Lrl from Italy

[Nicolas]

hi all
I Thank all our teachers for their good ruffle and exchange their experience notament mr nicola and Franco italy and of course all the others and that my testing of pcb lrl by Franco italy

Good work and nice Design Ouiarabe thanks for your cooperation and help all members
You are so Great my friend

[mustefa ubram]

Hi mustefa ubram
In your Lrl there is a spiral coil that is between the input and the stylus antenna, this is not in my design, perhaps it may be useful, but it could be not useful. Perhaps the phenomenom doesn't cross the spiral coil.

Best Regards
tank you franco.I picked the spiral coil of circuit.
franco one question:
How long should the antenna steel?

[moving]

Here, exactly this happens in my lrl Franco with CD4046, if I act on p1 so that the LED remains lit a bit, touching the "antenna and the LED spegne.Inoltre" should be inserted in a VU meter coil in series with the LED, to make it more "efficient reading the signal picked up again before the" lED lights up

[FrancoItaly]

The stylus antenna it's about 30cm, you can extend up to 1m, with more snsitivity, but it's possible the "compact effect".

[mustefa ubram]

tank you so much dear Franco

[mustefa ubram]

dear franco lrl with quarz osilator Should react to the TV or 50hz ac signal?

[FrancoItaly]

I don't know, now I'm not in Italy and I cannot make experiments, but if you touch the antenna input the signal DC goes low and this is a good test.

[brs]

Hello Francoa When you put L1 = 7 Turen you over the piece of allergies

[FrancoItaly]

Hi All
I want to make a summarized especially for new visitors of this forum. I state that I have no economic interest, in fact I am the only one who has provided all the details to build a working LRL. I intend to continue the work of Esteban who for health reasons can not be present in the forum. Esteban is the man who revealed the operation of Lrls, although it did not provide all the details and this out of respect for his cousin Alonzo. I think Alonzo, founder of Mineoro, be the first who discovered that the non-ferrous metals buried after a certain period of time emit anything that can be detected at meters away. This "phenomenon" can be revealed in different ways but its nature is unknown, we only know that interacts with other known phenomena, and this allows us to reveal it. I suspect that comes into play (also) some kind of electric field as in all my Lrls the transducer consists of a rod antenna in combination with a coil.
I also think that the frequency of operation is not very important, since LRL is practically a passive receiver and the internal oscillator does not affect the external environment. In fact the frequency of PD Alonzo is approximately 60Khz, that of the PD of Morgan is 77Khz and in my Lrls varies from 4 to 10Mhz (no appreciable difference). As far as the ionic sensor of some commercial lrls in my opinion you do not need but I could be wrong. However, they do not serve to distinguish gold from other metals. I hope my words encourage any of you to experience in this field and I can assure you that the "phenomenon" really exists and that you can build a lrl at low prices. Obviously, it takes some practice in electronics, to achieve pcb and it takes the normal laboratory equipment. You also need a test field with pieces of silver, coins, cutlery etc. buried at about 20 cm for a period of a few weeks or more, this depends on the type of terrain and I think the distance from the equator.

Best Regards

[FrancoItaly]

Hi All
The Lrls are very directional, sensitivity is highest in the direction from south to north,minimun from north to south and a average from west to east and vice versa. When you are just above the target the signal stops and this may be useful for a sort of pinpoint. The tests made by fluorescent lamps, Pc monitor or short circuit of a battery in my opinion are not useful, should at most indicates that the electronics work well. The Lrls are very sensitive to strong electromagnetic fields, near transmitters are virtually useless. Normally Lrls are very stable but if there is too much amplification we have the "compass effect", ie, if we turn the lrl away or closer to the north-south axis we have a strong signal. The best setting is to adjust the sensitivity until the effect disappears.

Best Regards

[Morgan]

thanks for the simple explanations about LRLs

most of your words are based on the Estebans basic school of the LRLs,however ,me,Geo,Max,Astrodetect,Andreas,J_player and many others give GREAT CLUES for the LRLs and the misteryous PHENOMENON.

Many people aske me,why I not partecipate in this forum so much as before...its becouse I arrive to a stage that is beyond the LRL explanations of this forum. I build the perft LRL for myself,its the PDK-3, this kind of device works on Hz frequencies and using one simple capacitor of pf I can adjust the sensitivity to locate gold or silver at amazing distance and depht.

I am not electronic engineer, my studies of electronics are very poor, but I have a field test with gold and silver buried many years ago and this aloud me to make many tests with LRLs and upgrade the PDKs, but the PDKs not work the same all around the world,of course they work as LRL very well in Portugal,Spain,Greece, but not very well in other countries as Italy ,Germany,UK etc

Anyway they already found many treasures...

Regards

[FrancoItaly]

Hi Morgan
Of course, you and others have contributed a lot, I meant to say that Esteban has made known to us all the world of Lrls and convinced us to continue with the research.

Best Regards

[nelson]

Yes Franco i think you are correct with your explanation of LRL´S

I also agree that may be the frequency is not important. I remeber if i´m not wrong that Esteban did some experiments at much higer frequencies seccesfully.

Good explanation and thanks for your support.
Regards
Nelson



Hi All
I want to make a summarized especially for new visitors of this forum. I state that I have no economic interest, in fact I am the only one who has provided all the details to build a working LRL. I intend to continue the work of Esteban who for health reasons can not be present in the forum. Esteban is the man who revealed the operation of Lrls, although it did not provide all the details and this out of respect for his cousin Alonzo. I think Alonzo, founder of Mineoro, be the first who discovered that the non-ferrous metals buried after a certain period of time emit anything that can be detected at meters away. This "phenomenon" can be revealed in different ways but its nature is unknown, we only know that interacts with other known phenomena, and this allows us to reveal it. I suspect that comes into play (also) some kind of electric field as in all my Lrls the transducer consists of a rod antenna in combination with a coil.
I also think that the frequency of operation is not very important, since LRL is practically a passive receiver and the internal oscillator does not affect the external environment. In fact the frequency of PD Alonzo is approximately 60Khz, that of the PD of Morgan is 77Khz and in my Lrls varies from 4 to 10Mhz (no appreciable difference). As far as the ionic sensor of some commercial lrls in my opinion you do not need but I could be wrong. However, they do not serve to distinguish gold from other metals. I hope my words encourage any of you to experience in this field and I can assure you that the "phenomenon" really exists and that you can build a lrl at low prices. Obviously, it takes some practice in electronics, to achieve pcb and it takes the normal laboratory equipment. You also need a test field with pieces of silver, coins, cutlery etc. buried at about 20 cm for a period of a few weeks or more, this depends on the type of terrain and I think the distance from the equator.

Best Regards

[reza vir]

Thanks Franco
Hi metals buried their frequencies will change
And have no fixed frequency treasure
This frequency change at any time due to soil chemical
But all treasure is a fixture that creates a magnetic field around them to Hala.

Thanks and regards

[Sneshko]

Dear friends!
When it comes to the Phenomenon, I have come to the following conclusion:
- The local magnetic field has a large effect on the frequency with which it is possible to register a Phenomenon created around the buried object;
- The chemical composition of the soil, mineralization of soil moisture and have a strong influence on the length of time required for creating the Phenomenon;
- Length of time that the facility is spent buried in the soil influences the strength of the Phenomenon;
- Local climate conditions have an important impact on the detection of Phenomena in the search field.
Everything you need to know when it is desired to detect the Phenomenon!
Regards!
Sneshko

[Nicolas]

Dear friends!
When it comes to the Phenomenon, I have come to the following conclusion:
- The local magnetic field has a large effect on the frequency with which it is possible to register a Phenomenon created around the buried object;
- The chemical composition of the soil, mineralization of soil moisture and have a strong influence on the length of time required for creating the Phenomenon;
- Length of time that the facility is spent buried in the soil influences the strength of the Phenomenon;
- Local climate conditions have an important impact on the detection of Phenomena in the search field.
Everything you need to know when it is desired to detect the Phenomenon!
Regards!
Sneshko

Hi dear Snezhko it is all right you say. but I would add if you have a receiver and a transmitter you should find resonance frequency between the two
because the frequency is very low according to my tests and my experiences. may be it is high but I did not find results at least in my country. and I confirm this.

[Avanturis]

Hello Franco!!! For this locator can you do PCB please, I am an amateur for this but am interested,if possible!!
Best regards!!!!!!

[Avanturis]

:frown: I forgot also C18, it's 4.7 nF.


Hello Franco!!! For this locator can you do PCB please, I am an amateur for this but am interested,if possible!!
Best regards!!!!!!

[Avanturis]

[/PHP]Hello Franco!!! For this locator can you do PCB please, I am an amateur for this but am interested,if possible!!
Best regards!!!!!!

[Avanturis]

For this shematic !!!

[FrancoItaly]

This is not mine, it comes from the forum, I have not tested but I thing it's working. I have not a decent Pcb to show.

Best Regards

[Avanturis]

Thanks Franco,one more question,please:
Can the 70 circles of the antenna wire to be of dimension 0,40mm?
Thanks and best regards

[FrancoItaly]

The wire isn't critic, 0.2 to 0,4 works ok, but also an antenna stylus or a brass rod works also well without coil.
Best Regards

[Avanturis]

Thank you so much Franco!!
Best regards

[mustefa ubram]

hi franco
how are you today dear ?
franco Please explain a little about the details L1?(TURN-NUMBER WIRE- Diameter OF coil-
Capacity?)
I built with wire diameter 10 mm diameter of coil 10 mm and 3round
is this correct ?

[detectoman]

in my field where i buried 30 coper coins in past months i try my pd then i take a further signal, then after i of new try my pd the signal dissapared i can understand those pd need a atmosferic conditions specifis for operation

en mi campo donde yo pruebo enterre 30 monedas de coobre, en pasados meses yo probe mi pd lrl entonces yo obtuve una fuerte señal, entonces despues de nuevo meses despues yo pruebo mi pd y la señal desaparecio, yo puedo entender que estas pd necesitan especificas condiciones atmosfericas para funcionar, tal vez aun las etapas de la luna les afecten, las alineaciones planetarias, el sol y la temporada del año :)

[mustefa ubram]

hi franco
how are you today dear ?
franco Please explain a little about the details L1?(TURN-NUMBER WIRE- Diameter OF coil-
Capacity?)
I built with wire diameter 10 mm diameter of coil 10 mm and 3round
is this correct ?
hi franco
i have a question:rolleyes:

[FrancoItaly]

Hi Mustefa,
Now I'm in Italy, before I don't see your post. Yes the coil is 10mm diameter, long 10mm and 3 turns. The capacitor is 22pF but today I have used a variable capacitor 4-20pF and in the next day I go in my test field. perhaps I can discriminate gold...
Best Regards

[mustefa ubram]

Hi Mustefa,
Now I'm in Italy, before I don't see your post. Yes the coil is 10mm diameter, long 10mm and 3 turns. The capacitor is 22pF but today I have used a variable capacitor 4-20pF and in the next day I go in my test field. perhaps I can discriminate gold...
Best Regards
Tank you very much franco

[mahinda]

hi..... I am mahinda ...please send this circuit diagrams with details
thank you

[FrancoItaly]

Look here:

http://www.longrangelocators.com/forums/showthread.php?t=18933&page=9

[FrancoItaly]

The coil L1 is better if it consists of 2 turns and for greater sensitivity you must shield the entire box with aluminum adhesive except the cover of the input stage, as seen from the photos. The shielding must be connected to the ground of the input circuit. The handle must be at least 20 cm long with a diameter of 4 cm or 5cm, also to have maximum sensitivity you must hold the handle with both hands. The best antenna is a stylus 80cm-100cm. With 30cm it has the minimum sensitivity, the greater the length the greater the sensitivity. With these changes, it is possible to detect targets that were previously ignored, such as, for example, short time metals buried (1 month or more) in your test field.

[mustefa ubram]

The coil L1 is better if it consists of 2 turns and for greater sensitivity you must shield the entire box with aluminum adhesive except the cover of the input stage, as seen from the photos. The shielding must be connected to the ground of the input circuit. The handle must be at least 20 cm long with a diameter of 4 cm or 5cm, also to have maximum sensitivity you must hold the handle with both hands. The best antenna is a stylus 80cm-100cm. With 30cm it has the minimum sensitivity, the greater the length the greater the sensitivity. With these changes, it is possible to detect targets that were previously ignored, such as, for example, short time metals buried (1 month or more) in your test field.
hi franco.how are you ?
Congratulations Excellent.Why did you shield box?
What was the material of the box?wood or plastic?
If the box be made ​​of wood, does need a shield?
What is your opinion on fiber Pulygan?

[FrancoItaly]

Hi Mustefa,

The material is plastic and I think that any type is fine. By shielding the LRL is more sensitive with no false signals caused by the human body and, as I said, the higher sensitivity can make the difference in whether or not to reveal the buried metal used as a test. I do not know how does the wood, but you can try.

Best Regards

[WM6]

Wood is hygroscopic and can easily change its properties.

Wood is not really suitable for such sensitive design, even impregnated and lacquered not.

[FrancoItaly]

Hi WM6,

I agree with you, wood is poor insulator and poor electrical conductor, but with the aluminum shield I think that you can use. I prefer to use plastic panels that I find with ease.

Best regards

[brs]

HI franco

More sensitive L1 8turen

[brs]

http://cdn.top4top.net/i_50a7c8466d1.jpg

[FrancoItaly]

HI brs,
This is my lrl? What is the coil in the upper side of the box?
Best Regards

[mustefa ubram]

franco in your lrl with 8mhz frq and cap 22p The inductance L1 is about 180 Nanohenries ?true?
http://chemelec.com/Calculators/LC-Calculator.htm

[brs]

Hi Franco
This two in one device below the passive receiver only of Andreas and the top of your device

[brs]

TV almost 5meters led first Lights
two meters led first and led The second lights
After the one-meterThree lights on.
Sorry Translator Use

[brs]

Is it true Francoa amendments
P1= 10k
P2= 680k
L1 = 8 turen wire ,50mm

[FrancoItaly]

Hi Mustefa,

these data are ok.

Best Regards

[FrancoItaly]

Hi brs,
I will try the coil with 8 turns but with 3 turns and up to 100pF for the capacitor I had no results. Probably every country requires a particular frequency.
Best Regards

[Bill512]

Hi Franco, this is my version of your LRL ,the one with the 4046.
First of all, I want to say a big thanks to you, for sharing these schematics.
I don't know if these LRL actually working, but I strongly believe that you believe in these.
And this matters, sharing with everyone in this forum, something personally precious.
This ,at my opinion ,is the true spirit of collaboration in this forum.
Thanks again.:)
Bill

[FrancoItaly]

Hi Bill512,
Good work, I want to add that in this LRL can be added also the measure of the signal amplitude as in the LRL with quartz at 8MHz, in fact the amplifier is the same in the two cases. I have done this in a particular LRL to see if there were differences between the various metals by comparing measurements of phase and amplitude, but it seems that there is no difference.
Regards

[daniel]

Hi there

do someone have a PCB preferably in black and white from the LRL from post 68 ?

thanks very much

[Bill512]

Hi Bill512,
Good work, I want to add that in this LRL can be added also the measure of the signal amplitude as in the LRL with quartz at 8MHz, in fact the amplifier is the same in the two cases. I have done this in a particular LRL to see if there were differences between the various metals by comparing measurements of phase and amplitude, but it seems that there is no difference.
Regards
Hi Franco,
while playing around with the FrancoPPL, I noticed that close to power sources or close to "potencial anomalies from buried metals", the Led goes off.
The same happens in the voltage at pin 1 of the LM358.
Is this normal? or maybe there is some mistake in my PCB?
regards

[Geo]

Hi Franco, this is my version of your LRL ,the one with the 4046.
First of all, I want to say a big thanks to you, for sharing these schematics.
I don't know if these LRL actually working, but I strongly believe that you believe in these.
And this matters, sharing with everyone in this forum, something personally precious.
This ,at my opinion ,is the true spirit of collaboration in this forum.
Thanks again.:)
Bill


Hey Bill artist....:lol:

[FrancoItaly]

HI Bill512,
If you are sure that in the presence of metals buried by the time the LED goes out, then you have to connect R5 to pin not inverting of LM358 and the cursor of P3 to R6 (inverting pin). While the phenomenon always causes an increase of the signal is possible that the phase change is acting contrary to your Llrl or in your country. In my LRL output of the CD4046 (pin 2) there is a negative change that is reversed by the LM358 because it is necessary that the signal increases to turn on the LED.
regards

[mustefa ubram]

hi franco
I'd attach a uv meter with microcontroller for 8mhz circuit .I want to know what part of input uv meter should be connected of 8mhz circuit?
Is located in the center of the phenomenon changes the overall frequency of the oscillator?

[Bill512]

Hey Bill artist....:lol:

thanks Geo.
Probably, this LRL it will be a nice experimental instrument.:)

[Bill512]

HI Bill512,
If you are sure that in the presence of metals buried by the time the LED goes out, then you have to connect R5 to pin not inverting of LM358 and the cursor of P3 to R6 (inverting pin). While the phenomenon always causes an increase of the signal is possible that the phase change is acting contrary to your Llrl or in your country. In my LRL output of the CD4046 (pin 2) there is a negative change that is reversed by the LM358 because it is necessary that the signal increases to turn on the LED.
regards
thanks for the reply Franco.
For the moment, I will leave it "as is".
The point is to find buried metals and explore further the associated phenomena.
So, the inverted output is not a big issue.

[Geo]

Bill, did you test it at Leon's field test???
It must locate the buried gold coin

Regards

[FrancoItaly]

Hi Mustefa,
You can connect the Vmeter at the out of IC1A.
Regards

[mustefa ubram]

franco in your lrl with 8mhz frq and cap 22p The inductance L1 is about 180 Nanohenries ?true?
http://chemelec.com/Calculators/LC-Calculator.htm
franco i think this is mistak.with cap 22p and 180nh resonance is for L1 79mhz.for 8mhz we need 18microhenri self.with this resonance we need 18turn of 1mm wire with 1cm diameter.
What is opinion?

[Bill512]

Bill, did you test it at Leon's field test???
It must locate the buried gold coin

Regards

not yet George, but I think that it would be a difficult task - this gold coin is buried deep (+90cm).

[reza vir]

If you use coins from 1 to 10 cm
If the number of coins you in more depth
Depending on the size and durability of metal in the soil Zaid

[Geo]

not yet George, but I think that it would be a difficult task - this gold coin is buried deep (+90cm).
Yes it is deep but we catch the phenomenon with the other lrl....

[Geo]

Hi HOBBIT
Tune P1 for about 3Mhz, tune P2 for about 1-6V (AC signal) at point X and at pin2 (phase comparator output) a DC signal 0.5-6V. This is not a metal detector and hand tests serve little. As I said and I repeat here there is no other way to test the lrls, you must have a long buried metal that is in same place at least a few months (for my experience) or to know a place where there is surely a long buried metal. An empirical system is exploiting the compass effect, you need to adjust the gain towards the maximum sensitivity until you have the compass effect then you have to lower the gain until it disappears. This happens with my lrl.
Best Regards

Hi Franco.
Yesterday i tried to adjust the lrl properly.
It was unable to make it oscillate at 3 Mhz so i replace the capacitor from 68p to 47 pf.
Now output at pin 3,4 is square signal 3 mhz. Signal at point X is triangular 6V but at pin2 is not DC but a not clear triangular. Is it right???

Regards

[reza vir]

Hey why do not you instead of 8 MHz to 3 MHz frequency do you use?
Do you have any particular reason?
Most devices operate below 1 MHz?

[Nicolas]

Hi Franco.
Yesterday i tried to adjust the lrl properly.
It was unable to make it oscillate at 3 Mhz so i replace the capacitor from 68p to 47 pf.
Now output at pin 3,4 is square signal 3 mhz. Signal at point X is triangular 6V but at pin2 is not DC but a not clear triangular. Is it right???

Regards

Correct Geo and this is not right !!!!! Waiting our Colleagues Franco to explain this
Than Geo

[Geo]

Hey why do not you instead of 8 MHz to 3 MHz frequency do you use?
Do you have any particular reason?
Most devices operate below 1 MHz?

Schematic with PLL (4046) works at 3 Mhz not 8 Mhz.
At 8 Mhz works other schematic that uses Xtal.

[reza vir]

Thanks Geo
Which of the three circuits are better looking?
Regards

[Geo]

Look at #302, 8Mhz sensor stage...

[FrancoItaly]

Hi Geo,
It's correct the capacitor for VCO of CD4046, it depends on type of IC, the phase comparator output (pin 2) is an AC signal, is normally a rectangular wave with variable duty cycle, but at the maximum frequency of the CD4046 can also be triangular, however, I am referring to a measure DC voltage rms value. As for the output X is perhaps better a lower value to make sure that there is no saturation, to achieve what should be decreased P2, if in spite of this you do not have a result decrease C8 and C9 and as a last resort you have to disconnect C8 or C9, in this way will be the parasitic capacitance to bring the signal to the base of TR2. I built 2 copies of this LRL and work well but I realize that it is more simple to build version with the quartz oscillator. The oscillator frequency is not critical and it goes from 3Mhz to 10Mhz may be necessary to change the value of C1 in the oscillator stage. I want to add that to be sure that the amplifier stage does not come in oscillation you have to use a double-sided pcb, the lower side connected to ground and the components soldered on the top side and you have to use another pcb for oscillator stage. I hope that with this aid all of you can build my LRL.
Best Regards

[mustefa ubram]

Hi franco thank you for replays.
please read post 307

[indiana jones]

Today I made the lrl Franco.

pcb is ready



http://s18.postimg.org/ymdopmo15/fffffffffffffff.jpg (http://postimage.org/)

[mustefa ubram]

this is my new pcb of lrl franco.2 layers and with pulygan;)

[daniel]

Wow great work Indiana & Mustefa!

Does someone have this *.lay file from FrancoItaly 2nd LRL please? I want to build the device but Im using a DIY CNC router to create PCB.



http://www.longrangelocators.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=18810&stc=1&d=1392062019

[FrancoItaly]

Hi Mustefa,
The resonant frequency of L1 and 22pF capacitor is not connected with the oscillator frequency but is related to the phenomenon and is quite critical and perhaps depends on the country. In my country and in Switzerland also work well for L1 2 turns, but do not turn 1 and not working 47-68-82pF capacitors. Great work for your pcb and for this of Indiana Jones.
Best Regards

[indiana jones]

[QUOTE=daniel;150214]Wow great work Indiana & Mustefa!

Does someone have this *.lay file from FrancoItaly 2nd LRL please? I want to build the device but Im using a DIY CNC router to create PCB.



I have this file in .pcb for pcb wizard

http://s27.postimg.org/68vq3dy9b/franco.jpg (http://postimg.org/image/68vq3dy9b/)

[daniel]

[QUOTE=daniel;150214]Wow great work Indiana & Mustefa!

Does someone have this *.lay file from FrancoItaly 2nd LRL please? I want to build the device but Im using a DIY CNC router to create PCB.


I have this file in .pcb for pcb wizard

http://s27.postimg.org/68vq3dy9b/franco.jpg (http://postimg.org/image/68vq3dy9b/)


That would also be great! I will then download the trial version of PCB Wizard. Thank you very much Indiana.

[Nicolas]

Wow great work Indiana & Mustefa!

Does someone have this *.lay file from FrancoItaly 2nd LRL please? I want to build the device but Im using a DIY CNC router to create PCB.



http://www.longrangelocators.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=18810&stc=1&d=1392062019


Hi Daniel I have find you this For Franco LRL2

http://s01.arab.sh/i/00011/9q9by38w7dlu.png

[daniel]

Thanks Nicolas!

[daniel]

I've built FrancoItaly's LRL2 from post 68. Instead of the stylus antenna I've used simple coil (like the one from FreePDK). See the attached photo.

I don't have buried metals but did test with TV and it works from 4 meters away and through concrete walls! Potentiometer P3 is super sensible but if adjusted well then if target is recognized it starts to blink. Maybe with a precision multiturn potentiometer it will be easier to adjust.

PS. With stylus antenna it does not react to TV.

[Nicolas]

Hi Daniel nice job and work. Use multiturn for precision is so better. And try to use ferrite coil with frequency 75khz is so better for gold
My congratulation

[FrancoItaly]

Hi daniel,
The test with the tv is not significant, my lrl with stylus antenna practically does not react to any signal, if not very close, but feels the phenomenon. I repeat once more that needs to be done tests with metals buried at least 1 month.
Regards

[mustefa ubram]

HI FRANCO
HOW ARE YOU DEARE FREIND?
What is the minimum and maximum voltage output in ic1a?
what is voltage range in output ic1a?

[daniel]

Did tests today with buried metal (Iron rods that are over 30 years buried) but no signal at all. Tried both antennas stylus and mono coil. Nada nothing :-( thats a bit of frustrating. Only TV and fluorescent lamps works.

I 've also put a variable capacitor for stylus antenna C11 (5 - 27pf) to see if something changes but its the same it doesnt work for me.

Anyone here with positive results? Did you found something buried with this LRL? Im very interested because maybe I build something wrong.

[mustefa ubram]

Hi freind.
i think frnco told this lrl working only for non magnetic metals same copper or solver.dont work for magnetic metal

[Geo]

Franco do you remember how much is the signal at emitter of TR1 at schema with xtal 8Mhz??
I constructed a new ground plane pcb but something is not going right.

Regards:)

[FrancoItaly]

Hi Geo,
The important thing is that there is a signal at the output of TR1, about 2V - 5V, as I mentioned with the quartz disconnected there should be no DC voltage signal at the output, and with quartz connected you need to choose C2, C3, C4 for a DC signal (about 2-5V). The best solution is a double-sided PCB with the lower face connected to ground and with the components soldered on the top face.
Regards

[mustefa ubram]

HI FRANCO
HOW ARE YOU DEARE FREIND?
What is the minimum and maximum voltage output in ic1a?
what is voltage range in output ic1a?

franco please reply to this post

[FrancoItaly]

Hi Mustefa,
If you refer to PLL schematic we have IC2A, not IC1A and the important thing is that at PIN 2 of IC1 there is a DC voltage 1-6V (measured with a DC voltmeter, with scope we have an impulse segnal). The IC2A output must be regulated by P3 for better threshold.
Regards

[FrancoItaly]

Hi daniel,
As mustefa said the Lrls do not respond to iron target and this is a good luck... For me it works well 2 or 3 turns for L1 with 22pF and this for my country and in Switzerland, you can try 4 or more turns but remember you must have a long time buried metal for test.
Regards

[FrancoItaly]

Hi mustefa,
I don't see IC1A, what it you're referring to?
Regards

[mustefa ubram]

Hi Mustefa,
If you refer to PLL schematic we have IC2A, not IC1A and the important thing is that at PIN 2 of IC1 there is a DC voltage 1-6V (measured with a DC voltmeter, with scope we have an impulse segnal). The IC2A output must be regulated by P3 for better threshold.
Regards
Hi franco my porpose is 8mhz crystal osilator tape lrl.i want out put voltage range in the pin 1 ic1a (358?
thank you very much
http://www.longrangelocators.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=19136&stc=1&d=1410968976


http:// http://www.longrangelocators.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=19136&stc=1&d=1410968976

[Geo]

Hi Geo,
The important thing is that there is a signal at the output of TR1, about 2V - 5V, as I mentioned with the quartz disconnected there should be no DC voltage signal at the output, and with quartz connected you need to choose C2, C3, C4 for a DC signal (about 2-5V). The best solution is a double-sided PCB with the lower face connected to ground and with the components soldered on the top face.
Regards

Hi Franco.
Thanks for your answer.
I made a double side pcb but i have the upper face connected to gnd, i think there is not problem. I adjusted the capacitors so to have a dc out of 4.1 v but when i touch the antenna the out goes up, don't lowers as you wrote at other thread. Who is your opinion?????

Regards

[FrancoItaly]

Hi Geo,
This case has never occurred in my lrls (I've built a dozen lrls) for some unknown reason your LRL works in reverse mode. Try it out on the field and see how it behaves with the phenomenon, basically touch the antenna is an empirical way to test the LRL.
Regards

[mustefa ubram]

Hi Franco.
Thanks for your answer.
I made a double side pcb but i have the upper face connected to gnd, i think there is not problem. I adjusted the capacitors so to have a dc out of 4.1 v but when i touch the antenna the out goes up, don't lowers as you wrote at other thread. Who is your opinion?????

Regards

HI GEO
if you made lrl 8mhz tayp.Please measure the output of IC1a.I want the minimum voltage in stand by system and maximum voltage When it reacts.i want for connect to the micro?
thant you

[FrancoItaly]

Hi Mustefa,
The pin 1 of IC1A must be at a more low voltage of the connection point between R5 and R6, and in this way all the LEDs are off and this is achieved by adjusting P1. If you want a more soft regulation of P1 you have to add a resistor on the ground side and must be calculated in such a way that with P1 rotated fully clockwise to the first LED is lit and the buzzer is on. You have to remember that adjusting P2 (gain) varies the output of IC1A and then you must also adjust P1.
Regards

[mustefa ubram]

Hi Mustefa,
The pin 1 of IC1A must be at a more low voltage of the connection point between R5 and R6, and in this way all the LEDs are off and this is achieved by adjusting P1. If you want a more soft regulation of P1 you have to add a resistor on the ground side and must be calculated in such a way that with P1 rotated fully clockwise to the first LED is lit and the buzzer is on. You have to remember that adjusting P2 (gain) varies the output of IC1A and then you must also adjust P1.
Regards
thank you franco
I want to connect the output voltage to the micro.maximum input voltage for micro is 5v.I want to know the maximum and minimum output voltage for potentiometer designed for voltage 5V.
please help me?
thank you

[FrancoItaly]

Hi Mustefa,
I think that the best solution is to power IC1 with 5V instead of 12V, adjusts the output of the sensor stage to approximately 2V and put one 5V zener to non inverting input of IC1A and ground.
Regards

[daniel]

Hi Franco.
Thanks for your answer.
I made a double side pcb but i have the upper face connected to gnd, i think there is not problem. I adjusted the capacitors so to have a dc out of 4.1 v but when i touch the antenna the out goes up, don't lowers as you wrote at other thread. Who is your opinion?????

Regards

Have the same problem with LRL2 sometimes it goes in reverse mode. Seems like it has to do with signals around you. To avoid that I turn Pot3 all the way down and only then I power up the cirucit. I wait 10sec for it to settle down.
Now I turn Pot3 up until the LED lights up. Then I turn it a little bit down until the LED goes off. Now I can move around and find my TV in 4 meters distance :-) and LED goes on.

If I go very very near to the TV then sometimes it goes in reverse mode and LED goes out when it finds the TV. Seems like if the signal is to high it switches in reverse mode.

[Geo]

Thanks daniel.
I use LRL3 with other display schematic so i can't try what you say.
Maybe a good box with shield to be a good solution

Regards:)

[mustefa ubram]

hi franco
please see
The closed circuit opamp non-inverting and And increasing the voltage method.Why in practice it does not work?When the maximum is rv4 voltage output is 10/5 volt .By touching the pin base of transistor2 voltage decreases to 0.5 V.why?I thought that the sense phenomenon on the output voltage increases linearly:shrug:
What is Duty rv4?Please explain about class opamp?

[FrancoItaly]

Hi mustefa,
I cannot open your file, are you referring to 5Volt modification?
Regards

[mustefa ubram]

Hi mustefa,
I cannot open your file, are you referring to 5Volt modification?
Regards

hi franco
I did not modify to 5volt.I want to change the output voltage from 0 to5
please explain about opamp class and rv4 in this scematic?

[FrancoItaly]

Hi mustefa,
there is an error, pin 2 (inverting input) must be connected to R14 and gain potenziometer and the other side of R14 must be connected to RV4 cursor.
Regards

[Avanturis]

Hi mustefa,
there is an error, pin 2 (inverting input) must be connected to R14 and gain potenziometer and the other side of R14 must be connected to RV4 cursor.
Regards



Hello Franco !!!!
I built your LRL but not completed, you posted to see if it is built correctly.
I need your help please if you have time look !!!
1 Where to connect the antenna with 70 turns (wire is 0,40mm)?
2. Did is correct (-) polarization of the battery to connect to mass GROUND .... or where to connect?
3. Is there a way to measure the power of electricity for P2 (1-6V) or should be set on the spot where I had buried object?
Please explain to me!!
This is picture

[FrancoItaly]

Hi Avanturis,
The coil antenna or (better) the stylus antenna must be connected to 3 turns coil.
It is correct (-) polarization of the battery to connect to mass GROUND.
All measurements can be performed in the laboratory in the absence of metal buried. The two terminals of the coil antenna must be connected together and only one wire goes to the 3 turns coil, but, I repeat, it's better the stylus antenna.
Regards

[AurumKid]

Hi Franco.
Im from Philippines.
Im curious about your work. which diagram should I build, which is better with stability? the 1st or 2nd with 4066 or the last with xtal? I'm confused

[FrancoItaly]

Hi Aurumkic,
The better, more simple, it's with quarz.
Regards

[Avanturis]

Hi Avanturis,
The coil antenna or (better) the stylus antenna must be connected to 3 turns coil.
It is correct (-) polarization of the battery to connect to mass GROUND.
All measurements can be performed in the laboratory in the absence of metal buried. The two terminals of the coil antenna must be connected together and only one wire goes to the 3 turns coil, but, I repeat, it's better the stylus antenna.
Regards


Thanks FrancoItaly!
Regards

[mustefa ubram]

hi franco.
i made your lrl 8mhz tayp with quartz
I used the output of the micro.I connected to the input adc micro to pin emitter transistor 5.The voltage at the emitter of transistor 5 is 6 volts in standby mode.When touch the antenna decreases the voltage of about 0.5 volts.this is correct?
i used a variable capicator for lc circuit 0-70pf.with change capicator The output voltage change.
I removed the opamp circuit.Micro is able to measure the voltage change of about 1 mV.I used a 4 x 20 LCD. The change is about 1 mV full of a character of 20 characters.I measured with an accuracy of 1 mV to 20 mV change.I think this is a very high sensitivity.
Now I have a question for you:
When the steel antenna sense phenomenon.Whether the output voltage increases or decreases the output voltage as when the antenna is touched?
What level is the change of voltage ?Much more than 0.5 volts or 0.5 volts?

[FrancoItaly]

Hi Mustefa,
When you touch the antenna the voltage decreases with the phenomenon the voltage increases. The level of change voltage may be about 0.5V or more or less, I think it's not critical. By touching the antenna it's a way for testing the lrl. The sensitivity of your micro I think is too much, it's possible you sense the compass effect.
Regards

[v_gh]

Hi, I'm from Iran
I need a good gold detector, one can not help me?

[mustefa ubram]

hi franco
how are you today?:)
What is the best value for the capacitor?LC circuit?
I used a variable capacitor 0-70p.The output voltage is increased or decreased by changing amount of capacitor.
How to adjust capacitor?The minimum or maximum output voltage?

[FrancoItaly]

Hi mustefa,
for me the better is 3 turns and 22pF, the output 2V - 6V.
Regards

[mustefa ubram]

Hi mustefa,
for me the better is 3 turns and 22pF, the output 2V - 6V.
Regards
ok franco.
for detect 2v is best or 6v?

[mustefa ubram]

hi franco
I've tested the old buried metal.I've buried two copper bowls 6 months ago.i tested .
But it was futile:frown::frown::frown::frown::frown:why?

[FrancoItaly]

hi mustefa,
test different directions and different angles of the antenna, it's also possible that the copper do not emit. For my test I have used silver and gold.
Regards

[mustefa ubram]

Hi Nicolas
At the time I did only test on the test but Rubin with my Lrl revealed a buried copper plate from 25 years to a depth of 60 cm to 4 m in South/North direction and 2.5 m in East/West direction.
Best Regards
hi franco
In this post you said you could reveal a copper plate.So can detect copper?
Or you could say that detect non-magnetic metals such as aluminum.
Which tayp your lrls(8mhz quartz-with 4046 or..) is the best and most sensitive?
Explain a little about the project phase comparator with 4046?

[FrancoItaly]

Hi mustefa,
I think the lrls can reveal all the non-ferrous metal but copper probably needs more time to emit the phenomenon. Quartz lrl is more simple to build, 4046 Lrl needs more amplification, but are substantially equal in performance. The phenomenon changes the phase and the amplitude of the amplified signal and the phase comparator of the CD4046 indicates the variations of phase with the VCO of the CD4046.
Regards

[mustefa ubram]

new pcb of 8mhz tayp For all friends:)

[AurumKid]

new pcb of 8mhz tayp For all friends:)

thanks mustefa for your attachment

regards

[AurumKid]

Hi Mustefa

Do you have black & white pcb layout in pdf format? Can you please post it here?

Thanks In Advance

Regards

[mustefa ubram]

Hi Mustefa

Do you have black & white pcb layout in pdf format? Can you please post it here?

Thanks In Advance

Regards
for you

[AurumKid]

for you

thank you ;)

[mustefa ubram]

hi franco .i have question dear frenid
I've buried 3 gold pieces with salt today.How long should I wait for testing?
i made today your lrl type 4046.I think this is much more sensitive than other types.With the antenna touching or close to the antenna output 358 pin1 voltage increases.this is correct?
What is the most appropriate voltage at the base of the middle p2 ?

[Avanturis]

new pcb of 8mhz tayp For all friends:)


Dear Mustafa!
I can't open the file,can you tell me wich program to use or send me PDF file.
Regards

[FrancoItaly]

Hi mustefa,
in my test field gold targets with no salt emit about 1 month later.
I do not remember if touching antenna output voltage Increases the important thing is that the phenomenon causes an increase in the output voltage of IC2A.
The most appropriate voltage at the base of the middle p2 is what allows you to have the correct voltage at point X.
Regards

[mustefa ubram]

Hi mustefa,
in my test field gold targets with no salt emit about 1 month later.
Regards
thank you franco
Is the use salt with pieces gold effects on early emit?
my lrl with 4046 is Very sensitive to fluorescent lamps:shrug:it detect a lamp of 1meter with steel antenna.By turning the capacitor LC circuit Change in output voltage .And sensitivity to fluorescent lamp changes.Can this be a sign that the circuit works correctly.?

[FrancoItaly]

Hi mustefa,
I do not know if the salt accelerates the phenomenon, however, the salt does not corrode the gold and perhaps not be able to accelerate the phenomenon. I do not know if sensitivity to fluorescent lamp somehow has to do with the phenomenon.
Regards

[mustefa ubram]

hi to all
this is new version pcb of franco with 4046.I hope the good work:frown:

[FrancoItaly]

Hi mustefa,
great work, you give a professional look to my LRL. I hope you have the same result on the field!
Regards

[mustefa ubram]

Hi mustefa,
great work, you give a professional look to my LRL. I hope you have the same result on the field!
Regards
thank you very much franco.
I'm also hoping
franco ?Can I use the bc237 instead of bc183?and bc548 instead of 170?
If constructed properly by touching the antenna output happening?

[Nicolas]

thank you very much franco.
I'm also hoping
franco ?Can I use the bc237 instead of bc183?and bc548 instead of 170?
If constructed properly by touching the antenna output happening?

Yes you can dear Mustafa . Nice work and job

[FrancoItaly]

Hi mustefa,
I think that all transistors type BC238, BC108, BC548, BC109, BC239, BC549 and similar are OK but only type "C" (BC109C, BC548C...) because they have much more gain.
Regards

[FrancoItaly]

Hi mustefa,
If you touch the antenna the DC output signal goes low.
Regards

[mustefa ubram]

hi mustefa ubram,
very nice job.

With what program did you draw?

I have designed with professional software altium.This is software for industrial design

[mustefa ubram]

thank you very much dear franco
I will soon make Type 4046 with new version pcb .And tell you the result.

[AurumKid]

Very nice work mustefa. Do you have a pcb design for crystal osc type?

[mustefa ubram]

Very nice work mustefa. Do you have a pcb design for crystal osc type?
I sent complet pcb in last page for crystal osilator type.(sperint layout file)

[king40]

hi mustafa ubram
I build version 3 (8 mghz sensor )
my result like you mustafa
I sense tv and mobile phone signal
and can't detect my buried silver

[mustefa ubram]

Hi franco
I found th transistor bc237c.is this transistor good for replace with bc180?
Whether work your lrls only with C suffix?
I did not use a transistor circuits before with the suffix C?

[FrancoItaly]

Hi mustefa,
Perhaps the LRL also works with BC ... "B" with less amplification, but I have not tried it. I think it is better not to make changes and use the "C".
If you do not find the "C" try "B" but it will be necessary to reduce the value of the emitter resistors of 1K and try 820 or 680 or 560 ohms.
Regards

[mustefa ubram]

hi franco
i am sorry:frown:i make your lrl 4046 again with new pcb.but I could not get a result.When I'm touching the antenna does not create any change in output.Voltage does not decrease.But when the the mobile is close to the antenna LED is illuminated.Even when I disconnect the LC circuit. Again shows the response to the the mobile.:frown::frown::frown:
What do you think?
please help me

[mustefa ubram]

Hi mustefa ubram
The signal coming from the VCO of IC1 goes to the TR2 base and then it's amplified by TR3 and TR4, the TR4 collector goes to phase comparator of IC1 with the out of VCO. At pin 2 of IC1 there is a signal corresponding to phase difference, this signal is inverted and amplified by Ic2. Part of signal of VCO goes to ground by C10 - C11 and L1. The "phenomenon" changes the phase and the amplitude of the signal
Best Regards
dear franco
Please complete this more and more clearly explain how to operate the system?
When the signal is produced by the LC circuit?
What makes the phenomenon of changes in signal?
What is the function of capacitor C10?
Whether the VCO signal enters directly into the amplifier?
What is the function of the LC circuit?
Why use two capacitors C8-C9?
If you are is possible to explain fully.
TANK YOU FRANCO

[FrancoItaly]

Hi Mustefa,
I want to start by saying that I do not know much about the true nature of the phenomenon and that what I say is good for my country and I have made known my LRL also because I want to know if it works in other countries.
The LRL is based primarily on a high gain amplifier stage. The signal to be amplified comes from the VCO of IC1 and is applied to the amplifier through C8 and C9. The required value is about 0.5 pF, the value is difficult to find, so I used two capacitors of 1 pF connected in series. C10 has a double function, it carries the signal coming from the antenna to the base of TR2 and it carries part of VCO signal to the ground via L1. LC filter certainly let a signal that has the same resonance frequency or a harmonic or a sub-harmonic. My LRL works only with 2 or 3 turns for L1 and 22 pF, but it's possible that other turns work fine in other country.

Best Regards

[mustefa ubram]

Hi Mustefa,
LC filter certainly let a signal that has the same resonance frequency or a harmonic or a sub-harmonic.
Best Regards
thank you very much dear franco
Please explain this more if it is possible for you.?

[FrancoItaly]

Hi mustefa,
Unfortunately I can not say more, but the important thing for me is that the LRL works well.
Best Regards

[king40]

we need to try and more experience to found information about phenomenon

[mustefa ubram]

hi
i made 4046 complet. I've tested with various rounds coil of 2 -10 rounds.
But it does not work:frown::frown::frown::frown::frown::frown::fro wn:When i touch the antenna voltage will decrease
But the real purposenot operating.:frown::frown::frown::frown:I do not know nothing:shrug::shrug::shrug::shrug::shrug:

[Nicolas]

Hi friends
I put here this scheme for use with all LRL to see the decrease of DC en ?millivolts
this scheme is for 0 to 5V. if you need other band need change the value of R1 and R2




And I have others Model I put here when I have times

[FrancoItaly]

Hi mustefa,
Sorry but I cannot help, if you touch the antenna and output decreases the lrl is ok, perhaps your test field is not good.
Regards

[brs]

dear franco
In field experiments need minerals underground phenomenon to be

[brs]

And also the need for depth

[FrancoItaly]

Hi brs,
I don't know what you mean, be more clear
Regards

[brs]

Underground metal period of time you need to be a phenomenon or emit ions
Sorry used Translator

[FrancoItaly]

In my test field 5 silver coins emit after about a month 2 meters away but I have not experience for other type of ground, I wait for some notice from who has builded my lrl.

[Salar]

Hi franco
Good day I am Salar from Tehran and new in forums.
I builded two copy of 4046 lrl but both of have one problem.In 3MHZ I don't have (1-6V)AC at point X with Oscilloscope only 0.5 V but when I decreased frequency about 200khz AC voltage appear above 1 V AC and pin 2 have (5.5V)DC . I used BC237 as TR1. where is problem?
Did you tested your quartz lrl in your test field and what was the result?
Regards,
Salarhttp://www.uploadax.com/images/60796366603300297305.jpghttp://www.uploadax.com/images/53209972431812773941.jpghttp://www.uploadax.com/images/73671458517732583762.jpghttp://www.uploadax.com/images/17679755006907102184.jpg

[FrancoItaly]

HI Salar,
Instead of C8 and C9 put a single capacitor ( 2pF or more) for 1-6 V at point X with about 3 Mhz as vco frquency, BC237 is OK. The quartz lrl works well in my test field and is more easy to build and every quartz in 3 -10 mhz range is OK.

Regards

[mahditala]

Hi fanco here is your LRL. I make PCB to improve it and try to land with some modification on the choice of the frequency search.

And I give you the PCB to do and try.
please part list

[mustefa ubram]

hi franco
how are you.?
happy new years:) with delay
What do you think about using a diode Varactor 22 Pico alternative?

[FrancoItaly]

I'm well but not yet in Italy, yes the varactor is a good idea, but tuning is not critical, 10 or 20 pF it's the same (in my country), also without capacitor it works well with the only base/emitter capacitance (about 10 pF).
Regards

[mustefa ubram]

also without capacitor it works well with the only base/emitter capacitance (about 10 pF).
Regards
i think is important 22pf capicator .this is for resonance frequency with L1
franco capacitance base/emiter!!!!??????????what is your mean?which transitor ?
please ore explane?

[FrancoItaly]

I mean the base-emitter capacitance of TR2 that is in parallel with C10 through C9.

[wtrk]

Thnaks...

[darkman]

Dear FrancoItaly
Thank you for sharing your lrl
I built this one i have silly question how its work ?????
the led is going on and off when i change the value of p3
but p1 and p2 didn't make any change at the led
how to test your lrl ??
how can i know that is working ?

best regard

http://www.foxpic.com/VehmezsA.jpg (http://www.foxpic.com/)

[FrancoItaly]

With P1 you change the frequency, the better is about 2.5 - 3Mhz (the max frequency for CD4046). With P2 you change the amplitude of the signal, the better is at point (X) (the TR4 collector) a 2 -4 Volt peak to peak, with the scope you must have a good sine curve, not distorted. If you touch the antenna the output signal must decrease. You must have a test field with buried metals (gold, silver or copper) for at least a few months.
Regards

[darkman]

thx Franco bud for all this info's :)
i will try my best and will tell u the results very soon

Regards

[du6r]

Dear FrancoItaly
you have great work's with lrl
i just built one of your's with (IC)
on manual test with cell phone the led is lighting up
when i touch the antenna the led is get off
when did i know that the lrl is ready to start locating in range field
now is there any video show how to adjustment the p1 > p2 > p3??? or explain how to work with your lrl ? its seem to me its OK with hand test but what about detect metal
underground dose it working with metals in field range
**** From where can i take the signal line for display circuit (I mean the ic lrl)
how do i now that's the lrl is working in field
should the led light when i but golden ring close to antenna ?
too many question in my mind
can i get your e.mail plz i really need to contact with you :rolleyes:
Sorry for my bad English
thank you

[FrancoItaly]

in a previous post I explained how to adjust P1 and P2, P3 is the adjustment of the threshold and also the sensitivity. All LRL only work with metals buried for some time, at least a few months. if you do not have a test field you can go to any place as you can with a metal detector and control every signal obtained with the LRL with the metal detector. If the signal is present for more than 10, 20 meters in the north south direction, his is the compass effect and you must therefore decrease the sensitivity. It should be recalled that the LRL is not a metal detector and therefore does not behave in the same way.
Regards

[darkman]

Now can i connect (display Stage) or (UV meter) To your lrl circuit(with ic) ? if yes , from what point can i get the signal? is it pin2 in ic1?


http://www7.0zz0.com/2015/04/03/13/866031338.jpg (http://www.0zz0.com)

[FrancoItaly]

The display stage is composed by IC2A (phase amplifier) and IC2B (comparator and led driver). More led drivers or a vu meter must be connected at the IC2A output. At PIN 2 of IC1 there is a pulse signal with duty cicle that changes when the phase changes.
Regards

[mustefa ubram]

hi franco
What is the resonance frequency?(tank circuit)?

[FrancoItaly]

Approximately 150MHz, depends on the values of L1, C11, C10 (negligible) and the base-emitter junction of TR2 (about 10 pf).
Regards

[mustefa ubram]

Approximately 150MHz, depends on the values of L1, C11, C10 (negligible) and the base-emitter junction of TR2 (about 10 pf).
Regards
Why so much

[FrancoItaly]

perhaps in this range there are emissions in the frequency on which the phenomenon acts. It was a coincidence that my LRL works, is not due to my studies, I have just realized that this circuit (RF sniffer) could reveal the phenomenon. I tried to change some values, such as inductance, capacitance in the resonant circuit, crystal frequency (3 to 10Mhz), but the best are the ones that I have indicated.

[Geo]

Hello Franco. How are you????
Long time!!!!!!!.............

[FrancoItaly]

Hi Geo
I'm fine and you? In this time what did you do? you counted the gold coins that you are getting?

[FrancoItaly]

During this time I have not much time to look for treasures ... I'm waiting for someone who has built my LRL that can prove it on the ground. I'm also testing a type of PI metal detector that only works a few microseconds after the pulse, but it is difficult with the means available to a hobbyist. Currently I am in Switzerland but I come back Saturday for an electronics fair in Genoa where I always find something to buy, such as a bag with hundreds of electronic components to 1 euro...
Regards

[Geo]

Hi Franco.
Some problems with my health don't let me (for instant) to go for T.H. This time that i have very good LRLs i have n't the ability to work them :angry:.

Regards:)

[mustefa ubram]

franco
your frq is 3mhz.Why not use the L/C circuit the resonant frequency 3mhz?!!!!!!
In this frequency of the circuit is the best performance:|:|:|:|

[mustefa ubram]

franco
your frq is 3mhz.Why not use the L/C circuit the resonant frequency 3mhz?!!!!!!
In this frequency of the circuit is the best performance:|:|:|:|
franco What duty c8-c9 in 4046 model?
what is best value for c8-c9?
How is must The amplitude of the output the signal in c9?

[FrancoItaly]

The frequency from quartz or vco is not important and is indipendent of LC frequency, it's only a carrier that is modulated by the phenomenon. You must think to C8 and C9 as a single capacitor, in my case I have used 2 capacitor 1pF in series to have 0.5 pF. The exact value depends on the parasitic capacitance. in one case I removed the two capacitors and LRL worked fine. At point X (TR4 collector) there must be a signal from 2 to 4V peak-peak .

[mustefa ubram]

Thank you franco
not importance frq ok?can i replace 100kh or less with 3mhz for carrier signal?

[FrancoItaly]

I don't understand what you mean with 100Kh. The better frequency is in the range 3-10 Mhz.

[taxma1981]

https://youtu.be/kE-Q7_mYzks

[FrancoItaly]

Well, but this means that the LRL works in the lab but what it feels is not the phenomenon but electromagnetic sources. Now you need to go to a real field, and the only adjustment is the sensitivity, if it is too sensitive you have the compass effect and if not sensitive enough you do not feel the phenomenon.

[taxma1981]

electrical appliances does not beep, wants strong signal to do; the detector circuit can work with 9 volts; in video I have the circuit of your detector Franco

[taxma1981]

Franko ok now?


https://youtu.be/_-jHKqrVxzE

[abdou2014]

HI HAKIM FROM ALGERIA I BUILT A NEW FRANCO LRL PHANTOM
http://www.longrangelocators.com/forums/showthread.php?t=19076&highlight=phantom
HOW TO TEST WITHOUT AN UNDERGROUND METAL FIELDS, CAN I TEST IT WITH A FUNCTION GENERATOR . IT DO NOT RESPOND TO ELECTRIC FIELDS LIKE TV. HOW I MADE FOR CALIBRATE IT FOR A RECEPTION BETWEEN 50 KHZ AND 80 KHZ. PLEASE HELP ME

[FrancoItaly]

Hi abdou2014,
the only thing you can do is touch the antenna and see if the signal at the output decreases and if so go out and search and found all the signals with metal detector.
Regards

[FrancoItaly]

Hi taxma1981,
The only thing that I see is that there is a signal in one direction, continuing to walk in that direction, what happens? If the signal stops after a few meters you have to check from other directions, normally the maximum sensitivity is from south to north, minimum from north to south and from east to west as the media also from west to east.
Regards

[taxma1981]

Thank you franko..why only of blue led plays; the red lights und the white up only when χρύπησει the buzzer?

[FrancoItaly]

In this scheme "http://www.longrangelocators.com/forums/showthread.php?t=19076&highlight=phantom" DL3 and buzzer are on for low signals, for medium signals is on also DL2 and and for max signals is on also DL1. DL3 and buzzer are always on when there is a signal.
Regards

[taxma1981]

the second POTENTIOMETER 470 does not work like and turning ...why?,

[abdou2014]

THANK YOU Mr FRANCO, WHAT IS THE VALUE OF OUTGOING FREQUENCY ?

[FrancoItaly]

P2 is for sensibility, on real field you must change P2 for no compass effect. The effective frequency (internal) of the Lrl is that of the quartz but there is not a direct link with the phenomenon, I think that the "heart" of the revelation of the phenomenon is Tr2.
I repeat that by chance I discovered this LRL. It was a rf sniffer in the range of FM that because of the parasitic capacitances of the circuit board is entered into oscillation about 5 Mhz. Later I improved the design by adding a first oscillator (CD4046, VCO and phase comparator) hoping to get some discrimination and a stable oscillation. Finally I designed the LRL with quartz, very similar to the original design, very stable and with the ability to change the frequency.
Regards

[taxma1981]

thank you franko: D

[abdou2014]

Mr FRANCO, CAN YOU PUT THE DIAGRAM OF YOUR FINAL LRL FOR BUILD IT . I HAVE NOT SUCCESSFUL IN THE PHANTOM VERSION .

[folharin]

somebody else built and tested this project?

[FrancoItaly]

PHANTOM version is the same that my final lrl, but not the printed board. What you mean when you say "not successful" ? When you touch the antenna the signal goes down?
Regards

[abdou2014]

when I turn it on, there is not a signal in antenna , and when i turn threshold the leds will light one by one with a buzzer sound

[FrancoItaly]

in the antenna there is no measurable signal, the output (TR5 emitter) there must be a DC signal in the range 1-6V (you can choose for example 4V). To change the output signal you must act on the total value of C2, C3 and C4 which adjusts the amount of signal that will be amplified by TR1, TR2, TR3 and TR4. If the output is zero you have to increase the capacity, remove C2-C3-C4 and in their place put a 1pF capacitor, if not just put 1.5pF and so on until you get 4V output (for example). The output signal must be stable and touching the antenna with a finger signal output should decrease slightly
Regards

[abdou2014]

the output of TR5 is 2V , is it ok ?

[FrancoItaly]

Yes, it's ok

[abdou2014]

THANK YOU Mr FRANCO FOR YOUR HELP ;)

[FrancoItaly]

with my last LRL (I think is the tenth) I had to change the value of two capacitors to make it working. The heart of all the LRL is the high gain part consists of TR2, TR3 and TR4; if the gain is too large this part goes into oscillation and it's very unstable, if instead the gain is too low, the phenomenon is not revealed.I use the type BC183C transistors because I own a lot, but you can use equivalent types (BC109C, BC209C, BC239C and so on) the important thing is that they are NPN silicon with high "beta" (suffix "C"). The RF gain of the amplifier,for a certain range of frequencies, depends on the value of C13 and C14, the lowest value = less amplification and vice versa. I suggest using instead C2, C3 and C4, a single capacitor of 1 pF and measure the output signal (TR5 emitter), if the DC signal is zero should be increased C13 and / or C14 until a stable signal (from 1 to 5V is not critical), if the signal is still zero with C13 = C14 = 100nF increase the value from 1 pF to 1.8pF and repeat the process. In my case I used 1.8pF, and C13 = 33nF, C14 = 10nF. If the signal is unstable even removing the capacitor 1pF must decrease C13 and / or C14.The important thing to point out is that of not increasing too much the value of the capacitor consisting of C2, C3 and C4 in order to obtain a signal at the outputas in this way is masked the low gain of the transistors. As I said the optimum value is 1 ... 2pF or less and it is for this reason that I used three capacitors connected in series, in fact, for example, two capacitors connected in series 1pF give a capacity of 0.5pF
Regards

[darkman]

the output of TR5 is 2V , is it ok ?

i have got the same voltage .

[abdou2014]

1-when i turn threshold the leds will light one by one with a buzzer sound is it ok .
2-the output of TR5 is 2.7V and when i touch the antenna the signal didn't decrease, where i must seek for solve this problem .

[FrancoItaly]

What 'is the value of C2, C3 and C4 or individual capacitor you used?

[FrancoItaly]

uses a whip antenna or the antenna coil? for the tests is sufficient a piece of wire 30cm

[abdou2014]

C2=C3=C4= 1pF

[FrancoItaly]

If you remove C2, C3 and C4 there is still signal at the output? Touch the antenna is an empirically test so even if the signal does not decrease touching the antenna is possible that the LRL functions equally on the real ground.

[insight]

Again an absurd plan and people who waste your time there!
The same device that is sold as a locator of electromagnetic waves.
:lol:و هموطنانی که فقط وقتشون رو در انجمن فلزجو برای ساخت این جور ابزارآلات بیهوده تلف میکنن

[FrancoItaly]

I have said several times that my LRL is basically a "RF sniffer" but that amplifies the signal generated by an internal oscillator, the frequency is between 3 and 10Mhz. Many of us deal with LRL for several years and there is definitely a "phenomenon" that in some way is output from metals buried by time. I do not want to convince anyone, and I do not sell anything, I only accept constructive criticism from those who have realized my LRL and not by those who after seeing the circuit says it's a waste of time. You're the one who loses time in this thread.
Regards

[Qiaozhi]

Again an absurd plan and people who waste your time there!
The same device that is sold as a locator of electromagnetic waves.
:lol:و هموطنانی که فقط وقتشون رو در انجمن فلزجو برای ساخت این جور ابزارآلات بیهوده تلف میکنن
Personally I don't mind people wasting their own time designing and testing electronic LRLs. It's all part of the learning process, and it doesn't really cause any harm. However, L-rods are a different matter, as are blatant scams aimed at relieving others of their hard-earned money. Otherwise known as "wallet mining".

[folharin]

Personally I don't mind people wasting their own time designing and testing electronic LRLs. It's all part of the learning process, and it doesn't really cause any harm. However, L-rods are a different matter, as are blatant scams aimed at relieving others of their hard-earned money. Otherwise known as "wallet mining".

QIAOZHI! see you as an unbeliever of any projects.you thing is good electronic engineer your side vision for eletronic circuits.you should put your electronic knowledge showing the errors in each circuit.Long Range locators exist.i saw with my eyes!

[insight]

QIAOZHI! see you as an unbeliever of any projects.you thing is good electronic engineer your side vision for eletronic circuits.you should put your electronic knowledge showing the errors in each circuit.Long Range locators exist.i saw with my eyes!

i think all projects about long range that are without a primary source of propagation of electromagnetic waves are just a juck:lol:

[Qiaozhi]

QIAOZHI! see you as an unbeliever of any projects.you thing is good electronic engineer your side vision for eletronic circuits.you should put your electronic knowledge showing the errors in each circuit.Long Range locators exist.i saw with my eyes!
The error are not in the electronic circuits per se, but in the underlying principle.

What did you actually see with your [own] eyes? Remember - even if you're skilled in the art of identifying instances of self-deception, self-delusion, and selective memory; your eyes can still deceive you. That's how conjuror's make their living.

An LRL can be used to identify a general area in which to search, but a metal detector is then used to pinpoint the target. Once a target is recovered, the glory goes to the LRL, and the metal detector is conveniently forgotten when the story is retold. You might as well throw a stone, and then search the area were the stone lands. You will achieve the same results.

[Geo]

But.. if there is n't metal detector and you locate the object with lrl???? :???:
Ohhh George... passed so many years but you did n't change your mind!!!!


Regards:)

[Qiaozhi]

But.. if there is n't metal detector and you locate the object with lrl???? :???:
Ohhh George... passed so many years but you did n't change your mind!!!!


Regards:)
:lol:
It seems that you have also not changed your mind.
So many experiments, but you still believe. :???:

Science is not on your side.

If you manage to locate the object without a metal detector (Note: This very rarely happens), then you need to caste your mind back and remember all the empty holes.

[Geo]

Not exactly....
There are many times that i found objects only with lrl, also many times with the use of metal detectors any many times that i made empty holes.....
I have clear mind to see all :cool:.

:)

[FrancoItaly]

I will make a summary of the advice I gave publicly on the forum and privately.
My LRL essentially consists of an oscillator, around TR1 and a stage with high gain, TR2, TR3 and TR4 that amplifies a small part of the signal supplied by TR1. In the absence of external disturbances the signal at the output is a stable DC voltage. The "heart" is around TR2, the resonant circuit formed by L1 / C10 is connected through C9 to the base of TR2 and in appearance a signal captured by the antenna should be amplified by TR2, TR3 and TR4, and then only a signal with a frequency equal to the resonance frequency could be amplified. But if this were true, there should be a radio station that creates a uniform field in a large area and independent of the direction of the receiving antenna, and I think it's unlikely. If we consider the signal provided by the oscillator it is applied to the base of TR2 and a part of it is brought to ground through C9, C10 and L1. If the output signal increases, that is, we are in the presence of the "phenomenon", it means that lowers the signal that goes to ground, perhaps because it increases the impedance of the resonant circuit L1 / C10.
For the sensor stage it’s better to use a double side PCB with the lower part that is connected to ground and this serves to prevent auto-oscillations. When you have finished building the sensor stage you have to disconnect C2, C3 and C4 and to measure the voltage at the output that must be zero, if not mean that there is too much amplification and you must reduce C13 and/or C14, for example 470pF or 390pF.
Afterwards check that TR1 oscillates at a frequency of quartz, at the TR1 emitter must be about 1 or 2V peak to peak or more, is not change C1 but often you do not need just the parasitic capacitance of the transistor. Then connected in place of C2, C3 and C4 a single capacitor 1pF and measure the voltage at the output that must be in the range 1-5 V DC. If the voltage is more than 5V connect C2 and C3 in serie (we have 0.5pF). if the voltage is still too high connect also C4. If the voltage is zero with the 1pF capacitor necessary to increase the gain by increasing C13 and/or C14. As regards the display stage, with P1 adjusts the threshold and with P2 the gain of IC1A. P2 may be a trimmer to adjust only once so that with P1 a maximum there is not the effect compass.
As for the transistors are all of the type BC183C, this is because I have a lot of it, but I think any type equivalent is fine, the important thing is that they are of the type "C" that is, with great amplification (high beta).
The LRL is not a metal detector and it does not behave as such. The maximum sensitivity is walking from south to north, it is minimal walking from north to south and is average walking from west to east and vice versa. During the search, the antenna must be parallel to the ground but as it approaches the target you may have to tilt it down. Just above the target signal disappears to reappear walking past the target. I hope this will be useful for those who have already built my LRL and for those who plan to build. I ask you only to let me know of your findings.

[Geo]

Hi Franco.
Did you measured the beta of bc183C that you use???

Regards :)

[FrancoItaly]

Hi Geo,
The beta it's in the range 400-600.

Best Regards

[abdou2014]

HI Franco i built an auther version of your LRL ( CD4046 + LM358 ) .The output (TR4 EMITTER ) = 1.2 V And when i turn P2 the signal amplitude does not increase . it gives always 1.2 V same by removing C8 and C9 . is it ok

[FrancoItaly]

The CD4046 version is not equal to quartz version, infact there is not 2 rectifier diodes and TR5. At TR4 emitter you measure 1.2V DC and this is correct. You must have at TR4 collector (point X) about 2-6V peak to peak and of course you must have a scope. With quartz version at TR5 emitter you have a voltage proportional to AC voltage at TR4 collector. If you don't have a scope you can build the TR5 stage and use this as a monitor or you can use this as output for the following stage, to do this you have to disconnect R3 from pin 2 of CD4046 and connect at TR5 emitter.

Regards

[abdou2014]

thank you ,why when I touch the antenna LED not light , I saw a video of your lrl the led lights when the hand is near the antenna !! how I should test it ??

[FrancoItaly]

when you touch the antenna the signal goes down, set the led on (not too much) and touch the antenna, the led goes off.

[abdou2014]

I have not the same results. did i do an error in component location . can you verify my diagram please

[FrancoItaly]

Sorry but I have not used this PCB for my lrls, I have not designed this PCB and at the moment It's difficult to me to understand if there is some error.
Regards

[abdou2014]

Please Franco can you give me a pcb of your lrl ,
I built all version of your lrl and I always put mistakes

[mustefa ubram]

Please Franco can you give me a pcb of your lrl ,
I built all version of your lrl and I always put mistakes
hi abdou2014
this is correct pcb for me.crystal version
g.l:)

[abdou2014]

THANK YOU MUSTEFA BUT I CAN'T OPEN THE FILE . I TRIED WITH PROTEUS 8.1 ERROR

[sinclairuser]

THANK YOU MUSTEFA BUT I CAN'T OPEN THE FILE . I TRIED WITH PROTEUS 8.1 ERROR

you need winrar, or 7zip http://www.7-zip.org/a/7z938.exe

to open this file its compressed, download 7zip from above link, its safe, when installed, 7zip will unzip it, the file you need is inside the opened folder.
make sure you unzip the file simply opening it is no good.

[abdou2014]

I tried everything and it not work

[abdou2014]

Ok I Managed with Sprint Layout. Mr Mustefa I did not understand the position of the outside potentiometer P1 at the PCB . can you help me

[mustefa ubram]

çHi.you can open with sprin layout software this file.
sorry i am in travel.
best wish

[FrancoItaly]

I would like to know the author of this video some details on the type of buried metal and with what orientation you have the greatest signal:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yR3tzT2Jd-g

[dojranski]

Hello franco

40 cm depth ..2 gold rings 4 grams of 18k gold ..40 days buried .. the beginning of the film is West East..
end of the film the north south…best signal north south
the output signal dc of the TR5 emitter is 5.6V….
sorry for my bad english..
Regards and thanks for your project

[FrancoItaly]

Hi Dojranski,
I'm glad you managed to run my LRL, now you're ready for a real field research! I hope that others succeed. 40 cm for two gold rings are out of reach for most of the metal detector. The lrls are much more sensitive than metal detectors and this makes it virtually impossible to verify all the signals of the LRL beyond the range of metal detectors.
regards

[Nicolas]

Hello franco

40 cm depth ..2 gold rings 4 grams of 18k gold ..40 days buried .. the beginning of the film is West East..
end of the film the north south…best signal north south
the output signal dc of the TR5 emitter is 5.6V….
sorry for my bad english..
Regards and thanks for your project


Hello dojranski very nice test dear thanks to share it . How about your LRL's ? ;)

[Nicolas]

Hello franco

40 cm depth ..2 gold rings 4 grams of 18k gold ..40 days buried .. the beginning of the film is West East..
end of the film the north south…best signal north south
the output signal dc of the TR5 emitter is 5.6V….
sorry for my bad english..
Regards and thanks for your project


Hello dojranski very nice test dear thanks to share it . How about your LRL's ? ;)

http://www.geofazma-detectors.tripod.com (http://www.geofazma-detectors.tripod.com/)

[FrancoItaly]

Hi Nicolas,
It's my last lrl, the quartz version.
Regards

[Nicolas]

Hi Nicolas,
It's my last lrl, the quartz version.
Regards

Hello Franco come stai ? yes i know that

[FrancoItaly]

Hi Nicolas,
I'm fine and you?

[brs]

Hi dojranski
The video has become the desire to assemble a Franco again the question of whether any post new currency it

[brs]

Sorry
, I mean new additions I use a translator

[detectoman]

hello francoitaly i go begin make your lrl, i have a question for you, i appreciate very much your answer, can you say me please if i can put in you circuit a cristal piece whit 10.160 mhz? or obligate i need exact frecuence of 10 mhz?, i not have this but other cristal osccillation frecuence fractions, for bad english excusme, thanks dman :)

[FrancoItaly]

Hi detectoman,
Every frequency in the range 3 -10Mhz works well, I think it's ok also 10.1 or 10.2Mhz or similar, I have not noticed any changes. It would be interesting to try with a harmonica to 59Khz (frequency gold?) For example 59Khz X 100 = 5.9Mhz.
Regards

[FrancoItaly]

To test it would be better to use a LC oscillator and not a quartz, but at this moment I cannot try.

[Astrodetect]

Hello franko
As I see your last 8MHZ Sensor LRL, you use the same principle as Mineoro DCH85 but you have connected directly the oscillator to the input of Receiver. This is the same as DCH which instead of connecting directly to the receiver, the oscillator uses a coil behind the antenna of the receiver.Same thing i think.What do you think?

[FrancoItaly]

As I said in my LRL oscillator only it serves to generate a reference signal and the phenomenon modulates this signal. The signal is not transmitted in the environment, but I do not know well mineoro lrls. My lrl derives from a RF sniffer that accidentally came in oscillation at about 4Mhz.

[FrancoItaly]

I decided to change my LRL and run at 59Khz (gold frequency) but at the time I am away from home and I can not test it. In practice it is a species of regenerative receiver, but the oscillation is continuous, even without signal at the input. To achieve this a part of the signal, using 4.7K trimmer and 100pF capacitor, it is send to the coil. For the coil we may use about 100 turns and we have to choose the right value for the capacitor placed in parallel to the coil. The emitter capacitors of the second and third transistor they set the stage gain of each transistor and the value must be determined experimentally. I repeat that I have not made this change, and I hope that some of you have wanted to do it.
Best Regards