ICONOS MD 807

[takhslambos]

finaly this iconos not working at all? the owners want to add there axpierience?

[Morgan]

finaly this iconos not working at all? the owners want to add there axpierience?


How you know the ICONOS not work as LRL ? Do you already try this LRL in your treasure place ?

According Geo,he found one gold fragment 4 m distance... I think he not lie to this forum.

[takhslambos]

i dont now i m asking.i m thinking to bay one iconos.is someone now who is sell it?

[Morgan]

i dont now i m asking.i m thinking to bay one iconos.is someone now who is sell it?



Yes,the ICONOS is your best choice,please buy one in your country Greece ;)


I think is very cheap LRL ...

[takhslambos]

is someone else found something whith iconos or dch85m?

[takhslambos]

what do you mean that iconos is my best choise?is the best PD you ever test it?

[Funfinder]

@ takhslambos
Where can you still buy this device and what's the price?

I found out this info here
http://www.hotlinekw.com/iconos_md_ic807.htm
and that their formerly page no longer exists:
http://www.iconos-md.eu/

and here 2 years ago a customer from china was very unsatisfied:
http://174.132.129.189/~moreland/forums/showthread.php?t=14262


@ Geo
Morgan wrote: According Geo,he found one gold fragment 4 m distance... I think he not lie to this forum.
If you read this can you tell us more about the Iconos and if it's possible to test this device also in air?

I wonder why it's fixed to "gold only" - I don't hope because long time buried gold is so seldom almost noone can prove if the unit really works? Would be much better if it's able to select between different metals.

[Morgan]

@ takhslambos
Where can you still buy this device and what's the price?

I found out this info here
http://www.hotlinekw.com/iconos_md_ic807.htm
and that their formerly page no longer exists:
http://www.iconos-md.eu/

and here 2 years ago a customer from china was very unsatisfied:
http://174.132.129.189/~moreland/forums/showthread.php?t=14262


@ Geo

If you read this can you tell us more about the Iconos and if it's possible to test this device also in air?

I wonder why it's fixed to "gold only" - I don't hope because long time buried gold is so seldom almost noone can prove if the unit really works? Would be much better if it's able to select between different metals.


WHAT IS ICONOS ???

Long Range Locator,work electromagnetic resonance,head with Gold sample.The same is MINEORO DCH 85.

Some people buy this devices and want to find treasure in the garden,very funny,if not find,they become unappy...This need a lot of expeditions and tests,and probably in 500 places can be found one treasure.
About distances,this LRL´s can found treasure 80 meters,and gold coin (with sparzed signals) not more than 10 meters,always need metal detector for pinpoint. The great distances they put in their sites are ILUSION.

I not give advice here for people by this expensive detectors,i say better try to build similar device with low cost price (see my threads )and try in the fields,results will be the same.

Regards

12128

[Funfinder]

Hi Morgan,

Thanx for the answer. It is great that you have tested and selfmade such ionic detectors but there are some points generally very mysterious:

@ "Mineoro FG79 Price?" in Post #7 from 2008 you've been totally against them:
http://www.geotech1.com/forums/showthread.php?t=12468&highlight=mineoro+fg79
Is this because those devices doesn't work outside of Brazil - not in equation with different ionic-fields or something? If so, is there a Mineoro Model that works everywhere and do you still have some to sell?

Next:
@ LRL Ionic/Electrostatic energy field locator Page 5
http://www.geotech1.com/forums/showthread.php?t=14731&page=5
hung in post #116 wrote:
The PDC project and the latest models are many times more powerful than the DCH. The DCH needed almost 100% of ionic emanations to detect. The PDC only 50%.

Testing both of them a couple of years ago in a ancient gold target, the PDC beeped clearly at 100 m distance. The DCH not a single beep even from 25 m.


Yesterday I saw at:
http://www.mineoro.com/goldDetectors/finding_mexico.php#
that the PDC210 no longer is produced but replaced by the much more sensitive FG80.

What does this mean?
Was hung right with his test results or was it a lie and is the PDC210 better?

@ "new mineoro video" hung also found a piece of copper-tube in an ancient city - post 7 - just from a month ago:
http://www.geotech1.com/forums/showthread.php?t=16552&highlight=copper+tube

Again with the PDC210.
I guess the PDC210 is much better because it also shows other metal-signals.

As you said, large and long time ago buried gold is very seldom - perhaps 1 out of 500 places, so it's stupid focussing on gold only and frustrating alot customers that throw away there LRLs because they find nothing at all!

I could built the ionic detector and because I found that LM324N opamp also the Gold Gun AL718 out of scratch with some mods and alot additional experimenting but when I read the info of "hung" and your formerly Mineoro statements I wonder what's really right or wrong now and why those devices should work under brazil conditions and not with european.

btw. thanx for the nice pic - under what circumstances and from which distance did you found this cache?

[Morgan]

Hi Morgan,

Thanx for the answer. It is great that you have tested and selfmade such ionic detectors but there are some points generally very mysterious:

@ "Mineoro FG79 Price?" in Post #7 from 2008 you've been totally against them:
http://www.geotech1.com/forums/showthread.php?t=12468&highlight=mineoro+fg79
Is this because those devices doesn't work outside of Brazil - not in equation with different ionic-fields or something? If so, is there a Mineoro Model that works everywhere and do you still have some to sell?

Next:
@ LRL Ionic/Electrostatic energy field locator Page 5
http://www.geotech1.com/forums/showthread.php?t=14731&page=5
hung in post #116 wrote:


Yesterday I saw at:
http://www.mineoro.com/goldDetectors/finding_mexico.php#
that the PDC210 no longer is produced but replaced by the much more sensitive FG80.

What does this mean?
Was hung right with his test results or was it a lie and is the PDC210 better?

@ "new mineoro video" hung also found a piece of copper-tube in an ancient city - post 7 - just from a month ago:
http://www.geotech1.com/forums/showthread.php?t=16552&highlight=copper+tube

Again with the PDC210.
I guess the PDC210 is much better because it also shows other metal-signals.

As you said, large and long time ago buried gold is very seldom - perhaps 1 out of 500 places, so it's stupid focussing on gold only and frustrating alot customers that throw away there LRLs because they find nothing at all!

I could built the ionic detector and because I found that LM324N opamp also the Gold Gun AL718 out of scratch with some mods and alot additional experimenting but when I read the info of "hung" and your formerly Mineoro statements I wonder what's really right or wrong now and why those devices should work under brazil conditions and not with european.

btw. thanx for the nice pic - under what circumstances and from which distance did you found this cache?

Hi F. finder

This cache was found not more than 20 m distance and deep was 60 cm.
Was found with Pistoldetektor prototype ,one copy of the original,this you can see in yootube working as demonstration.

[Morgan]

Hi Morgan,

Thanx for the answer. It is great that you have tested and selfmade such ionic detectors but there are some points generally very mysterious:

@ "Mineoro FG79 Price?" in Post #7 from 2008 you've been totally against them:
http://www.geotech1.com/forums/showthread.php?t=12468&highlight=mineoro+fg79
Is this because those devices doesn't work outside of Brazil - not in equation with different ionic-fields or something? If so, is there a Mineoro Model that works everywhere and do you still have some to sell?

Next:
@ LRL Ionic/Electrostatic energy field locator Page 5
http://www.geotech1.com/forums/showthread.php?t=14731&page=5
hung in post #116 wrote:


Yesterday I saw at:
http://www.mineoro.com/goldDetectors/finding_mexico.php#
that the PDC210 no longer is produced but replaced by the much more sensitive FG80.

What does this mean?
Was hung right with his test results or was it a lie and is the PDC210 better?

@ "new mineoro video" hung also found a piece of copper-tube in an ancient city - post 7 - just from a month ago:
http://www.geotech1.com/forums/showthread.php?t=16552&highlight=copper+tube

Again with the PDC210.
I guess the PDC210 is much better because it also shows other metal-signals.

As you said, large and long time ago buried gold is very seldom - perhaps 1 out of 500 places, so it's stupid focussing on gold only and frustrating alot customers that throw away there LRLs because they find nothing at all!

I could built the ionic detector and because I found that LM324N opamp also the Gold Gun AL718 out of scratch with some mods and alot additional experimenting but when I read the info of "hung" and your formerly Mineoro statements I wonder what's really right or wrong now and why those devices should work under brazil conditions and not with european.

btw. thanx for the nice pic - under what circumstances and from which distance did you found this cache?


About MINEORO

Yes,i´m against the huge prices of mineoro products and the propaganda of LRL performance are not true.
Until now i get results with my DC2008 model,thats becouse i stop sell my MINEORO,i find that it can work but NOT AS THEY PUT IN THE SITE. Mineoro DC2008 work very defective when is to find objects in gold.

My finds with DC2008 :

Large silver coin 4 meters distance (only sparzed sounds around the target,impossible to pinpoint)

Golden buckle (similar distance,sparzed sounds around,not possible to pinpoint)

A few objects in the beach (the same behavior)

treasure i never found with MINEORO,but i think is possible.

So you can build one LRL project,i think results will be the same,and you save your money.

[Funfinder]

Thx morgan and it's very good you bring the important facts up: "Not working as described".

Sparzed sounds from a detector that costs 1000s of dollars... - even if 4m for a coin is a respectable distance!
But what you do if the sounds vanish in thin air or the pinpointing with an usual MD fails...


We need reliable equipment and signals - we also don't use shovels made out of cardboard - we have to analyze the real potential and "quality" and don't rely on "good looking" advertisment infos!

What I'm missing is the shielding in other directions! I built a cantenna for WLan WiFi and worked alot with antennas and ant.amps and have 3 sat-dishes on the roof and they all work directional!

So how a LRL should work properly if it receives "ball-like" the EM-disturbances from all directions? And this is even if the antenna has some "directive form" as long as it is not properly shielded or housed in a metal-tube like my USB Stick cantenna below, which still has a 45° working field.

The Mineoro is in a wooden box because of reducing static electricity-fields and I doubt it has a directional shielding inside at all.

Before I will put many hours in electronical building, engineering, testing and finetuning work:

Please tell me if the ionic-electrostatic field detector from 2008 found here:
http://www.geotech1.com/forums/showthread.php?t=14731
is the best choice or do exist better schematics meanwhile? The same question about the Alonso PistolDetector (is this the same as Gold Gun AL718?) you and Geo prefer.

Of course I will tell you in return if I'll find out any improvements (of course I will make them), because I can put really exTreme huge effort into something and can make excessive tests, too.

[Astrodetect]

Hi
My opinion is that if you want directivity by electromagnetic fields in these LRL's it is difficult to acomplish because the frequencies involved are too low with huge wavelengths, therefore the best way to have precise directivity as an LRL is by infrared detection, like Esteban has shown.
Regards

[Funfinder]

@ Morgan
Oh - now I see there is a first post concerning the cache (btw. the main post from me also is above) - 20m is really fantastic! :)

Is the pistol you used the same system Geo found the mine a few weeks ago?


Hi Astrodetect,
infrared already uses a very short wavelenght between light and microwaves so I don't know what you exactly mean.

Could it be some of these LRLs are just simple EM-Field Meters? Using FETs and gold as electrode just because it has near same electrostatic attributes like air?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electrostatic_fieldmeter
http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elektrofeldmeter

However at least the magnetic flux between the earth-caps is directional and the gravitation also.

btw. I wanna try out that: "ic burns near treasure"-circuit or schematic. Where can I find it? :cool:

[Morgan]

@ Morgan
Oh - now I see there is a first post concerning the cache (btw. the main post from me also is above) - 20m is really fantastic! :)

Is the pistol you used the same system Geo found the mine a few weeks ago?


Hi Astrodetect,
infrared already uses a very short wavelenght between light and microwaves so I don't know what you exactly mean.

Could it be some of these LRLs are just simple EM-Field Meters? Using FETs and gold as electrode just because it has near same electrostatic attributes like air?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electrostatic_fieldmeter
http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elektrofeldmeter

However at least the magnetic flux between the earth-caps is directional and the gravitation also.

btw. I wanna try out that: "ic burns near treasure"-circuit or schematic. Where can I find it? :cool:


Hello

The LRL i post schematic in 2008,is experimental Zahori for beginers,anyway i experiment some LRL results with big metals underground,but the BFO should be very stable,unfortunatly it drift time to time,also the Antennas configuration are not the best,it can be better(just ask Detectoman,he build good antennas for this project). Actualy i adapt special ionic chamber to this project,that i think can work fine without BFO dtector,its more simple,but i need to try on field.
About PD,yes its the most efective LRL i ever use,but it needs critical adjustments in the LIMIT,as you can see Geo travel to my country just to see,and we make the video films.

Regards

[Funfinder]

thx for pointing me in the direction - if it's this:
http://www.geotech1.com/forums/showthread.php?t=11674&page=6
I can try it first. But there exist also 2 other circuits that could work...

All this stuff reminds me alot on long time ago kids-electronic-experiments - amplifying of background-noise or putting some metal near some coil gave a change in audiofrequency...

But this is good because all those "EM-LRL-Circuits" have a broad variation spectrum. First I will try amp-circuits without all that many capacitors and stuff - keep it simple in the beginning like with detector-radio receiver (that works: "free to air").

I haven't seen the video movies yet but read about it and this was a great idea from you and Geo in 2009 to prove those LRLs under reasonable and real TH-conditions!

btw. what is the common reaction if "treasure" is near so I can focus on it: Does "static noise" vanishes or raises?

[Morgan]

thx for pointing me in the direction - if it's this:
http://www.geotech1.com/forums/showthread.php?t=11674&page=6
I can try it first. But there exist also 2 other circuits that could work...

All this stuff reminds me alot on long time ago kids-electronic-experiments - amplifying of background-noise or putting some metal near some coil gave a change in audiofrequency...

But this is good because all those "EM-LRL-Circuits" have a broad variation spectrum. First I will try amp-circuits without all that many capacitors and stuff - keep it simple in the beginning like with detector-radio receiver (that works: "free to air").

I haven't seen the video movies yet but read about it and this was a great idea from you and Geo in 2009 to prove those LRLs under reasonable and real TH-conditions!

btw. what is the common reaction if "treasure" is near so I can focus on it: Does "static noise" vanishes or raises?

Long time ago buried metals(hig conductive) or treasures acumulate or generate energy. When you locate treasure the sound in eletrostatic detector will increase,the same with the BFO,all together.
You should talk with member Detectoman from Mexico,he have build the project and made better performance,he is expert in BFO detectors.

Regards

[Funfinder]

OK, very interresting:

"Long time ago buried metals(hig conductive) or treasures acumulate or generate energy."

Because usually a piece of metal will "absorb" a part of the EM radiation energy of a metal detector by eddy currents, magnetic saturation etc. Perhaps this is the reason why some LRLs find the treasure anymore after someone "radiated" it with the in comparation very "strong" EM fields of his MD. Comparable with magnetized iron. I can imagine the buried treasure will absorb the "natural" and "industrial" radiation around for a long time and interact if the EM-field around changes, that's why this larger metal objects can radiate something at all! Temperature and galvanic effects may also play a role, but not necessarily.

OK, maybe this is too much to ask, but perhaps someone already know on what main-frequency range that "treasure-energy" radiates with the strongest level?!

Is it a mixture of all kind of frequency like with uncovered motor-sparks so you can simply can use some sort of "very sensitive everything-amplifier"?

I asked this because alot frequency spectrums can give alot background-noise and failure signals, even can jam good signals completly! There even exists the 8K background noise from the universe / big bang. Especially VHF radio stations, cell phones, satellite signals and: electricity lines make extreme noise if near - and most of the time if not always those are near.


Well, building a BFO is no problem:
http://www.easytreasure.co.uk/bfo.htm
I also can modify a wire-searcher that uses other circuit.

Perhaps a BFO that is very stable and recognises the difference of just 5Hz (audible as ticking) for the beginning is a good idea - especially if it works somehow "directional concentrated".

But if I find some FETs or what else will work maybe I'll better go for the electrostatic - could bring much more exciting test-experiments. :D

Thx Morgan, also for the info about Detectoman, perhaps I'll contact him or he posts some suggestions here.

[Funfinder]

In the meanwhile I found the shielded antenna detector so it has to be directional:

THE FERRITE TREASURE SENSOR
http://www.geotech1.com/forums/showthread.php?t=14935

And i will test with open basis transistor, microvoltmeter, opamp circuits in series and all kind of stuff that can signalize the smallest amounts of EMfield, frequency or current-changes. Not to forget all kind of different antennas, coils...

btw. ferrite is blocking / absorbing HF! Anyway: Let's start the action. :)

edit: look what I've found - I could try this self created "Super Amplifier"-schematic with 2 PNP transistors from 12 years ago:

[Funfinder]

I knew it!

http://www.geotech1.com/forums/showthread.php?t=12107

Dear Mr. Moreland,

We would like to double-accept your challenge, as :

- MINEORO manufacturer of electronic LRL and
- SEGMAX manufacturer of mechanical inertial detectors by ionic and electrostatics fields (not dowsing)

- Our system of detection is by ionic fields and electrostatic fields.
- It is neither electromagnetic nor terrestrial magnetic or magnets.

But seeing the dust on the outside screen of HF TV-Tube is proof enough electrostatic is electromagnetic, too. :) And aren't ions "overflueous" electrons?

However it's very good the mineoro inventors himself point us in the right direction - even if we really have to combine different methods to get most reliable results.

And: I don't wanna know what the Mineoro LRL signalizes if you're standing on a mountain and a thunderstorm is near... My father survived such a great electrostatic event...

Under such circumstances you'll get that spacy "haircut" like above - but without any plastic-friction. :lol: :lol: :lol:

Yeah, that's THE idea! We go treasure hunting with a mobile tesla generator! :D :D :cool: This is really cool, as long as the flash hits the treasure! ;) Like under real conditions the high electorstatic field causes the flash to hit the nearest and most attractive "electrode", which often is metal. Don't wear any umbrella in a thunderstorm but wear a mobile faraday cage @ MDing. :cool:

So the only question remaining is how to make the flash hit the treasure and not us, some ground or trees! And without big noise & setting the treasure chest on fire! :D

[Morgan]

I knew it!

http://www.geotech1.com/forums/showthread.php?t=12107



But seeing the dust on the outside screen of HF TV-Tube is proof enough electrostatic is electromagnetic, too. :) And aren't ions "overflueous" electrons?

However it's very good the mineoro inventors himself point us in the right direction - even if we really have to combine different methods to get most reliable results.

And: I don't wanna know what the Mineoro LRL signalizes if you're standing on a mountain and a thunderstorm is near... My father survived such a great electrostatic event...

Under such circumstances you'll get that spacy "haircut" like above - but without any plastic-friction. :lol: :lol: :lol:

Yeah, that's THE idea! We go treasure hunting with a mobile tesla generator! :D :D :cool: This is really cool, as long as the flash hits the treasure! ;) Like under real conditions the high electorstatic field causes the flash to hit the nearest and most attractive "electrode", which often is metal. Don't wear any umbrella in a thunderstorm but wear a mobile faraday cage @ MDing. :cool:

So the only question remaining is how to make the flash hit the treasure and not us, some ground or trees! And without big noise & setting the treasure chest on fire! :D

Hi funfinder

You have some ideias,can put in practice and inform us. i can tell you all MINEORO devices detect TV screen radiation,also the project i put in threads,even go more distant...
The box must be made of wood,no plastic,this is very important.
This is a LRL easy to build project and nobody become empthy walett.
The BFO you post is good for the project becouse of good stability.I have buit,its the Dave Smith BFO,this man is the ZAXON-X1 builder,good MD but heavy and disccriminate on 70% of iron ,anyway better than PI detectors ...

Regards

[Funfinder]

Hi Morgan,
thx for your answer and I got a new idea already:
You are one of the few persons here that has some Mineoros.

Can you make some tests at what distance and circumstances (as example place some iron objects between the detector and the device) it shows a new gold- or silver coin?

The distance is not important but the question, how and if "usual" noble metal gets detected in air and what "unburied" energy level a coin etc. has. In Air tests at least are reliable and repeatable, thats why such experiments will lead us to "all the time working" LRLs.

[Morgan]

Hi Morgan,
thx for your answer and I got a new idea already:
You are one of the few persons here that has some Mineoros.

Can you make some tests at what distance and circumstances (as example place some iron objects between the detector and the device) it shows a new gold- or silver coin?

The distance is not important but the question, how and if "usual" noble metal gets detected in air and what "unburied" energy level a coin etc. has. In Air tests at least are reliable and repeatable, thats why such experiments will lead us to "all the time working" LRLs.



Its not so easy...

Only the model DC 2008 can detect gold in air test,but distance on large coin is 20 cm. The other models DCH 85 ,PDC 210 and DC 2006 not detect metal in air test but detect static charges on plastics,the DC 2008 not detect the plastics.
The DC 2008 is the model i like,becouse found some objects,and the DCH 85 with circuit TDA 7000 (modificated by Esteban) is also good and found objects. But MINEORO never locate with pinpoint precision as they claim in their site,it was always flip flop sparzed signals a few meters around the objects, i always confirm it was not erratics.

[Funfinder]

Very well - at least one detector finds a coin by "electrostatic"-method and those 20cm are improvable.

However now I know that coins in air test will get more complicated as battery-sparks sensitivity tests.

But I don't know this is better if the new DC 2008 doesn't detect (any?) electrostatical-charges.

If you attach the Mineoro to some small parabolic satellite dish which is grounded with the box you may get better directional results.

I can imagine the pinpointing is complicated because of the broad and low frequency spectrum. So it works more like a:
"The nearer the signal-source, the stronger the waves."

However to construct and improve such devices it is very important those find metal - even with low sensitivity and very close - under "hobby-room conditions" and not only under "undisturbed far out in the fields or woods" ones.

btw. sparzed signals also can be the fault of a wrong designed end-stage. If the "give a blink or beep level" is too high you just will hear or see some "peak values". This is a question of threshold, filtering and making small changes of signal-power very good distinctable.

Thats's why some broadband analogue output could be better than just some on/off LEDs.

btw. the new ultrabright LEDs still work with a 1kOhm resistor using 9V (normally those work with 4.5 Volts and a pre-resistor of about 50-100Ohm) starting with 220 Ohm so it's possible to use them as very sensitive and from dark to bright going "analogue" signal-lamps.

OK, I really have now all information and will start with the "creative experiments". Yesterday I built already the accu-pack (8 x 1.2 or 1.5 Magnum) that has a 9V battery connector so the power is on! :D

First I will keep the circuits very simple but still trying to get maximum gain so almost everybody here can reproduce the effects. The more complex part will be a good "directional antenna" 'cause I guess just a small alu-tube won't receive much energy. Perhaps I'll find something between 90cm sat.dish and litte alutube. :D

I'm outta here but soon back and will inform you about the first tests including schematics and additonal stuff! :cool:

[Funfinder]

Fantastic :cool: - the first "treasure" already was found - 3 FETs, 1 Thyristor and some other stuff! :D (most of them from an old Macintosh Plus TV-Unit board)

I haven't found any 2N3819 or MPF102 but I'll check if mine work the same good or even better. :)

[Morgan]

Very well - at least one detector finds a coin by "electrostatic"-method and those 20cm are improvable.

However now I know that coins in air test will get more complicated as battery-sparks sensitivity tests.

But I don't know this is better if the new DC 2008 doesn't detect (any?) electrostatical-charges.

If you attach the Mineoro to some small parabolic satellite dish which is grounded with the box you may get better directional results.

I can imagine the pinpointing is complicated because of the broad and low frequency spectrum. So it works more like a:
"The nearer the signal-source, the stronger the waves."

However to construct and improve such devices it is very important those find metal - even with low sensitivity and very close - under "hobby-room conditions" and not only under "undisturbed far out in the fields or woods" ones.

btw. sparzed signals also can be the fault of a wrong designed end-stage. If the "give a blink or beep level" is too high you just will hear or see some "peak values". This is a question of threshold, filtering and making small changes of signal-power very good distinctable.

Thats's why some broadband analogue output could be better than just some on/off LEDs.

btw. the new ultrabright LEDs still work with a 1kOhm resistor using 9V (normally those work with 4.5 Volts and a pre-resistor of about 50-100Ohm) starting with 220 Ohm so it's possible to use them as very sensitive and from dark to bright going "analogue" signal-lamps.

OK, I really have now all information and will start with the "creative experiments". Yesterday I built already the accu-pack (8 x 1.2 or 1.5 Magnum) that has a 9V battery connector so the power is on! :D

First I will keep the circuits very simple but still trying to get maximum gain so almost everybody here can reproduce the effects. The more complex part will be a good "directional antenna" 'cause I guess just a small alu-tube won't receive much energy. Perhaps I'll find something between 90cm sat.dish and litte alutube. :D

I'm outta here but soon back and will inform you about the first tests including schematics and additonal stuff! :cool:


Very well,you can develop better antenna for this LRL,but also need something very ligth,satelite dish ok but one of the smaller.
As i told,this is one LRL experimental and open to many modifications and improvments for better performance.

Regards

[Morgan]

12190

12191Very well,you can develop better antenna for this LRL,but also need something very ligth,satelite dish ok but one of the smaller.
As i told,this is one LRL experimental and open to many modifications and improvments for better performance.

Regards

[Funfinder]

Morgan you're right with the antenna, 'cause the pistol-MD shouldn't be too heavy.

Accupack, Case, electronic, Antenna - maybe all together 1-2kg max.

I've been lucky with my FET find 'cause I found this info:

"2N5485 is a viable alternative to the seeminly weak MPF 102"

And I've constructed already circuit01 - see below. :D
It is very simple and uses two NF "low gain" transistors (the most common ever) but it has already noise output via speaker, even without any antenna!

The principle is an AM diode receiver with audio amp but without any tuning capacitor or ferrite-transformer-coils and you can built it at 1x1cm size even without pcb. Very sensitive already because it justs needs a 470k resistor as "electron-feed". No sparks audible so far.

Perhaps this will be later just the audio-stage. For amplifying such week electrostatic signals i have to check what noise level all those parts have and maybe an op-amp LM358 or LM324 makes a better job. And I'm already curious how good the field effect transistor will receives "whatever"..

Anyway - my first receiver circuit after a very long time and this is just the beginning! :)

[Funfinder]

Silver Ring lying on cartboard detected from 15-20cm! over some sort of transformercoil I attached to the gate. Hum vanishes if ring is near.

So far no shielding and built on a plastic surface - no problem! :lol: :cool:

FET 2N5485 drain to antenna in (see schematic) and source to +9V via 150 Ohm resistor. Everything else like before.

Antenna- and fine-tuning-experiments will follow soon.

Thx for ya help Morgan and as you see already it also won't take very long to perfectionate the whole thing. :)

[Morgan]

Silver Ring lying on cartboard detected from 15-20cm! over some sort of transformercoil I attached to the gate. Hum vanishes if ring is near.

So far no shielding and built on a plastic surface - no problem! :lol: :cool:

FET 2N5485 drain to antenna in (see schematic) and source to +9V via 150 Ohm resistor. Everything else like before.

Antenna- and fine-tuning-experiments will follow soon.

Thx for ya help Morgan and as you see already it also won't take very long to perfectionate the whole thing. :)


Well,it seem we are alone in this project but i like to hear you have good results with the first PCB. Anyway what kind of antena or coil you make to detect the silver ring ?

Regards

[Morgan]

Silver Ring lying on cartboard detected from 15-20cm! over some sort of transformercoil I attached to the gate. Hum vanishes if ring is near.

So far no shielding and built on a plastic surface - no problem! :lol: :cool:

FET 2N5485 drain to antenna in (see schematic) and source to +9V via 150 Ohm resistor. Everything else like before.

Antenna- and fine-tuning-experiments will follow soon.

Thx for ya help Morgan and as you see already it also won't take very long to perfectionate the whole thing. :)


I´m curious becouse the original static receiver cant detect fresh metal,yes if we connect the BFO ...Are you sure about this results ?

[detectoman]

may be not detect the metal, but static hand, can you put the ring on an cotton wire how fishing?

[Funfinder]

http://www.multiupload.com/SHCZFGJA5H

In the test from yesterday I layed the ring on the other side of a Din A5 cartboard and neared it to the coil, so I definitivly can tell you that it was not the hand, because of the vanishing expotential amplitude of the signal the very closer the ring came.
In the video it's more the hand but it also works with rings only or iron, as example tin-cans (from a half meter so far). :)

This experimental circuit isn't adjusted to any frequency at all - perhaps this is much better - and it HAS to detect metal at this level if it should find it out in the wild! :D

I just have some problems to keep the "hum" alive.
If the circuit stands at a very good calibrated position (sometimes mm-work) the static remains and the speaker outputs it all the time, but sometimes I have to touch the FETs gate with my finger until the "field" is up again.

Anyway its possible to get this good audible signal all the time.

Also recognised there is some "phase-shift" involved, sometimes noise raises, sometimes vanishes if metal comes near to coil or even to FET wires. But don't focus too much on this few trafo-windings - they mean nothing. Those thing was just near my hand so I attached it.


Next I have to find out how to calibrate the peak-gain by tunable condenser or variable resistor and how to make it stable and sensitive. If you have some FET left you can built this circuit in 15min. and make your own experiences, verify my discoveries and support the task! :)

[Funfinder]

http://www.multiupload.com/FJ82JS1ID5

With the new added resistor (red dots only connected) you can see in the video loud and clearly how the ring gets detected which swings from a thread til 10cm with this improvised coil - with both cables at the FETs gate. The circuit now is much more sensitive and louder. Perhaps the basis of T2 needed some additional current, but I don't know why this has to be te one from the speaker.

Directional works only with grounded reflector. I made some fancy tests with my mini-tesla-coil plasma ball which got detected from 1m.

And I tested an op-amp LM358 connected at the output of the FET - louder but important analog signals were missing so I still use the transistors.

Perhaps antenna- and out in the wild-tests tomorrow or in the next few days.

[detectoman]

dear funfinder; very interest you experiment, i too work in these statics field
i send you me embrace, thanks for you exposition

[Morgan]

http://www.multiupload.com/FJ82JS1ID5

With the new added resistor (red dots only connected) you can see in the video loud and clearly how the ring gets detected which swings from a thread til 10cm with this improvised coil - with both cables at the FETs gate. The circuit now is much more sensitive and louder. Perhaps the basis of T2 needed some additional current, but I don't know why this has to be te one from the speaker.

Directional works only with grounded reflector. I made some fancy tests with my mini-tesla-coil plasma ball which got detected from 1m.

And I tested an op-amp LM358 connected at the output of the FET - louder but important analog signals were missing so I still use the transistors.

Perhaps antenna- and out in the wild-tests tomorrow or in the next few days.


Hello Funfinder

In this last video i´m convinced your LRL is detecting the ring.
This is one way to simplificate the project,and probaly we dont need to use the BFO circuit. Thanks for this improvments.
Can you tell what kind of diode you have in your device ?

Thanks

[detectoman]

mm may be this is only the begin of an intersting lrl, i think morgan can voila how rocket to moon, to this little project
whit other transistor input and preamplifer, e.g 3904 may be can detect in metales, radio reception so far
too whit other transistor dupla complementaries: bc547+ A1273Y you can put very hig and stronger sound what need block further whit your hands, your ears
i whis good future for this wird project
i like to parabolic grounded be incluide for directional, may be an big lamp handed light deflector
ohhhhhh mam! what bad is my english!

[detectoman]

may be we need other input jfet tipe for major noble metal detection, exist many!

[Morgan]

http://www.multiupload.com/FJ82JS1ID5

With the new added resistor (red dots only connected) you can see in the video loud and clearly how the ring gets detected which swings from a thread til 10cm with this improvised coil - with both cables at the FETs gate. The circuit now is much more sensitive and louder. Perhaps the basis of T2 needed some additional current, but I don't know why this has to be te one from the speaker.

Directional works only with grounded reflector. I made some fancy tests with my mini-tesla-coil plasma ball which got detected from 1m.

And I tested an op-amp LM358 connected at the output of the FET - louder but important analog signals were missing so I still use the transistors.

Perhaps antenna- and out in the wild-tests tomorrow or in the next few days.


Let´s put this your improvments in the thread ELECTROMAGNETIC FIELD DETECTOR,and also other people can come with more ideas.

[Funfinder]

Good idea, Morgan so this topic remains to the Iconos MD 807.
Here's the thread:

Simple but brilliant LRL
http://www.geotech1.com/forums/showthread.php?p=112103

[detectoman]

hello morgan and guys, the bfo sta clara ( saxon ) is the best for be stable, only put the first oscilador transistor reversed, bc548, whit these these bfo came stable, these bfo acept evervary transistor in the other steps for operation, if you put to final stage an mps, a12 have amount of sound, but whit other resistence
you should put near of 325 turns of wire in reference coil may be .20 wounded in pipe of plasti of 1 cm, and extended these turns aprox, 8 cms, then put inside an ferrite nucle for adjustable
the best configuration of turn, is where the speaker sound how tac tac
in coil of down plate, near of 3 ohms of wire
but for projet lrl, and ciruit static jfet, you should aproximate the wire same of all's coil, for an armony, equal thickness e.g
so if wire of plate bfo detection is .20, i think you should put in all, too .20, and anten static too .20
should acomplish in lrl bfo-static, and wave resonance in all coils, may be the coil detection ( not reference )
so, if static reception is out of resonance whit coils bfo, or in other dimension, the bfo not detect far, too very important is the tipe of transistor
a13 last step, is good but very hig consume energy, so bc 548 is adecuate
inn saxon, you can play whit variety of transistor, any detect rf major
i build an bfo saxon very stabile, put first osc, reversed transistor 548, any 2 little cap cross in determined part, i have the schematic in any notebook need find, but saxon is very noble bfo, i sure no need reversed transistor of stabilizations, if coils wire gauge of bfo, is in equalibration, no need to all,
the bfo saxon is the most apropiate for soil mineral exclusion, but not discriminate
if you go use bfo, i can give opinions at everyvary
bfo saxon project, isnt deeper but not detect little trash, is fine
for me the make these old project and modify, is my beauty hobby
bfo is the champion

[detectoman]

apologies, no! wire of coil of plate in bfo saxon, should be no thin, for normal md
but first make the reference coil whit 325 turns, wire most thin, plastic 1 cm- 8 extended, adj nucle, how in anterior mesage, after calculate winding the rastre coil @ obtain right silence in speaker and stable
but for conjunction how lrl, & added circuit, rf or static, need other configuration in other armonics, to silence, or, hum", this no easy
the difficultous all,'s lrl is the put to point final adjust calibration, this is always narrow

[Morgan]

apologies, no! wire of coil of plate in bfo saxon, should be no thin, for normal md
but first make the reference coil whit 325 turns, wire most thin, plastic 1 cm- 8 extended, adj nucle, how in anterior mesage, after calculate winding the rastre coil @ obtain right silence in speaker and stable
but for conjunction how lrl, & added circuit, rf or static, need other configuration in other armonics, to silence, or, hum", this no easy
the difficultous all,'s lrl is the put to point final adjust calibration, this is always narrow


No need this 325 turns,i build my saxon BFO and use variable capacitor from old pocket radio,and it works fine.

[detectoman]

???????????????? howwwwwwwwwwww? then var cap make the time's coil oscilator? may be may be, :( I am disapointed, due condenser is an aluminum coil
wow morgan you is an genius of electronic, i go implement these crazy idea
i go need an big seleector for caps

[Morgan]

???????????????? howwwwwwwwwwww? then var cap make the time's coil oscilator? may be may be, :( I am disapointed, due condenser is an aluminum coil
wow morgan you is an genius of electronic, i go implement these crazy idea
i go need an big seleector for caps


In stead of the reference coil with 325 turns,you can use 1 mH chok variable from an old radio.

[detectoman]

bfo for most range, i prefer coil big large 8 cm 1 cm diameter center adj of brass whit nucle or iron spring ( anten ) 325 turns more less
saxon for president

[takhslambos]

WHAT IS ICONOS ???

Long Range Locator,work electromagnetic resonance,head with Gold sample.The same is MINEORO DCH 85.

Some people buy this devices and want to find treasure in the garden,very funny,if not find,they become unappy...This need a lot of expeditions and tests,and probably in 500 places can be found one treasure.
About distances,this LRL´s can found treasure 80 meters,and gold coin (with sparzed signals) not more than 10 meters,always need metal detector for pinpoint. The great distances they put in their sites are ILUSION.

I not give advice here for people by this expensive detectors,i say better try to build similar device with low cost price (see my threads )and try in the fields,results will be the same.

Regards

12128
WHAT ABOUT THIS WHITE ONE PD?IS BETTER THAN THE BLACK ONE?

[Morgan]

WHAT ABOUT THIS WHITE ONE PD?IS BETTER THAN THE BLACK ONE?


This PD in the photo (with silver coins) is the clone,it works very good.
But the original works better.

13781

[WM6]

WHAT ABOUT THIS WHITE ONE PD?IS BETTER THAN THE BLACK ONE?



Both are in same working condition - both cannot detect nothing in soil: not from remote, nor from vicinity.

Except if targets are buried by yourself - than you detect not by PD, but by SD (Self Deception).

[Qiaozhi]

Both are in same working condition - both cannot detect nothing in soil: not from remote, nor from vicinity.

Except if targets are buried by yourself - than you detect not by PD, but by SD (Self Deception).
To be slightly pedantic - self deception applies to dowsing gadgets and certain electronic LRLs, but the PD does have a real T/R metal detector built-in (a Heathkit GD348 ) and therefore is actually capable of detecting metal buried in the ground. The debate surrounds the claimed medium-range detecting ability, not the short-range. By the way, I say "medium-range" because the PD does not claim to be a long-range detector. The term "long-range" is reserved for the idiotic claims of target detection measured in kilometers.

[hung]

See Morgan?
Now you might understand what I told you in our email group about these skeptics not suceeding in replicating the PD. After wrong schematics, inverted transistors and wacky theories of operation, they never understood what was going on.

From what he said above, you can testify they know even less now about it, than they did 2 years ago.

Alonso can sleep peacefully.
You can sleep peacefully.

[Qiaozhi]

See Morgan?
Now you might understand what I told you in our email group about these skeptics not suceeding in replicating the PD. After wrong schematics, inverted transistors and wacky theories of operation, they never understood what was going on.

From what he said above, you can testify they know even less now about it, than they did 2 years ago.

Alonso can sleep peacefully.
You can sleep peacefully.
At least the skeptics do not feel the need to post badly faked videos of their PD clones in an attempt to convince others of their (alleged) superior knowledge. You are a legend in your own lunchtime. :razz:

[WM6]

To be slightly pedantic - self deception applies to dowsing gadgets and certain electronic LRLs, but the PD does have a real T/R metal detector built-in (a Heathkit GD348 ) and therefore is actually capable of detecting metal buried in the ground.

.

Agree, but not deeper in soil as the worst Chinese metal detector. Agree that this "PD" can be used as bad MD in soil, but not as LRL PD.

If one try to use it as LRL PD it covert to EDR (Electronic Dowsing Rod) in his hand and all detecting operation to dowsing self deception.

[Qiaozhi]

Agree, but not deeper in soil as the worst Chinese metal detector. Agree that this "PD" can be used as bad MD in soil, but not as LRL PD.

If one try to use it as LRL PD it covert to EDR (Electronic Dowsing Rod) in his hand and all detecting operation to dowsing self deception.
In fact the Heathkit GD348 is an early non-motion T/R design and is badly affected by ground effect, so I agree that its ability when compared to the worst Chinese detectors is definitely not deeper.

[J_Player]

At least the skeptics do not feel the need to post badly faked videos of their PD clones in an attempt to convince others of their (alleged) superior knowledge. You are a legend in your own lunchtime. :razz:Hmmmm.... That's it!
The missing piece of the puzzle. "legend in his own lunchtime" is the time where HungScience is supreme, and all other janitors are mesmerized by tales of this astounding knowledge until the lunch bell signals end of lunch time. :rolleyes: