listen to ion gold

[mustefa ubram]

hi to all
Friends can help in this project?
To listen to the sound of metal ions from the surface to have a sensitive circuit.It pre amplifier and then transmitted to an amplifier and I hear the sound.
You can help me to design a circuit sensitive to very low frequencies?
Do you have such a plan really work?
tnx:)

[J_Player]

I was told this circuit is good to listen to low frequency metal ion sounds. I have not tried it, but maybe it will work...

http://imgs.xkcd.com/comics/circuit_diagram.png

Best Wishes,
J_P

[mustefa ubram]

j-p
If you do not believe this issue please do not comment and did not talk to the derision.:angry:I read most of your posts in this relationship and 99% of the ridicule.If you know a better educated and civilized people do not experience the issue that it should not interfere.I was asked a question with a scientific basis for your answer, please post to the diversion did not
best time

[J_Player]

j-p
If you do not believe this issue please do not comment and did not talk to the derision.:angry:I read most of your posts in this relationship and 99% of the ridicule.If you know a better educated and civilized people do not experience the issue that it should not interfere.I was asked a question with a scientific basis for your answer, please post to the diversion did not
best timeMost educated and civilized people know that metal ions do not emit an audible sound that can be heard from the surface.
Even with a million gain amplifier, you will not hear the sound of metal ions coming from buried metals as you wander about with your amplifier and headphones in hand.
If this were not the case, then professors would be teaching students in universities all over the world how to identify different buried metals and ores with their amplifiers.
Suppose there were actually metal ion sounds that could be heard, but it requires special advanced amplifiers to hear... maybe a squid amplifier.
Major universities have these expensive amplifiers, and would be quick to announce any buried metal ion sounds they discovered when using them.
This would make their university more famous and prestigious to announce such a breakthrough in geological sciences.
Can you think of a reason why they have not made this announcement?

If a person insists that buried gold ions really do make an audible sound that you can detect as you walk about with an amplifier, then we must consider maybe this person is not educated, of if he is educated, maybe he prefers delusions to reality, or is only making a joke.
Since it is hard to believe anyone thinks buried metal ions actually emit audible sounds that you can hear if you turn up your amplifier, it appears that this a request to indulge in delusions, or possibly a joke.
You can see the circuit I showed is also appropriately delusional to suit this sort of undertaking.

If you are not making a joke, and you really believe you can hear sounds from buried gold ions, then you could use any audio amplifier, 1 or 2 stages to get whatever gain you want, and a filter capacitor to keep out any high frequency.
In my opinion, it is not worth the trouble to draw one out, but you will find lots of suitable amplifiers in the LRL threads, such as the zahori thread shows one here: http://www.longrangelocators.com/forums/showpost.php?p=43132&postcount=8
Note: This circuit uses a digital sample and hold circuit to hold the sampling rate to 50 Hz.
Further reduction in sample rate can be set by changing the values of P4/R9, then filter capacitors or active filters downstream to tune to a specific frequency.
Or here is a simple FET amplifier with extreme gain: http://www.longrangelocators.com/forums/showpost.php?p=122861&postcount=253
Be sure to not use headphones with this circuit because it is too sensitive to have dangling wires to a headphone. Use a hard-wired speaker instead.

In my opinion it is a waste of time to draw these circuits to be used as an audio amplifier for listening to the audible sounds of buried gold ions.
And it is even more a waste of time to actually build it.
But it is good entertainment to watch other people build this sort of thing and wait to hear them post audio files which contain sounds of buried gold ions that they record as they walk about with their ion sound amplifier.
I suspect we will never hear any audio files posted that are the sound of gold ions in the ground.
But if I am wrong, and you can actually locate buried gold by listening for buried gold ion sounds, then I suspect you will become quite rich following your treasure recoveries, and commercial ventures to sell your ion-listener to treasure hunters and geologists.

Best wishes,
J_P

[Dell Winders]

An early Gold detector that was used long before JPlayer's WIS, (When Idiots Speak) comments, was a crystal radio hair tuned to make crackling sounds thru the headphones when walking over Gold deposits. Dell

[Dave J.]

Y'know, Dell, some of us here actually have some knowledge of electronics and geophysics. And you know that when you post bunk here, the bunk gets debunked. Perhaps a forum where debunking isn't allowed would better suit you?

If anyone (even you) believes that crystal sets detect gold as you describe, I recommend that y'all actually build one and go walking around the boondocks with it and try to decipher the crackling sounds. Thus will the Universe inflict its punishment upon those who demand that it knuckle under to the fantasies of mortals, and thus will Charles Darwin be vindicated.

--Dave J.

[Dave J.]

hi to all
Friends can help in this project?
To listen to the sound of metal ions from the surface to have a sensitive circuit.It pre amplifier and then transmitted to an amplifier and I hear the sound.
You can help me to design a circuit sensitive to very low frequencies?
Do you have such a plan really work?
tnx:)

Mustefa, building an amplifier that will operate in the audible frequency range down to the thermal noise floor from source impedances greater than several hundred ohms is a pretty straightforward task, although you have to be careful to make sure that the output doesn't feed back into the input and make the thing oscillate. That's as much a matter of construction technique as it is circuit design.

The problem you face is not how to build such an amplifier, but that the gold ions which you suppose would be detected, don't actually exist.

If you sincerely believe that "gold ion guns" such as from Mineoro really work, then the best you can do is to copy it. The problem of course is that if you are successful in copying it, it will work as well as a Mineoro-- which is to say, it isn't going to detect gold ions since there are none to detect and if there were a few it wouldn't detect them anyhow since the signal would be below the thermal noise floor. The apparatus is fraudulent.

The electronics engineers who post here cannot tell you how to build what you want, they can only tell you not to waste your time trying to detect something that isn't there to be detected. If the "gold ions" were actually there to be detected, the corresponding apparatus to detect them would either be on the market already, or would be under development, quite possibly by people who post here. And it wouldn't be fraudulent.

--Dave J.

[Dave J.]

Real gold does exist. But not very much. Even in mineable ores, the concentration of gold is normally in parts per million.

The stuff is really heavy, it has very little tendency to go floating up into the air. That's why aeolian deposits exist.

In principle really tiny particles ("micron gold") could become airborne through an assist by Brownian (thermal) motion to diffuse upward through the laminar boundary layer (typically several millimeters thick) to reach the convection layer, but to my knowledge no such phenomenon has ever been reported in the geophysical literature. There are a whole slew of problems with such a proposal.

1. The gold would have to be on the surface, literally. Not two atoms deep.

2. If this is free gold we're talking about, it would have to be unattached to anything else.

3. Several millimeters is a long way for a gold atom to diffuse through a thermally driven random walk process, and it's not until it's halfway through the boundary layer that the probability of going all the way through exceeds the probability of diffusing back to the surface from whence it came. In other words, even if a gold atom gets airborne somehow, the chances of its remaining airborne are very small.

4. Gold is the most malleable substance known. The atoms cling to each other despite forces which destroy the crystal structure. You can cut the stuff but you can't break it.

5. The tendency of gold atoms to cling to each other despite the forces of thermal diffusion is what makes it possible for gold nuggets to form in ores, despite the fact that the concentration of gold in the bulk material is extremely low.

6. LRL'ers love "micron gold" because it's the perfect alabi for failure. Real miners aren't much interested in "micron gold" because assay methods that work on the atomic level show very little such gold in relation to gold which is recoverable by practical mining methods. Gold atoms have a strong tendency to clump together. When they don't (because the thermal diffusion processes necessary to make it happen weren't favorable) what you have is (for example) plain vanilla rhyolite which if you succeed in detecting gold in it, you've performed an absolutely worthless act, like proving there's gold in seawater.

7. It is the malleability which makes it possible to pound gold into foil so thin that the stuff is partially transparent, and the foil thus applied to a solid surface does not evaporate, it's there hundreds of years later as long as it's not subjected to abrasion.

8. A free gold atom is not an ion. Gold is very resistant to ionization, that's why it is so resistant to chemical attack.

So, anyone want "gold ions" floating around in air waiting to reveal the presence of a gold coin buried 100 years ago? Welcome to Mineoro's fantasy club.

Now, to give a bit of credit where credit is due, I suppose that Mineoro and Hung and Dell and our other gold experts here already know all this and have thunk it through, and know for an absolute fact that gold ion guns are fraudulent without any scientific basis whatsoever, they are designed with only one purpose in mind and that's to rip off customers big time.

But then again, it's possible that they literally don't know any science relevant to gold, and all they have is fairy tales which they believe, and they love their fairy tales so much that they reject all evidence to the effect that their fairy tale has no basis whatsoever in reality.

--Dave J.

[Dell Winders]

Really Dave. You sure are expressing a lot of ignorance about your knowledge of Gold. Of course that is understandable if you have never found very much. WIS Dell

[Dave J.]

Really Dave. You sure are expressing a lot of ignorance about your knowledge of Gold. Of course that is understandable if you have never found very much. WIS Dell

Well, Dell, you evidently have no knowledge of a sort that you're willing to divulge on the subject. Meanwhile the things I said are things that anyone can independently verify. Therefore it's not my word against yours, it's the Universe's word against yours.

And the funny thing is that you don't even sell "gold ion guns", only your fraudulent competitors do, and yet you try to defend them against the proof that they are fraudulent!

Is there anyone familiar with human nature who can't figure out why you defend a competitor whose product is entirely different from your own, a product which is provably fraudulent? For example, do you yourself know why you performed such a strange maneuver?

--Dave J.

LRL forums are great places for researching human nature!

[J_Player]

Gold ions under the ground do exist.
Natural gold is mined from the ground after it cools from molten form and solidifies usually in rock fractures, but is often found in ores such as tellurides and other chemical compounds.
Gold which is mined is usually alloyed with copper, silver and other metals that are often similar to jewelry gold alloys.
Natural gold in the ground corrodes.
Yes, it corrodes.
But it corrodes in very trace amounts.
Scientists have measured the gold ions in the ground which corrode from primary gold deposits, and they find there are traces of gold ions in the parts per trillion concentrations.
Parts per trillion... How much is this?
One part per trillion is the same as one byte of data from your hard drive that has 1 terabyte of data capacity on it.
if you are lucky, you might find 3 parts per trillion of gold ions near where buried gold has been sitting for ages.
It is kind of like searching your 1 terabyte hard drive for 3 single bytes which prove there is gold hidden in the hard drive somewhere.

So is it a lie to say gold does not corrode?
I doubt it... for all practical purposes, gold does not corrode.
However, you can cause gold to corrode if you toss it in a cyanide bath.
Or if you toss it in a bath of aqua regia.
You will see that the gold dissolves and the solution begins to fill with gold ions.
But we don't see cyanide baths or aqua regia baths buried under the ground to dissolve large amounts of gold.

This raises an interesting question:
Where did the gold ions come from that scientists measured at parts per trillion levels in the soil?
It turns out there is a very interesting story about these gold ions which was first released by geomicrobiologist Frank Reith in Australia.
He discovered there are microbes that live under the ground in conditions which don't generally support life of any organism.
And these organisms were able to eat and digest gold metal, while excreting gold ions.
How could they do that?
They secrete cyanide, which can dissolve gold to form aurocyanate, producing gold ions.
After ingesting the gold ions, they excrete these ions which end up in a new location in the soil and eventually revert back to metallic gold.
This all seems hard to believe, but it has been verified by countless experiments which prove it actually happens.
Furthermore, Frank Reith's team discovered that if these underground bacteria are present at a location where there is buried gold, they will help to create a column of gold ions which travels upward through the ground to the surface of the earth,
This is not a theory, but a fact that has been observed and proven by scientists all over the world.
This column of gold ions is only maybe 3 parts per trillion maximum strength, and usually less than 1 part per trillion.
But it does represent an anomaly to the surrounding soil which does not have any measurable concentration of gold ions.
Is this beginning to sound exciting?
Well it is, for some people.
For example, the people at MMI laboratories (which resulted from Frank Reith's discovery) go to mining sites and take samples of soil back to the laboratory to measure the parts per trillion of gold ions.
With their survey data, they can tell the mine where to dig for new gold ore deposits.
But what about treasure hunters?
What treasure hunter can take soil samples to their laboratory and measure parts per trillion to find the location of a buried treasure?
Also, consider it takes quite a few years for the microbe colony to grow to sufficient size to make a sizable attack on a gold metal deposit.
Freshly buried gold will not be exposed to these microbes which take some time to grow.
In addition, the column of ions which moves upwards happens due to annual rain cycles causing the soil to become wet and dry, and the capillary action through the soil which tends to cause the ions to move up.
Even if the microbes are present, we need quite a few years worth of rain cycles to move these trace amounts of ions toward the surface.
In cases of ancient primary gold deposits that were formed more than 10,000 years ago, Scientist have measured these ion trails traveling more than 5000 feet up to reach the surface and mark the spot where there is gold buried below.

This all may seem exciting to the treasure hunter.
But think about it... 3 parts per trillion?
MMI labs can measure it if they take a soil sample to their lab and titrate it, then use some very sophisticated electronic instruments to determine the gold ion content.
Why does MMI labs go to this trouble?
Because this is the only workable way they could find to take measurements of sub parts per trillion ions.
If they could detect these anomalies with a hand-held detector, don't you think they would do it?
Is it possible that they concluded hand-held detectors cannot find any anomaly in buried gold ion concentrations of parts per trillion amounts?

Here are some more details about gold ions in the ground:
1. The gold ions from a buried chunk of gold can be attacked by bacteria which secrete sodium cyanide that dissolves tiny amounts of gold which they ingest,
2. It takes awhile for a colony of these bacteria to form and make a noticeable attack on a chunk of buried gold
3. After bacteria attack a chunk of buried gold and dissolve some gold metal from the surface, you will not be able to tell this happened from looking at the chunk of gold.
It will look the same as before it had a few molecules dissolved from the surface.
4. The column of gold ions will travel upwards in the soil because of capillary action that is caused by changes in the soil moisture content, and a moisture gradient that results from the surface to the depth of the buried gold.
Over many years, the effect will be to draw gold ions upward toward the surface of the ground.
5. When gold ions reach the final 10-30 cm of their travel through the ground, they cease to be ions.
When the ions come close to contacting the open air and effluents that run over the surface of the soil, these ions become bound with other elements to become compounds.
This is true for all metal ions, not just gold.
In the case of gold, the ion usually combines with another gold ion to become metallic gold, or a micro particle of gold.
Gold ions can also attach to other existing gold lattice structures, which may be gold nuggets that they attach to which helps the nugget to grow.
6. After the gold ion combines to become a compound or micro-gold particle at the surface, it is no longer an ion.
At this time, it can move due to the forces of erosion, wind, or other mechanical means.
7. Most interesting. The concentration of gold in the air has been measured to be in the parts per trillion range... same as the concentration of gold found in these underground ion trails.
However, all the airborne gold has been measured to be microscopic metallic gold particles, not ions!
The gold particle concentrations in the air have been measured to be homogenous at various sampling locations.
It appears the action of the winds is adequate to prevent any anomalies from becoming prominent.
8. The concentration of gold in the oceans has also been measured to be in the parts per trillion, similar to the airborne amounts and subterranean amounts.
There are some anomalies in gold concentrations in the oceans... usually associated with ocean vents which dribble underground materials into the ocean floors.
But in the open oceans, these anomalies seem to be lost.

If you are interested in reading more about this strange science of gold ions, read here where I introduced the topic to this forum: http://www.longrangelocators.com/forums/showthread.php?t=13276
It's a long read, but it has a treasury of links and support data that shows images of these gold eating microbes and backup data about subterranean gold-moving mechanisms (Many of the links in that thread no longer work because this is no longer a new story).

We can see that gold actually does corrode in trace amounts, as does platinum, palladium and all other so-called noble metals.
But what about detecting the ions from these buried metals?
Do these ions exist at the surface? (NO).
Are they floating in the air 7.2 feet above the ground as Mineoro propaganda says? (NO) -- see below.

Can they be detected by a hand-held electronic detector?
I don't know about that.
I do know that I have not seen any commercially available LRL that can detect gold ions.
And I have not seen any commercial or experimental MFD locator that can detect gold ions.

The fact that there is an anomaly is enough to say there can be hope of detecting it.
I look forward to the day when someone can find a way to actually do it.
I doubt it will be easy.
Remember, we are looking for a part per trillion concentration of gold ions which is at least 10 cm below the ground.
How to detect it?
I already gave some answers in the other thread that focused on this problem: http://www.longrangelocators.com/forums/showthread.php?t=13276
You can do it by looking to detect secondary effects.
And you may need to send some energy in to get a readout.

If any one has any doubts, I can guarantee none of the commercial ion detectors will help you find treasure.
But there are a few experimenters in this forum who have found some success with their experiments.

Fake Mineoro propaganda which says gold ions rise into the air:

http://www.longrangelocators.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=2477&stc=1&d=1184767044

Best wishes,
J_P

[Dell Winders]

Ions, Zions, what difference does it make how it works as long as the results are consistent & positive. If hot air from your mouth would detect Gold, you would be a zillionaire.

MFD, or HID will discriminate and detect the same exact targets that the Mineoro, or their custom locators do. In my experience, the Mineoro will even detect and beeps as it is scanned across the discriminated Signal line generated by the MFD.

According to all this hoopla you guys make over Ions, am I supposed to be so stupid as to believe that the Mineoro, is detecting Gold Ions generated by the frequency used in the MFD? Well, I have no such illusions, and I know for fact that the L- Rod(s) used with an MFD , or HID, or the early electronic receivers are NOT detecting Gold Ions. From my own field experience I find it unlikely that the Mineoro, are any other LRL functions by detecting Ions.

Why do you keep beating the same dead horse over and over for years? You call that intelligent? It's just more long winded, WIS, rhetoric without substance. DelL

[Dave J.]

Dell, that horse we flogged to death is the one you were riding, even though it was Mineoro's horse (as I already commented on). And oddly enough, you're still trying to keep one foot in the stirrup by claiming that Mineoro's admitted fraud produces the same results as yours does even though yours is constructed entirely differently!

There is "truth in advertising", and you've given us a classic example of it. It always turns out that what you know about LRL's and what the debunkers know, is the same thing.

--Dave J.

[mustefa ubram]

Thank you for your good information freinds
I would like to make a class with a booster coil is sensitive to sense frequencies.Please help me to outline the coil comes with Enhancer.
Your opinion about electromagnetic circuits?With this metal finds do circuits?

[Dave J.]

The first circuit with the whip antenna operates at a frequency determined by the parallel resonance of the antenna capacitance and the inductor. By adding a variable capacitor in parallel with the inductor you can make it tunable. This circuit is a simple E-field signal strength indicator, variations on it have been around for many decades, before transistors they were doing it with vacuum tubes.

The second circuit is a badly designed H-field detector, probably the worst I've seen here. Connected to a carefully designed induction balance (including a separate transmitter circuit) it might be able to detect an iron manhole cover on the surface.

--Dave J.

[Jim]

According to all this hoopla you guys make over Ions, am I supposed to be so stupid as to believe that the Mineoro, is detecting Gold Ions generated by the frequency used in the MFD?

Yes.

[reza vir]

hi mustefa
Take a look at this circuit.