The proof LRLs really work

[Funfinder]

... seems to be still missing !!!

I wanna make it simple so anyone can understand it:

There is a big difference a LRL proven works under the needed circumstances or even just sometimes

and:

the detection of objects is result by pure coincidence or chance!


This issue we have to made glass-clear - this is the very first starting point!


Per instance a pendulum:

Attach it on your rooms-lamp and leave it alone:

Does it swing forth or back or describes circles or eliptical moves?

NO WAY!

If there is no breeze, earthquake or a person that walks on the floor above this pendulum is DEAD mouse-dead!

Therefore it is not allowed for any scientifical tests because the movements originate from its user, from the human body with its unconscious or concious muscle-energy (= ideomotor effect)

The same applies to dowsing rods, as long as they are not able to move without a connected (holding) person.

Dell Winders as expample can attach his wonder-stuff onto a huge rock and can wait forever until it moves by itselfs - good luck - perhaps a flash strikes it and throws it to the ground! :lol:

_______________________________________________


Because we don't need any paranormal interactivity -
and this would be the case if a "sensitive" or whatever psy-gifted
person or even medium is needed to create the "success".


________________________________________________


Let's take a closer look to the electronical LRLs we are interested much more anyway!


As I told already, the first absolutly necessary and important step is to proof such a device is able to detect something and all at a real repeatable, scientifically and logically acceptable basis.


We know already from the Mineoro device describtion (hunt from north to south etc.) that the "pheonomon" if exists has something to do with magnetical field distortion.

(and we know also that Alonso seems to need some "cheap" tricks sometimes to convince people...)

Anyway, this "does it really work at all" test is an absolutly MUST !!!

Otherwise those devices find stuff by pure coincidence or better the user finds this stuff by his additional affords (with a real working metal detector)

So with this question everything starts or falls down!

btw. this question also decides if a LRL company commits a crime or not. They are allowed to seel a device that under certain circumstances REALLY works, but nothing else!

_____________________________________________

Now lets take a look what kind of testing-situation applies, is needed for those electronical LRLs for getting real counting results:


The most simple solution would be to test it at a site where it is absolutly clear that enough "long time ago" metal is available.

!!! Per instant some ore-mines, gold-fields, older amusement-places where people lost alot coins, holiday-beaches which contain enough rings and stuff !!!

At such places the LRL-producer no longer can come with its "the LRL doesn't work with fresh buried finds"-excuse. Oh what a pity, I'm heartbroken! :razz:


The next important thing is that the LRL really works at such a location, the result is clear and certain interpretable and many times repeatable.

Of course we don't need just a repeatable signal, it also counts that at the located region there is indeed something to find.

We need other precausions:

A body-search of the LRL-practitioner is needed so he can not play cheap bags-player-tricks. Another method would be different persons have to dig the region, at best persons who don't know this is a scientifal test they're working for.

A second security measure is that not just the "LRL-provider-person" detects with his device! He has to give his device to other persons and those have to be able to get the same beeps etc. from the exactly same place! This also will reduce or eliminate other tricks like rubbing plastic parts to get static signals.


Now let's assume this test was successful.
This still doesn't mean anything.
You can throw the dice and say that the 6 will be visible on the upper side and it really happens - but not because of any magical talents, just by pure chance!

The same way by pure chance could be a find located at the area the LRL has circumscribed.
This area must not exceed a certain range because otherwise the test is useless!
It's no big deal to find something at an area of 10 x 10 meters!
The smaller the delimited area, the better. 2x2m may be acceptable, depenting on the probability to find something at the selected hunting-region.


Finally all what is needed to repeat those tests until a clearly non-by-chance achievable result shows up!


The percentage-relation also has to consider finds that are deeper than the "pinpointing usual metal detector" may able to find.

But we have to be really carefully here, because after we have excluded all the other possible tricks this will be the No 1 weakpoint for all those potential betrayers and cheap trick players !!! :angry: :nono:



Their cheap excuse will be:
Oh sorry, my LRL works fantastic, just the find is much deeper than your metal detector is able to locate it!

But we are no fools to believe such naive arguments! :razz: :lol:


Depending on the search-region of course there is certain probability the find is deep outside the metal-detectors reach, but for shure not all the time!


btw. the LRL-provider will have a hard time first to explain why the heck only long time ago buried objects would be locatable!
Because this argument may be just a very cunning protection-assertion so he can avoid much easier tests with fresh buried objects!

Be very careful, those guys "are washed with all waters" as we have a saying here in Europe - to make believe their LRLs are real working! Because for many of them its their life-content, being the proud owner of a real working wonder-machine! Their whole self-image depends on it! Not for all - I will not diffame fair working people - but there are too much black sheeps in this area, too many cunning sharlatans and their only aim is to enrich theirself by ripping of "stupid" people! :angry: Be warned! :nono:
This world is no childrens-birthday! :(


The displeasure, unwill and indignation of many of them concerning scientifical tests already is a huge indicator that there is something fishy! :nono: :angry: Many of them know they will not pass a secure test where they no longer can play cheap tricks! So they avoid them by all circumstances and invent unbelievable excuses! Fraudsters with highly criminal minds! :angry:


From where to continue - oh yeah:

Depending on the search-region of course there is certain probability the find is deep outside the metal-detectors reach, but for shure not all the time!

Find a good LRL test location is the alpha and omega!

The gold fields of Australia would be a very good place because often the nuggets are just a few cm or inches below the surface.

And those nuggets are still so frequently there for creating 10-20 tests at one day.


BUT: getin to the outback could be a very expensive and also dangerous trip (deadly spiders, snakes and other animals, the weather, a long flight etc.)

So we need at least some alternatives:

Old battlefields per instance would be matching.

They are full of lead-balls and if the LRL is capable in finding not-iron metal objects it has enough possibilities to detect those lead balls from a distance. The depth of them also is good, most of the time they are just 10-20cm deep and within the range of usual MDs.


other alternatives?!
I am asking you !!! I'm shure you will come up with some good ideas! You have to if you will finally solve this pesky LRL problem!

Don't forget: All we need to know if it is works at all!
And therefore meaningful tests are the only way!

We have already some fitting but we can need even more!

!!! Per instant some ore-mines, gold-fields, older amusement-places where people lost alot coins, holiday-beaches which contain enough rings and stuff !!!

Large empty areas where it is known in older times there have been villages are proper, too.
Mountain regions too, if the steepness there doesn't negativly affect the LRL.

Even old cellars, wine-hangs, ghost-towns, dry river beds - there are many test-locations possible! It's not a MUST to test the LRL in some australian ect. gold-fields.

Even the debris of some old copper mines may work.


If those tests would be positive, really positive, it would push the LRL business extremly, even if those devices don't work all the time (rain, snow, storm etc.).

Otherwise the LRL-disciples can go to India into an ashram or built esoterical sects because no one will believe their as wrong proven claims!



So I hope now I've made it clear, CRYSTAL-CLEAR:

There exists enough good methods to test if this stuff works at all or not!
And thats the Premise (precondition) #1 !!!!


Does it work at all - YES or NO ???!!!

As long this is not clear this whole LRL-jabbering is nothing than a childsplay with dowsing-rods! :angry:

[Dell Winders]

You have to ask your self, if you are smart enough to learn to use L-rods to detect Magnetic fields? Judging from the idiocy of your rant, apparently not. It's easy to understand that you don't want an LRL to work and destroy your prejudice beliefs. :lol:

Really, it's no loss to any one but yourself for any of your false beliefs.

If you want to place L rods in a stationary vice that's your prerogative but it sounds like a stupid, awkward way of using them. Be sure you connect wires to the handles and hold the ends of the wires. A human connection is used to alter the polarity of the Rod(s).

[Qiaozhi]

A human connection is used to alter the polarity of the Rod(s).
A human connection is used to [unconsciously] move the rod. This is your so-called trained ideomotor effect, or (in other words) self deception.

[kostas87]

A human connection is used to [unconsciously] move the rod. This is your so-called trained ideomotor effect, or (in other words) self deception.

the dowsing works in two ways, with the ideomotor, and with real signals metals.
Many people think they dowsing and doing it wrong way, with ideomotor. are what many people almost everyone ..: Συνοφρύωμα:
But there are people with correct dowsing where they can see only signals metals.!
are two completely different things!;)

[Dedevil]

A human connection is used to [unconsciously] move the rod. This is your so-called trained ideomotor effect, or (in other words) self deception.

Ha! Self proclaimed guru.

Does a compass need human touch to work?
What is happening inside the compass needle to make it move?

Back to school for you do not pass Guru status.

Try reading http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electroscope

[Fred]

Ha! Self proclaimed guru.

Does a compass need human touch to work?
What is happening inside the compass needle to make it move?

Back to school for you do not pass Guru status.

Try reading http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electroscope

Amazing how simple things like magnetism and electric charges have been puzzling some people, and served their need to explain obscurantism :p

[Qiaozhi]

Amazing how simple things like magnetism and electric charges have been puzzling some people, and served their need to explain obscurantism :p
Exactly. As you can see, some people are in the denial phase. :frown:

How unconscious hand movement and self deception are somehow supposed to be related to magnetism, I've no idea.

[Carl-NC]

If I place a strong magnet under 1-of-10 paper cups, would someone having an ordinary compass be able to determine which cup has the magnet?

If I place a strong magnet under 1-of-10 paper cups, would someone having ordinary L-rods be able to determine which cup has the magnet?

I would not offer my $25,000 prize for the compass test.

[Geo]

Ohhhhh..... came the Great Forces:lol:

[Dell Winders]

Mineoro offered a $50,000 challenge for anyone that could prove the Mineoro didn't work.

Carl, had already been promoting his sick agenda by proclaiming the Mineoro, did not work but, without proof. The Mineoro Challenge was Carl's opportunity to provide absolute proof, be a hero to his Randi Skeptic cult following, be $50,000 richer, and prove Dell, to be wrong.

Carl, by his own words said he had to borrow additional money to pay $2,700 to buy a slightly used Mineoro, shows how sure he was of winning such an easy challenge?

Apparently, Carl was unable to scientifically prove the Mineoro does not work, just as he has never proven LRL's that Dell, has successfully used in the field do not work. He is good at BSing his agenda, If Carl, with all his EE genius can't win such an easy $50,000 challenge, how can anyone win his $25,000 self promotion gimmick? Yes , I offered, and Carl amended the rules. Again, by his own words, He wanted to make it difficult for anyone to collect his $25,000.

Electroscope offered a $100,000 Challenge. Carl, never won that one either.

Talk about self deception. The self appointed Scientific pretenders have Carl as an example.

Cut the gimmicks, Carl. Intelligent people see you as a hypocrite, I know you as a liar, your gimmick as a self promoting scam, and your supporter puppet comments as "When Educated Idiots Speak" (WEIS) Dell

[Dave J.]

Difference between a compass and L-rods:

Compass responds to real magnetic fields.

L-rods respond to imaginary magnetic fields.

Therefore the two kinds of magnetic fields are orthogonal.

*********

The math gets kinda tricky on ya because real magnetic fields are vectors in 3-space, and if you convert from vector representation to cartesian, you're stuck having to use imaginary numbers to describe a real vector.

Now suppose the magnetic field is of the kind where the vector magnitude itself is imaginary? Pseudoscientists, put your pseudomathematician hats on (y'know, the ones made of tinfoil to protect your brain from skeptic rays), sharpen your pencils and have at it! (Dell, you're in over your head on this, better leave it up to Hung and Mr. Devil.)

--Dave J.

[Dell Winders]

DaveJ, irrational comments are an example of WEIS

DaveJ, tell us of the DB field tests you have conducted comparing L-Rod detection of Magnetic fields with that of a Magnetometer? Dell

[Carl-NC]

Mineoro offered a $50,000 challenge for anyone that could prove the Mineoro didn't work.

Carl, had already been promoting his sick agenda by proclaiming the Mineoro, did not work but, without proof. The Mineoro Challenge was Carl's opportunity to provide absolute proof, be a hero to his Randi Skeptic cult following, be $50,000 richer, and prove Dell, to be wrong.

Carl, by his own words said he had to borrow additional money to pay $2,700 to buy a slightly used Mineoro, shows how sure he was of winning such an easy challenge?

Apparently, Carl was unable to scientifically prove the Mineoro does not work, just as he has never proven LRL's that Dell, has successfully used in the field do not work. He is good at BSing his agenda, If Carl, with all his EE genius can't win such an easy $50,000 challenge, how can anyone win his $25,000 self promotion gimmick? Yes , I offered, and Carl amended the rules. Again, by his own words, He wanted to make it difficult for anyone to collect his $25,000.

Electroscope offered a $100,000 Challenge. Carl, never won that one either.

Talk about self deception. The self appointed Scientific pretenders have Carl as an example.

Cut the gimmicks, Carl. Intelligent people see you as a hypocrite, I know you as a liar, your gimmick as a self promoting scam, and your supporter puppet comments as "When Educated Idiots Speak" (WEIS) Dell

In all that, you failed to even address the simple question:

If I place a strong magnet under 1-of-10 paper cups, would someone having ordinary L-rods be able to determine which cup has the magnet?

At least DJ's reply was entertaining.

And, no, Mineoro never offered a $50k challenge, and, no, you never "offered" anything.

[Dell Winders]

Sorry Carl,I forgot to mention your "convenient" memory losses. Dell

http://www.longrangelocators.com/forums/showthread.php?t=12134

CAPTION: Mineoro Challenge... maybe

[WM6]

Sorry Carl,I forgot to mention your "convenient" memory losses. Dell

http://www.longrangelocators.com/forums/showthread.php?t=12134

CAPTION:

Their offer was one more scam only.

[Fred]

Mineoro offered a $50,000 challenge for anyone that could prove the Mineoro didn't work.


Do you realize how funny this is ? I mean, a company that offer a reward to be "proven their stuff don´t work " ?!? Ahah. What a joke....
And "according to their research methods" right? Does it includes the use of a hidden transmitter ?

Why not to simply prove their marvellous devices actually works ??
Would seem more logical and productive to me :razz:

[Funfinder]

Our dowsing-device and L-rod gurus wanna tell us that's (see below) the way it works - I highly doubt it!


1. You can let attract a thin paper to a charged plastic ball but not
a wooden dowsing-rod to the ground which is immune against static
charge and already shortcuted by the human feet.


2. This also can't work because if the person walks there are
much stronger shocks, vibrations and repercussions than
the static field


3. the static-field difference a small metal objects creates
is far to low to be detectable just by human senses plus
a simple dowsing tool




It is very simple to scientifically test if a person with or without his device is able to detect static. Place him on a wooden floor where below is a room that contains different static charged items.


The human body is no walking electroscope or static charge detector!
Especially not while walking over grass or other areas. No chance.


And there is no way that the landcard of a map-dowser will have special static-charge-hotspots over certain areas that fully match with the real world outside where treasures may be be hidden! :lol:


It's really interesting what methods Dell Winders uses to trick or "convince" people so they may think what he tells may be the truth.

The blind will lead the blind...



@ Dell Winders

What's next? The human body as a gravity-field-distortion detector?

Holy cow! Dell Winders found the lost souls from the pirates of the Florida keys with his new model - the detection signal looks like crossed bones! :lol:


Dell, enjoy it that I'm not the gouvernator :D of Florida or you could detect the iron bars of a prison cell already for a long long time, but from the inside! :lol:

You are fooling stupid folks who doesn't know it any better with your pseudo wonder machines and you have not the slightest feeling of guiltiness about it. Instead you think you are the best. :angry: :angry: :angry:

All you have are flukes and ideomotoric self-deception!

read this:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carpenter_effect

And now Dell please stop hijacking this thread, if your stuff really works Carl Moreland would have found the proof for this since many many years! :nono:
You are just one of so many many esoterical crap provider old grannys and superstitious people fall for!

You also could sell crystals made of glass and tell them it will protect them from evil spirits and many of those extremly mentally poor lunatics out there would believe it!

Perhaps you should go to Haiti and ban the voodoo-gods with your wonder-machines - this land is full of blind believers! Or even better:
Go there an the detect some zombies! :lol: :lol:



@ all:

Back to topic !!!

This thread is about real electronical EM-field detecting devices and really reliable methods to test them!!!

Angle-poles, pendulums or dowsing stuff for shure never will pass such tests!

[Carl-NC]

Thank you, Dell, you are right, and I had forgotten about that. As the linked thread shows, Mineoro not only refused to follow up on the "challenge," they even blocked my emails. Some challenge, eh?

The question remains unanswered.

[Dell Winders]

Funfinder you present yourself as another example of the cult of WEIS that reside here. Unfortunately, You have been trapped in your little box for so long you haven't a clue how physics work in nature.

Go ahead, Let all those pent up rants out about me, and how uneducated you believe LRL consumers are, and see if it helps ease some of your frustrations. A reality check is probably in order.

If what I say bothers you so much, just ignore me. I don't mind. Dell :lol:

[WM6]

If static field attract dowsing rod independent from ideomotoric movement of dowsers hand, then why they must keep dowsing rod in hand during dowsing session?

Wouldn't dowsing rod be more attracted by static field, if hanged on string instead to be held firmly in hand?

[Qiaozhi]

Funfinder you present yourself as another example of the cult of WEIS that reside here. Unfortunately, You have been trapped in your little box for so long you haven't a clue how physics work in nature.

Go ahead, Let all those pent up rants out about me, and how uneducated you believe LRL consumers are, and see if it helps ease some of your frustrations. A reality check is probably in order.

If what I say bothers you so much, just ignore me. I don't mind. Dell :lol:
You remind me of a long deceased uncle. When I was studying Physics at university, he asked me, "What's a physic anyway?". :lol:

FunFinder's link included a very true statement concerning those self-deluded souls who believe that dowsing really works: "Many subjects are unconvinced that their actions are originating solely from within themselves."

Try looking outside your [trailer] box at the real world for a change. Map dowsing at your kitchen table is a fools' game.

[Geo]

You remind me of a long deceased uncle. When I was studying Physics at university, he asked me, "What's a physic anyway?". :lol:

FunFinder's link included a very true statement concerning those self-deluded souls who believe that dowsing really works: "Many subjects are unconvinced that their actions are originating solely from within themselves."

Try looking outside your [trailer] box at the real world for a change. Map dowsing at your kitchen table is a fools' game.

So what????, because funfinder told it .. what is mean???, it is right!!!....:lol::lol:

Qiaozhi, calm. One day you will see a real dowser and after it you will not know what to say....
For you, all the believers to dowsing are fools and all the non believers are the clever.

I don't think...... :lol::lol:

[J_Player]

So what????, because funfinder told it .. what is mean???, it is right!!!....:lol::lol:

Qiaozhi, calm. One day you will see a real dowser and after it you will not know what to say....
For you, all the believers to dowsing are fools and all the non believers are the clever.

I don't think...... :lol::lol:I saw a real dowser, and I knew what to say:
"Why are you finding only gold nuggets which you place on the ground and watch them while you are dowsing?
Can't you find the nuggets when I hide them? "


Best Wishes, :)
J_P

[J_Player]

You have to ask your self, if you are smart enough to learn to use L-rods to detect Magnetic fields?

...If you want to place L rods in a stationary vice that's your prerogative but it sounds like a stupid, awkward way of using them.
Be sure you connect wires to the handles and hold the ends of the wires. A human connection is used to alter the polarity of the Rod(s).

Originally posted by Qiaozhi:
A human connection is used to [unconsciously] move the rod. This is your so-called trained ideomotor effect, or (in other words) self deception.Hmmm....
It sounds like Dell has suggested an actual test we can perform to prove L-rods will detect the magnetic field of objects which LRLs find...
We can attach rods in a vice and connect wires to the handles and hold the ends of the wires like Dell says.

Then we can get an assistant to wave some targets in front of the rods to see if they move.
We can try samples of the same elements which Dell says he tested on his web page: gold, silver, copper, lead, nickels, diamonds, emeralds, garnet, flint and aspirin".
We will certainly see the LRL L-rod move to follow the magnetic field of these objects.... :rolleyes:

Will it work as well as this L-rod LRL following the "magnetic field" of a gold ring we wave in front of it when there is no vice?

http://www.longrangelocators.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=11602&stc=1&d=1268610423

Now lemme see...
The force vectors go right-left, front-back, and vertical.
I wonder where the imaginary component is?


Best wishe's :)
J_P

[Qiaozhi]

So what????, because funfinder told it .. what is mean???, it is right!!!....:lol::lol:

Qiaozhi, calm. One day you will see a real dowser and after it you will not know what to say....
For you, all the believers to dowsing are fools and all the non believers are the clever.

I don't think...... :lol::lol:
OK ... I'll take the bait. ;)

What do you mean by "a real dowser"?

[Carl-NC]

I'm still wondering if there is really anyone who can use L-rods to detect a magnetic field, or if that was another spurious claim. I'm sure I could do it if the rods are made of steel. Maybe that's what he meant.

[J_Player]

I'm still wondering if there is really anyone who can use L-rods to detect a magnetic field, or if that was another spurious claim. I'm sure I could do it if the rods are made of steel. Maybe that's what he meant.I believe you will see the rods Dell sells are made of 1/8" brass brazing rods.
The belief in "magnetic field" causing a brass or copper L-rod to move comes from pseudoscience collected by people who do not have much education.
Pseudoscience practitioners are not very good with scalars, vectors or imaginary numbers; their version of science must explain imaginary signal lines.

Wierd magnetic teachings can also come from practitioners of hungscience, who were taught the facts of magnetic fields, but prefer to make up their own axioms of science.
This helps them to explain how they can locate a coin from a mile distance, as long as they don't have annoying science and reality to get in the way.

Best Wishes, :)
J_P

[Dell Winders]

JP, is another grand supporter of WEIS, who is locked in his safe little closed minded box where actual field tests, knowledge, or field experience is permitted to enter. Dell :lol:

[J_Player]

JP, is another grand supporter of WEIS, who is locked in his safe little closed minded box where actual field tests, knowledge, or field experience is permitted to enter. Dell :lol:It looks like I wandered out of the "science box" to the "land of Omnitronia" where king Dell explained how to make L-rods detect Magnetic fields from a vice....
You have to ask your self, if you are smart enough to learn to use L-rods to detect Magnetic fields?

...If you want to place L rods in a stationary vice that's your prerogative but it sounds like a stupid, awkward way of using them.
Be sure you connect wires to the handles and hold the ends of the wires. A human connection is used to alter the polarity of the Rod(s).Is this your suggestion to show how field testing an L-rod in a vice really works, from "Dell knowledge and field experience"?
Or did someone else post those words? :lol: :lol: :lol:


Best Wishes, :)
J_P

[Qiaozhi]

JP, is another grand supporter of WEIS, who is locked in his safe little closed minded box where actual field tests, knowledge, or field experience is permitted to enter. Dell :lol:
Did you mean "not permitted to enter"? :lol:

It's strange how the personal insults start when you find yourself in a corner. ;)

[Geo]

OK ... I'll take the bait. ;)

What do you mean by "a real dowser"?

... that all the people that say they are good dowsers, they are not.
Real dowser is the good dowser, is the man that knows very good how to discriminate and how to calculate the depth. I did not saw a good dowser to has the ability to dowsing at all metals.
My friend (teacher) was good only at copper and silver, some other only to copper and lead but i saw only an old man that he was very good at gold, no other metals. He found a lot of gold coins and objects and of course he was very very rich. Persons that i wrote was REAL dowsers.
Now they are not at life.

Regards

btw... if you remember you must send me a message.....:)

[Dell Winders]

Yes, very strange.

I went to update my e-mail and received this message.
The administrator has banned your email address.

I wonder what Carl, is afraid of? Could it be that someone visiting here will seek the truth? Dell :lol:

[Geo]

I'm still wondering if there is really anyone who can use L-rods to detect a magnetic field, or if that was another spurious claim. I'm sure I could do it if the rods are made of steel. Maybe that's what he meant.


Dowsers say it magnetic field but i don't know what it is.
Some times dowsers can't dowsing for 3 or 4 weeks and they say that the magnetic field is low. I don't know what exactly they feel... but they have not any responce from the rod .
I don't feel it because i have not the abillity to dowsing more far that 20...30 m.

[Carl-NC]

Yes, very strange.

I went to update my e-mail and received this message.


I wonder what Carl, is afraid of? Could it be that someone visiting here will seek the truth? Dell :lol:

Dell, I could say that I haven't banned your email address, but you never claimed I did, did you?

I am still curious about detecting magnetic fields with L-rods, and why there is not a single person on Earth who could demonstrate this.

[Funfinder]

@ all
Please let's move away now from the dowsing topic, thx.



@ Morgan
Please tell us how you are testing your PDK!

Thank you very very much! :)

Is the weather already OK in Portugal for new tests?

[Dell Winders]

Dell, I could say that I haven't banned your email address, but you never claimed I did, did you?

I am still curious about detecting magnetic fields with L-rods, and why there is not a single person on Earth who could demonstrate this.

The administrator has banned your email address.

You could say that and I wouldn't expect you to be truthful, but that doesn't stop the message from appearing when I try to update my e-mail on your site.

If you are curious you should investigate and learn something. Dowsers, have claimed their L-Rod(s) have been detecting Magnetic lines for at least 60 years.

My own DB L-Rod comparison tests with a magnetometer proved this to be true. Dell

[Qiaozhi]

You could say that and I wouldn't expect you to be truthful, but that doesn't stop the message from appearing when I try to update my e-mail on your site.
Try reading the "I Can't Register... Why?" thread, before making accusations. ->
http://www.longrangelocators.com/forums/showthread.php?t=15155

[J_Player]

...If you are curious you should investigate and learn something. Dowsers, have claimed their L-Rod(s) have been detecting Magnetic lines for at least 60 years.

My own DB L-Rod comparison tests with a magnetometer proved this to be true. DellWhere can we read a report on your DB L-Rod comparison tests with a magnetometer?


Best Wishes, :)
J_P

[Carl-NC]

Dowsers, have claimed their L-Rod(s) have been detecting Magnetic lines for at least 60 years.

Well there ya have it, all the proof a person would need. It must be true!

[Dell Winders]

Where can we read a report on your DB L-Rod comparison tests with a magnetometer?


Best Wishes, :)
J_P

For what purpose? Aren't you capable of conducting your own DB comparison tests? That's the only way you will ever know for sure. It's for certain that with your arrogance of self importance, and superior attitude toward folks with no formal education you aren't going to accept my word for it. Dell

[J_Player]

For what purpose? Aren't you capable of conducting your own DB comparison tests? That's the only way you will ever know for sure. It's for certain that with your arrogance of self importance, and superior attitude toward folks with no formal education you aren't going to accept my word for it. DellFor what purpose?
For one, I never heard of a DB comparison test with a magnetometer that proves dowsers L-Rod(s) detect Magnetic lines.
In fact I don't know that it is possible to make a DB comparison test with a magnetometer that proves dowsers L-Rod(s) detect magnetic lines.

The purpose of reading this report of your DB test is to learn what procedure you used to conduct a DB test, and the results you recorded from this test, and of course to learn something from Dell.
But how can we establish that you in fact conducted a DB test? Because you said so?
How can we know what results this alleged DB test produced?
Is there a reason why we should believe you are telling us facts about an alleged DB test, or is this more wind from Winders? :shrug:

Best Wishes, :)
J_P

[Mike(Mont)]

Dell, no matter how much you waterboard those skeptics, they will never give in, never admit they are wrong. They will scratch, claw, gouge, kick and scream. They will take it with them to their grave. It's what I call the Natural Selection Process. Some people will not accept the Graces given to them by our creator. They take the positive and turn it into a negative. That's what they choose.

[Dell Winders]

Try reading the "I Can't Register... Why?" thread, before making accusations. ->
http://www.longrangelocators.com/forums/showthread.php?t=15155

Thanks Q! I guess it's hard for WEIS people logic to understand why I wouldn't think to search thru the entire forum to find a "closed" thread entitled "Why I can't register" (I couldn't find it in the search engine} when I have already been registered on this forum for years and was simply attempting to update my E-mail address in my profile which has been expired for more than a year.. Although my present E-mail address has n NEVER before been rejected before by any company,forum, or person, I guess I should understand Carl's paranoia of being spammed by me. :lol:

O.K. you have banned me from updating my E-mail address from my profile, it's no big deal for me.

So be wary of any E-mail that comes to you from, omnitron@gmx.com :lol:

[Dell Winders]

and of course to learn something from Dell.

That would be a novelty from an avid supporter and participant in Carl's, WEIS group

Have you asked Carl, for his field reports on all the purported tests he has conducted on L-Rods & LRL's? You seem believe what Carl tells you with blind faith and trust in it's accuracy. If so, and you are incapable of conducting tests yourself, why ask me, ask Carl?

Sure, I could waste my time here explaining the hundreds of field tests I've conducted, the protocol, and the results, but to what avail? I've tried for years to provide useful information on Carl's forums and it is always met with mockery & ridicule, as it does for so many others who have come to this forum to share, or obtain information.

If there were a real scientist among you, sincerely interested in duplicating the Magnetic field tests, then maybe I would take some time but judging by the stupid, irrational remarks made by the owner of this forum, attracting scientist to this forum will never happen.

I am still curious about detecting magnetic fields with L-rods, and why there is not a single person on Earth who could demonstrate this. :lol: Dell

[J_Player]

That would be a novelty from an avid supporter and participant in Carl's, WEIS group

Have you asked Carl, for his field reports on all the purported tests he has conducted on L-Rods & LRL's? You seem believe what Carl tells you with blind faith and trust in it's accuracy. If so, and you are incapable of conducting tests yourself, why ask me, ask Carl?

Sure, I could waste my time here explaining the hundreds of field tests I've conducted, the protocol, and the results, but to what avail? I've tried for years to provide useful information on Carl's forums and it is always met with mockery & ridicule, as it does for so many others who have come to this forum to share, or obtain information.

If there were a real scientist among you, sincerely interested in duplicating the Magnetic field tests, then maybe I would take some time but judging by the stupid, irrational remarks made by the owner of this forum, attracting scientist to this forum will never happen.

:lol: DellUm, Dell...
I never saw Carl post misleading BS or false information in this forum. Trust is not necessary -- I can check reputable sources to confirm his statements are true.
But this is not the case for what you post... reputable sources do not teach that L-rods detect magnetic lines.

1. Carl never said he performed a DB L-Rod comparison tests with a magnetometer that proves dowsers L-Rod(s) detect Magnetic lines... YOU DID..!
It doesn't even make sense to ask Carl when you are claiming you did it.

2. How can anyone duplicate a DB test that never happened?
Or suppose I am wrong, and the alleged DB L-Rod comparison tests with a magnetometer tests did happen.
Then how can anyone duplicate this test if you are not capable of producing your test report to show what test protocol you used and results data you expect them to duplicate?
Nobody asked you to explain anything... simply post the test report for your alleged DB test of L-rod(s) detecting magnetic lines.

Did Dell really conduct any DB L-Rod comparison tests with a magnetometer that proves L-rod(s) detect magnetic lines?
Or is this more BS from Dell Winders? :rolleyes:


Best Wishes, :)
J_P

[Qiaozhi]

Thanks Q! I guess it's hard for WEIS people logic to understand why I wouldn't think to search thru the entire forum to find a "closed" thread entitled "Why I can't register" (I couldn't find it in the search engine} when I have already been registered on this forum for years and was simply attempting to update my E-mail address in my profile which has been expired for more than a year.. Although my present E-mail address has n NEVER before been rejected before by any company,forum, or person, I guess I should understand Carl's paranoia of being spammed by me. :lol:

O.K. you have banned me from updating my E-mail address from my profile, it's no big deal for me.

So be wary of any E-mail that comes to you from, omnitron@gmx.com :lol:
Which is odd, because there is a thread at the top of the forum entitled: Help! (http://www.longrangelocators.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=65) Look here if you are having problems.

I suppose you also didn't read the part where it says "I can set up your account manually if you want to use one of these email accounts."

Ask me nicely and I'll change it for you. :D

[brasilpb]

Friends'm still newbie with the phenomenon of long distance detection, I believe that the noble materials may're sending a signal and RF passive recipients able to locate, why it was like a metal detector does not need to be buried for a long period by that time would not interfere, perhaps the noble materials may be suffering an electrolysis sedendo electrons, or receiving electrons, most would not need any more secret, in order to make sure that would use an oscilloscope to monitor the output signals the passive receiver to see if it would have an abnormality in the target location.


Amigos ainda sou novato com o fenômeno da deteção de longa distância, creio eu que os materias nobres possam tá enviando algum sinal de RF e os receptores passivos consigam localizar, por que se fosse como um detector de metais não precisaria estar enterrado por um longo perÃ*odo, por que o tempo não iria interferir, talvez os materias nobres possam estar sofrendo uma eletrólise sedendo eletróns, ou recebendo eletróns, mais que não precisaria de mais nenhum segredo, para poder ter a certeza teria que usar um osciloscopio para monitorar os sinais na saÃ*da do receptor passivo, para ver se teria alguma anomalia no local do alvo.

[Dell Winders]

Oscilliscopes were used successfully to monitor the incoming "Receive " signals of experimental locators in 1982. I field tested two of these units. Dell

[mustefa ubram]

please see this tapic
http://www.longrangelocators.com/forums/showthread.php?t=18785

[Dell Winders]

Which is odd, because there is a thread at the top of the forum entitled: Help! (http://www.longrangelocators.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=65) Look here if you are having problems.

I suppose you also didn't read the part where it says "I can set up your account manually if you want to use one of these email accounts."

Ask me nicely and I'll change it for you. :D

???? Your message was loud & clear The administrator has banned your email address. Now, you want me to beg you to update my profile?

My account is already registered, why do you insist I should search "help" to find out why I can't register??? Your WEIS logic defies common sense. I can post my E-Mail address on this forum, omnitron@gmx.com but I can't include it in my profile because Carl, is paranoid of being spammed??? :lol: Dell

[J_Player]

Oscilliscopes were used successfully to monitor the incoming "Receive " signals of experimental locators in 1982. I field tested two of these units. Dell

http://www.longrangelocators.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=18341&stc=1&d=1359830162Hahahahahahahaha.....
Oscilloscopes were successfully used to monitor the signals from Rangertell LRLs too. And I field tested two of these units.
Pictures of oscilloscopes and Rangertells don't show anything about any DB testing,
same as your photo of an oscilloscope and LRL has nothing to do with alleged DB tests which you never did.
Yup it looks like Dell Winders is posting another load misleading BS to fool people so they will believe he did DB testing that proved L-rods detect magnetic lines.

Um, Dell...
You have demonstrated that you don't know what you're talking about; you're just posting more crap instead a report from your fake claims of DB testing.
It appears you made no DB comparison test to prove L-rod(s) detect magnetic lines.
You can't produce any test results or even a protocol for DB tests you did not conduct.

Here we see again, the LRL buffoon comes to illustrate he doesn't even know how to conduct a DB test.
He sends us an oscilloscope photo to convince us he ran DB tests which proves L-rods detect magnetic lines.
What you showed us about your alleged DB tests is -- nothing!
You got nothing Dell, just empty words and old photos that have nothing to do with alleged DB tests.

It is clear you have no purpose in this discussion other than to disrupt and derail it so you can make rants to promote MFD products you sell.
We don't need lies you made up about DB tests that you never did, and other crap you post to clog up a topic where you have nothing to add except LRL salesman rhetoric.
Why don't you take your crap somewhere else where people will believe you made DB test and proved L-rods detect magnetic lines... Like T-net. http://www.geotech1.com/forums/images/smilies/roll.gif

Or if you really want to post here, the admins made a special place for you: http://www.longrangelocators.com/forums/showthread.php?t=11824 :lol:


Best Wishes, :)
J_P

[Qiaozhi]

???? Your message was loud & clear Now, you want me to beg you to update my profile?

My account is already registered, why do you insist I should search "help" to find out why I can't register??? Your WEIS logic defies common sense. I can post my E-Mail address on this forum, omnitron@gmx.com but I can't include it in my profile because Carl, is paranoid of being spammed??? :lol: Dell
I'm not asking you to beg, just ask me nicely. Hint: Something like: "Please can you change my email address in my account to xxx@gmx.com", otherwise I'll assume you're OK to stay as you are. Is it that difficult to ask a skeptic for help? :lol:

Yes, your account is already registered, but changes of email address need to be checked by sending an email to that account to confirm that it's a real address and not a made up one. The system is set up to reject email providers that are commonly used by spammers. So, if you've now switched to a spammy email provider, you will no doubt encounter some problems..

[Dell Winders]

Q, you are the boss here to run the forum as you see fit, I've stated my case. You are free to do as you wish. I am not here to tell you what to do.

I have made efforts to get skeptic's help in the past on one of Carl's forums. In all sincerity I asked if any one in the group could build me a meter that would measure the fluctuating strength of the Magnetic field above the Earth in real time ?

The resident clowns posted several pages of your usual guffaws & ridicule over that one. Carl, gave an answer to the extent of his electronic knowledge for me to use a Magnetometer. Ive done a lot of Magnetometer work detecting and metering magnetic anomalies, so from their replies I knew I was asking Idiots who did not have a clue but would rather result to ridicule and mockery than to admit it. So far, I see nothing has changed.

Right JPlayer? Dell

[Mike(Mont)]

I think most people know what a skeptic I am. I don't believe ANYTHING or just about anyone on the forums. Now I wonder if the person who is using "Dell Winders" is some imposter. Maybe the real Dell Winders is sick or something. I've tried to contact him since the middle of November. You never know what goes on around these treasure forums, but it's mostly not good.

[Carl-NC]

Mike, you are one of the LEAST skeptical people I've ever run across. But I agree about this "Dell" person, I suspect an imposter as well. Just doesn't sound like him. Almost alien-like, and not the illegal variety. The real Dell is out somewhere digging up gold bars.

[Qiaozhi]

Q, you are the boss here to run the forum as you see fit, I've stated my case. You are free to do as you wish. I am not here to tell you what to do.

I have made efforts to get skeptic's help in the past on one of Carl's forums. In all sincerity I asked if any one in the group could build me a meter that would measure the fluctuating strength of the Magnetic field above the Earth in real time ?

The resident clowns posted several pages of your usual guffaws & ridicule over that one. Carl, gave an answer to the extent of his electronic knowledge for me to use a Magnetometer. Ive done a lot of Magnetometer work detecting and metering magnetic anomalies, so from their replies I knew I was asking Idiots who did not have a clue but would rather result to ridicule and mockery than to admit it. So far, I see nothing has changed.

Right JPlayer? Dell
I will assume that you're OK to stay as you are then.

Anyway, if you are an imposter (as the latest conspiracy theory suggests) then changing Dell's email would not be a good idea.

[J_Player]

I will assume that you're OK to stay as you are then.

Anyway, if you are an imposter (as the latest conspiracy theory suggests) then changing Dell's email would not be a good idea.An imposter? http://www.longrangelocators.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=17736&stc=1&d=1325442464

Sorry Dell,
You're dang lucky Mike(Mont) discovered this imposter using your account to make fake claims that you ran DB tests.
Don't let him change yer email account!

And good luck with them gold bars yer diggin' up. http://www.geotech1.com/forums/images/smilies/clap.gif


Best Wishes, :)
J_P

[Carl-NC]

Yup, the REAL Dell would never make spurious claims.

[Funfinder]

@ Dell Winders


Dell, I will not ignore you, too bad for you. :nono:

We will find out what is your evil or ill mission in life!

I'm shure you have many unsatisfied customers already. :angry:



You need psychological self-deception to protect your own mind.



With your obscure and seen from a technical point of view

absolutly not at all able to work "loose-wires" all what

people will detect are findings by pure chance.



You never will be able to prove the absurd stuff you are claiming
on even one of a respected technical university in the states or anywhere in the world.

I wonder what tricks you are using to convince and fool potential
buyers so they start to throw their money away!
How much of the money you need to invest into deceiving promotion?!
Perhaps the same money as the nuclear-lobby has to.



I doubt you are able to make even one really convincing demonstration. All you can do ist cheat stupid folks.


You must be the same manipulative like astrologers who claim
that lightyears far away stars or planets of our solar systems are
able to decide about the fate, fortune and way of somebodys life!

Hahaha, somebody should throw them into psychiatrist clinic! :angry:
They already must have lost completly any sense for reality!


Who do people like you want to BS ???

You are like stealing candy from a baby, stealing money from
fooled and deceived persons who believe in your big liar-show!


The only reason why a business like yours can be runned at all
is because you are hiding and being camouflaged within the
esoterical misbelieve nonsense where almost anything is possible.

You also could sell simple hazelnut-rods in this area of sharlatans!


L-rods with improvement electronics - WOW, great!
Too bad the human person still has to hold them - to inject the
magical esoteric aura etc. bla bla bla.


Dell, you never will be able to explain STEP BY STEP why your dummy-detectors are working at all, and never you will be
able to succeed under real meaningful test-conditions!

Why you don't go to Vegas and make some magical-shows on stage - at least that way the people really know what they will get for their money!



It's a shame how much time all those evil and bad working elements in this world consumes from the precious life of other persons! :angry:

[Dell Winders]

Another example of WEIS? Nice Rant, Funfinder! Do you feel better? Too bad there are no facts, or truth to back up your false allegations. Then, you might be believable.

Carl, that's a great group of Hate mongering followers you attract.You must be very proud of yourself. :lol: Dell

[WM6]

Another example of WEIS? Nice Rant, Funfinder!

:lol: Dell

You mean WISE, Dell?

Great contribution Funfinder. I enjoy reading.

[Carl-NC]

Sorry Dell, overt fraud gets people riled up sometimes.

[Dell Winders]

As one of the biggest perpetrators you would know. Your friend Randi, got caught for his deception, so will you. :lol: Dell

[Geo]

As one of the biggest perpetrators you would know. Your friend Randi, got caught for his deception, so will you. :lol: Dell

Dell, can you tell more about him ???

[Mike(Mont)]

Carl, I have to give credit where credit is due. Yes that is Dell. I know because he ignores me. For years I've done everything I could to give him praise. He's a stubborn old goat and has the control freak in him (I guess we all do. just some people won't admit it). If you don't do what he says, he throws you under the bus. I guess I don't have to tell you that. LOL I still like him and I'm thankful for what he has taught me. We all have our faults.

Carl, I have to believe you are very misguided. Someone with your intelligence should have figured it out by now that the MFD's really do work. It's bothered me for years. That's okay, I don't care to waste my efforts trying to convince anyone. I know and that's all that really matters. Obviously I am very slow in realizing this. Out of all the skeptics you are my favorite, if there is such a thing.

[Dell Winders]

Dell, can you tell more about him ???

]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/James_Randi

[Fred]

I have been reading this forum for years, i have built, experimented, discussed many devices and ideas.
I have an open mind.
And yet, i am STILL looking for a proof that a real LRL device of any kind is working....And by working, i mean able to find underground metal in a independent and reliable way.
And that, i the real world, not the imaginary one.

But hey, that´s ok ! I am not waiting for an incredible treasure to realize myself, and i have all the time of the world to see it happen.

However, from what i have learn so far, the best way to earn easy money in this LRL world is by selling nonsense devices or brass rods at insane prices.

[Dell Winders]

Carl, I have to give credit where credit is due. Yes that is Dell. I know because he ignores me. For years I've done everything I could to give him praise. He's a stubborn old goat and has the control freak in him (I guess we all do. just some people won't admit it). If you don't do what he says, he throws you under the bus. I guess I don't have to tell you that. LOL I still like him and I'm thankful for what he has taught me. We all have our faults.

Carl, I have to believe you are very misguided. Someone with your intelligence should have figured it out by now that the MFD's really do work. It's bothered me for years. That's okay, I don't care to waste my efforts trying to convince anyone. I know and that's all that really matters. Obviously I am very slow in realizing this. Out of all the skeptics you are my favorite, if there is such a thing.

Mike you have always been both a customer, and a good friend. I am always grateful for your friendship and appreciate all the feed back you have given me from all the independent field & experiments you have conducted with LRL's. On your own you have studied, practiced and experimented with LRL's to the point you know much more than Carl, or his blind faith supporters. Nothing has changed except my inability to maintain communication at times. For that, I apologize.

You have to appreciate Carl's predicament. In his past efforts to make a name for him self at my expense, If he were to admit to being wrong about LRL, or MFD, he would be subject to libel for his defamation, and unscrupulous deeds. His reputation, and possibly his job would be ended, and costly.

As this forum clearly demonstrates it is set up for Carl's supporters to do his dirty work for him and he can't be held accountable. Smart!

I don't care how much they hammer me with untruths because my lifelong reputation is based on honesty. They can't destroy truth. My gripe is they try to paint my customers as uneducated, brainwashed, fools, stupid, deceived, and any other derogatory reference, and that is far from the truth.

Mike, as one of my many repeat customers, and friend, you are among those being insulted and slandered on this forum for your trust.

To use a religious connotation I could say " Forgive them, for they know not what they do", but that would be an insult to the intelligence of Carl's WEIS group, because they know very well what they are doing, as do I.

After years and years of harassment from Randi, and Carl, for my speaking the truth, Randi has fallen on his own sword . I can no longer find my name in his search engine. A change of heart, or a fear of more legal libel because of his own deception?

The same as with Randi, Carl's dishonesty will be revealed and truth will prevail. Some MFD's do indeed work in the field for me, you, and thousands of other consumers. But of course, NEVER for Carl. :lol: Dell

[Mike(Mont)]

So you are saying maybe they aren't as intelligent as I give them credit for? That notion has occurred to me. And if Carl is my favorite, you have a good idea of what I think of the others.

I know most people do not follow my "religious" thinking. It's much more about the ancient sage's knowledge. They were so in tune with nature. Very few today have a clue of any of it. It's beyond their low-life comprehension where greed, power, security are the only things they know. Just like when I said they take the positive and turn it into a negative, I know they can't even understand that one they are so far away from the truth. That's the Natural Selection Process at work.

[WM6]

Some MFD's do indeed work in the field for me,

:lol: Dell

Yes, in the field of deceiving people to make money.

[Dell Winders]

Yes, in the field of deceiving people to make money.

Carl, has you deceived into believing MFD can't work. How much money is he making out of his deception? :lol: Dell

[Carl-NC]

Carl, I have to believe you are very misguided. Someone with your intelligence should have figured it out by now that the MFD's really do work. It's bothered me for years. That's okay, I don't care to waste my efforts trying to convince anyone. I know and that's all that really matters. Obviously I am very slow in realizing this. Out of all the skeptics you are my favorite, if there is such a thing.

Mike, if it bothers you then take an hour out of your day, and show me an MFD, or any LRL, that really works. That's all I ask, show me. If you say, "no, I have nothing to prove," then I will agree; you have nothing to prove.

[J_Player]

Carl, has you deceived into believing MFD can't work. How much money is he making out of his deception? DellHe didn't fool me...
I know MFD can work, and I know who's making money out of deception:


http://www.longrangelocators.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=17850&stc=1&d=1327337460


Best Wishes :)
J_P

[kaligula]

V