some discrimination and in the original (unpublished) version the phase changes were compared with the amplitude variations, but I did not get positive results and so I decided to post only the part related to the phase changes. I have always recommended the version with the quartz oscillator because it is easier to make and the sensitivity is practically the same. Finally I want to add that it is not practical to increase the sensitivity too much otherwise the compass effect appears and this makes the tool very difficult to use.
Best Regards.


Thank you FrancoItaly for detailed explnation.
I think your idea is a very good but the hardware need some modifications,
There are many things which should be tried, for example IR pcb attached to your LRL, optical filters, new antenna design etc, etc.

I've made several LRLs from you, and i have also problems like SKY/GROUND effect, in fact influience of local vriations of earth magnetic field,but the main probem are false signals.
I havent made digging snapshoots but i am telling a truth i found a waste amounts of underground ferrite objects and what is very interesting all of them have bneen at last stage of corrosion.

To avoid this we need to modify input front end circuit, like puting in parallel with L1 small variable capacitor, lower overal gain of preamplifier stages, put ferrous-filter (100pF in series with 1Meg or bigger resistor, better same value potenciometer), try magnetic coupling stimulus instead electric couling like is yours, lowering stiimulus freq. with LF variable signal gnerator from couple of Hz to about 100KHz, use full metal case, with aluminium handle, work with both haand, use silver-mica capacitors for whole device etc. etc.

Last year i've got very storng signals frm the acient roman's site from about 80 meter distance with telescopic antenna lenght about 1,5m. Next grediometer measurement (gradient type) had shown something is at HotSpot but the depth was over 5 meter, and what is bigest problem for me and my partner, the site is only 50m from the international highway. So i was quit, because toio many risk.

In any way thank you for your ideas and your honesty help allof us.

ps: My new idea is, lowering gain of preamplifier and use diodes in combination with low-offset OP preamplifier to rise the "halo-signals" from the background noise. With diodes we coud demodulate, "Halo" modulated carrrier in hundreds of mV range, with small OP trick we can run demodulation in mV or even uV range, very close to noise floor of components. It is simple and effective, just use those diodes in feeback loop of some good CMOS OP, while grounding non-inverting input at common via some bigger capacitor. Anyone can draw schematic..

Best Regards
Dubulumach

[Dubulumach]

I Geo,
In Italy it is said in the old barrel there is good wine ...
Certainly it takes some new idea but not only theory but also work in the laboratory and on the real ground.
Best Regards

Yes it is a truth, but in old Italy also had said

In vino veritas, in aqua sanitas. The truth is in wine, the health is in the water. :)

similar like this one - the vine is like a woman, as you consume as so much, became so softy palate.:)

Best Regards
Dubulumach

[Dubulumach]

Hi Franco.
Now for us the years gone :(.
It is time for the new members :lol:

Regards

Not for you and FrancoItaly, my friends. :lol:

The future will be, like you drawing to be. :)

Best Regards
Dubulumach

[FrancoItaly]

Thank you FrancoItaly for detailed explnation.
I think your idea is a very good but the hardware need some modifications,
There are many things which should be tried, for example IR pcb attached to your LRL, optical filters, new antenna design etc, etc.

I've made several LRLs from you, and i have also problems like SKY/GROUND effect, in fact influience of local vriations of earth magnetic field,but the main probem are false signals.
I havent made digging snapshoots but i am telling a truth i found a waste amounts of underground ferrite objects and what is very interesting all of them have bneen at last stage of corrosion.

To avoid this we need to modify input front end circuit, like puting in parallel with L1 small variable capacitor, lower overal gain of preamplifier stages, put ferrous-filter (100pF in series with 1Meg or bigger resistor, better same value potenciometer), try magnetic coupling stimulus instead electric couling like is yours, lowering stiimulus freq. with LF variable signal gnerator from couple of Hz to about 100KHz, use full metal case, with aluminium handle, work with both haand, use silver-mica capacitors for whole device etc. etc.

Last year i've got very storng signals frm the acient roman's site from about 80 meter distance with telescopic antenna lenght about 1,5m. Next grediometer measurement (gradient type) had shown something is at HotSpot but the depth was over 5 meter, and what is bigest problem for me and my partner, the site is only 50m from the international highway. So i was quit, because toio many risk.

In any way thank you for your ideas and your honesty help allof us.

ps: My new idea is, lowering gain of preamplifier and use diodes in combination with low-offset OP preamplifier to rise the "halo-signals" from the background noise. With diodes we coud demodulate, "Halo" modulated carrrier in hundreds of mV range, with small OP trick we can run demodulation in mV or even uV range, very close to noise floor of components. It is simple and effective, just use those diodes in feeback loop of some good CMOS OP, while grounding non-inverting input at common via some bigger capacitor. Anyone can draw schematic..

Best Regards
Dubulumach

HI Dubulumach,
I've never modified my Lrl because in all the places I've tried it has behaved well. As I have already said, you can change L1 (1 yet 2 turns) and C10 (from 10 to 33pF). It also works L1 = 2 turns and C10 = 0pF. But if you leave this frequency range the lrl does not work while in this range I did not notice differences in sensitivity. As for the iron I never had problems, as far as I could experience my lrl is insensitive to iron. According to your experience, have you checked whether removing the iron is there still a signal?
Best Regards

[FrancoItaly]

Yes it is a truth, but in old Italy also had said

In vino veritas, in aqua sanitas. The truth is in wine, the health is in the water. :)

similar like this one - the vine is like a woman, as you consume as so much, became so softy palate.:)

Best Regards
Dubulumach

Another Italian proverb: you can not have a full barrel and a drunken wife.

[Dubulumach]

Another Italian proverb: you can not have a full barrel and a drunken wife.

:lol::lol::lol: This one is the best. :lol::lol::lol:

You are very inteligent man FrancoItaly.
Thank you.

ps. small mod for your Quartz LRL, new mV amplitude detector.
https://s31.postimg.org/dulzj4rqz/New_amplitude_detector.jpg

[FrancoItaly]

:lol::lol::lol: This one is the best. :lol::lol::lol:

You are very inteligent man FrancoItaly.
Thank you.

ps. small mod for your Quartz LRL, new mV amplitude detector.
https://s31.postimg.org/dulzj4rqz/New_amplitude_detector.jpg

It's interesting, but if the DC gain is too much then there is the compass effect and it is also better if the DC gain is linear.

[Dubulumach]

It's interesting, but if the DC gain is too much then there is the compass effect and it is also better if the DC gain is linear.

Hi FranoItaly

I think you are right. From my experiments with your LRLs "SKY & COMPASS" effects are due to overal preamplification of first 3 BC183C transistors. I think there should be introduced small negative feedback with AGC (auto gain control) smmall control voltage to keep amplification is given range, tuned to avoid sky and compass effects. These effects are like Esteban said due to earth magnetic field. LRL simple catch this field.Maybe we need J-Fet at input with small negative control voltage to keep amplification in desired range,so enough to catch GOLD and SILVER targets, while are not present SKY & COMPASS" effect, alos known as "Horizon" effect.

I have some ideas we should try, but now am engaged to other project.

Also i think stimulus frequency (oscillator electrical stimulation) should be in LF range, for example 60-80KHz, not more,

Take a look at Geo's schemtic of DC2006, where with only 3 transistors and 2 big resonant loops, this LRL catch GOLD and SILVER targets.

FrancoItaly i am 90% sure that low energy photons are direct responsible if not direct for "Halo" effect but like kind of wireless conveyor (bridge) of "Halo" signal. Interference with upper FM band 110-140MHz could be via overtones (lowest sub harmonics) of the low energy photons freq.

One of RF-tricks for your LRL
https://s31.postimg.org/s942inkor/Coil_capacitor.jpg

ps. Your original PCB works perfect, better than PCB from Spectra PCB rouuter.

Best Regards :)
Dragan

[Dubulumach]

Keep going further improving LRL technology.
This one is from my countryman Nikola Tesla, very old invention.

FrancoItyaly this special coil i plan to use as LC tank frontend of your LRLs.
This Tesla's invention has very special attribute such , it easy pick up longitudinal waves (compression/decompression waves). Maybe "HALO WAVES" are this sort of waves? We need only to make proper phasing of both halves of coil, via some quality semi variable capacitor small value 5-50pF. Or in other case ground center tap, add resonant capacitor only to one halve CW or CCW? (should be experimented at real target test field) and pick-up a signal with other halve. Each inductance should not be more than 3 turns with minimum diameter wire 1mm, to get bigger Q-factor.

https://s31.postimg.org/alm9kkdd7/Zeitmachine_2.png

Regards
Dragan

[FrancoItaly]

Keep going further improving LRL technology.
This one is from my countryman Nikola Tesla, very old invention.

FrancoItyaly this special coil i plan to use as LC tank frontend of your LRLs.
This Tesla's invention has very special attribute such , it easy pick up longitudinal waves (compression/decompression waves). Maybe "HALO WAVES" are this sort of waves? We need only to make proper phasing of both halves of coil, via some quality semi variable capacitor small value 5-50pF. Or in other case ground center tap, add resonant capacitor only to one halve CW or CCW? (should be experimented at real target test field) and pick-up a signal with other halve. Each inductance should not be more than 3 turns with minimum diameter wire 1mm, to get bigger Q-factor.

https://s31.postimg.org/alm9kkdd7/Zeitmachine_2.png

Regards
Dragan

Pay attention to the AGC, with this system you risk making the lrl insensitive to amplitude changes, I recommend instead to act on the DC gain.

[Dubulumach]

ok.

FrancoItaly, I am thinking something, maybe the "Halo" siganals are very-very fast, with very short transitions times.
Maybe we need preamplifier with very high slew rate.

What do you think ?

As i said earlier my best result with your Quartz vesion LRL is about 60-80 m. I think he catch signals from very big target, but no way to dig on that place, because it is very near international highway, here at me in south Serbia.

[Dubulumach]

FrancoItaly here is new frontend preamplifier for your LRLs.

https://s31.postimg.org/45r2zwbln/Franco_new_preamplifier.jpg

I am thinking about direct J-FET demodulation using well known interdependency between Is (source current) and Vgs (gate voltage) with very low Id (drain current). You already know that linearity of demodulated sugnals is much better when using ordinary diode like 1n4148. And input voltage at the input could be smaller than 100mV, so we get better sensitivity and in same time better linearity.

Maybe we need additional sitmulus for example "bomb" the gold with short impulse bursts for example 100KHz like it had realised in Heatkit GD348 ?

Tell me what do you think about upper things ?
What should be done next in your opinion ?

Regards
Dragan

[Dubulumach]

FrancoItaly read this old Esteban Cabrera Grinok post. I think it is very important to redesign your LRLs.

Some experiments demonstrates that the buried metal can produces negative or positive charges. If the environment is positive in a particular day, the metal becomes negative. If negative, the metal acquires positive charge. This is the "reason" why is important to detect the rapid variation in the site of the buried metal, positive or negative, and as the article refers (translate in English by Qiaozhi in this thread, read it!!!), Zahori detects the most minimum umbalance of charges, positive or negative. The article also refers that is possible to detect various kinds of fields, not only the AC fields, in theory also radiactivity. Buried metal for long time contain a quantity of energy. The oscillator based on the 555 justly despolarize the antenna in the supossed case it acquires nocive charges for the detection.

http://www.longrangelocators.com/forums/showthread.php?t=11674&highlight=ionic&page=4

Also capacitor in series with the telescope antenna is not a good variant according to Estaban, because from his experiments it will pick up all kind of interference.

We need to design a new sensor.

Should there be positive results if we make antenna pre biasing, charging the outer surface with some controlled ammount of possitive and negative charges (still unknown for science), directly from the independent battery source.

Zahori is very sensitive with very low sampling rates. All below 100 samples per second is good according to Esteban experiments.

What do you think FrancoItaly ?

ps: About ionic fields in the water (Esteban information), I can report data from one old German natural researcher that in some special nights, with naked eyes could be seen billions of tiny sparks in slow flowing German river Rhine, with her main tributaries Moselle, Main, Necker, Weser and Elbe. So information about 4 times greater detection distance with LRLs in the water, contrary to the soil is truth.

Regsrds
Dragan

[Dubulumach]

FrancoItaly, would you like to analyse and give me some suggestions (positive & negative) about this new type "Halo-effect" sensor. :)

I've gave him a name "SFCH Sensor". It is semi-passive type. I've take in account many useful suggestions from Esteban Cabrera Grinok.

Thank you.
https://s31.postimg.org/png4ch70b/SFCHS.jpg
Regards
Dubulumach

[FrancoItaly]

Hi Dubulumach,
You propose many changes and I think it's better to open a new thread. I think the only advice I can give you is to put the changes into practice. I can tell you the tests I did in the past and then I discarded. I used the CA3130 for the input stage in a low frequency and very high impedance version, but it proved to be extremely sensitive to walls, trees and the ground itself, therefore practically unusable and this excludes the possibility in some way to use the measurement of ions to reveal the "phenomenon". Furthermore, the first working lrl I made was in practice a pulse induction MD with a transmitting coil (about 10cm diameter), a receiving coil (a single turn) perpendicular to the transmitting coil and an input stage formed by a toroidal ferrite with three windings, one connected to the antenna (V-shaped), one connected to the receiving coil and one connected to the input stage. The three windings were tuned to the operating frequency of the transmitter coil (which was not damped as in the usual MDs). The oscillation frequency of the MD was 60Khz but that at the ends of the transmitter coil were not damped oscillations of about 5Mhz. In this type of lrl I can exclude that there was somehow the frequency of about 100Mhz as in my last lrl.

[perzo]

HI ALL: pleas see PCB franco ITALY.http://s9.picofile.com/file/8322982676/1.jpg

[perzo]

THis layout file
http://s9.picofile.com/file/8322982868/franco.LAY.html

[perzo]

http://s9.picofile.com/file/8322983034/fg.JPG

[Dubulumach]

Hi Dubulumach,
You propose many changes and I think it's better to open a new thread. I think the only advice I can give you is to put the changes into practice. I can tell you the tests I did in the past and then I discarded. I used the CA3130 for the input stage in a low frequency and very high impedance version, but it proved to be extremely sensitive to walls, trees and the ground itself, therefore practically unusable and this excludes the possibility in some way to use the measurement of ions to reveal the "phenomenon". Furthermore, the first working lrl I made was in practice a pulse induction MD with a transmitting coil (about 10cm diameter), a receiving coil (a single turn) perpendicular to the transmitting coil and an input stage formed by a toroidal ferrite with three windings, one connected to the antenna (V-shaped), one connected to the receiving coil and one connected to the input stage. The three windings were tuned to the operating frequency of the transmitter coil (which was not damped as in the usual MDs). The oscillation frequency of the MD was 60Khz but that at the ends of the transmitter coil were not damped oscillations of about 5Mhz. In this type of lrl I can exclude that there was somehow the frequency of about 100Mhz as in my last lrl.

Thank you FrancoItaly

Very interesting experiments you did, and very smart configuration of your modified pulse induction MD wit non dumped transmitting coil.
maybe i need to start exactly from that configuration. Only i want to know, does this modified PI-LRL has ability to discriminate (classify targets) according to Esteban Cabrera Grinok, between gold, silver, copper, aluminium and ferrous targets ?

If your answer is positive, i think i would like start from exactly your configuration and listen your next suggestions and advices.
I think i can do it, but need some time to check up new hardware at real terrains with real ancient targets.

My logic is so simple. Why to rediscover something you already did and it work good. I need a real working LRL for me and my best friend, not for comercial purposes, not for glory, not for grants etc.etc. Only one good working LRL any possible type which tuned work good with GOLD, SILVER classifier for prospecting with my friend Bojan, mostly ancient roman's terrains here at South Serbia. I need to get away from mountain where i am currently living. Geo has some photos of my old house in highlands. I need to come back to city again and very probably get away from Serbia, maybe Greece, maybe Italy, maybe Brazil. Who knows ?

Best wishes and regards
from the mountain
Dragan

[dojranski]

MISTER PERZO HERE YOU HAVE A ERRORhttp://s8.picofile.com/file/8322994642/fg_1_.JPG

[Dubulumach]

My south curiosity :lol: :lol: :lol:

Does anybody did measurement of quartz crystal frequency drift in presence of "Hallo" phenomenon (silica quartz chip flooded in the "Halo cloud") ?.

If there is a very tiny freq.drift, for example 1ppm (parts per million of Hz), and measurement were done correctly, well than we have found a perfect "Halo sensor".

Regards
Dubulumach

[FrancoItaly]

Hi Dubulumach,
my lrl "pulse induction" did not have the discrimination. I don't think that there is a single frequency i.e. only for gold and not for other metals. Perhaps there is a range of frequencies where the gold responds better then other metals, you can try putting in place of C10 a varactor diode and do a scan, manual with potentiometer or automatic with oscillator (0.5 Hz or less). Anyway I don't think that the discrimination is necessary, the lrl is not sensible for iron, if the target is out the range of a MD it is certainly an interesting metal, very unlikely to be aluminum or other "modern" metal. If the research area is in the mountains then it is unlikely that there will be much metal waste. The strength of an lrl is that it is possible to explore a large area in a short time even if there are almost insurmountable obstacles for an MD (vegetation, walls and ruins).

[Dubulumach]

Thank you FrancoItaly, You are really GOLD MAN. :)

Best regards
Dragan

[Dubulumach]

Hey FrancoItaly

Good afternoon

I think these emails are very important. Both are from MorgandePortugal. If all he said is a truth, and i think he is not a fraud, we need AGC whatever we make your or his version of LRLs. I was experimenting a lot with your PLL LRL and Quartz LRL, and found some intersting behaviour. One of many is we need periodicaly discharge telescopic antenna simply touching the ground for a moment. It seems "Halo" particles on some way were glued to antenna and overload frontend premplifier, moving working point over the safe threshold and boost earth mag.field detection. All kind od Sky/Ground/Compass effect are due to detection of very weak Earth H-field.

Looking for this terrible problem i was found some interesting new dated research in magnetometry logging and i think you should read whole science article. Seems you have right because we have deal with some kind of motional electric field with spinning. Of course these experimental data are not for public use, so if you are interesting i will send you a copy to your email. Just drop me your email link via private message.

Second, I've madee a preliminary design of new passivew receiver frontend (change original Alonso circuit), with new AGC block, linearised demodulation output, and couple of LPF stages. This new design work with 2 ferrite rods, one is active and other use to balance the 1st to avoid Sky/Ground/Compass overload as MorgandePortugal said. I will no post my schematic, to avoid steal of my ideas. Even Esteban didn't posted complete schematics of his working LRLs.

There is new idea working with 3 ferrite rods wit same permeability in differential configuration, where two rods are active and 3rd is a balance rod. This configuration gives new opportunity like gradien measurement, which could be important as i think. This imply use of very high dV/dt preamplifierswith biggest possible GBWP, with new synchro detector system to cut-off unwanted noise jamming and all kind od interferences.

The big problems are correct frequencies of passive receiver. 77KHz simple do nothing here in South Serbia. I need a new empirical data.

"Hello
As Franco Italy told you,this is the compass efect,it hapens with very sensitive LRLs,in some countries the PDK-2.1 have this problem,and the solution is reduce the sensitivity or calibrate the LRL in the direction of this lines,this way avoid completly the interference and still enough power to locate buried targets. Maybe the PDK videos i post in this forum help you to understand HOW TO PINPOINT the buried objects,what is more dificult is most of the gold or silver objects are located with PDK in only one direction (see the video of gold object found by robalocarapanda,where is possible to see clear,the PDK locate only in one direction) however there are other object that are located in two dir. others in three or even four dir., one good way to learn is to use the method of TRIANGULATE ,where you check the signals in all directions and make ground MARKS to understand the position of this object. Other mistery is when you finaly locate the exat point where the object is buried,still another problem with the PDKs and maybe the ToTEM too,when you lower the LRL less than one meter above the target the LRL OVERLOAD and lost the signal ,and when you raise it again for 1m or more above,the signal returns (check this Phenomenon in the robalocarapanda video) all this caracteristics was signaled by me in this forum many times. Happy days for you and your family.

Regards
Morgan"


"I believe you locate N-S magnetic lines,becouse this can hapen very often when the coil or ferrite is not well balance or other possibility is wrong number of turns in the RX(receptor) coil,also little change in value of capacitor near RX some times solve the problem, but,as i told before, the more fast solution is to calibrate the ToTeM in the direction of this N-S line and start a search.This way the LRL only locate the buried objects and avoid the N-S lines. We have many many things to learn about LRLs,but it will worth all the time we lost with them !!! People like Funfinder,Max,WD40 etc etc , are allways present as skeptics becouse ,you know,still skeptics that said the men never arrive to the moon,and when some of them locate gold coins with LRLs,they will say,this is coincidence...thats it".

Good Luck
Morgan"

ps: You should try schottky diode sensor with tuned shorted wave-guide attached to your telescope antenna, because the simply fact there is 10dB boost of overal sensitivity for your LRL's, using it. If you want i will send you "know how" via private email.

Best regards
Dragan
South Serbia
East Balkan (not west like EU politician lie).

[Merlin]

MISTER PERZO HERE YOU HAVE A ERRORhttp://s8.picofile.com/file/8322994642/fg_1_.JPG

mr. Perzo - another error!

[perzo]

HI FrancoItaly: what is frquency in iran?

Regards.

[perzo]

MISTER PERZO HERE YOU HAVE A ERRORhttp://s8.picofile.com/file/8322994642/fg_1_.JPG

HI:dojranski pleas do corect layout file in this pages.
regards.

[perzo]

HI:FRANCOITALY.Would you use the frequency of the local transmitter?
Regards.
PERZO

[dojranski]

http://s8.picofile.com/file/8323146200/ORGINAL.JPG

I think this is correct..

[FrancoItaly]

HI:FRANCOITALY.Would you use the frequency of the local transmitter?
Regards.
PERZO

There is not a particular frequency, the operation of my lrl does not require the presence of a radio station.

[perzo]

There is not a particular frequency, the operation of my lrl does not require the presence of a radio station.
Thank you very much

[Treasureshunter]

I greet the members of the forum ...
I ask forgiveness for my English ...
After trying enrolled in forums ...
My turn and I publicly thank Franco to manufacture.
I am an amateur in electronics and maybe I can not give precise information
to the members who they asked me in my email
But I can upload my work and experiments I did and maybe some help ...

https://postimg.org/image/jord1udjp/
https://postimg.org/image/yfll52yqn/
https://postimg.org/image/bsu4hujnt/
I need your pcb ...
please

[perzo]

http://s8.picofile.com/file/8323146200/ORGINAL.JPG

I think this is correct..


Thank you so much for this

[GOLDEN LILLY]

Hello franco. I build your lrl based on your pcb. All the components are based on your specifications. However, i do not have the voltage drop when touching the antenna, what should i do to have a voltage drop of 100 to 200mv. Capacitors c1,c2 and c3 are all 1 picopards. Please help me. Thank you...

[FrancoItaly]

Hello franco. I build your lrl based on your pcb. All the components are based on your specifications. However, i do not have the voltage drop when touching the antenna, what should i do to have a voltage drop of 100 to 200mv. Capacitors c1,c2 and c3 are all 1 picopards. Please help me. Thank you...

You must follow my helps to avoid self oscillations.

[GOLDEN LILLY]

Does it mean i have oscillation when no voltage drop when touching the antenna?

[FrancoItaly]

Does it mean i have oscillation when no voltage drop when touching the antenna?

Yes, if the stage is self oscillating it is not affected by touching the antenna.

[abdou2014]

a problem has occurred in my Franco LRL, I use two rechargeable battery 9 V and a regulator 7812, every time I set the threshold and the gain, the sensitivity decreases alone, and I will be forced to increase the gain every 30 seconds, is there someone who has had the same problem ???

[abdou2014]

the 12v power supply is stable, test with voltmétre, but the led goes Off alone after each setting ???

[FrancoItaly]

the 12v power supply is stable, test with voltmétre, but the led goes Off alone after each setting ???

If the sensor stage output is steady as 12V supply the only explanation may be that the body affects the regulation, try to adjust the threshold to a higher level so as to be the first led on and find the point where moving the hand off the led turns off.

[abdou2014]

I use the display 1 led, and when I approach my hand from the antenna the led lights, I think it's the opposite.

[FrancoItaly]

I use the display 1 led, and when I approach my hand from the antenna the led lights, I think it's the opposite.

I mean that by moving your hand away from the control of the threshold the LED turns off, so you have to adjust the threshold so as to have the LED on and find the right position with which the LED turns off moving away.

[abdou2014]

the pot threshold does not react to my hand, my hand near or far is the same thing for the LED,
the LED light only when my hand is near to the telescopic antenna , how inverted and make the led turn off instead of it turns on near the antenna ???

[abdou2014]

I'm going to change the pcb, the old one was perfect, I found a misterious method to suppress the sky effect :lol::lol::lol:

[FrancoItaly]

the pot threshold does not react to my hand, my hand near or far is the same thing for the LED,
the LED light only when my hand is near to the telescopic antenna , how inverted and make the led turn off instead of it turns on near the antenna ???

As I said before, touching the antenna is a way to empirically establish if the sensor stage is properly tuned. Normally the signal decreases but it may happen that instead the signal increases, so it is not a malfunction of the lrl.

[FrancoItaly]

I'm going to change the pcb, the old one was perfect, I found a misterious method to suppress the sky effect :lol::lol::lol:

I'm curious to know how your system works. It may be possible to increase sensitivity and perhaps even have some discrimination.

[Dubulumach]

Hello FrancoItaly

Your LRLs work but suffer from so called "Albedo problem". What is it ?
When you enter in range of Halo-effect field with telesopic antenna you have already disturbed the field. Your antenna need extreme loosy coupling with ambient, to be at maximum sensitivityy not disturbing the field. Use capacitive coupling between two very small capacitors or two very small inductors at the end of your antenna. Also good high impendance RC filter is needed to reject iron targets or selective LC filters, each tuned for specific color metal.

Best Regards
Dubulumach.

[FrancoItaly]

Hello FrancoItaly

Your LRLs work but suffer from so called "Albedo problem". What is it ?
When you enter in range of Halo-effect field with telesopic antenna you have already disturbed the field. Your antenna need extreme loosy coupling with ambient, to be at maximum sensitivityy not disturbing the field. Use capacitive coupling between two very small capacitors or two very small inductors at the end of your antenna. Also good high impendance RC filter is needed to reject iron targets or selective LC filters, each tuned for specific color metal.

Best Regards
Dubulumach.

Hi Dubulumach,
I have experience only on land in Italy and Switzerland (near Italy), also a member of the forum that lives in central america confirms the same thing, that is my lrl (but I think all the others) are insensitive to iron, I believe that iron does not emit the phenomenon. Certainly if the gain is too high the compass effect appears and also many other disturbances of which I do not know the origin. I can think of small metal fragments (non-ferrous) or radio transmitters whose fundamental frequency or harmonic (lower or upper) falls within the range of L1 / C10.
As a general rule if the disturbance remains constant while walking it is the compass effect or some electromagnetic disturbance, while if it disappears after a few meters it is almost certainly a small piece of metal that maybe the MD can not reveal:

Best Regards

[Dubulumach]

Hy FrancoItaly

Why don't you try frontend preamplifier for example from Mineoro DC210 which Geo has discloded.? Or use RF sniffer from DCH85 with TDA7000 tunnd at 110-120Mhz ?

Any horizont effect (sky/ground) make lrl prospecting impossible, right ?

Best Regards
Dubulumach

[abdou2014]

I made this modification franco lrl with tda7000, it did not work, I found two ways to eliminate the effect of the sky, but I have not yet tried in the test field, but a great sensitivity and discrimination for different fields :cool:

[Dubulumach]

I made this modification franco lrl with tda7000, it did not work, I found two ways to eliminate the effect of the sky, but I have not yet tried in the test field, but a great sensitivity and discrimination for different fields :cool:

analyse this. you need to inject very weak signal (uV) from Franco's oscillator via 0.33pf or less at base of BF494 transistor.
http://dodaj.rs/images/dT96x.jpg
BFO
http://dodaj.rs/images/dTimv.jpg

http://www.longrangelocators.com/forums/blob:null/8a71efa4-9aaf-48eb-9afa-1500a0cfaf8d
http://www.longrangelocators.com/forums/blob:null/8a71efa4-9aaf-48eb-9afa-1500a0cfaf8d
http://www.longrangelocators.com/forums/blob:null/8a71efa4-9aaf-48eb-9afa-1500a0cfaf8d
http://www.longrangelocators.com/forums/blob:null/8a71efa4-9aaf-48eb-9afa-1500a0cfaf8d

[abdou2014]

did you build this modification, make us a schema, for me, I connected the output of the TDA to the TR2 mixer .

[Dubulumach]

did you build this modification, make us a schema, for me, I connected the output of the TDA to the TR2 mixer .

No.
Output of TDA7000 is weak audio signal. in fact noise. tune rf sniffer away from any FM station foe example 118-120Mhz.

[abdou2014]

other picturs noT open ???

[Dubulumach]

http://dodaj.rs/images/dTimv.jpg

[abdou2014]

what's Pre amp reference ?

[Dubulumach]

USE BEST NF PREAMP YOU CAN FIND ON INTERNET.

SEARCH AND READ. NOT WAIT SOMEBODY DO JOB FOR YOU.

[abdou2014]

I just want see your ideas and your progress , I do not intend to make it , I have two LRLs that works wonderfully :D:cool:

[Dubulumach]

I dont show my ideas and dont sell nobody. Thats only for me. Nor one will gift you working LRL schematic for free. Thats the fact.
Don't ask, but make yourself.

[FrancoItaly]

I believe that little can be done to increase sensitivity. We have seen that increasing the gain at some point appears the compass effect. Perhaps you can act by varying the frequency of L1 / C10 and checking if there is a point where you can further increase the gain before the compass effect appears.

[abdou2014]

you mean that the sky effect has a bandwidth, we can also remove the sky effect and vary LC to receive the phenomenon .

[FrancoItaly]

you mean that the sky effect has a bandwidth, we can also remove the sky effect and vary LC to receive the phenomenon .

It's possible, but I have not tried.

[abdou2014]

tomorrow I'm going to the test field to experiment
you will have the results, thank you Mr Franco.

[abdou2014]

Franco LRL contains two different type of sensor, i think it's the best ;)

[abdou2014]

it can be used at the same time with different sensors : EM . IR . RF. SC. UV. PL .......

[abdou2014]

VU DISPLAY

[HaFar2010]

HelloDear Franco.
I have a question about it, some people believe that your LRL (like Mole PROSPECTOR (http://deltapulse.eu/?p=83)) will turn off if we are exactly on target. Do you think it's true?

[humhum]

HelloDear Franco.
I have a question about it, some people believe that your LRL (like Mole PROSPECTOR (http://deltapulse.eu/?p=83)) will turn off if we are exactly on target. Do you think it's true?





So like My Homemade Mineoro LRL, I have test with my LRL ,if Treasure is Big ,
and when I am on it (center of Treasure or around) Nothing Beep my Device. (as Esteban said). This is Real ,But LRL of Francoitaly is not Ionic Receiver , reaction may be different.;)

[HaFar2010]

Is your LRL base on chamber Mechanism?

[humhum]

Is your LRL base on chamber Mechanism?


Yes with İonic Chamber.

[FrancoItaly]

I think the "phenomenon" above the target is null, or at least very small, so all the lrl behave in the same way. My lrl does not have an ionic chamber and I honestly do not know how useful it can be. Esteban said that even the Mineoro (with the ionic chamber) was also sensitive to other metals, although to a lesser level.

[humhum]

I think the "phenomenon" above the target is null, or at least very small, so all the lrl behave in the same way. My lrl does not have an ionic chamber and I honestly do not know how useful it can be. Esteban said that even the Mineoro (with the ionic chamber) was also sensitive to other metals, although to a lesser level.


Yes Franco , absolutely correct ,Receiver with Ionic chamber not sensitive only for Gold,
its sensitive little to little of Silver, Copper, Bronze ... and this is problem for me :angry:, because I need Sensitivity only for Gold or only for Silver .


Best Wish.

[abdou2014]

But LRL of Francoitaly is not Ionic Receiver ( after ) yes with İonic Chamber ??????

humhum you are confused !

[humhum]

,But LRL of Francoitaly is not Ionic Receiver , reaction may be Different.;)




This answer was for LRL without Ionic.

[abdou2014]

But LRL of Francoitaly is not Ionic Receiver ( after ) yes with İonic Chamber ??????

humhum you are confused !


do you remove L 3 turns when you convert your LRL to Ionic mode ???:D

[zakari]

HI ALL

HI ABDOU2014

IF YOU REMOVE L3TURNE AND REPLACE WITH 100NANO FARAD CERAMIC THE FRANCO LRL CONVERT TO IONIC DTCTOR

[FrancoItaly]

[QUOTE=zakari;156903]HI ALL

HI ABDOU2014

IF YOU REMOVE L3TURNE AND REPLACE WITH 100NANO FARAD CERAMIC THE FRANCO LRL CONVERT TO IONIC DTCTOR
[/Q

With this change, my lrl still reveals the phenomenon?

[abdou2014]

in this field indicator, the diode used is high frequency 600-1600Mhz, what is the best diode for FM range , Thank you !

[zakari]

[QUOTE=zakari;156903]HI ALL

HI ABDOU2014

IF YOU REMOVE L3TURNE AND REPLACE WITH 100NANO FARAD CERAMIC THE FRANCO LRL CONVERT TO IONIC DTCTOR
[/Q

With this change, my lrl still reveals the phenomenon?


with this change not reveals the phenomenon

[abdou2014]

NEW FRANCO LRL DISPLAY :D

[zakari]

Hi all
abdou2014
l belive the most important effect in franco lrl is self oscilation
design your display pcb for reduce self oscilation

Best regard
zakari

[abdou2014]

if you build your PCB in double face, side / component with their connection , side / ground, as described Franco, it will have no self oscillation.

[Bill512]

So like My Homemade Mineoro LRL, I have test with my LRL ,if Treasure is Big ,
and when I am on it (center of Treasure or around) Nothing Beep my Device. (as Esteban said). This is Real ,But LRL of Francoitaly is not Ionic Receiver , reaction may be different.;)

Hi Humhum,
I remeber once, while testing my "Franco PLL", that in an area of 30X30 meters aprox, there was a well noticed minimum.
It was the only "null" in this 30X30m area, I don't know if was any other null outside.
Anyway, in your case, how you can be sure that actually you are above a hidden treasure?

[FrancoItaly]

Hi Humhum,
I remeber once, while testing my "Franco PLL", that in an area of 30X30 meters aprox, there was a well noticed minimum.
It was the only "null" in this 30X30m area, I don't know if was any other null outside.
Anyway, in your case, how you can be sure that actually you are above a hidden treasure?

Hi Bill512,

the correct sequence is this:
Proceed in the north / south direction (preferably, to have the greatest detection distance), if there is a target we have a minimum signal, continuing the signal increases but above the target the signal is zero.

Best regards.

[humhum]

Hi Humhum,
I remeber once, while testing my "Franco PLL", that in an area of 30X30 meters aprox, there was a well noticed minimum.
It was the only "null" in this 30X30m area, I don't know if was any other null outside.
Anyway, in your case, how you can be sure that actually you are above a hidden treasure?


Hi Dear Bill512, * My Ionic Device not is from FrancoItaly LRL circuits.
* Test with my Ionic LRL for Treasure not is first , I Do very Test with it.
* Initial Signal detection of Target (or Sens) was from 600 meter long, and when I was on Target , this Signal is Disappeared, around 5 meter (Radius=2,5 meter). :|

[humhum]

in this field indicator, the diode used is high frequency 600-1600Mhz, what is the best diode for FM range , Thank you !



Hi Dear Abdou2014 , You can use 1n4148 (nS) for FM circuit, because

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1N4148_signal_diode
The 1N4148 is a standard silicon switching signal diode. It is one of the most popular and ... the JEDEC nomenclature. The 1N4148 is useful in switching applications up to about 100 MHz with a reverse-recovery time of no more than 4 ns. ( 250 Mhz).

[Bill512]

Hi Dear Bill512, * My Ionic Device not is from FrancoItaly LRL circuits.
* Test with my Ionic LRL for Treasure not is first , I Do very Test with it.
* Initial Signal detection of Target (or Sens) was from 600 meter long, and when I was on Target , this Signal is Disappeared, around 5 meter (Radius=2,5 meter). :|

Hi Humhum,
I know that you have your LRL's like the "Homemade Mineoro LRL".
The question is ,did you dig for the "Target" or not?
regards

[abdou2014]

Thank you Dear Humhum !

[humhum]

Hi Humhum,
I know that you have your LRL's like the "Homemade Mineoro LRL".
The question is ,did you dig for the "Target" or not?
regards



I got very good signal with MD,law in my country not posible for dig.:angry::nono:
I have and other signal from my garden before 10 years I buried
only Silver of 40-50 cm deep , and my Mineoro also sens this Target.:)
I Have other more Targets.... But without dig , only with MD.


Regards.

[FrancoItaly]

I will post here an improvement suggested by a member of the forum.
I tried this change and I found that it really works. In practice, the phenomenon is amplified before reaching the base of TR2. This allows to have two main advantages, the first is to be able to use a shorter antenna, but the main advantage is to make the tuning of the sensor stage less difficult. In fact, it is no longer necessary to obtain the maximum gain with the risk of self-oscillations. Even the pcb is less critical. The missing gain is then supplied by the antenna amplifier. The only calibration of this amplifier is to adjust the 4.7K potentiometer for maximum sensitivity.

[abdou2014]

what is the display compatible with this change ?

[FrancoItaly]

what is the display compatible with this change ?

As for the display nothing changes.

[Dubulumach]

Hello my friend FracoItaly :)

How do you do sir ?
Have you done treasure hunting in recent days ?

Best wishes from South Serbia
Dubulumach

[Dubulumach]

Hello dear FrancoItaly :)

Some interesting finds from my area.
http://dodaj.rs/images/U8PLe.jpg

Best wishes
Dubulumach

[FrancoItaly]

Hello dear FrancoItaly :)

Some interesting finds from my area.
http://dodaj.rs/images/U8PLe.jpg

Best wishes
Dubulumach


Hi Dubulumach,

I'm fine thanks, but unfortunately the only research I did with the imagination. Congratulations on the findings, the merit is an lrl?

Best Regards.

[humhum]

Hello dear FrancoItaly :)

Some interesting finds from my area.
http://dodaj.rs/images/U8PLe.jpg

Best wishes
Dubulumach


Congratulations Dear Dubulumach, you with which PD found these Coin and etc..

[Nicolas]

Congratulations Dear Dubulumach, you with which PD found these Coin and etc..




Jello oldest friend humhum



I think is LRL franoItaly if he write in this topic... waiting our friend Dubulumach from Serbia to clarify

[humhum]

Jello oldest friend humhum

I think is LRL franoItaly if he write in this topic... waiting our friend Dubulumach from Serbia to clarify



Hello Dear Friend Nicolas, If this circuits is of LRL francoItaly , maybe it is with Modification ,
because I see so like small Coil or Ferrite for Stimulator + 8 pin IC .

I think this PD circuit looks like PD of Dear Geo .

[Nicolas]

Hello Dear Friend Nicolas, If this circuits is of LRL francoItaly , maybe it is with Modification ,
because I see so like small Coil or Ferrite for Stimulator + 8 pin IC .

I think this PD circuit looks like PD of Dear Geo .


Yes may dear humhum...

[Dubulumach]

Hello FrancoItaly

I am ready for big Roman's gold quest in MOESIA SUPERIOR. :)

to all.
Alonso PD and Morgan PDK work. And work excellent. You have all needed data on forum. Just read all posts from LRL masters Esteban, Geo, Morgan, FrancoItaly to complete mosaic.

Franco Italy PLL LRL work with some modifications.
Zahori also work with modifications.

Thats all folks. MOESIA SUPERIOR is waiting tomb riders.
http://dodaj.rs/images/UBfrt.md.jpg
Good luck.
Dubulumach

[abdou2014]

I think I will come a day :cool:

[Dubulumach]

http://dodaj.rs/images/UieuR.png

[Dubulumach]

Yes, Tabula Traiana is a Roman's monument dedicated to the Roman Emperor Trojan, which is located in the Djerdap gorge from the Serbian side in East Serbia on river Danube.

youtube.com (http://yandex.ru/clck/jsredir?bu=6qqm&from=yandex.ru%3Byandsearch%3Bweb%3B%3B&text=&etext=1822.2vUWLjKyY01e8P0b9-NAEJVP7hG88HV_0YRvPipicH363SC90CSUGFlE365qOiHj.f5b 0bbd28ddcec06d17c0f1e2f5f7e91f7c520aa&uuid=&state=PEtFfuTeVD4jaxywoSUvtB2i7c0_vxGdgvKc46qzPyd-ujzmIIyXCLkRPo8BaMF9_I3gemYQzuLSJ5b56m-vkxGasW83obnmxBLbHZwJFcXWf2NJetb0Vg9pG52w5rkn&&cst=AiuY0DBWFJ5Hyx_fyvalFMRj5hirMuwY4KlrvXSCDOKUMP W4uWepcMuD0Z-tSBfZuOf3plWI1l0dmHh52Qyw-52ofyNKLX7Pxos9wb_vtzHH57twTMbj9FeK1Zg4nCdsQzPaag9 0XwE3aCRKgVYzWvBYVXvlO90NfYl_jMmE8mpaTKh6pfNI32qHS XMNo2lgxK18DJ7oWbQ0zUBpuRMeRrzeTPOssD3p6ZfOQuaWAMb T078bd5YDVcigOckyq2lulWFklKlQpqs3n3UsAHdfA8Oiaa57q aSCsz_likNUmVRvxm6oUv_eMP_Yn8J8QkBc8KRBUnymv4gj7L-i1RZnQ_J_NVE-LirmbyEb4uKJ6oAFQ8b2IWvtczzJDgOmu3X3yhvtc48x1Dg8rS ExLQdfsM9NxlI-o4m_IwBaHCcFox262NBGrXyVEd0O_kn_QtZEV4KPzWf4TT3Ltb NmVK2A1Q,,&data=UlNrNmk5WktYejY4cHFySjRXSWhXTVdnWUhmLU5pZzdzU lpIYS1HZ1ZISUpLOFhMNGNHcUdQdVNrSnZIMnBxaE5UMjlOdEV Fc2FXdFVoZGMzMkExMDNkai1QUWZpaXkycFJybG1BbGxQUzAs&sign=05940640f6ef8fbeba0231d380a6bb46&keyno=0&b64e=2&ref=orjY4mGPRjk5boDnW0uvlpAgqs5Jg3quM84KmdIKt3c,&l10n=ru&cts=1529353941940&mc=3.4529298646522095&hdtime=179188)›watch?v=6vzOJBq3nPo (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6vzOJBq3nPo)

Near is the Golubac Fortress, medieval fortified town on the south side of the Danube River, 4 km downstream from the modern-day town of Golubac, Serbia.

https://avatars.mds.yandex.net/get-pdb/477388/9829363a-cd75-4566-a96d-f4546dc50e9d/s1200?webp=false

Regards
Dubulumach

[FrancoItaly]

This is for hendra and other members that have requested help for the realization of my lrl and that maybe they do not want or time to read the older posts. They have made me a private request but I do not have time to answer everyone privately.

[kazımabı67]

Hi franco my porpose is 8mhz crystal osilator tape lrl.i want out put voltage range in the pin 1 ic1a (358?
thank you very much
http://www.longrangelocators.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=19136&stc=1&d=1410968976


http:// http://www.longrangelocators.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=19136&stc=1&d=1410968976
hı,what are +,_ and other foot on lm358?

[abdou2014]

In the PCB :D

[abdou2014]

DISPLAY PCB

[HaFar2010]

HelloDear All.
I have a question about impedance, What is the minimum impedance of phenomenon to be able detecting?

[FrancoItaly]

We know very little about the phenomenon I think that the range of impedance is very broad.

[HaFar2010]

Thanks, can you guess a minimum and maximum?

[FrancoItaly]

Thanks, can you guess a minimum and maximum?

I have no idea.

[lupen]

I have read all pages but at every page somethink added somethink removed....very confused...

Someone if ihas a complete part list guide photos in addition to build this project please upload here or please send me at lupengr29@gmail.com

I believe that this experiment promise good results :D :D :D

[FrancoItaly]

I have read all pages but at every page somethink added somethink removed....very confused...

Someone if ihas a complete part list guide photos in addition to build this project please upload here or please send me at lupengr29@gmail.com

I believe that this experiment promise good results :D :D :D

Here is all the material for the construction of my lrl, with the pcb of the sensor stage separated from the display stage. I recommend adding the antenna amplifier because it makes the calibration of the sensor stage less critical (as it requires less amplification). Unfortunately, the original pcb does not include the antenna amplifier that must be on a separate pcb or you can modify the original pcb. I repeat that the pcb of the sensor stage is better than it is double-sided, with the lower face connected to the ground. I also recommend making the 3 LED version and using the power stage that appears in the single LED version. I understand that it may seem a bit confused but it is a project that has changed over time. In addition to this version there is also that without quartz oscillator but with the IC CD4046, but I find it more complicated without being more sensitive.

[lupen]

Thank you very much Franco I will try it ;)

[Dubulumach]

Both FrancoItaly designs work but you will have big problems catching old rusty iron and otyher non noble metals because all of them create the phenomenon when were long time earthed.

FrancoItaly device need good Gold and Silver classifier to work as full valuable lrl. Think about how to make working classifier for gold. Without classifiewr device is like ordinary PI detector but on much higher distances.

D1,2= 1N60 (AA119)

Best regards
Dubulumach

[FrancoItaly]

Both FrancoItaly designs work but you will have big problems catching old rusty iron and otyher non noble metals because all of them create the phenomenon when were long time earthed.

FrancoItaly device need good Gold and Silver classifier to work as full valuable lrl. Think about how to make working classifier for gold. Without classifiewr device is like ordinary PI detector but on much higher distances.

D1,2= 1N60 (AA119)

Best regards
Dubulumach

I do not want to make controversy, but according to my experience and that of other people my lrl is sensitive to all non-ferrous metals, so also copper, bronze and other alloys (and of course gold and silver), but not iron. However it is possible that in certain terrains this can happen, for example Geo says that he has not succeeded in making it work. So surely the terrain is very important and I take note of your experience.

[VECTROUM]

Hello

It is possible to post the pcb drawing of the antenna amplifier?

Thank you on advance.

[FrancoItaly]

Hello

It is possible to post the pcb drawing of the antenna amplifier?

Thank you on advance.

Sorry, I don't have, but it's very simple.

[VECTROUM]

It is seperate pcb, correct?
Because i have allready contructed the sensor and display pcb's.
If someone have made it please send me the drawing at geortimas@gmail.com.

Thank you in advance.

[havoc88]

The antenna PCB and parts overlay.
PCB size 2cm X 2cm

[FrancoItaly]

The antenna PCB and parts overlay.
PCB size 2cm X 2cm

this is a good job, a valuable help for those who are not very practical with electronics and this is also the spirit with which I started this thread, in fact I decided to make available to all my lrl both in the spirit of open source and both because it could improve with the help of all the members. The original project was born by chance with the sensor stage that self-oscillating, but it was quite critical and dependent on the design of the pcb, later I added the quartz oscillator and the version with CD4046, in which we measure the phase variations and not the variations in amplitude. The last improvement is the antenna amplifier, made by a member of this forum, as I said before it is a circuit that amplifies the "phenomenon" and that makes the tuning of the sensor stage less critical, because in this way it is not necessary to obtain the maximum gain at the sensor stage, with the risk of self-oscillation.

[havoc88]

Mr. Franco we appreciate your goodwill to share your work and your knowledge with us.

[VECTROUM]

Thank you Havoc88 you are superb.
Thank you also Francoitaly for your excellent job on this lrl.
I have completed building it and i noticed that is very sensitive to the horizons.

[FrancoItaly]

Thank you Havoc88 you are superb.
Thank you also Francoitaly for your excellent job on this lrl.
I have completed building it and i noticed that is very sensitive to the horizons.

As I said in "helps.txt" you have to reduce gain until the compass effect disappears.

[FrancoItaly]

I modified the coupling between the antenna and the amplifier stage with a second coil wound on L1 (I call it L2), in this way there is a better adaptation between the impedances in play and ultimately a greater gain and a better selectivity. In this way there is a greater amplification for the "phenomenon" but not for the compass effect. At the moment I have no way of trying other changes that I leave to you as a task. In my prototype I did not put C10 (there is only the base / emitter capacitance). You can try to put a capacitor in parallel with L2 in order to tune it as L1 / C10, this may be in the 22pF-47pF range. L2 is wound over L1 and you can use a plastic holder on which to wrap first L1 (3 turns) and then L2 (2 turns).

[VECTROUM]

Hello, i want to connect a meter in order to visualize sensor readings and i want to ask in wich output i have to connect it.

Thank you in advance.

[FrancoItaly]

Hello, i want to connect a meter in order to visualize sensor readings and i want to ask in wich output i have to connect it.

Thank you in advance.

You can connect a meter at output of sensor stage (TR5 emitter).

[VECTROUM]

Thank you for your awnser, may i ask wich pin of bc183c is the output?
e,c, or b?

Thank you in advance.

[FrancoItaly]

Thank you for your awnser, may i ask wich pin of bc183c is the output?
e,c, or b?

Thank you in advance.

e = emitter.

[VECTROUM]

Thank you mr.Franco.

I made the display stage with 3 leds based on the drawing of this post #2142, but i have a problem.
The buzzer rings(in low volume) even with the led of.
I have power 0f 1.25v on the buzzer even with the potenciometer in the lower setting.
I cant find any mistake, do you have something in mind about that?

Thank you in advance.

[FrancoItaly]

Thank you mr.Franco.

I made the display stage with 3 leds based on the drawing of this post #2142, but i have a problem.
The buzzer rings(in low volume) even with the led of.
I have power 0f 1.25v on the buzzer even with the potenciometer in the lower setting.
I cant find any mistake, do you have something in mind about that?

Thank you in advance.

put 2 or 3 diodes (low signal type) in series with buzzer or 2.2V zener.
the mistake is that the buzzer rings also with low voltage and that the operational output is not 12V but less.

[VECTROUM]

Hello mr.Franco.
I followed your correctionts and everything work ok.
I want to ask if it is possible to connect arduino as display
Device in order to visualise the values.

Thsnk you in advance.

[FrancoItaly]

Hello mr.Franco.
I followed your correctionts and everything work ok.
I want to ask if it is possible to connect arduino as display
Device in order to visualise the values.

Thsnk you in advance.

Yes is possible to use arduino as display.

[VECTROUM]

Yes is possible to use arduino as display.

Hello, i made the lrl as suggested, by following the helps but its still very sensitive to compass effect.
I have to lower the gain so much that is not catching the phenomenon.

[FrancoItaly]

Hello, i made the lrl as suggested, by following the helps but its still very sensitive to compass effect.
I have to lower the gain so much that is not catching the phenomenon.

Yes, too much amplification causes the compass effect, on the other hand I think the compass effect is part of what we call "phenomenon". The phenomenon "emerges" from that flow of energy that flows in the south / north direction, perhaps caused by the solar wind. If there is no phenomenon the flow is uniform and the lrl (which is immersed in this flow together with our body) reveals nothing. Currently I'm trying to understand if it is possible to reduce the compass effect, in this way it would be possible to increase the gain of the lrl. After all, it's the same thing you do with metal detectors where the effect of the ground is neutralized.

[Arash]

Hello Mr Franco
When this circuit is more sensitive to receiving frequency، Also is it more sensitive to the phenomenon?

[VECTROUM]

Yes, too much amplification causes the compass effect, on the other hand I think the compass effect is part of what we call "phenomenon". The phenomenon "emerges" from that flow of energy that flows in the south / north direction, perhaps caused by the solar wind. If there is no phenomenon the flow is uniform and the lrl (which is immersed in this flow together with our body) reveals nothing. Currently I'm trying to understand if it is possible to reduce the compass effect, in this way it would
be possible to increase the gain of the lrl. After all, it's the same thing you do with metal detectors where the effect of the ground is neutralized.



I noticed that the lrl is catching the east/west line and not the north/south.

[FrancoItaly]

Hello Mr Franco
When this circuit is more sensitive to receiving frequency، Also is it more sensitive to the phenomenon?

This is what I want to try, that is, if there is a frequency which the lrl is insensitive to the phenomenon but not to the compass effect.

[FrancoItaly]

I noticed that the lrl is catching the east/west line and not the north/south.

Are you sure it's the compass effect? There is also the sky effect that manifests itself by tilting the lrl upwards. The compass effect is recognized because proceeding in the north / south axis the signal always has the same intensity. However, reducing the gain these effects must disappear.

[zakari]

HI FRANCO ITALY

I WISH YOU AND YOUR WIFE TO BE OKY
I NOTICED IN YOUR CIRCUIT THE SELF OSCILATION IS VARIABLE AND NOT FIX DURING THE DAY AND NIGHT THERE FOR I PUT THE SWITCH KEY BEFORE OF 330 OHM RESISTOR OF CRISTAL AND ONE DOUBLE VOLUME 5KILO INSTEAD OF 1KILO RESISTORS OF TR3&TR4
FIRST I SWITCH OFF THE VOLTAGE OT XTAL THEN WITH VOLUME ADJUST THE OUTPUT VOLTAGE NEAR THE ZERO THEN SWITCH ON THE KEY

WITH THIS OPERATION I CONTROL SELF OSCILATION AND STABILITY OF CIRCUIT
EXCUSE ME FOR MY BAD ENGLISH




BEST REGARD
ZAKARI

[FrancoItaly]

[QUOTE=zakari;157199]HI FRANCO ITALY

I WISH YOU AND YOUR WIFE TO BE OKY
I NOTICED IN YOUR CIRCUIT THE SELF OSCILATION IS VARIABLE AND NOT FIX DURING THE DAY AND NIGHT THERE FOR I PUT THE SWITCH KEY BEFORE OF 330 OHM RESISTOR OF CRISTAL AND ONE DOUBLE VOLUME 5KILO INSTEAD OF 1KILO RESISTORS OF TR3&TR4
FIRST I SWITCH OFF THE VOLTAGE OT XTAL THEN WITH VOLUME ADJUST THE OUTPUT VOLTAGE NEAR THE ZERO THEN SWITCH ON THE KEY

WITH THIS OPERATION I CONTROL SELF OSCILATION AND STABILITY OF CIRCUIT
EXCUSE ME FOR MY BAD ENGLISH

If the sensor stage is correctly set up and calibrated, there must be no problems, such as differences in operation between day and night or different types of terrain. As suggested by a member during calibration, the antenna amplifier must be disconnected and once connected it is necessary to adjust the potentiometer (trimmer) for maximum sensitivity which is not necessarily the maximum gain. You talk about auto oscillation, but the sensor stage does not have to be in oscillation, it just has to amplify the signal coming from the quartz oscillator. You must follow everything I suggest in the helps.

[lord]

morgan: i cant understand very good to you, how put you the capacitors, in serie coil or in parallel? if you put in parallel modifing frecuence? in serie what can happen? any know? thanks i havent a frecuence generator, how you see at what frecuence resonate the rx?




hi my friend



what the best frequency for gold detect ?


how to build that frequency ?


how to make filter for receiver frequency ?


for detect 2m -3m underground detect >


Thanks form you:)

[edward]

hi
dear franco

i built your lrl the output voltage on tr5 emitter is 4 volts The machine has a reaction to
Fluorescent lamps from 10 cm
I tested your lrl on the 2 grams buried gold at 10 cm depht that was buried two years ago but no reaction
also i tested this on buried 15 * 15 cm copper bowl at 60 cm depht that was buried 4 years ago but no reaction
One of my friends built your device and tested it with a 1 watt fm transmitter on an ancient site i have this test clip send me your email to send this clip to you
But one thing in my friend's test is ambiguous for me He put a volt meter on the front panel. When he turns on the lrl, the volt meter shows zero, and when he approaches to the target the voltage rises to 10 volts
In your opinion, where can Volmetter be installed?
regards

[FrancoItaly]

hi my friend



what the best frequency for gold detect ?


how to build that frequency ?


how to make filter for receiver frequency ?


for detect 2m -3m underground detect >


Thanks form you:)

if you are referring to my lrl there is not a particular frequency for gold and I think we have a sensitivity over the meter, especially for metals buried for hundreds of years.

[FrancoItaly]

hi
dear franco

i built your lrl the output voltage on tr5 emitter is 4 volts The machine has a reaction to
Fluorescent lamps from 10 cm
I tested your lrl on the 2 grams buried gold at 10 cm depht that was buried two years ago but no reaction
also i tested this on buried 15 * 15 cm copper bowl at 60 cm depht that was buried 4 years ago but no reaction
One of my friends built your device and tested it with a 1 watt fm transmitter on an ancient site i have this test clip send me your email to send this clip to you
But one thing in my friend's test is ambiguous for me He put a volt meter on the front panel. When he turns on the lrl, the volt meter shows zero, and when he approaches to the target the voltage rises to 10 volts
In your opinion, where can Volmetter be installed?

regards

It is possible that the lrl is not sensitive enough, you followed the instructions of my helps.txt? Did you follow the north / south direction for research? The digital display can be connected to the output of the first operational where the threshold is set.

[lord]

if you are referring to my lrl there is not a particular frequency for gold and I think we have a sensitivity over the meter, especially for metals buried for hundreds of years.




how to work pulse induction detector for deep detect?:)

[FrancoItaly]

how to work pulse induction detector for deep detect?:)

With pulse induction metal detectors you can use very large heads, even more than 1 meter in diameter, and then you can get a great depth, even over 2 m. for large enough objects.

[edward]

It is possible that the lrl is not sensitive enough, you followed the instructions of my helps.txt? Did you follow the north / south direction for research? The digital display can be connected to the output of the first operational where the threshold is set.

i read your help.txt file and all pages of this threat then I made your lrl accurate
I found that the output voltage (emitter transistor 5) should be between 4 and 6 volts
Also, the sensitivity is directly related to capacitors c2,c3,c3, When i reduce the amount of these 1pf capacitors, for example, 4 or 5 in series, instead of 3 this will increase the sensivity ( when i touch the antenna the output voltage falls about 0.4 volts and when mobile phone is calling the lrl responds from 50 cm distance)
but the main problem is that by reducing the amount of these capacitors the output voltage falls below 3 volts and this is not in accordance with the instruction
but when i added the antenna amplifire the output voltage does not drop by touching the antenna but the lrl reacts when mobile phone calling from 2 meters

in your opinion how can sensivity be increased without reducing the output voltage???
this is my lrl
http://www.longrangelocators.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=20308&stc=1&d=1540651347

[lord]

With pulse induction metal detectors you can use very large heads, even more than 1 meter in diameter, and then you can get a great depth, even over 2 m. for large enough objects.




thank you every much my friend :):cheers:

[kazımabı67]

"supposed target" it is not the best test, you have to bury for example silver objects in a land free from metals, best first pass with the metal detector. After 1 month or more the phenomenon is noticeable.

hı.franco :which terminal of the lm358(-.+.end put)?thanks

[FrancoItaly]

i read your help.txt file and all pages of this threat then I made your lrl accurate
I found that the output voltage (emitter transistor 5) should be between 4 and 6 volts
Also, the sensitivity is directly related to capacitors c2,c3,c3, When i reduce the amount of these 1pf capacitors, for example, 4 or 5 in series, instead of 3 this will increase the sensivity ( when i touch the antenna the output voltage falls about 0.4 volts and when mobile phone is calling the lrl responds from 50 cm distance)
but the main problem is that by reducing the amount of these capacitors the output voltage falls below 3 volts and this is not in accordance with the instruction
but when i added the antenna amplifire the output voltage does not drop by touching the antenna but the lrl reacts when mobile phone calling from 2 meters

in your opinion how can sensivity be increased without reducing the output voltage???
this is my lrl
http://www.longrangelocators.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=20308&stc=1&d=1540651347

Decreasing the total value of C2 / C3 / C4 decreases the output signal but not the gain, then you can have, varying C2 / C3 / C4, for example 3V or 4V or 6V but the gain does not change and therefore the performances are the themselves. It is normal that by adding the antenna amplifier the lrl does not react anymore to the antenna touch, so first you need to calibrate the sensor stage in the original version, then with the antenna connected to the base of TR2 and then connect the antenna amplifier. As I have already said, the antenna amplifier allows you not to push the gain of the sensor stage as much as possible, with the risk of self-oscillation. In fact, the minor amplification will be compensated by the amplifier antenna.

[FrancoItaly]

hı.franco :which terminal of the lm358(-.+.end put)?thanks

Pin 4 = -V
Pin 8 = +V
Pin 1 = out 1
Pin 2 = in1 -
Pin 3 = in1 +
Pin 5 = in2+
Pin 6 = in2 -
Pin 7 = out 2

[HaFar2010]

Hello
Dear All.
I have a request. Please share PCB of Mr. Franco's LRL.
Thanks

[HaFar2010]

please PCB component

[edward]

Decreasing the total value of C2 / C3 / C4 decreases the output signal but not the gain, then you can have, varying C2 / C3 / C4, for example 3V or 4V or 6V but the gain does not change and therefore the performances are the themselves. It is normal that by adding the antenna amplifier the lrl does not react anymore to the antenna touch, so first you need to calibrate the sensor stage in the original version, then with the antenna connected to the base of TR2 and then connect the antenna amplifier. As I have already said, the antenna amplifier allows you not to push the gain of the sensor stage as much as possible, with the risk of self-oscillation. In fact, the minor amplification will be compensated by the amplifier antenna.

thank you for your reply mr franco

i did not notice the self oscillation test ( measuring of output voltage in tr5 emitter)??? should the measurement be with antenna or without the antenna????
With the antenna and without quartz I have 3 volts on the emitter of transistor 5, and when I disconnect the antenna, the voltage is zero.

[FrancoItaly]

thank you for your reply mr franco

i did not notice the self oscillation test ( measuring of output voltage in tr5 emitter)??? should the measurement be with antenna or without the antenna????
With the antenna and without quartz I have 3 volts on the emitter of transistor 5, and when I disconnect the antenna, the voltage is zero.

The self oscillation test must be with antenna.

[edward]

The self oscillation test must be with antenna.
I replaced c13 and 14 with a smaller quanities(470 or 330 pf) but there is no chande in output voltage
What is your opinion mr franco?

[FrancoItaly]

I replaced c13 and 14 with a smaller quanities(470 or 330 pf) but there is no chande in output voltage
What is your opinion mr franco?

You must increase C13/C14 for more gain.

[edward]

You must increase C13/C14 for more gain.
I have 3 volts in output with antenna and without quarts
So the sensor is self oscillation to avoid the self oscillation i need to zero the voltage i should decrease the c13 and c14 (according to help file)
But with decreasing c13 and c14 there is no change in output voltage

[FrancoItaly]

I have 3 volts in output with antenna and without quarts
So the sensor is self oscillation to avoid the self oscillation i need to zero the voltage i should decrease the c13 and c14 (according to help file)
But with decreasing c13 and c14 there is no change in output voltage

Try R10 = R12 = 1.5K for less gain.

[edward]

Try R10 = R12 = 1.5K for less gain.

I replaced r10 and r12 with 1.5 kohm but the output voltage is yet 3 volts

[FrancoItaly]

I replaced r10 and r12 with 1.5 kohm but the output voltage is yet 3 volts

Maybe the transistors have a too high amplification, try to use BC183B or BC549B for TR3 and TR4. Did you use the double-sided pcb with the lower face connected to the negative? If the sensor stage self oscillates too easily the fault can be of the pcb.

[edward]

Maybe the transistors have a too high amplification, try to use BC183B or BC549B for TR3 and TR4. Did you use the double-sided pcb with the lower face connected to the negative? If the sensor stage self oscillates too easily the fault can be of the pcb.

I used bc183c for tr1 to tr5

[FrancoItaly]

I used bc183c for tr1 to tr5

As I said try to use BC183B or BC549B for TR3 and TR4.

[FrancoItaly]

As I said try to use BC183B or BC549B for TR3 and TR4.

Also try C13/C14 = 220pF or 100pF

[edward]

Also try C13/C14 = 220pF or 100pF
I used 470 pf instead of 560 pf the voltage falls about 0.3 volts

[FrancoItaly]

I used 470 pf instead of 560 pf the voltage falls about 0.3 volts

The voltage must be about 0 volt, 0.3 V at the output means that there is at least 1 V of alternating voltage on the collector of TR4, the voltage drop of the diodes must be taken into account. As I said, put C13 / C14 = 220 pF or 100 pF.

[edward]

I used 470 pf instead of 560 pf the voltage falls about 0.3 voltshttp://www.longrangelocators.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=20312&stc=1&d=1541954038

http://www.longrangelocators.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=20311&stc=1&d=1541954013

[edward]

i tested 100 pf the voltage is about 1 volts when i put 20 pf for c13 and c14 the output is 0 volt but there is another problem when i connect the quartz the output is 0.6 volts

[FrancoItaly]

i tested 100 pf the voltage is about 1 volts when i put 20 pf for c13 and c14 the output is 0 volt but there is another problem when i connect the quartz the output is 0.6 volts

You have to increase the total value of C2 / C3 / C4, ie put only C2 = 1pF, if not enough it increases to 2pF until the output voltage is in the range 3 - 6V (non-critical).
Remember that with two or three capacitors in series the total capacity is less.

[erfan]

Hello every body
And hello dear franco italy
And a special thanks to franco italy.
Because he shared what ever he knows with no financial out look.I wish best for franco italy.

[FrancoItaly]

Hello every body
And hello dear franco italy
And a special thanks to franco italy.
Because he shared what ever he knows with no financial out look.I wish best for franco italy.

Thanks for the compliments, there can be real progress only with the collaboration of everyone. The "phenomenon" that allows the operation of the lrls is still largely unknown, but it is as real as many members have already been able to verify. As far as possible I help everyone in the realization of my lrl and take this opportunity to summarize the useful advice for the construction:
- the sensor stage has a very high gain and therefore there is the risk of self oscillations, it is advisable to use a double-sided pcb with the lower face connected to the negative and on the upper one the components will be soldered, no holes are necessary , only that, if necessary, to connect the upper mass to the screen constituted by the lower face of the pcb.
- the transistors are of the BC183C type or equivalent (for example BC549C or others), also the BC183B can be used as long as the beta (gain) is higher than 500.
- the total value of C2 / C3 / C4 establishes how much the quartz oscillator signal will be amplified by the sensor stage and therefore
determines the output value.
- C13 / C14 determine the gain of the sensor stage, in fact, increasing the value of C13 / C14 lowers the actual value of R10 / R12 (for the frequency of 8Mhz) and therefore increases the gain of the stage.
- On the TR2 base there is the mixing between the 8Mhz signal and the "phenomenon" captured by the stylus antenna.

[edward]

Thanks for the compliments, there can be real progress only with the collaboration of everyone. The "phenomenon" that allows the operation of the lrls is still largely unknown, but it is as real as many members have already been able to verify. As far as possible I help everyone in the realization of my lrl and take this opportunity to summarize the useful advice for the construction:
- the sensor stage has a very high gain and therefore there is the risk of self oscillations, it is advisable to use a double-sided pcb with the lower face connected to the negative and on the upper one the components will be soldered, no holes are necessary , only that, if necessary, to connect the upper mass to the screen constituted by the lower face of the pcb.
- the transistors are of the BC183C type or equivalent (for example BC549C or others), also the BC183B can be used as long as the beta (gain) is higher than 500.
- the total value of C2 / C3 / C4 establishes how much the quartz oscillator signal will be amplified by the sensor stage and therefore
determines the output value.
- C13 / C14 determine the gain of the sensor stage, in fact, increasing the value of C13 / C14 lowers the actual value of R10 / R12 (for the frequency of 8Mhz) and therefore increases the gain of the stage.
- On the TR2 base there is the mixing between the 8Mhz signal and the "phenomenon" captured by the stylus antenna.

Hi mr franco and thank you for your help

I tested bc548, bc547 b , bc 238b , bc 547c , and the results was same, my pcb is self oscillation, i have to use 20 pf capacitors for c13 , c14 to avoid from self oscilation
I think when i increase total value of c2 , c3 , c4 for increasing output voltage the lrl sensivity decreases

Now i have 2 question mr franco
1- how much is maximum amount that can be used for r10 and r12
2- does your lrl dont work with low voltage in output? ( for example 0.5 volts or 0.6 volts)

[FrancoItaly]

Hi mr franco and thank you for your help

I tested bc548, bc547 b , bc 238b , bc 547c , and the results was same, my pcb is self oscillation, i have to use 20 pf capacitors for c13 , c14 to avoid from self oscilation
I think when i increase total value of c2 , c3 , c4 for increasing output voltage the lrl sensivity decreases

Now i have 2 question mr franco
1- how much is maximum amount that can be used for r10 and r12
2- does your lrl dont work with low voltage in output? ( for example 0.5 volts or 0.6 volts)

1 -Usually it is chosen for R10 / R12 a value lower than that of R9 / R13. I made several copies of my lrl and I always managed to eliminate self oscillation. Try to remove C13 / C14, in this way it should stop oscillating, if so, decrease R10 / R12 until it oscillates again, then increase again R10 / R12 until the oscillations cease. For example R10 / R12 = 1 K no oscillations, R10 / R12 = 680 ohms no oscillations ... R10 / R12 = 220 ohms no oscillations, R10 / R12 = 100 ohms yes oscillations, choose R10 / R12 = 220 ohms. This difficulty in eliminating self oscillations makes me think of a defect in the pcb, there may be some parasitic coupling. I always recommend using a double-sided pcb.
2 - my lrl works also with low voltage output but for me it's better at least 2V, in fact it could happen when the installation was completed or in the field that the tension lowered further, in this way it would also greatly reduce the sensitivity, since it could not regulate the threshold effectively.

[edward]

Hi mr franco and thank you for your help

I tested bc548, bc547 b , bc 238b , bc 547c , and the results was same, my pcb is self oscillation, i have to use 20 pf capacitors for c13 , c14 to avoid from self oscilation
I think when i increase total value of c2 , c3 , c4 for increasing output voltage the lrl sensivity decreases


Now i have 2 question mr franco
1- how much is maximum amount that can be used for r10 and r12
2- does your lrl dont work with low voltage in output? ( for example 0.5 volts or 0.6 volts)

Hi mr franco

There is something interesting

When i use switching power supply the output voltage increases from 3 volts to 6 volts( without quartz)
I think this is because of long wire of switching power supply
The last test was with 2× 9 volts battery
I think self ocsilating has another reason
Before that i made your lrl sensor with your pcb layout and the results was same i had 3 volts in output without quartz
Both pcb was double side
What about the tr4 collector? how much should this voltage be?

[edward]

1 -Usually it is chosen for R10 / R12 a value lower than that of R9 / R13. I made several copies of my lrl and I always managed to eliminate self oscillation. Try to remove C13 / C14, in this way it should stop oscillating, if so, decrease R10 / R12 until it oscillates again, then increase again R10 / R12 until the oscillations cease. For example R10 / R12 = 1 K no oscillations, R10 / R12 = 680 ohms no oscillations ... R10 / R12 = 220 ohms no oscillations, R10 / R12 = 100 ohms yes oscillations, choose R10 / R12 = 220 ohms. This difficulty in eliminating self oscillations makes me think of a defect in the pcb, there may be some parasitic coupling. I always recommend using a double-sided pcb.
2 - my lrl works also with low voltage output but for me it's better at least 2V, in fact it could happen when the installation was completed or in the field that the tension lowered further, in this way it would also greatly reduce the sensitivity, since it could not regulate the threshold effectively.

I removed c13 , c14 and i had 6 volts in output without quartz
R10 , R12 was 1 k resistors i chenged these with 2× 5k potentiometers and i started to increasing the potentiometers in 4k for both output voltage were 0 volt

I have 8 volts in tr4 collector

[FrancoItaly]

I removed c13 , c14 and i had 6 volts in output without quartz
R10 , R12 was 1 k resistors i chenged these with 2× 5k potentiometers and i started to increasing the potentiometers in 4k for both output voltage were 0 volt

I have 8 volts in tr4 collector

Well, 6V in output it's ok. The only unknown is if the gain is sufficient, however the further gain of the antenna amplifier should compensate.

[edward]

1 -Usually it is chosen for R10 / R12 a value lower than that of R9 / R13. I made several copies of my lrl and I always managed to eliminate self oscillation. Try to remove C13 / C14, in this way it should stop oscillating, if so, decrease R10 / R12 until it oscillates again, then increase again R10 / R12 until the oscillations cease. For example R10 / R12 = 1 K no oscillations, R10 / R12 = 680 ohms no oscillations ... R10 / R12 = 220 ohms no oscillations, R10 / R12 = 100 ohms yes oscillations, choose R10 / R12 = 220 ohms. This difficulty in eliminating self oscillations makes me think of a defect in the pcb, there may be some parasitic coupling. I always recommend using a double-sided pcb.
2 - my lrl works also with low voltage output but for me it's better at least 2V, in fact it could happen when the installation was completed or in the field that the tension lowered further, in this way it would also greatly reduce the sensitivity, since it could not regulate the threshold effectively.
I conected the quartz and out put voltage is 0 volt

C13 , c14 removed
R10 , r12 4 kilo ohm
Quartz connected output voltage is 0 volt
Quartz disconnected out put voltage is 0 volt
Tr1 emitter frequency is 8 mega heartz
Tr4 collector voltage is 8 volt

And I am tired :lol:

[FrancoItaly]

Hi mr franco

There is something interesting

When i use a the output voltage increases from 3 volts to 6 volts( without quartz)
I think this is because of long wire of switching power supply
The last test was with 2× 9 volts battery
I think self ocsilating has another reason
Before that i made your lrl sensor with your pcb layout and the results was same i had 3 volts in output without quartz
Both pcb was double side
What about the tr4 collector? how much should this voltage be?

switching power supply is not recommended. May be in the laboratory there are other forms of disturbance, you have to try outside with battery power. It is not possible to measure the signal on the collector of TR4 with an oscilloscope because the signal disappears, the DC output measurement is sufficient. Also try to keep the antenna very short, 10 -15cm, inside the laboratory.

[FrancoItaly]

I conected the quartz and out put voltage is 0 volt

C13 , c14 removed
R10 , r12 4 kilo ohm
Quartz connected output voltage is 0 volt
Quartz disconnected out put voltage is 0 volt
Tr1 emitter frequency is 8 mega heartz
Tr4 collector voltage is 8 volt

And I am tired :lol:

DC voltage of TR4 collector must be about 5-6V but with R10=1K, by changing R10 also collector voltage changes. You have =0V with quartz because the gain is very poor, try C2 only (disconnect C3/C4) you have 1pF, if you have no result try 2pf or more.

[edward]

switching power supply is not recommended. May be in the laboratory there are other forms of disturbance, you have to try outside with battery power. It is not possible to measure the signal on the collector of TR4 with an oscilloscope because the signal disappears, the DC output measurement is sufficient. Also try to keep the antenna very short, 10 -15cm, inside the laboratory.
Yes mr franco i was thinking this is for laboratory i think the test should be outside the laboratory

[FrancoItaly]

Yes mr franco i was thinking this is for laboratory i think the test should be outside the laboratory

When I said that the measurement could not be performed with the scope I meant the 8MHz signal. Tell me the measurements of your sensor stage pcb, have you connected the lower part to the ground?

[edward]

When I said that the measurement could not be performed with the scope I meant the 8MHz signal. Tell me the measurements of your sensor stage pcb, have you connected the lower part to the ground?

Yes the lower part was connected to ground

[edward]

DC voltage of TR4 collector must be about 5-6V but with R10=1K, by changing R10 also collector voltage changes. You have =0V with quartz because the gain is very poor, try C2 only (disconnect C3/C4) you have 1pF, if you have no result try 2pf or more.

But if the laboratory is the reason this means when the lrl approaches the phenomenon the sensor start to self oscilating??

[FrancoItaly]

But if the laboratory is the reason this means when the lrl approaches the phenomenon the sensor start to self oscilating??

No, the lrl is also very sensible to many electromagnetic disturbances, also in my lab I have many signals.

[edward]

No, the lrl is also very sensible to many electromagnetic disturbances, also in my lab I have many signals.
In my laboratory there is laptop , wireless modem , swithching powersupply , osciloscope , near the pcb when i am testing and on the left and right sides of my laboratory there is tow stores with same instruments

[FrancoItaly]

In my laboratory there is laptop , wireless modem , swithching powersupply , osciloscope , near the pcb when i am testing and on the left and right sides of my laboratory there is tow stores with same instruments

sources of disturbance can be even a few meters away. Several years ago I was in an area with TV repeaters, in that place the lrl was practically unusable for a radius of at least 100m. The input circuit, L1 / C10, is tuned around 100Mhz, any transmitter on that frequency, or superior harmonic or sub harmonic, can generate a signal in the lrl.

[edward]

sources of disturbance can be even a few meters away. Several years ago I was in an area with TV repeaters, in that place the lrl was practically unusable for a radius of at least 100m. The input circuit, L1 / C10, is tuned around 100Mhz, any transmitter on that frequency, or superior harmonic or sub harmonic, can generate a signal in the lrl.
I tested the circuit in another place and the results was same

I have 7 volts in my output without quartz and c13 , c14 560pf
C2 , c3 , c4 = 1 pf r10 , r12 =1k
Does your lrl work with this state and without quartz? I have 6 to 7 volts in my aoutput and when i touch the antenna the voltage decreases about 200 milivolts

[FrancoItaly]

I tested the circuit in another place and the results was same

I have 7 volts in my output without quartz and c13 , c14 560pf
C2 , c3 , c4 = 1 pf r10 , r12 =1k
Does your lrl work with this state and without quartz? I have 6 to 7 volts in my aoutput and when i touch the antenna the voltage decreases about 200 milivolts

Yes, my lrl also works this way, in fact this lrl originated from an RF sniffer that self oscillated, later I wanted to create a lrl simpler to set up. I realized that the self-oscillation was due to the characteristics of the pcb.

[edward]

I tested the circuit in another place and the results was same

I have 7 volts in my output without quartz and c13 , c14 560pf
C2 , c3 , c4 = 1 pf r10 , r12 =1k
Does your lrl work with this state and without quartz? I have 6 to 7 volts in my aoutput and when i touch the antenna the voltage decreases about 200 milivolts
What do you think that i build your first schematic( self oscilation)? Which schematic is better?

[FrancoItaly]

What do you think that i build your first schematic( self oscilation)? Which schematic is better?

If the signal at the output is stable, there is no difference.

[edward]

Yes, my lrl also works this way, in fact this lrl originated from an RF sniffer that self oscillated, later I wanted to create a lrl simpler to set up. I realized that the self-oscillation was due to the characteristics of the pcb.
I will complete this pcb and will go to test point
I have a test point with 2 grams gold at 10 cm depth buried 3 years ago and a 15 cm copper bowl buried 5 years ago at 60 cm depht

[edward]

If the signal at the output is stable, there is no difference.
Output voltage is stabe at 6.6 volt and when i touch the antenna the voltage decreases 200 milivolts

[FrancoItaly]

Output voltage is stabe at 6.6 volt and when i touch the antenna the voltage decreases 200 milivolts

Well, it's ok.

[RS_Phil]

Well, it's ok.
Do you have update on your newly circuit my friend FrancoItaly, I mean a PCB?

[FrancoItaly]

Do you have update on your newly circuit my friend FrancoItaly, I mean a PCB?

No you have to change the original one or add a small pcb.

[erfan]

Hello franco Italy.
I put sample of L1 and L2 in your antenna adapter for example. I want to know if you mean antenna adapter like this.(Attached picture 3)
1.There is L1=3 TURNS inside which is connected to earth in one side and connected to C10 and capacitor 100pf in other side.
2.There is L2=2 TURNS outside which is connected to earth in one side and connected to antenna in other side.
Do you confirm all these?

[FrancoItaly]

Hello franco Italy.
I put sample of L1 and L2 in your antenna adapter for example. I want to know if you mean antenna adapter like this.(Attached picture 3)
1.There is L1=3 TURNS inside which is connected to earth in one side and connected to C10 and capacitor 100pf in other side.
2.There is L2=2 TURNS outside which is connected to earth in one side and connected to antenna in other side.
Do you confirm all these?

yes, I confirm. I recommend making this change (and the amplifier antenna) only after having developed the sensor stage in the original version.

[edward]

yes, I confirm. I recommend making this change (and the amplifier antenna) only after having developed the sensor stage in the original version.

Hi mr franco

I completed the lrl

I was wrong the pcb was not self oscillation the battry was corrupt

With the switching power supply your lrl pcb is self oscillation because in the switching is a potentiometer between vcc and gnd for setting the voltage this causes passing a little current

This is a really perfect treasure detector i dont tested it on my test area yet but i tested it on a really ancient site and this reacted to the main point with very high sensivity in all directions that my last buildings from this version didnt had any reaction

Thank you for every thing mr franco

Regards

[teo]

For all of you Franco when you say in the original version I was not aware of it

[FrancoItaly]

For all of you Franco when you say in the original version I was not aware of it

I post here my original lrl.

[teo]

thanks franco

[abdou2014]

https://ibb.co/ckb8768

https://ibb.co/WDFgrg4

is this winding method is right Mr Franco ?

[FrancoItaly]

https://ibb.co/ckb8768

https://ibb.co/WDFgrg4

is this winding method is right Mr Franco ?

Yes.

[abdou2014]

Thank you :)

[FrancoItaly]

Dear Franco

Would I use the metal case Bc108 instead of the Bc183C?

Yes, no problem.

[darkman]

hi guys :) miss you all >>

[abdou2014]

Thank you friend :)

[Arash]

hi All
I assembled this pcb and tested it
I TAKE RESULTS TO SENSE METAL

[abdou2014]

can you share Layout file ?

[darkman]

hi all :


Mr franco , abdu bro hope you are OK


what did you think of this Edition of your lrl ?



https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/1UPYUqfOlZWWKDLw6Egeap3AkVPBt-WVE?usp=sharing




thx

[abdou2014]

Nice job, I hope it will work :)

[FrancoItaly]

I just got home, I think your project is valid, the important thing is that it works.

[Geo]

Hello Franco.
Long time......
How are you ???

My wishes:)

[FrancoItaly]

Hello Franco.
Long time......
How are you ???

My wishes:)

Hi Geo,
I'm well and you? Unfortunately I am a long time away from home and from my laboratory and also from the research fields ... I hope you are luckier.

[Geo]

Oh yes, i am home with laborator at underground.
I have one month yet before begin the works at farm.
Yesterday i took a Xtal version to see (for another time) how it works and catch the phenomeno, or how phenomenon aplied at input circuit....
I connected the scope at collector of Tr2 (mixer) and gave signal with generator (via a small wire as antenna) at input. Without input signal i had a signal of 8Mhz at Tr2 but with input signal 120Mhz i had signal about 1Khz. Why???? where are the other frequences of mixer?? (120+ 8Mhz or 120-8Mhz or the same for harmonics)????
It works as to exist a LF filter at out of mixer. Any idea???

Regards

[FrancoItaly]

Oh yes, i am home with laborator at underground.
I have one month yet before begin the works at farm.
Yesterday i took a Xtal version to see (for another time) how it works and catch the phenomeno, or how phenomenon aplied at input circuit....
I connected the scope at collector of Tr2 (mixer) and gave signal with generator (via a small wire as antenna) at input. Without input signal i had a signal of 8Mhz at Tr2 but with input signal 120Mhz i had signal about 1Khz. Why???? where are the other frequences of mixer?? (120+ 8Mhz or 120-8Mhz or the same for harmonics)????
It works as to exist a LF filter at out of mixer. Any idea???

Regards

I have no idea, but the fact is that TR2 is not really a mixer that is used for frequency conversion, if I remember well in this case the signals must be very large to make TR2 work in a non-linear way, that is to say with distortion . In the case of my lrl signals of very small amplitude are mixed.
Regards

[mc_307]

hello my fiends.,
What's the latest working document on the circuit?
and was it really a friend who could work?

[humhum]

I Think that with Franco Xtal LRL , Lucky frequency can be is with 9.736,305 Mhz . ;)