Real signal generator for dowsing

[ANDREAS]

Hello everyone.
I present here a prototype generator designed for a client few months ago.
The project is correct 100%
Anyone who wants to build this, follow the instructions to obtain a generator that actually carries the signal into the earth.
Schematics for generators or complet module DDS generators (you can find ebay) anyone can easily find today.
Schematic for amplifiers output signal, there are many. Some schematics for amplifiers have been published here in the forum.
I believe that, anyone who wants to experiment with dowsing with a generator sends real signal within the earth, it's worth making this effort.
Continued ....

[Qiaozhi]

Hello everyone.
I present here a prototype generator designed for a client few months ago.
The project is correct 100%
Anyone who wants to build this, follow the instructions to obtain a generator that actually carries the signal into the earth.
Schematics for generators or complet module DDS generators (you can find ebay) anyone can easily find today.
Schematic for amplifiers output signal, there are many. Some schematics for amplifiers have been published here in the forum.
I believe that, anyone who wants to experiment with dowsing with a generator sends real signal within the earth, it's worth making this effort.
Continued ....
Sorry Andreas, this is based on dowsing, so it cannot possibly be used to find treasure.
Just my skeptical view. :frown:

[ANDREAS]

Sorry Andreas, this is based on dowsing, so it cannot possibly be used to find treasure.
Just my skeptical view. :frown:
Hi Qiaozhi
I never said my opinions on dowsing, never I mentioned whether it is effective or not use dowsing for detecting treasure.
The presentation is for those involved in dowsing with a generator that truly sends a signal to earth .
Please wait to see the sequel and you figured we refer exclusively to the way that can signal generator inside the earth.
Nothing more
best regards

[Qiaozhi]

Hi Qiaozhi
I never said my opinions on dowsing, never I mentioned whether it is effective or not use dowsing for detecting treasure.
The presentation is for those involved in dowsing with a generator that truly sends a signal to earth .
Please wait to see the sequel and you figured we refer exclusively to the way that can signal generator inside the earth.
Nothing more
best regards
OK, I understand. You're simply supplying a demand.

[ANDREAS]

Thank you Qiaozhi
I think you understand me . As you know my English is very poor and I don't like use of translation, as you know my opinion about dowsing.

...continue
As we know, the usual method of electronic dowsing survey, done by using a frequency generator, digital or simply that the dowsing connects the earth with copper or stainless steel needles.
Usually when placed close to the pins together on Earth, utilizing a buffer - transformer between the generator and needles.
All dowsers believes is indeed important (in terms of dowsing) in output accuracy and stability of the generator, because dowsing "believes" that it just depends on the stability of the effectiveness of investigations.
I will not mention if the force is investigating the dowsing method, as I don't comment on specific frequencies dowsers believe that it is necessary to research a specific target (eg gold).
I refer only to the wrong opinion, all dowsers, who believe that the mark of a generator can be spread on the land with spikes and even a sizable distance.
In fact if you put a generator with spikes on earth the true length of the signal propagation depends mainly
1. Since the distance between the two needles of the generator
2. From the "texture" and moisture of the land surrounding the needles
Detailed presentation and use of formulas to understand the above two parameters are not necessary here. Just I telling you that the maximum distance signal propagation in the earth needles is usually... (distance pins) * 2.9 * (special soil conditions) * (Power output RMS)
The specific conditions of soil has values of 0.7 (soil without water) - 2.4 (soil with plenty of water) on average.
So if we have two connector neeedles on earth with 1m spacing and dry ground, 1WRMS amplifier, the signal can not be spread more than 1 * 2.9 * 0.7 * 1 = 2.03 meters. He even along the spreading is to exclude any axis linking the two needles to another location and have another reduction.


Therefore any dowser who believes that the generator helps to stimulate the target at long distances is a misunderstanding. In practice Excite «ideomotor phenomenon" nothing more.
But if you really still believe that the signal travels from the needles through the earth, make a simple experiment. Whoever has digital generator to output 560-1200KIZ and connect the pins to ground. With a simple AM radio can detect the signal generator in X distance. If you cover with a metal box together needles & generator, we see that the signal is lost. In fact, the radio signal received directly from the generator and not through the earth. This is the reason that shielded a canister missed the mark, simply because there was no signal detected from earth aapeftheias
Conclusion.
The presentation of this system is to have a realistic method for sending signals inside the earth.
I have not opinion on the effectiveness of dowsing research. I have respect only for how they really need to connect a generator to send an X mark on a Y distance away and think this is enough help for those dealing with dowsing experiments or even investigating dowser search
continues

[hung]

This is not for dowsing but for swivel type LRLs employing rods for response.
Also tough it works to some extent you don't need to stick it in the ground as the actual transmitting component used in dowsing is not hertzian.

[nelson]

Hi Andreas

Very nice device you are showing and i agree with Qiazori and you that this is only for people that likes to experiment about dowsing.

Best regards

Nelson

Hello everyone.
I present here a prototype generator designed for a client few months ago.
The project is correct 100%
Anyone who wants to build this, follow the instructions to obtain a generator that actually carries the signal into the earth.
Schematics for generators or complet module DDS generators (you can find ebay) anyone can easily find today.
Schematic for amplifiers output signal, there are many. Some schematics for amplifiers have been published here in the forum.
I believe that, anyone who wants to experiment with dowsing with a generator sends real signal within the earth, it's worth making this effort.
Continued ....

[ANDREAS]

Generator work with flat-top aerial used in the VLF, LF, MF and shortwave bands. This antenna invented before 1920. The flat-top antenna functions as a monopole antenna with capacitive load.
The original flat-top antenna consists of a horizontal wires a vertical wire is connected to the center of the horizontal wire and hangs down close to the ground. Sometimes use many parallel horizontal wires, connected together at the center wire.
Here we can use this type antenna, with small mods for send signal in ground.
What we are newest?.
Replacing wires with a stable horizontal metal plate, building a certain way, so we have real capacitive load.
The antenna performance is close to 5%, depends on the accuracy of the construction. Usually amateur with handmade can produce perfomance 3-4% Not bad, if you understand, that simply needles the earth has performance near 0,5%. In this case you have performance up 400%
Materials for antenna
Your generator
two metal plates diametre 20-25cm.
IMPORTANCE only two plates have exactly the same dimensions.
coaxial cable connectors
A small plate diameter 1/10 of the large plate
Several personal work
See the schematic construction. I think is simple enough for everyone
I wish you success in all experiments in dowsing
best regards

[J_Player]

... Therefore any dowser who believes that the generator helps to stimulate the target at long distances is a misunderstanding. In practice Excite «ideomotor phenomenon" nothing more.
But if you really still believe that the signal travels from the needles through the earth, make a simple experiment. Whoever has digital generator to output 560-1200KIZ and connect the pins to ground. With a simple AM radio can detect the signal generator in X distance. If you cover with a metal box together needles & generator, we see that the signal is lost. In fact, the radio signal received directly from the generator and not through the earth. This is the reason that shielded a canister missed the mark, simply because there was no signal detected from earth aapeftheias...


... Generator work with flat-top aerial used in the VLF, LF, MF and shortwave bands. This antenna invented before 1920. The flat-top antenna functions as a monopole antenna with capacitive load.
Hi Andreas,
I congratulate you for showing complete details for construction of your antenna to use for MFD signals.
Your signal generator looks very well-packaged as well as your antenna construction.

What you say for measuring signal distance is the same as what I measured.
I could not find the signal to travel more than 30 cm when I put two needles in the ground for a 5v signal generator sending audio frequency.
michael found better distance of two meters when he used his 100 watt 24 volt audio amplifier (TDA7294). But after 2 meters michael lost his signal.
It is exactly as you say. The signal is lost after a short distance.

Now I see your prototype is using only a single needle to send the signal.
Radio experimenters know the flat top antenna is used to send RF broadcast.
But most modern flat top antennas use a different configuration with long stretched parallel wires.
This flat top design that you made is based on earlier concepts which do not broadcast Hertzian waves, but they certainly send waves into the ground.
When I read the theories behind this antenna, I imagine the signal would travel very far.
But I can find very little information for how far the signal is sent through the ground.
Have you taken measurements to find how much distance you can detect the signal from your antenna needle?


Best Wishes, :)
J_P

[ANDREAS]

Thank you J_P
As I write, I became a single building prototypes for client.
Measurements were made on soft ground without water.
Ground Needle put ground with water and salt
With 8 W RMS amplifier at frequency 10 kHz signal "lost" in 40 meters
distance
Frequency of 1 kHz 30 meters distance
Frequency 15- 20 kHz maximum 10 meters distance
Frequency >20KHZ maximum 4meters distance
It's logical . Generator use with a output stage a amplifier TDAseries
This is audio amplifier and can not signal gain > 20 kHz
With freq >20KHZ work only standard (auto - select) output stage signal 200mv AC from generator
My opinion... with multiplication loops first plate and second plate work as reflector can go longer distance
I believe with output stage FETs power push-pull is better.
Interest here. My customer after experiments believe the generator has range 500 meters distance!!!!!! I am not dowser... i have not opinions for extreme range
Best regards

[aft_72005]

""Generator work with flat-top aerial used in the VLF, LF, MF and shortwave bands."""

Hi Andres
Why you didn't apply power directly to ground??? and By Antenna ?
Also you need big antenna for radiation 20 kHz .

[J_Player]

Thank you J_P
As I write, I became a single building prototypes for client.
Measurements were made on soft ground without water.
Ground Needle put ground with water and salt
With 8 W RMS amplifier at frequency 10 kHz signal "lost" in 40 meters
distance
Frequency of 1 kHz 30 meters distance
Frequency 15- 20 kHz maximum 10 meters distance
Frequency >20KHZ maximum 4meters distance
It's logical . Generator use with a output stage a amplifier TDAseries
This is audio amplifier and can not signal gain > 20 kHz
With freq >20KHZ work only standard (auto - select) output stage signal 200mv AC from generator
My opinion... with multiplication loops first plate and second plate work as reflector can go longer distance
I believe with output stage FETs power push-pull is better.
Interest here. My customer after experiments believe the generator has range 500 meters distance!!!!!! I am not dowser... i have not opinions for extreme range
Best regardsHi Andreas,
The distances which you measured seem very interesting.
We do not find these same distances when we use a simple pair of ground probes as we see from typical MFD apparatus.
This makes me think this is a very interesting antenna for MFD users and dowsers to make experiments with.
Of course, you are correct. TDA series is for audio amplifier, and will not send good signals more than 20 KHz.
But we see most MFD users are interested to send audio frequencies, so TDA can work for these experimenters.
To send higher frequencies, I agree, you must have an amplifier with faster output stages to give a clean signal.
Better to use RF amplifiers.

Now, I have one final question.
When you made your distance measurements, what voltage did your DDS generator send to the antenna?
We know it was only 20 mv at 20 KHz, but what voltage was the antenna at 1 KHz and at 10 KHz?
Also, your what instrument did you use to detect the ground signal from a distance?

Best Wishes, :)
J_P

[aft_72005]

""With 8 W RMS amplifier at frequency 10 kHz signal "lost" in 40 meters
distance""

Tip this subject , power is 8W when apply to load for example 4 ohm ,
While the power apply to ground more less than 8W , because in depended to
Ground resistance .
Best regards.

[aft_72005]

""With 8 W RMS amplifier at frequency 10 kHz signal "lost" in 40 meters
distance
Frequency of 1 kHz 30 meters distance
Frequency 15- 20 kHz maximum 10 meters distance
Frequency >20KHZ maximum 4meters distance""


Andreas, I had some experiment seem you at past .
What s you measured is correct . my measurement seem you :thumb:

[J_Player]

""Generator work with flat-top aerial used in the VLF, LF, MF and shortwave bands."""

Hi Andres
Why you didn't apply power directly to ground??? and By Antenna ?
Also you need big antenna for radiation 20 kHz .Hi Aft,
This antenna is not designed to send RF into the air.
The original design of this antenna was intended to send to send 95% power to the ground, and 5% loss to the air.
The flat top metal plates are used to add capacitance which allows a transfer of power to the ground.
From what Andreas says, his modification is working better than simple ground probes.

Best wishes, :)
J_P

[aft_72005]

Hi J_P


""This antenna is not designed to send RF into the air.""

Yes , surly

""The original design of this antenna was intended to send to send 95% power to the ground, and 5% loss to the air.""

Power connected to circular diameter 25 cm on top!!!!
My opinion is this subject " 20 khz cannot radiated by circular with 25 cm diameter
On top ".
Best regards .

[aft_72005]

""The original design of this antenna was intended to send to send 95% power to the ground, and 5% loss to the air""

Please see picture , I seeing ground connect to rod and coaxial shield , power to
Circular antenna with 25 cm diameter .
May be I seeing false .

[J_Player]

""The original design of this antenna was intended to send to send 95% power to the ground, and 5% loss to the air""

Please see picture , I seeing ground connect to rod and coaxial shield , power to
Circular antenna with 25 cm diameter .
May be I seeing false . Hi Aft,
The power is connected as you say.
But the power does not radiate from the plates.
Only 5% of the power is intended to be lost from the plates through RF radiation.
This antenna is not a typical RF dipole antenna.
It operates using the “near field” effects of the oscillator and a capacitor to deliver single-line power transmission.
The purpose of the flat top metal plates is to add capacitance to the circuit, which is necessary to allow a transfer of power to the ground.
This design of antenna was first put into practice on a large scale by Marconi when he modified it so it could be used for RF broadcast.
But the original design was intended to transmit longitudinal electric waves into the ground (not electromagnetic waves as we think of in RF broadcast).
The purpose is to send power into the ground (as you might send it through a conductor for an AC power cable), not to send RF into the air.
This kind of power transmission is usually tuned for a single frequency, but I am surprised to see it works on various frequencies from VLF to MF.
In fact, this is the first practical example of this design I have seen used in modern electronics.
This is why I think this will be an interesting project to experiment with.

Since this device is designed to inject power into the ground, then the distance we can measure this power will depend on the mobile ions in the ground.
This explains why Andreas tells us about the water and salt content of the ground when he talks about distance which the signal can travel.
It seems Andreas is following the same science for his measurements as geologists use when they make their earth resistivity surveys, and induced polarization studies.

Best Wishes, :)
J_P

[ANDREAS]

""Generator work with flat-top aerial used in the VLF, LF, MF and shortwave bands."""

Hi Andres
Why you didn't apply power directly to ground??? and By Antenna ?
Also you need big antenna for radiation 20 kHz .
Hi Aft
You are correct. If you study well my last posts ,I work with efficiency 5%. This is because the antenna (plates) are very small.
regards

[ANDREAS]

for J_P
Now, I have one final question.
When you made your distance measurements, what voltage did your DDS generator send to the antenna?
We know it was only 20 mv at 20 KHz, but what voltage was the antenna at 1 KHz and at 10 KHz?
A generator can not have the capabilities we want. Grounds generator with high voltage output, will probably be better. Even better a proper antenna design can have better performance. I start designed a new antenna (in my spare time) and I'll see what can be done

Also, your what instrument did you use to detect the ground signal from a distance?
I have a old VLF receiver (1KHZ-100KHZ) unknow firma (maybe military) with panel a field meter and a big-big external feritte antenna. For detection signal i use antenna-feritte vertical place and measurement via field meter
Best regards

[aft_72005]

""This design of antenna was first put into practice on a large scale by Marconi when he modified it so it could be used for RF broadcast.""

Yes, for this reason , this work interesting for me "" how radiated AF signals??""
From short antenna

[aft_72005]

Hi Aft
You are correct. If you study well my last posts ,I work with efficiency 5%. This is because the antenna (plates) are very small.
regards

Radiated %5 !!!http://www.persianrc.net/forum/images/smilies/SEVeyesB04_th.gif, crux solve for me nowhttp://www.persianrc.net/forum/images/smilies/SEVeyesB08_th.gif . thank you .

[aft_72005]

Andreas, this is my opinion base of my experiment , for more power , must be
Increased V PP( amplitude of Af signals) , connect amplifier output to
Ground by two rods . rod must be near together . with this method
Signals radiated as ""omni-directional ""

[aft_72005]

""The original design of this antenna was intended to send to send 95% power to the ground, and 5% loss to the air.""

thank you J_P . crux solved
Other things , I am designer in RF band. i remember designed "Rf amplifier"
, out put power was 15 W at 100MHZ ;), 20 years ago . when I was Yong and 24 years old .
But I am researcher about LRL now .http://www.persianrc.net/forum/images/smilies/SEVeyesC08_th.gif

[J_Player]

for J_P
Now, I have one final question.
When you made your distance measurements, what voltage did your DDS generator send to the antenna?
We know it was only 20 mv at 20 KHz, but what voltage was the antenna at 1 KHz and at 10 KHz?
A generator can not have the capabilities we want. Grounds generator with high voltage output, will probably be better. Even better a proper antenna design can have better performance. I start designed a new antenna (in my spare time) and I'll see what can be done

Also, your what instrument did you use to detect the ground signal from a distance?
I have a old VLF receiver (1KHZ-100KHZ) unknow firma (maybe military) with panel a field meter and a big-big external feritte antenna. For detection signal i use antenna-feritte vertical place and measurement via field meter
Best regardsHi Andreas,
I agree with you, I think you will find better distance if you use a higher voltage at the antenna.
My thinking is an RF power amp maybe 10 watts can be used to guarantee the 10 watts is available to the antenna at all frequencies.
I can also see it would be good to raise the voltage using a transformer to deliver higher voltage to the antenna and ground.

When you first presented your flat top antenna, you said :
"This antenna invented before 1920. The flat-top antenna functions as a monopole antenna with capacitive load.
...Anyone who wants to build this, follow the instructions to obtain a generator that actually carries the signal into the earth".
This is how I recognize this design to be based on the multiple loaded flat top antenna that was used in the early Marconi broadcasting stations in 1919.
This design was actually adapted from Nikola Tesla's patents for sending power to the ground.
I see your modification of this antenna is even simpler than the Marconi design.

But now you are talking about making new modifications for a proper antenna, so I am thinking you will modify to stop if from acting as single-wire ground transmission which Tesla designed.
It sounds as if your are planning to change it to become an antenna to broadcast more than 5% of the power into the air as RF broadcast.
If you do this, then I expect the ground power transmission will diminish, as more power is broadcast into the air.
In the VLF and LF bands, a large amount of this RF power radiated from the antenna will still penetrate the ground after passing through the air.

But if my idea is mistaken, then maybe you will be making modifications to the antenna for better power transmission to the ground.
If this is what you are intending to do, then I can see some possible mods which may bring this design closer to the original design which Tesla made to allow good power transfer to the ground.
In Tesla's designs, he used a resonant transformer to increase the voltage that is sent to the transformer.
But if we are to use a DDS generator to produce many different frequencies for testing, then we will not be able to use a resonant transformer, because the transformer will be resonant only at one frequency.
So it appears that if this scheme is used, we can only use a step-up transformer, which will probably not be resonant.
Still, we can find better ground penetration with a higher voltage.

I wait to see if there are modifications made by you or other readers.
See below for a schematic diagram of the Marconi Flat top antenna and some links for further reading:

http://www.tuks.nl/wiki/index.php/Main/PrinciplesOfWirelessPower
http://amasci.com/tesla/tmistk.html

http://www.teslauniverse.com/nikola-tesla-patents-649,621-transmission-of-energy
http://www.teslauniverse.com/nikola-tesla-patents-645,576-transmission-of-energy
http://www.teslauniverse.com/nikola-tesla-patents-1,119,732-transmitting-electrical-energy

Note: These are not schematics for construction. They are only general diagrams to show basic concepts.

[ANDREAS]

Thank you J_P for your infos
Final construction for those with generators.
Construction is a little difficult, because the gap between the rings must be 0.02mm. All rings associated with the signal generator. The grounding connected to the main plug. The best materials for "sandwich" construction is acrylic 4mm + metal rings + acrylic 4mm
With the tip (rings) you don't need a extra metal plate as reflector
Efficiencies greater than 95% signal through the earth, ranging 250HZ-14KHZ
Enjoy your success

[taxma1981]

Here I have a layout of a dowser similar antennas that work well ..

http://s12.postimage.org/y0jxbrpex/diataksi_ravdoskopikou.jpg (http://postimage.org/image/y0jxbrpex/)

[Mike(Mont)]

Thank you Qiaozhi
I think you understand me . As you know my English is very poor and I don't like use of translation, as you know my opinion about dowsing.

...continue
As we know, the usual method of electronic dowsing survey, done by using a frequency generator, digital or simply that the dowsing connects the earth with copper or stainless steel needles.
Usually when placed close to the pins together on Earth, utilizing a buffer - transformer between the generator and needles.
All dowsers believes is indeed important (in terms of dowsing) in output accuracy and stability of the generator, because dowsing "believes" that it just depends on the stability of the effectiveness of investigations.
I will not mention if the force is investigating the dowsing method, as I don't comment on specific frequencies dowsers believe that it is necessary to research a specific target (eg gold).
I refer only to the wrong opinion, all dowsers, who believe that the mark of a generator can be spread on the land with spikes and even a sizable distance.
In fact if you put a generator with spikes on earth the true length of the signal propagation depends mainly
1. Since the distance between the two needles of the generator
2. From the "texture" and moisture of the land surrounding the needles
Detailed presentation and use of formulas to understand the above two parameters are not necessary here. Just I telling you that the maximum distance signal propagation in the earth needles is usually... (distance pins) * 2.9 * (special soil conditions) * (Power output RMS)
The specific conditions of soil has values of 0.7 (soil without water) - 2.4 (soil with plenty of water) on average.
So if we have two connector neeedles on earth with 1m spacing and dry ground, 1WRMS amplifier, the signal can not be spread more than 1 * 2.9 * 0.7 * 1 = 2.03 meters. He even along the spreading is to exclude any axis linking the two needles to another location and have another reduction.


Therefore any dowser who believes that the generator helps to stimulate the target at long distances is a misunderstanding. In practice Excite «ideomotor phenomenon" nothing more.
But if you really still believe that the signal travels from the needles through the earth, make a simple experiment. Whoever has digital generator to output 560-1200KIZ and connect the pins to ground. With a simple AM radio can detect the signal generator in X distance. If you cover with a metal box together needles & generator, we see that the signal is lost. In fact, the radio signal received directly from the generator and not through the earth. This is the reason that shielded a canister missed the mark, simply because there was no signal detected from earth aapeftheias
Conclusion.
The presentation of this system is to have a realistic method for sending signals inside the earth.
I have not opinion on the effectiveness of dowsing research. I have respect only for how they really need to connect a generator to send an X mark on a Y distance away and think this is enough help for those dealing with dowsing experiments or even investigating dowser search
continues

Yes, it is true that the distance between the ground probes affects the distance the signal is detectable. One MFD manufacturer says to put the ground probes about an inch apart. Another says five inches apart. It has been my experience that with wider ground probe spacing you eventually reach a point where the signal line does not "focus" at the target. Sort of like double vision.

I've mentioned about the Lockheed Martin underground communications systems for miners. That transmits voice (much more difficult than Morse code) a half-mile through the ground with such low power as to not be able to create a spark. Abandon ship!

[fmnotes]

Thank you J_P for your infos
Final construction for those with generators.
Construction is a little difficult, because the gap between the rings must be 0.02mm. All rings associated with the signal generator. The grounding connected to the main plug. The best materials for "sandwich" construction is acrylic 4mm + metal rings + acrylic 4mm
With the tip (rings) you don't need a extra metal plate as reflector
Efficiencies greater than 95% signal through the earth, ranging 250HZ-14KHZ
Enjoy your success

If the copper pcb manufacturers in electronics will not work properly?
It is necessary that the rings be 4mm aluminum?
I wait your answer.

[ANDREAS]

If the copper pcb manufacturers in electronics will not work properly?
It is necessary that the rings be 4mm aluminum?
I wait your answer.
If you have gap between rings 0,03mm, you can use PCB. My opinion is... more difficult use PCB for this antenna
regards

[fmnotes]

If you have gap between rings 0,03mm, you can use PCB. My opinion is... more difficult use PCB for this antenna
regards

I think if it works correctly and pcb copper, which will be easy for me to carve.
Otherwise need CNC MACHINE.

A question even if you use a signal amplifier, the amplifier output will not be better connects a coil around 8 ohms?
Performs better for the amp.

Thank you well.

[ANDREAS]

........A question even if you use a signal amplifier, the amplifier output will not be better connects a coil around 8 ohms?.........

You are right. For me at the moment, at interest only as an experimental model. About load 8 ohms is irrelevant, because the "technical load" is a resistance near the 50 ohm
best regards

[fmnotes]

You are right. For me at the moment, at interest only as an experimental model. About load 8 ohms is irrelevant, because the "technical load" is a resistance near the 50 ohm
best regards

Thank you ANDREA

[Dedevil]

I think this is a good project, but argue that everyone has jumped aboard and grown antenna out of their head in search of E.T. The basics of dowsing or divining by rod have been discussed on this forum before and I believe it was agreed by all that it is charge related. If we wish to take it any further, then let’s all go forward with science. And not go chasing Extra Terrestrials with fancy gadgets that have L.C.D. displays.

And so I will start a new thread,

Part 1 – Science of L rod dowsing

rgds

[fmnotes]

I think this is a good project, but argue that everyone has jumped aboard and grown antenna out of their head in search of E.T. The basics of dowsing or divining by rod have been discussed on this forum before and I believe it was agreed by all that it is charge related. If we wish to take it any further, then let’s all go forward with science. And not go chasing Extra Terrestrials with fancy gadgets that have L.C.D. displays.

And so I will start a new thread,

Part 1 – Science of L rod dowsing

rgds

What concerns many people is how to convey (the low frequencies to the ground) without loss of power.

[Dedevil]

What concerns many people is how to convey (the low frequencies to the ground) without loss of power.

You could pick a deeper ground. Notice that Marconi's circuit has a earth in the ocean.

[fmnotes]

You could pick a deeper ground. Notice that Marconi's circuit has a earth in the ocean.

did not understand the answer, you explain that to me.

[antonis]

ac current is a f....d up current it uses possitive and negative it is slow for dowsing rod need big ampl..work
nice work andreas

[Nicolas]

Hi all

You can use it to build one real generator and simple


http://www.scienceprog.com/wp-content/uploads/2008i/DDS2/AVR_DDS_front_panel.jpg

http://www.electronics-lab.com/projects/test/013/Schematic.png


http://www.electronics-lab.com/projects/test/013/Photo_2.jpg

http://www.electronics-lab.com/projects/test/013/Photo_4.jpg

http://www.electronics-lab.com/projects/test/013/Photo_11.jpg

I put here the Hex file

http://www.electronics-lab.com/projects/test/013/index.html

[goldfinder]

A similar signal generator is available on eBay for less than you can build one.
Goldfinder

[Mike(Mont)]

Generator work with flat-top aerial used in the VLF, LF, MF and shortwave bands. This antenna invented before 1920. The flat-top antenna functions as a monopole antenna with capacitive load.
The original flat-top antenna consists of a horizontal wires a vertical wire is connected to the center of the horizontal wire and hangs down close to the ground. Sometimes use many parallel horizontal wires, connected together at the center wire.
Here we can use this type antenna, with small mods for send signal in ground.
What we are newest?.
Replacing wires with a stable horizontal metal plate, building a certain way, so we have real capacitive load.
The antenna performance is close to 5%, depends on the accuracy of the construction. Usually amateur with handmade can produce perfomance 3-4% Not bad, if you understand, that simply needles the earth has performance near 0,5%. In this case you have performance up 400%
Materials for antenna
Your generator
two metal plates diametre 20-25cm.
IMPORTANCE only two plates have exactly the same dimensions.
coaxial cable connectors
A small plate diameter 1/10 of the large plate
Several personal work
See the schematic construction. I think is simple enough for everyone
I wish you success in all experiments in dowsing
best regards

This stuff is interesting, Just curious if anyone can interpret this diagram (post 8 of this thread) so an idiot can understand it. It shows the coaxial what appears to be two wires both attached to the lower plate--one to the lower surface and one to the center of the edge. It doesn't show any connection to the upper plate. :???: Thanks. I assume the center wire of the coaxial is supposed to be attached to the upper plate and the shield to the lower plate.

[Mike(Mont)]

After a bit of head scratching I see the top plate is not connected and is supposed to reflect the energy downward. That doesn't look right to me, but pretty sure most people would say the same about me. :lol:

If you go to post 25 (by J_Player) down at the bottom of the post and read the second article on Tesla, this is what Konstantine Meyl is doing. He wrote his papers on this in 1990 but he used pancake coils instead of the long tube coil. Then at the bottom of that article are more links about capacitive antennas. I've mentioned this that the skeptics are misapplying theory when they argue against the frequency discriminators. Beaty discusses this, although not the discriminators.

[Mike(Mont)]

:lol: Well, what do I know? Meyl says that if you don't know what you are doing, this energy can be dangerous to humans so you might want to keep that in mind and read all you can about it FIRST. From all accounts, Tesla was not right in the head. I guess it didn't kill him but no one knows what it did to him genetically. it appears he neutered himself. Guess you can't say he was "nuts". :lol:

[Mike(Mont)]

BTW, this is hardly considered dowsing. It just shows most people not not even understand what the word means. J_player posted the links to Bill Beaty's explanation of Tesla's work and that I agree with. Geez, did i just say that? Oh, well. I've leave this alone because I really don't care what others think, but something is not right.

Well, maybe I take that back. If it is not sending a signal then I guess it IS dowsing. :lol:

[WM6]

To improve wave propagation, directivity and sensing, you can always combine capacitive and inductive elements:

http://i64.tinypic.com/i4l538.jpg

[Mike(Mont)]

According to Meyl, the air between the coils is an "air capacitor".

All I can say is people who think there is only small amounts of energy transferred over very short distances must be trying to measure it the wrong way. It requires some kind of resonant device to gather the energy, otherwise no energy is transferred. It's there in the longitudinal waves that travel through the air along the earth.

http://amasci.com/tesla/tmistk.html

Look at figure 9

[Mike(Mont)]

Oops, did not describe this correctly. The free electrons in the wire (or the earth) are compressible and act like a longitudinal wave.

[kostas87]

Hi Andreas,
I agree with you, I think you will find better distance if you use a higher voltage at the antenna.
My thinking is an RF power amp maybe 10 watts can be used to guarantee the 10 watts is available to the antenna at all frequencies.
I can also see it would be good to raise the voltage using a transformer to deliver higher voltage to the antenna and ground.

When you first presented your flat top antenna, you said :
"This antenna invented before 1920. The flat-top antenna functions as a monopole antenna with capacitive load.
...Anyone who wants to build this, follow the instructions to obtain a generator that actually carries the signal into the earth".
This is how I recognize this design to be based on the multiple loaded flat top antenna that was used in the early Marconi broadcasting stations in 1919.
This design was actually adapted from Nikola Tesla's patents for sending power to the ground.
I see your modification of this antenna is even simpler than the Marconi design.

But now you are talking about making new modifications for a proper antenna, so I am thinking you will modify to stop if from acting as single-wire ground transmission which Tesla designed.
It sounds as if your are planning to change it to become an antenna to broadcast more than 5% of the power into the air as RF broadcast.
If you do this, then I expect the ground power transmission will diminish, as more power is broadcast into the air.
In the VLF and LF bands, a large amount of this RF power radiated from the antenna will still penetrate the ground after passing through the air.

But if my idea is mistaken, then maybe you will be making modifications to the antenna for better power transmission to the ground.
If this is what you are intending to do, then I can see some possible mods which may bring this design closer to the original design which Tesla made to allow good power transfer to the ground.
In Tesla's designs, he used a resonant transformer to increase the voltage that is sent to the transformer.
But if we are to use a DDS generator to produce many different frequencies for testing, then we will not be able to use a resonant transformer, because the transformer will be resonant only at one frequency.
So it appears that if this scheme is used, we can only use a step-up transformer, which will probably not be resonant.
Still, we can find better ground penetration with a higher voltage.

I wait to see if there are modifications made by you or other readers.
See below for a schematic diagram of the Marconi Flat top antenna and some links for further reading:

http://www.tuks.nl/wiki/index.php/Main/PrinciplesOfWirelessPower
http://amasci.com/tesla/tmistk.html

http://www.teslauniverse.com/nikola-tesla-patents-649,621-transmission-of-energy
http://www.teslauniverse.com/nikola-tesla-patents-645,576-transmission-of-energy
http://www.teslauniverse.com/nikola-tesla-patents-1,119,732-transmitting-electrical-energy

Note: These are not schematics for construction. They are only general diagrams to show basic concepts.
Very smart theory! it is practically believed that the transmission of signals by a single minute flash moment through a transformer has amplification and the creation of static fields over metals in the soil of a certain period of time;

[Geo]

Hey Kostas.... where are you???:)

[dragomir]

When we talk about frequency discrimination using generator and L rods, we first need to know that with L rods, electromagnetic waves can not be captured. People are good recipients of other types of energy, but not electromagnetic waves. If some of you are familiar with the experiments of Professor Turen, who is the founder of the scientific physical radiodetection, he will know that Turen has discovered another component of the wave. He says that each wave consists of a carrier wave, a wool and an information wave. A person with L rods is sensitive only to the information wave. Each electromagnetic wave is accompanied by an information wave. Information waves are subject to laws close to the properties of light. When the transformer is placed at the output of the frequency generator for reconciliation with the ground, its coil also emits the information field. It is enough to connect a suitable coil to the output of the frequency generator and the field will be emitted. Even if only the telescopic antenna is placed on the active end of the output of the frequency generator, the information field will still be emitted. Nuclear magnetic resonance can only be done in a Faraday cell. In the case of L rods and a frequency generator, nuclear information resonance is obtained. And for this, this resonance takes place outdoors in nature.

[Mike(Mont)]

My two cents cryptocurrency (just about worthless):

The ground has to be charged up. However, if the ground is conductive, there are leaks and it won't hold the pressure.

[kostas87]

When we talk about frequency discrimination using generator and L rods, we first need to know that with L rods, electromagnetic waves can not be captured. People are good recipients of other types of energy, but not electromagnetic waves. If some of you are familiar with the experiments of Professor Turen, who is the founder of the scientific physical radiodetection, he will know that Turen has discovered another component of the wave. He says that each wave consists of a carrier wave, a wool and an information wave. A person with L rods is sensitive only to the information wave. Each electromagnetic wave is accompanied by an information wave. Information waves are subject to laws close to the properties of light. When the transformer is placed at the output of the frequency generator for reconciliation with the ground, its coil also emits the information field. It is enough to connect a suitable coil to the output of the frequency generator and the field will be emitted. Even if only the telescopic antenna is placed on the active end of the output of the frequency generator, the information field will still be emitted. Nuclear magnetic resonance can only be done in a Faraday cell. In the case of L rods and a frequency generator, nuclear information resonance is obtained. And for this, this resonance takes place outdoors in nature.

Interesting! Explain more for the nuclear information.

[dragomir]

Mike, you do not have to excite the metal underground. Its field comes to the surface of the earth, thanks to the glow of the Earth's core. At the radiated waves of the Earth's core the waves of gold are modulated and rise above the earth's surface. There they are picked up on Earth's magnetic field and it takes them north.
What happens next? Solar radiation, according to Professor Turen, emits the waves of 86 chemical elements. But this is not radiation. The air is saturated with ultra-tiny particles, which are selectively attracted by the golden radiation and form oxides of gold on the surface of the earth.
What happens next? Solar radiation, according to Professor Turen, emits the waves of 86 chemical elements. But this is not radiation. The air is saturated with ultra-tiny particles, which are selectively attracted by the golden radiation and form oxides of gold on the surface of the earth.
The more golden field is transferred to the north, the more the vibration frequency changes. To the north, oxides appear that are combinations of chemical elements that have a frequency close to the frequency of gold, close but not the same.
Incorrect frequency generator frequency captures oxides in the north, which also decompose and release ions. And so all searchers capture fields north of the true treasure site - I am talking specifically about Europe.

[Mike(Mont)]

Well, the gold oxides might be the reason for all the false responses. Right now, going South sounds like a good idea. :)

[kostas87]

Hi Mike, how are you so sure? Soil does the phenomenon, we do not want to tear the soil but after the phenomenon, to help the atmosphere make it visible! Anyway, I had a meeting with my friend Geo, where we live in the same city and have great experience.
After much discussion and analysis, we could not find a clear solution and determine that this is some frequency or some other form of energy that could help to make the phenomenon more visible than it is. But I know very well that there is something that can help the phenomenon be more visible.

[dragomir]

The reason is the inaccurate frequency of the frequency generator. When the frequency is absolutely accurate, no oxides are captured in the north. You go straight to the treasure. These are my studies that show the following: Then there is a very strong resonance. No need for a high power generator - 1 watt can cover several kilometers in the air, but it must be visibility. The frequency of the generator is constant and is not influenced by climate change, temperature, humidity, pressure, magnetic storms, land fluctuations and operator biofield.

[Mike(Mont)]

Kostas, no one is forcing you to believe anything. This is just food for thought.

Dragomir, Christopher Hills (author of Supersensonics) wrote about searching for special plants/herbs by using the sunshine as a carrier wave. When he got a response, it meant he had crossed the line between the Sun and the herbs.

Sam "Lobo" Wolfe expanded on this theory and said the sunlight hits the target then continues/reflects at the same angle on past it. So basically if you are between the Sun and the target when you get a response your shadow is on the target or if you are past it you get a response on the reflected angle that comes back out of the ground. So I guess he covers all angles that way. LOL But he might have explained it improperly and like you say, the downstream response is really the oxides.

Thanks for the info.

[dragomir]

What I'm saying to you is not my hypothesis. This is my theory based on Touren's work and my research with technical means. And for the influence of the sun and work with the sun's rays was written by many French monk Padey.

[Mike(Mont)]

Abbe Mermet said there are gradients (or something like that) and the dowser can sense a mirror image at each line from E-W-N-S.

Bob Fitzgerald says the mirror image is to the south of the real target.

I heard somewhere about the target's field tilting towards the north which would make the target to the south. I believe the old timers were more sensitive. The modern day redneck dowsers are mostly watered down to nothing, ignorant, and greed motivated.

My own experience I've seen mirror images to the south of the real target. If you get a copy of the book "Supersensonics" there is a diagram of the magnetic fields--way more complicated than the simple flux lines of a magnet. Nodes/hot spots all over the place.

[dragomir]

I'm not talking about mirror images anywhere. I'm talking about what's happening with the vibrations coming from the buried metal in the ground. Mirror images are captured when working only with L rods and a witness. They appear to the north and to the south. They are hunted with L rods from a distance, and between them is the exact location between the northern mirror image and the southern mirror image.

[dragomir]

Mike, I wrote that my theory is not accidental, invented. I said using technical means to prove how the signal came to the surface of the earth and how it was transferred to the north. I did a very special generator that is fixed at 5 frequencies of metal. Frequency selection is sequentially directed along the oxide paths to the north, the first stopping on the metal. This way I can understand if the metal is there or there is energy contamination around the place. And this measurement is done at a great distance, saves time, and so on.

[kostas87]

Mike, I wrote that my theory is not accidental, invented. I said using technical means to prove how the signal came to the surface of the earth and how it was transferred to the north. I did a very special generator that is fixed at 5 frequencies of metal. Frequency selection is sequentially directed along the oxide paths to the north, the first stopping on the metal. This way I can understand if the metal is there or there is energy contamination around the place. And this measurement is done at a great distance, saves time, and so on.

Can you explain how this special frequency generator works?
I have done a lot of field tests with different types of generator frequencies, and they did not have good results.Can you prove that this works as it is or is it written to make an impression?
:όχι όχι:

[dragomir]

For now I will not share anymore. I had the idea of ​​making a working electronic long-range locator, but an accidental discovery during the frequency discriminator experiments opened my eyes to discovering the exact resonance frequencies of the metals. Now this discovery gives me tremendous opportunities for absolute discrimination and a very precise localization of the object underground. I still work because I have some details to finish.

[kostas87]

For now I will not share anymore. I had the idea of ​​making a working electronic long-range locator, but an accidental discovery during the frequency discriminator experiments opened my eyes to discovering the exact resonance frequencies of the metals. Now this discovery gives me tremendous opportunities for absolute discrimination and a very precise localization of the object underground. I still work because I have some details to finish.
Continue your project, I hope you have good results!
If I think the frequency is not very important in the field because it is not the metal radio to listen to music by tuning a frequency, than you would have with another source of energy.
Good luck!

[pablo72]

For now I will not share anymore. I had the idea of ​​making a working electronic long-range locator, but an accidental discovery during the frequency discriminator experiments opened my eyes to discovering the exact resonance frequencies of the metals. Now this discovery gives me tremendous opportunities for absolute discrimination and a very precise localization of the object underground. I still work because I have some details to finish.


but frequency of metals, diferent in diferent parts of the world, no?

[dragomir]

I guess the frequency will be the same anywhere. Only in the southern hemisphere the shifting will change to the south.

[dragomir]

Frequency generator - discriminator is ready. The displacement to the North is completely compensated, but a problem is encountered. Besides the displacement to the north, which I compensated, there is a displacement to the east. The displacement is not big - 2, 3 meters, but I'm looking for the reason. I think it's fault with the aether.

[dragomir]

The project is completely finished. The frequency generator discriminator is completely ready. There was a problem with gold ores, which slowed me down, but I have already successfully overcome it. In many places I found gold ores that made it difficult for me to search. Now I can claim to successfully discriminate against gold ores and catch the processed material.

[Pahom]

Congratulations on completing the project !!! It would be interesting to watch a video about the operation of the device !!!!

[dragomir]

No video required. It works like an omnitron. Put the generator on the ground and go around it with a Y stick. The signal is emitted in the air. It is very important that the rod is non-metallic. Works with a special kind of energy modulated with infra sound.

[humhum]

No video required. It works like an omnitron. Put the generator on the ground and go around it with a Y stick. The signal is emitted in the air. It is very important that the rod is non-metallic. Works with a special kind of energy modulated with infra sound.

Now, You with one or two metal rod send Frequency ( Khz + Hz modulated ) to ground , and so threasure emitted in air around it self gold signal , Later with a wood Y - stick you go around to Frequency Generator and moving for localized place of threasure.


But for real localization which frequency use Freq Generator ( maybe Khz ) and infrasond Hz for modulation ?

[dragomir]

Now, You with one or two metal rod send Frequency ( Khz + Hz modulated ) to ground , and so threasure emitted in air around it self gold signal , Later with a wood Y - stick you go around to Frequency Generator and moving for localized place of threasure.


But for real localization which frequency use Freq Generator ( maybe Khz ) and infrasond Hz for modulation ?

The signal is radiated only by air. A small fixed frequency box that I place on the ground and walk around with a stick.

[humhum]

The signal is radiated only by air. A small fixed frequency box that I place on the ground and walk around with a stick.


Also my project works so , but without infrasound modulation with main carriyer freq.
(only Main Khz Freq) and with two Metal Rod +mini hand Box. ;)


http://www.longrangelocators.com/forums/showthread.php?t=19283

[humhum]

The signal is radiated only by air. A small fixed frequency box that I place on the ground and walk around with a stick.



Dear Dragomir in Your test with your device up to what meter deep and what distance can find gold object .

[dragomir]

Dear Dragomir in Your test with your device up to what meter deep and what distance can find gold object .



The depth depends on the power of the broadcast signal and in samples I have reached approximately - 60 meters, but it can be increased or decreased. When the power is increased, no small objects are captured. The capture distance depends on the size of the metal, but it is very large, maybe 3, 4 kilometers.

[humhum]

The depth depends on the power of the broadcast signal and in samples I have reached approximately - 60 meters, but it can be increased or decreased. When the power is increased, no small objects are captured. The capture distance depends on the size of the metal, but it is very large, maybe 3, 4 kilometers.

Deep 60 meter , Distance to treasure 3-4 Km and with discrimination , Very very Good , Congratulation.

Maybe when power is increased gold ores not will find .

Your Frequency Generator Box send to Air Mhz or Khz with infrasound Modulation ?

Thanks for All Dowsing info .

[dragomir]

Deep 60 meter , Distance to treasure 3-4 Km and with discrimination , Very very Good , Congratulation.

Maybe when power is increased gold ores not will find .

Your Frequency Generator Box send to Air Mhz or Khz with infrasound Modulation ?

Thanks for All Dowsing info .

I will just say that the carrier wave is not electromagnetic. This wave carries the infrasound signal. Gold ores are otherwise discriminated against, but this is not done by increasing the power.

[tanrila]

The depth depends on the power of the broadcast signal and in samples I have reached approximately - 60 meters, but it can be increased or decreased. When the power is increased, no small objects are captured. The capture distance depends on the size of the metal, but it is very large, maybe 3, 4 kilometers.

hi to all masters and gurus this project really work ? and my qustion range fra for gold 5khz or 5.1 ....... and for find other metal and when we set 5khz just we can find gold or can find other metal with best regard

[Douglass]

Continue your project, I hope you have good results!
If I think the frequency is not very important in the field because it is not the metal radio to listen to music by tuning a frequency, than you would have with another source of energy.
Good luck!

The important thing is not the frequencies, but knowing how to control your forces, on the antenna. After all, everyone already knows the field grows!!!!!;)