Mineoro 2-Box -- 492 feet range?

[J_Player]

Today I was searching the internet for 2-box detectors that find deep treasure. These detectors are usually used for finding large caches of treasure or ore deposits, and can be used for locating caves as well as buried pipes. I found both the White's TM 808 and the Fisher Gemini-3 sell for around $700 or less. These both claim they can detect large targets up to 20 feet deep. But these are not so good for small targets.

Then I find on Mineoro website they sell the MP-10 two-box detector with a range of 164yd / 150m. Mineoro also says it will detect to a depth of 82.02ft / 25m. Now this is a hell of a 2-box detector to find metals that far. Mineoro says it uses Reflective, Conductive and Inductive methods to locate targets (same as Fisher and White's 2-box).

But wait... there's more. It will also find tiny gold nuggets, diamonds, precious and semiprecious stones. Now for a detector that can do all these things I would expect to pay more than $700 like the Whites and Fisher 2-box detectors. The price for the Mineoro MP-10 is $3499. I guess this is not bad considering the longer range and the ability to find tiny gold nuggets, diamonds and other precious stones.

http://www.mineoro.com/goldDetectors/mp10.php
http://www.mineoro.com/#


Has anybody ever tested one of these to verify that it finds treasure 492 feet away, and 82 feet deep?

Best wishes,
J_P

[Qiaozhi]

Today I was searching the internet for 2-box detectors that find deep treasure. These detectors are usually used for finding large caches of treasure or ore deposits, and can be used for locating caves as well as buried pipes. I found both the White's TM 808 and the Fisher Gemini-3 sell for around $700 or less. These both claim they can detect large targets up to 20 feet deep. But these are not so good for small targets.

Then I find on Mineoro website they sell the MP-10 two-box detector with a range of 164yd / 150m. Mineoro also says it will detect to a depth of 82.02ft / 25m. Now this is a hell of a 2-box detector to find metals that far. Mineoro says it uses Reflective, Conductive and Inductive methods to locate targets (same as Fisher and White's 2-box).

But wait... there's more. It will also find tiny gold nuggets, diamonds, precious and semiprecious stones. Now for a detector that can do all these things I would expect to pay more than $700 like the Whites and Fisher 2-box detectors. The price for the Mineoro MP-10 is $3499. I guess this is not bad considering the longer range and the ability to find tiny gold nuggets, diamonds and other precious stones.

http://www.mineoro.com/goldDetectors/mp10.php
http://www.mineoro.com/#


Has anybody ever tested one of these to verify that it finds treasure 492 feet away, and 82 feet deep?

Best wishes,
J_P
This is the usual Mineoro nonsense! :lol:
Otherwise why would they have to put "NOT DOWSING" on the mp10 webpage? This is the same old ionic detection crap.
And as for this ->

This modern invention can be used to manufacture countless electronic instruments for different applications like:
1. Locating documents (paper money) buried or exposed.
2. Locating all substances of the mineral world.
3. Locating all substances of the vegetable world.
4. Locating diamonds, locate semi-precious stones, locate water and a lot more. 50 years of ripping-off the unwary... :(

[J_Player]

Otherwise why would they have to put "NOT DOWSING" on the mp10 webpage?Hmmmm... Maybe you have something there... :oh:

I don't see nowhere on White's and Fisher web page where it says "NOT DOWSING"

White's TM 808: http://www.whiteselectronics.com/tm808w.php
Fisher Gemini 3: http://www.fisherlab.com/hobby/gemini3.htm
Mineoro MP-10: http://www.mineoro.com/goldDetectors/mp10.php

[Max]

I think that the guys at Mineoro... have some serius problem for claiming that a 2-box md could reach that detection range. :lol:

Maybe they can't sell LRLs anymore ! :razz:

Maybe the following association is made by potential customers:

Mineoro's LRL = CRAP

(crap as "nonsense"... not othe things :rolleyes: )

[Steve in MS]

I think that the guys at Mineoro... have some serius problem for claiming that a 2-box md could reach that detection range. :lol:

Maybe they can't sell LRLs anymore ! :razz:

Maybe the following association is made by potential customers:

Mineoro's LRL = CRAP

(crap as "nonsense"... not othe things :rolleyes: )

Max, I think you are too kind to this! I would like to see one that can only detect gold rings while ignoring all other metals, it doesn't have to detect them too far, say maybe 10 feet, that would be enough for me. Now if some of these LRL makers would send me one free, I would try it out and if it works, I will become a dealer selling them. I wonder if wave a gold ring close to a LRL would it move toward it? Probably not, therefore my conclusion is they don't work :lol:. I always wondered how they can sense gold and not other metals, gold must really give off a special signal for them to lock onto.

[J_Player]

1. Locating documents (paper money) buried or exposed.
2. Locating all substances of the mineral world.
3. Locating all substances of the vegetable world.
4. Locating diamonds, locate semi-precious stones, locate water and a lot more.Locating all substances in the vegetable world??

Hmmmm.... This could solve the problem of world hunger. No more need to pay for programs to send food to starving people. Just send them a Mineoro long range vegetable detector! :p

Best wishes,
J_P

[Max]

This is the usual Mineoro nonsense! :lol:
Otherwise why would they have to put "NOT DOWSING" on the mp10 webpage? This is the same old ionic detection crap.
And as for this ->

This modern invention can be used to manufacture countless electronic instruments for different applications like:

1. Locating documents (paper money) buried or exposed.
2. Locating all substances of the mineral world.
3. Locating all substances of the vegetable world.
4. Locating diamonds, locate semi-precious stones, locate water and a lot more.
50 years of ripping-off the unwary... :(

Hi,
I think they never had a neuron working there...

"2. Locating all substances of the mineral world."

that would say everything about... but then:



"Locating diamonds, locate semi-precious stones, locate water and a lot more. "

Aren't they from the "mineral world" ?

anyway...
ok diamond are precious, fine.
"semi-precious" stones, like e.g. garnet, agate... exist... fine.

What's puzzling me are precious "stones"... like emeralds, rubys... etc
that I cannot see in their LRL's menu. :lol: :lol: :lol:

Why not emeralds too ??? Why not ruby ???

I think that there in someplaces SA the sunrays hit very hard ! ;)

Or maybe they mean "everything" with "lot more"... who knows...

seems the Quadro Tracker's recipe but without the magic cards.

Kind regards,
Max

[Qiaozhi]

Hmmmm... Maybe you have something there... :oh:

I don't see nowhere on White's and Fisher web page where it says "NOT DOWSING"

White's TM 808: http://www.whiteselectronics.com/tm808w.php
Fisher Gemini 3: http://www.fisherlab.com/hobby/gemini3.htm
Mineoro MP-10: http://www.mineoro.com/goldDetectors/mp10.php
Exactly my point. :)
Why bother stating "NOT DOWSING" if it's a real 2-box detector?
Unless the writer of the webpage had a guilty conscience. :lol:

By the way, I think you meant to say "I don't see anywhere on White's and Fisher web page where it says "NOT DOWSING"".
Otherwise it's a double-negative. ;)

[Qiaozhi]

Locating all substances in the vegetable world??

Hmmmm.... This could solve the problem of world hunger. No more need to pay for programs to send food to starving people. Just send them a Mineoro long range vegetable detector! :p

Best wishes,
J_P
That's explains why there's so much random beeping.
It's reacting to just about everything, including the cabbage patch! :lol:

[J_Player]

This brings to mind a new idea for the Mineoro principle. Maybe Mineoro could develop a universal locator that will find all kinds of matter.

For example, a LRL operator could adjust for vegetable, then scan his head for any vegetable material clogging up the works. Or vacum might be another good setting for diagnostics of brain function. This might also be useful for finding water when you are dying of thirst in the middle of the desert, or locating distant stars for astronomers. Maybe even good for warning of impending hurricanes.

The possibilities are endless. If Mineoro ever decided to produce a universal locator like this, a new control knob would be needed to adjust what we are searching for.

[Morgan]

Hello J Player,i have one Mineoro 2 box model 08 MI, and i test this machine meny times in my field test where i have coins and other things buried for meny years.

[Morgan]

08 MI detects 1kg (coins) at 60cm in mineralized groud. With this 2box you can´t find single coins. Fortunly this device discriminate iron (size horse shoe).For me its a good metal detector,i find many things,very deep,but not so deep as Mineoro put as propaganda...

[Morgan]

I try another 2 box,the white´s TM808 and can´t get any signal over this buried 1kg coins(mineralized soil),so this time Mineoro 08MI is the winer.

[Morgan]

I think Mineoro 08MI also can find other things like precious stones or maybe nugets,because it as two sensitive metters and is prepared to work with ground resistivity,and also prepared to work with normal MD switch on the box with 12 meter cable,all optional. This device as good discrimination and good deep if you can do the delicate tuning in control panel,machine will give first the metter indication and when more near the target you ear also soud.I can say this metter its extremly sensitive.It can find easy one jar with coins 1 meter deep...

[Morgan]

About 08 MI i can congratulate Mr.Damasio the inventor for this good 2 box detector,i find deep and nice relics with this Mineoro. Unfortunly the oposit with the other one,the LRL...

[Fred]

I have just discovered that in Portuguese and spanish mineoro claims that his detectors can detect baby´s sex from 4 months old.
Everyday i understand better Einstein when he said the only thing that was infinite was human stupidity.:angry:
I wonder why they didnt translated that to the other languages.
Jplayer,you need one more position to your switch....
Fred.

[Clondike Clad]

I have a RT and was told it works
I wanted to see how far the game will go.
The ANSWER is ...................................:nono:

[roberts]

What??? Only 492 feet? I am disapointed! Knowing Mineoro's politic... must be much more! :lol:

[hung]

Negative or incorrect info about product users unprepared to release such, weighs a lot if disclosed public. This is true in all departments of comercial affairs. Metal detecting business is no exception.

Morgan once again shows to me he is a beginner in this art, does not know 40% of what his equipment can do and attempt to release his impressions as undisputable truth. I'm sorry for you man.

First of all. The 08MI along with the MP10 are probably the best 2box detectors ever made. I had told this in the past if anyone remember. Mineoro 2boxes act as regular 2 box (with unbelievable power) and also employs electrostatic principle technology to detect long time buried metals from long distance. Damasio in 1959 while building a new antenna system discovered a way to enhance RF reception and employed this in a new concept of 2boxes.

There's the documented case of Mr. Anisio Trelha who in 1969 found a cache of gold coins from 360 feet away using the 08MI. This is not story. This is fact!
The device detects also from its sides with a special antenna and pocesses 2 VUs showing activity for objects which fall in this scenario or for small objects.

YES. The 08MI , MP10 can detect small objects buried such as a coin or a ring. All you have to do is look at the VU and calibrate it for small objects.

I used to own a 08MI in the past.

Too bad Morgan does not know how to use his instrument right and pose here as an expert of it.

Suggestion: Learn your stuff first!

[hung]

I have just discovered that in Portuguese and spanish mineoro claims that his detectors can detect baby´s sex from 4 months old.


Sorry Fred I think you got this one wrong. AFAIK my PDC210 will never tell my wife the sex of her baby.

The info you talk above I think relates to the method Damasio was or is working based on his gathered knowledge which could do this. I don't know any details because it's been a long time since I've talked to him.
There's nothing to do with the current detectors actually.

I've heard some dowsers claim to do that. But I don't have suficcient data about employing dowsing for this to place a coment.

[Fred]

Hi Hung,

In the main page of the FG80/FG79 and DC2008 metal detectors,they say those detector uses a brand new thechnology (so not from 1959 i guess), with "ionic/electrostatic" field detectors, and that this technology is so new it can be used to build baby sex detector,people detectors, diamonds, big and small treasures. (...).
So they dont really say those detectors can detects that, but the technology does, and those detectors use that technology.

well, i think that "they" have pushed it a bit too far this time.

Fred.

[hung]

Hey Fred, you are partly right. The text says new detectors can be built using the ionic electrostatic technology to achieve goals like determining sex, substance types, etc. I really don't know if the IE method can allow this.

Sounds like dowsing methods. I honestly cannot talk about it as Damasio never told me details about this, so I rather not comenting on something I don't have data to process.

Maybe this kind of behaviour is that led me to the development of my own LRL system. I collected enough data to know what is and what is not.

Regards.

[hung]

From the site regarding the specific technology:

E é tão moderna, que se possa fabricar inúmeros instrumentos electrônicos. Pode-se fabricar, também, aparelhos para outras finalidades.

Translation excluding 2 portuguese grammar mistakes in the text:

'And it's so modern that several electronic devices can be manufactured. Devices to other goals can also be built'.

[Max]

From the site regarding the specific technology:

E é tão moderna, que se possa fabricar inúmeros instrumentos electrônicos. Pode-se fabricar, também, aparelhos para outras finalidades.

Translation excluding 2 portuguese grammar mistakes in the text:

'And it's so modern that several electronic devices can be manufactured. Devices to other goals can also be built'.

raspberry to you ! :rolleyes:

[Esteban]

The device detects also from its sides with a special antenna and pocesses 2 VUs showing activity for objects which fall in this scenario or for small objects.

Yes, activity of objects buried for long time.

I built a two boxes based on Charles D. Rakes' circuit in book. With modification in transmitter with germanium transistor at 2.7 ohm in emitter in limit, consumption 25 mA. In the receiver, the first stage repeated with some mods. In critic resonant adjustment quit and adding winds, no adding caps! it was capable to detect small artillery ball (individual), no very deep, but another brand of two boxes can't detect this small ball.

You can increases the sensibility of your TM808 inserting a plug without any connection or install a key for to interrupt the audio. Without the audio is very sensitive only with the meter for some two boxes, try you in your TM 808.

Return with my experiences. I replace the transmitter based on germanium for the transmitter of the Mineoro two boxes BL692. In the delicate adjustment I make –also mechanical, this is fundamental– I girate in a site the two box slowly and control the activity of the needle of the microamp. In a point the microamp show a kind of interference and found the origin: an only coin at 5 meters of the two boxes buried at 15 cm depth.

Another secret for two boxes: uses separates batteries for transmitter and receiver. I learn this of the old 2 boxes Mineoro BL692.

[Boattow]

Holy cow!!! I don't know what you are smoking but I want some:razz:

[hung]

Ola meu bom amigo,

In critic resonant adjustment quit and adding winds, no adding caps! it was capable to detect small artillery ball (individual), no very deep, but another brand of two boxes can't detect this small ball.

Fine, this means you've reached a good coil tuning without added capacitance. Congratulations. Nice winding calculations.

I replace the transmitter based on germanium for the transmitter of the Mineoro two boxes BL692. In the delicate adjustment I make –also mechanical, this is fundamental– I girate in a site the two box slowly and control the activity of the needle of the microamp. In a point the microamp show a kind of interference and found the origin: an only coin at 5 meters of the two boxes buried at 15 cm depth.

Another secret for two boxes: uses separates batteries for transmitter and receiver. I learn this of the old 2 boxes Mineoro BL692.

I have plans to turn a 08MI into a MP10 just by changing the transistors and some other minor mods. I have a friend who did this and will handle me the schematics.
Imagine, the 08MI with the power of a MP10!! Yes!
Err.. Well, first I gotta buy me the old 08MI model. Red or blue...:rolleyes:

PS. I still did not give up to show up at yur door (Paraguayan site). Let me finish the operation I told you and we'll see.:cool:

[Esteban]

Hung, amigo

Wish to know what's happens with the mixture 08MI - MP10. Experimenting with two boxes is very versatile.

[Qiaozhi]

Morgan once again shows to me he is a beginner in this art, does not know 40% of what his equipment can do and attempt to release his impressions as undisputable truth. I'm sorry for you man.

Too bad Morgan does not know how to use his instrument right and pose here as an expert of it.

Suggestion: Learn your stuff first!
I sincerely hope you never get (or even have now) a job in customer support. You've certainly blown your chances with Mineoro. :razz:

This reminds me of the tale where a computer support guy told a customer to put his computer in the box and send it back to the factory, because he was too stupid to use it!

[hung]

This reminds me of the tale where a computer support guy told a customer to put his computer in the box and send it back to the factory, because he was too stupid to use it!
Something similar Damasio would have probably told me at the time when I was just learning to use the 08MI.

Well I guess the above tale applies to me. When I first bought the detector I wanted it disguised so nobody would know what I was doing in the field. So this poor idiot here had a taylor to make a jacket to enclose the detector. When it was ready, I said: Perfect!
The first thought that came to mind was the obvious question people spoting me in the field would make: 'Who the hell is that madman walking the cropfield playin' a keyboard??" As I'm also a musician, I think this would fit just right.

To make a long story short, this huge stupidity made me miss God only knows how many targets since the VUs were always covered and I was only using the audio section. I stayed like this for almost 2 months, when I finally decided to read the manual. And there, loud and clear was written how a long time buried gold coin would appear several and several times bigger to the detector due to the electrostatic field emanation and how the VUs were important to that.
Doooohhh!

Well the good news is that I talked to my partner this afternoon. And I did not know he also owns a 08MI besides his MP10. So as he's owing me money, I proposed to get his 08MI and end the debt. The detector is back to Mineoro for repair. And guess what? It's the old red model.
He did not answer me right now :angry: but chances are he will accept. After all he owes me an amount which is superior to the detector value. Yeah, I know.. I have this uncontrolable feeling to always help people....

[J_Player]

These are all very interesting stories and speculations. But I am still wondering... is it really true what Mineoro says "will detect to a depth of 82.02ft / 25m." "It will also find tiny gold nuggets, diamonds, precious and semiprecious stones."

Has anyone tried the Mineoro MP-10 two-box detector and found any of these things at that depth? Or is this perhaps more Mineoro BS?

Best wishes
J_P

[Geo]

These numbers (25m) are not really:nono: for a normal 2Box detector.Except it is something else. Why Mineoro uses transmitter with 2 frequencies? Maybe the mix of signals to give something else........
I heard from people that used the old model of Mineoro (MO-80 i think) that it was a very good 2box detector and had the ability to detect from long distance. I never have work any of these Mineoro detectors
Your opinion:)????????

[Max]

These numbers (25m) are not really:nono: for a normal 2Box detector.Except it is something else. Why Mineoro uses transmitter with 2 frequencies? Maybe the mix of signals to give something else........
I heard from people that used the old model of Mineoro (MO-80 i think) that it was a very good 2box detector and had the ability to detect from long distance. I never have work any of these Mineoro detectors
Your opinion:)????????

Hi,
my opinion... is that all mineoro's stuff have some mistery inside ! :lol:

25meters for a 2box ? They wrote some hundreds meters... anyway... even considering 25meters "only" that's impossible for a 2box with standard dimensions and power (like gemini and the tm808 ) doing that way... detecting stuff at 25meters underground...

Oh... well... it could be possible... if they found some 1/2 kilometer diameter UFO there under the factory of Mineoro in Brazil !:lol:

Impossible... I heard of detection also at 12meters but of very large things... and I mean very very large much more than a car! I saw with my eyes and heard sound of targets from 4 meters and the like... but they was large pipes and most important very long structures.

Fact that they use 2 freq at tx means few to me... I've used to some different long wave freq in my stuff but never detected stuff at that range of 25 meters.... I've tested also near a old train and detector doesn't sound at 20meters but just at 10-12meters but on the air! Soil is really different thing for 2boxes... you cannot find stuff at 50-60cm (like 15cm paint can)... how can you hear sound from 25meters underground ???

What to say... to me it's just another impossible claim !:D

Kind regards,
Max

[antonio]

Yes, activity of objects buried for long time.

I built a two boxes based on Charles D. Rakes' circuit in book. With modification in transmitter with germanium transistor at 2.7 ohm in emitter in limit, consumption 25 mA. In the receiver, the first stage repeated with some mods. In critic resonant adjustment quit and adding winds, no adding caps! it was capable to detect small artillery ball (individual), no very deep, but another brand of two boxes can't detect this small ball.

You can increases the sensibility of your TM808 inserting a plug without any connection or install a key for to interrupt the audio. Without the audio is very sensitive only with the meter for some two boxes, try you in your TM 808.

Return with my experiences. I replace the transmitter based on germanium for the transmitter of the Mineoro two boxes BL692. In the delicate adjustment I make –also mechanical, this is fundamental– I girate in a site the two box slowly and control the activity of the needle of the microamp. In a point the microamp show a kind of interference and found the origin: an only coin at 5 meters of the two boxes buried at 15 cm depth.

Another secret for two boxes: uses separates batteries for transmitter and receiver. I learn this of the old 2 boxes Mineoro BL692.
hi Esteban!
can you please send me a diagram on how to separate the batteries for the TX and RX?

[antonio]

Yes, activity of objects buried for long time.

I built a two boxes based on Charles D. Rakes' circuit in book. With modification in transmitter with germanium transistor at 2.7 ohm in emitter in limit, consumption 25 mA. In the receiver, the first stage repeated with some mods. In critic resonant adjustment quit and adding winds, no adding caps! it was capable to detect small artillery ball (individual), no very deep, but another brand of two boxes can't detect this small ball.

You can increases the sensibility of your TM808 inserting a plug without any connection or install a key for to interrupt the audio. Without the audio is very sensitive only with the meter for some two boxes, try you in your TM 808.

Return with my experiences. I replace the transmitter based on germanium for the transmitter of the Mineoro two boxes BL692. In the delicate adjustment I make –also mechanical, this is fundamental– I girate in a site the two box slowly and control the activity of the needle of the microamp. In a point the microamp show a kind of interference and found the origin: an only coin at 5 meters of the two boxes buried at 15 cm depth.

Another secret for two boxes: uses separates batteries for transmitter and receiver. I learn this of the old 2 boxes Mineoro BL692.
hi Esteban!
can you please send me a diagram on how to separate the batteries for the TX and RX fo my TM-808? THANKYOU!

[Esteban]

Remember: is under your risk!!! you must be very prudent in this operation. I said that is better separation batteries for Tr and Rec for some projects, don't know if is good for the TM808. In the case you wish separate batteries, you need a swicht (or see if the rotative switch of the TM808 has a free switch for to use in this function). But the batteries checker position only will be for the receiver. Go schematic and mod. Hope I don't forget any detail! :lol:

[Esteban]

Hope no problem with P5_Sync? Any idea?

[Morgan]

These are all very interesting stories and speculations. But I am still wondering... is it really true what Mineoro says "will detect to a depth of 82.02ft / 25m." "It will also find tiny gold nuggets, diamonds, precious and semiprecious stones."

Has anyone tried the Mineoro MP-10 two-box detector and found any of these things at that depth? Or is this perhaps more Mineoro BS?

Best wishes
J_P
Hello J_P

I think nobody pay atention to all messages i put in Geotech Forums:angry:
I already put here the performance of my Mineoro 08-MI two box.all tests made in my field test with coins,objects and a gold medal buried 20YEARS AGO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
When i was in Brazil,i try both models 08MI and MP-10.The test was made by one member of mineoro team named Paulo Torquato(Paulinho),in Mineoro factory where there is a cooper radiator buried 16years ago,he try both ,and MP10 go only 10cm more deep,so i decide to buy 08MI.
If people here in Forum believe in what Hung say,that i´m a beginner in TH,i say he is wrong!!! More than 25 years ago i start metal detecting with an old M-scope"ORION",it was a sucessfull experience,in the first day i find some coins and a gold ring,so i never say bye bye to this hobby. should i say hobby? One person who travel to Brazil and spend a lot of money in Mineoro devices like i do,i think its more than simple weekend hobby.
So i registrate in Geotech forums only to share with other people wath i know and also to get more information about T-Hunting.
IF PEOPLE HERE DONT TRUST IN MY METAL DETECTING EXPERIENCE,AND THE RESULTS IN MY FIELD TESTS,I CHALLENGE EVERYONE HERE TO BUY THE SAME DETECTORS I HAVE AND YOU WILL SEE WHO TELL THE TRUTH IN THIS FORUMS!!!
Next week my team and me,we go travel to real gold mine and test Mineoro models FG80,DC2006,2008,PDC210 and Alonso LRL ,its what Hung say to Carl NC to do,but he is a very busy man...So,me and my team will travel to this far away gold mine,with real GOLD buried very deep long,long time ago...
If someone want to know the test results just ask,and PLEASE OPEN YOUR EYES,GO INTO REALYTY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

BEST REGARDS

[Fred]

With the extreme long range claimed for mineoro´s detectors, i dont see any point in testing it in a gold mine:There is gold everywhere,so i suppose it will l beep all the time, as usual? :D
Fred.

[Esteban]

Hi Morgan

I know that you can detect at semilong range distance with two boxes, well constructed, well adjusted, a coin at 5 meters (buried for long time) or some more of the receiver, but you'll pay attention in the "needle" of the microamp, what causes the movement in a X direction and no in other. Synthesis: all detector you can modify for semi-long range detector, as a car you can modify for to run as a rocket with nitro. :)

[Qiaozhi]

Hi Morgan

I know that you can detect at semilong range distance with two boxes, well constructed, well adjusted, a coin at 5 meters (buried for long time) or some more of the receiver, but you'll pay attention in the "needle" of the microamp, what causes the movement in a X direction and no in other. Synthesis: all detector you can modify for semi-long range detector, as a car you can modify for to run as a rocket with nitro. :)
Hi Esteban,

As a skeptic, I'm always intrigued by your LRL claims. The reason I am prepared to take you seriously, is because you don't appear to have a hidden agenda, and you're not trying to make a quick buck from some unsuspecting punter. My only wish is that you post a schematic of something you "know" works. I'm not looking for state-of-the-art, or expecting you give away the crown jewels. Just something that maybe can detect a coin 2m away, for example.

Perhaps that could be your Christmas present to us? :D

I'm prepared to build it and test with an open mind.

[Esteban]

Hi Qiaozhi,

Maybe, maybe. Who knows? :rolleyes:

[Morgan]

Negative or incorrect info about product users unprepared to release such, weighs a lot if disclosed public. This is true in all departments of comercial affairs. Metal detecting business is no exception.

Morgan once again shows to me he is a beginner in this art, does not know 40% of what his equipment can do and attempt to release his impressions as undisputable truth. I'm sorry for you man.

First of all. The 08MI along with the MP10 are probably the best 2box detectors ever made. I had told this in the past if anyone remember. Mineoro 2boxes act as regular 2 box (with unbelievable power) and also employs electrostatic principle technology to detect long time buried metals from long distance. Damasio in 1959 while building a new antenna system discovered a way to enhance RF reception and employed this in a new concept of 2boxes.

There's the documented case of Mr. Anisio Trelha who in 1969 found a cache of gold coins from 360 feet away using the 08MI. This is not story. This is fact!
The device detects also from its sides with a special antenna and pocesses 2 VUs showing activity for objects which fall in this scenario or for small objects.

YES. The 08MI , MP10 can detect small objects buried such as a coin or a ring. All you have to do is look at the VU and calibrate it for small objects.

I used to own a 08MI in the past.

Too bad Morgan does not know how to use his instrument right and pose here as an expert of it.

Suggestion: Learn your stuff first!
Hello
Before put this nonsense about me that i´m a beginner in metal detecting,you must pay more atention to my field tests,because i say all the truth to people in GEOTECH FORUMS.
For me it doesn´t mather who you are,but i should say you are the best MARKETING AGENT OF MINEORO LRL.

Kind regards

[Fred]

Hi Qiaozhi,

Maybe, maybe. Who knows? :rolleyes:

YOU know!
So, how it is? ;)
Fred

[antonio]

Remember: is under your risk!!! you must be very prudent in this operation. I said that is better separation batteries for Tr and Rec for some projects, don't know if is good for the TM808. In the case you wish separate batteries, you need a swicht (or see if the rotative switch of the TM808 has a free switch for to use in this function). But the batteries checker position only will be for the receiver. Go schematic and mod. Hope I don't forget any detail! :lol:
Thankyou again Esteban! I will take the risk!

[J_Player]

I think nobody pay atention to all messages i put in Geotech Forums. I already put here the performance of my Mineoro 08-MI two box.

08 MI detects 1kg (coins) at 60cm in mineralized groud. With this 2box you can´t find single coins. Fortunly this device discriminate iron (size horse shoe).For me its a good metal detector,i find many things,very deep,but not so deep as Mineoro put as propaganda... I try another 2 box,the white´s TM808 and can´t get any signal over this buried 1kg coins(mineralized soil),so this time Mineoro 08MI is the winer.

I think Mineoro 08MI also can find other things like precious stones or maybe nugets,because it as two sensitive metters and is prepared to work with ground resistivity,and also prepared to work with normal MD switch on the box with 12 meter cable,all optional. This device as good discrimination and good deep if you can do the delicate tuning in control panel,machine will give first the metter indication and when more near the target you ear also soud.I can say this metter its extremly sensitive.It can find easy one jar with coins 1 meter deep... About 08 MI i can congratulate Mr.Damasio the inventor for this good 2 box detector,i find deep and nice relics with this Mineoro. Unfortunly the oposit with the other one, the LRL...


I did read your field report about the Mineoro 08M1 2-box detector. From your posts I can conclude you observed the 08M1 finding a jar of coins 1 meter deep, not 492 feet deep as printed in the Mineoro propaganda. You also concluded the 08M1 can discriminate better, and locate shallow targets in mineralized ground where the less expensive competitors cannot. Judging from your conclusions, I would think this might be a good 2-box detector to use for finding metal targets in shallow ground where other 2-box detectors don't get a signal. (of course you need to pay the cost of 4 Whites or Fisher 2-box detectors for a 08M1).

What is interesting is that you say you think the 08M1 can also find other things like precious stones. Now this is where this detector could be an outstanding tool to use in diamond mines and for diamond prospectors. I would love to recover hands full of raw diamonds or rubies using a 2-box detector. What has been your experience in locating precious stones using the 08M1? Does it locate large diamonds like Sharky is hunting in India? Can you post any photos of diamonds or other precious stones you found?

Best wishes,
J_P

[Morgan]

Hello

About this device to find diamonds and other precious stones,i never try, so i can´t say if it realy works.
The 08 MI as some kind of ground resistivimeter to conect to this detector,they sell it as an extra. Its some kind of bars with cables to conect to detector and to ground,and its possible to measure ground resistivity using the meter of the two box,so i think if there are diferente measure in the field its because of diferent materials buried undergroud.Unfortunly i dont have experience in searching for precious stones.
This two box its a versatil device,it was my unique good choice in Mineoro...

Kind regards

[J_Player]

Hi Morgan

Thank you for your information. I am reading the 08M1 page and I see it has the same propaganda as the MP10 model except the range and depth is printed as 65.62yd / 60m Range, 2,81ft / 10m depth. compared to the 164yd / 150m range and 82.02ft / 25m depth for the MP10. How deep were you able to find your deepest treasure with the 08M1?

Good luck with your testing the Mineoro PDC long range locators. I will wait to see what results you observe.

Best wishes,
J_P

[Morgan]

Hi Esteban,

As a skeptic, I'm always intrigued by your LRL claims. The reason I am prepared to take you seriously, is because you don't appear to have a hidden agenda, and you're not trying to make a quick buck from some unsuspecting punter. My only wish is that you post a schematic of something you "know" works. I'm not looking for state-of-the-art, or expecting you give away the crown jewels. Just something that maybe can detect a coin 2m away, for example.

Perhaps that could be your Christmas present to us? :D

I'm prepared to build it and test with an open mind.
Hello

Are you interested in schematic of this detektorpistol made by Esteban ?
I come from my tests in a real gold mine where i test some mineoro lrl and this detektorpistol the same as Esteban as in photo.All the tests made with mineoro result in complete faylure,we get only randomic signals,so its useless devices for gold hunting.For me it doesn´t matter what Hung says,now i´m absolutly sure about mineoro,only randomic signals,none of them in the same place where tests was made before.
But fortunly with detektorpistol we get two times the signal in the same place and it was found a nice 0,5gr gold nugget at 10cm deep.I ask my friend the ouner of this device if i can make photos and take notes of this electronic circuit,and he say yes. So,i think this device was sell by Alonso but made by Esteban.
I decide not to put schematic here without his permition...
Can you convince him to give to forum this Christmas present?
I will make one of this pistoldetektor for me!!!
Kind regards

[Morgan]

Hi Morgan

Thank you for your information. I am reading the 08M1 page and I see it has the same propaganda as the MP10 model except the range and depth is printed as 65.62yd / 60m Range, 2,81ft / 10m depth. compared to the 164yd / 150m range and 82.02ft / 25m depth for the MP10. How deep were you able to find your deepest treasure with the 08M1?

Good luck with your testing the Mineoro PDC long range locators. I will wait to see what results you observe.

Best wishes,
J_P
Hello

With car size target you have meter movment 5m distance with this 2-box. Usualy little coins you cant fint but large coins its possible,only near the surface.
I already return from this tests near gold mine,and one of this lrl found gold but only two meter distance.I need a good E.engineer who help me to put more power on this device.Its not mineoro who find the gold.
There is the possibility to put shematic here...lets convince the inventor,he is among us in this forum

Kind regards

[Qiaozhi]

Hello

Are you interested in schematic of this detektorpistol made by Esteban ?
I come from my tests in a real gold mine where i test some mineoro lrl and this detektorpistol the same as Esteban as in photo.All the tests made with mineoro result in complete faylure,we get only randomic signals,so its useless devices for gold hunting.For me it doesn´t matter what Hung says,now i´m absolutly sure about mineoro,only randomic signals,none of them in the same place where tests was made before.
But fortunly with detektorpistol we get two times the signal in the same place and it was found a nice 0,5gr gold nugget at 10cm deep.I ask my friend the ouner of this device if i can make photos and take notes of this electronic circuit,and he say yes. So,i think this device was sell by Alonso but made by Esteban.
I decide not to put schematic here without his permition...
Can you convince him to give to forum this Christmas present?
I will make one of this pistoldetektor for me!!!
Kind regards
Yes, I am very much interested in the schematic for this detector pistol. :thumb:

Although I only had a short time to test the Mineoro, there was nothing but random beeping, just as you described. A very nicely varnished wooden case, but useless for detecting gold - longtime buried, or otherwise.
On the other hand, I respect your honest report on the detector pistol. Esteban seems convinced that this technology works, and he doesn't talk BS (unlike some others here) so I'm prepared to listen. If a schematic is forthcoming, I would definitely like to build a copy and perform some proper testing. Who knows? Maybe Esteban is right, and I'm wrong.
Are you able to back-engineer this design? If not, then please post some photographs of both sides of the PCB, and any other relevant details. Thanks. :cool:

[Esteban]

Do you can post pics of inside? In first place, if is the pistol I suspect wich is, I'll tell you how works...

[Morgan]

Do you can post pics of inside? In first place, if is the pistol I suspect wich is, I'll tell you how works...
Hello Esteban

This pistoldetektor find gold nugget 2m ditance and 10cm deep,no doubts absolutely no randomic signals,give twice signal in the same place,very stable detector.
My friend who buy this device,give me permition to study electronic circuit.Its heavy transistorised,6 circuit board with ferrit radio tipe,i think its the IB tipe pistoldetektor,its not ionic tecnology...next week i must return detector to him.
I´m prepared to make a copy of this device for me.
some people in this forum ask me to put shematic here.I think this is one of your tecnology,so i ask you permition to put photos of shematic.
What is your opinion or advice?

Best regards

[Morgan]

Yes, I am very much interested in the schematic for this detector pistol. :thumb:

Although I only had a short time to test the Mineoro, there was nothing but random beeping, just as you described. A very nicely varnished wooden case, but useless for detecting gold - longtime buried, or otherwise.
On the other hand, I respect your honest report on the detector pistol. Esteban seems convinced that this technology works, and he doesn't talk BS (unlike some others here) so I'm prepared to listen. If a schematic is forthcoming, I would definitely like to build a copy and perform some proper testing. Who knows? Maybe Esteban is right, and I'm wrong.
Are you able to back-engineer this design? If not, then please post some photographs of both sides of the PCB, and any other relevant details. Thanks. :cool:
Hello
So,you also another desapointed mineoro client...
I´m waiting Esteban answer,to put shematic here,only with his permition...

Kind regards

[Fred]

Hello
So,you also another desapointed mineoro client...
I´m waiting Esteban answer,to put shematic here,only with his permition...

Kind regards
Morgan,
Esteban already asked you (3 messages above)to post some pictures so he can tell if it is the right detector.
This information would be very interesting, thanks for sharing your experience.
I really hope Esteban will agree for the schematic.
regards,
Fred.

[Esteban]

Hello Esteban

This pistoldetektor find gold nugget 2m ditance and 10cm deep,no doubts absolutely no randomic signals,give twice signal in the same place,very stable detector.
My friend who buy this device,give me permition to study electronic circuit.Its heavy transistorised,6 circuit board with ferrit radio tipe,i think its the IB tipe pistoldetektor,its not ionic tecnology...next week i must return detector to him.
I´m prepared to make a copy of this device for me.
some people in this forum ask me to put shematic here.I think this is one of your tecnology,so i ask you permition to put photos of shematic.
What is your opinion or advice?

Best regards

I know about pistol technology thats works, why not? Many, many... I remember that a part of this pistol, the ferrite oscillator circuitry, the heart, was my collaboration toward Alonso and other few. I suspect is the pistol with 2 ferrites in very critical point adjustment between them. But don't know what Alonso think about to post the complete schematic here... Maybe I ask him? Please, take internal pic with a digital camera.

[Qiaozhi]

I know about pistol technology thats works, why not? Many, many... I remember that a part of this pistol, the ferrite oscillator circuitry, the heart, was my collaboration toward Alonso and other few. I suspect is the pistol with 2 ferrites in very critical point adjustment between them. But don't know what Alonso think about to post the complete schematic here... Maybe I ask him? Please, take internal pic with a digital camera.
... I'll tell you how works...
Thanks Esteban.
This is much appreciated. :) I'm looking forward to understanding the inner workings of this device.

[Esteban]

Hi Morgan, Qiaozhi and all,

Recently I speak by telephone with Alonso, and he said me there are three detectors like the yours in Europe.

He told me is a system with the 2 ferrites and infrared, is a last modification of the detector with only 2 ferrites.

But now is under negotiation with a firm and IS PATENTED.

So, no deppend of me for to be public. Sorry. :frown:

[mosha]

Hi Morgan, Qiaozhi and all,

Recently I speak by telephone with Alonso, and he said me there are three detectors like the yours in Europe.

He told me is a system with the 2 ferrites and infrared, is a last modification of the detector with only 2 ferrites.

But now is under negotiation with a firm and IS PATENTED.

So, no deppend of me for to be public. Sorry. :frown:

I don't understand, is this device built by you or Alonso?

if it is belong to Alonso, why he sold to us non working devices like mineoro DC2008 and at the same time sell the pistol type in the black market.

[Esteban]

I don't understand, is this device built by you or Alonso?

if it is belong to Alonso, why he sold to us non working devices like mineoro DC2008 and at the same time sell the pistol type in the black market.

I never said I built it. This is supossition of Morgan, no mine. But I know about main oscillator. Nobody sell in black market. The three pistol in existence are 3 prototypes under control by some users in Europe.

[Qiaozhi]

Hi Morgan, Qiaozhi and all,

Recently I speak by telephone with Alonso, and he said me there are three detectors like the yours in Europe.

He told me is a system with the 2 ferrites and infrared, is a last modification of the detector with only 2 ferrites.

But now is under negotiation with a firm and IS PATENTED.

So, no deppend of me for to be public. Sorry. :frown:
Do you know the number of the patent?

[Fred]

Esteban,
Dont slip to the dark side! :nono:
regards,
Fred

[Esteban]

Do you know the number of the patent?

Alonso told me is patented in Brazil. Don't know the number.

[Esteban]

Esteban,
Dont slip to the dark side! :nono:
regards,
Fred

If I can help with details, I'll do. Please, watch since my position: Alonso is my cousin in 2nd grade, I know him since 1979. I'll ask for a schematic I can post under his permission.

Regards

Esteban

[Fred]

Ok Esteban, that would be great.But dont you think if Alonso wishes to share the schematic, he just have to allow Morgan to post it?

When i talk about the dark side, i just mean, if you dont want to share it, just say it, but your explanations are not too good.they smell hung´s :)
As you understand , Morgan only asked your permission by respect to you, the law have nothing to do here.
Its your chance to act with fairplay ;)

Regards,
Fred.

[Qiaozhi]

If I can help with details, I'll do. Please, watch since my position: Alonso is my cousin in 2nd grade, I know him since 1979. I'll ask for a schematic I can post under his permission.

Regards

Esteban
Is it, by any chance, similar to the Gold Gun?

[Esteban]

Is it, by any chance, similar to the Gold Gun?

No, because is an oscillator with transistor and 2 ferrites, and this 2 ferrites is adjust between them in a point wich give more signal when metal is near, is a base autoexcited oscillator. This is one part. Between the ferrites is a kind of small gap.

[Qiaozhi]

No, because is an oscillator with transistor and 2 ferrites, and this 2 ferrites is adjust between them in a point wich give more signal when metal is near, is a base autoexcited oscillator. This is one part. Between the ferrites is a kind of small gap.
So - is this transmitter based on a Hartley oscillator?

[Morgan]

Ok Esteban, that would be great.But dont you think if Alonso wishes to share the schematic, he just have to allow Morgan to post it?

When i talk about the dark side, i just mean, if you dont want to share it, just say it, but your explanations are not too good.they smell hung´s :)
As you understand , Morgan only asked your permission by respect to you, the law have nothing to do here.
Its your chance to act with fairplay ;)

Regards,
Fred.
Hello

I take photos of all this 6 circuits and ferrite,i´m prepared to share with all this friends in forum,only need Esteban permition ,maybe he colaborate and put more NITRO on this device

Kind regards

[Morgan]

No, because is an oscillator with transistor and 2 ferrites, and this 2 ferrites is adjust between them in a point wich give more signal when metal is near, is a base autoexcited oscillator. This is one part. Between the ferrites is a kind of small gap.
Hello

I already get a note of all electronic components of this device,one of them(trimer)is made in Costa Rica.
If this device is patented maybe better not put schematic...
Anyway,its hand made LRL,box completly in wood,for the antenna it was used an old search coil of Garret groundhogg...
Now i send photo of device for you.

Best regards

[Morgan]

http://www.thunting.com/geotech/forums/Direcional AlonsoNo, because is an oscillator with transistor and 2 ferrites, and this 2 ferrites is adjust between them in a point wich give more signal when metal is near, is a base autoexcited oscillator. This is one part. Between the ferrites is a kind of small gap.

[Morgan]

http://www.thunting.com/geotech/forums/Direcional alonsoPistoldetektor

[Fred]

Morgan,
thanks for sharing,but
your pictures are not opening?
About patents, i understood is for Brazil only.
regards,
Fred.

[Morgan]

I´m new in this forum. Please tell me how to put correctly this photos ,or tell me you E-mail i send for you and you put here.

Kind regards

[Fred]

Ok Morgan
Maybe they are too big or something, one easy way is to put them here:
http://www.driveway.com
You browse where you have them on you PC, upload, and give me (or us) the link.That way you can post very big files.
Regards,
fred.

[Morgan]

http://www.thunting.com/geotech/forums/www.driveway.comOk Morgan
Maybe they are too big or something, one easy way is to put them here:
http://www.driveway.com
You browse where you have them on you PC, upload, and give me (or us) the link.That way you can post very big files.
Regards,
fred.

[Fred]

Interesting!
It doesnt look like there is 2 coils on the ferrite...
I hope you will be able to give more details.Now im even more intrigued :)
Thanks!
Regards,
Fred.

[Morgan]

Ok Morgan
Maybe they are too big or something, one easy way is to put them here:
http://www.driveway.com
You browse where you have them on you PC, upload, and give me (or us) the link.That way you can post very big files.
Regards,
fred.

Some photos of this detektorpistol3650

3651

[Esteban]

Is a variation of the pistol I have in my avatar. If circuit doesn't change, I see 2 ferrites.

[Morgan]

Do you can post pics of inside? In first place, if is the pistol I suspect wich is, I'll tell you how works...
Pistoldetektor

[Fred]

Ok Esteban,
I thought it was only one long ferrite.But its only 1 coil?
Can you tell us about principles?
thanks
Fred.

[Morgan]

Is a variation of the pistol I have in my avatar. If circuit doesn't change, I see 2 ferrites.
It doesn´t matter how many ferrites,it works in gold mine!

[Esteban]

Because only small part of another ferrite has coil. In the first pistol (red of avatar) was 2 ferrites and coil only a portion of another ferrite. As Alonso has many variation and invention each day (he, he!!!) is difficult to know if there are important changes.

[Morgan]

Pistoldetektor
Circuit with ferrite and a lot of transistor

[Fred]

Because only small part of another ferrite has coil. In the first pistol (red of avatar) was 2 ferrites and coil only a portion of another ferrite. As Alonso has many variation and invention each day (he, he!!!) is difficult to know if there are important changes.

Ok,i see...
I think that by adjusting the gap you are just adjusting the coil inductance,via the ferrite rod permeability ,resulting in tuning the oscillator or receiver to a precise frequency?.
Fred.

[mosha]

what is the upper cap? is it a transmitter?

regards,

[Qiaozhi]

I'm having some trouble deciding whereabouts the 6 boards are in this device.
Please see attached image. Am I correct?

[hung]

When i talk about the dark side, i just mean, if you dont want to share it, just say it, but your explanations are not too good.they smell hung´s :)
Fred.

No Fred. It smells honesty. It smells discretion and respect for other's own inventions and work. Much different from the rotten smell some exibit here trying to steal the efforts of sweat and hard work from others.

[hung]

So - is this transmitter based on a Hartley oscillator?
Yes ozzy, I want to see you implore, beg on your knees for a working LRL schematic and shout it out loud: 'Please, someone, anyone hand me a working LRL schematic, I just can't wait longer in desperation banging my head on the wall everyday!!":lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol:

[Esteban]

Why someone has to name other one in the discussion for to discredited him? :nono:

As I can see the demons are: Esteban, Hung and Dell... and other minor demons...

[Palamedes]

Why someone has to name other one in the discussion for to discredited him? :nono:

As I can see the demons are: Esteban, Hung and Dell... and other minor demons...

.. some demons can be usefull for treasure hunting and also other hobbies.
From Lesser Key of Solomon, Lemegeton - Goetia (Translated by Mathers)

[Fred]

No Fred. It smells honesty. It smells discretion and respect for other's own inventions and work. Much different from the rotten smell some exibit here trying to steal the efforts of sweat and hard work from others.
By saying "it smell hung´s [explanations]", i did not say it was not compatible with honesty or discretion.You did.you are probably right.
What i meant is those explanations were unclear , not logical .Like Hung´s.
Why those LRL´s are such a secret?.IB or PI are no secret, detectors are patented and everything is fine,constructors sell thousands of them because their technology is TRUSTABLE and well known.
Of course half a dozen guys are building their own (IB´s or PI´s) but what it is in comparaison with the quantities of detectors that could be sold if their reliability could be proven?

Esteban, i dont understand your last comment.who has discredited what?

Regards,
Fred.

[Esteban]

Some parameters

This device is sensitive for interference in the cities. Strong sparks causes false alarms. Good for inland.

[J_Player]

Perhaps we should review patents.
By patenting an idea. we do not make it secret. We release the secret to all the world to read about and understand. The patent registration is a document that shows all the world the details of what the inventor discovered, and grants the inventor the right to sue anyone who uses his patented idea for commercial profit without paying him for the right to use his idea. When we hear that a patented concept has been licensed, this means the holder of the patent has issued a license to someone else to use their patented idea. Licenses are usually issued with contracts that specify the licensee must pay a portion of their profits back to the person who registered the patent.

Patents will grant legal rights to the inventor only in the jurisdiction where the patent is registered. ie: a Brazilian patent does not give any legal rights to the inventor in Europe, North America, or Asia. Nor does it grant him rights in other South American countries. In order to get patent protection in Venezuela, the inventor would need to register his patent in Venezuela.

So the patent is only a legal registration where the inventor registers his right to take legal actions against anyone who uses the idea he patents commercially. And anyone who wants to read the details of how the inventor's concept can simply look up the patent and read the text, and look at the pictures. Anyone in the world is free to use these ideas in his shop to tinker and experiment, as long as they don't use this idea for commercial purposes in the country where the patent is registered.

An alternative to patenting an idea is to keep the idea as a trade secret. If the inventor does not patent his idea, then nobody will read the details or reproduce it in his own shop unless he discovered the same idea on his own. Trade secrets are often used because they dont require that the inventor disclose his idea for all the world to see, and they do not incur large legal fees to get the idea registered.

Aside from the legal ramifications, we are talking about a circuit design that the inventor probably does not want made public. If Esteban is a relative of the inventor, wouldn't it seem natural for him to want to respect his relative/friend's wish to keep his ideas and work private?

If I helped a friend with a series of projects, and I asked him not to reveal the details of the projects, then I would not feel good about my friend if I discovered he posted all the details on an internet forum. I see no reason to pressure Esteban to publish the circuitry under these circumstances, as it appears Alonso is the person to ask if you must have this circuit. Better yet, if he patented the circuitry, why not simply read his patent and see how it works there?

My experience in this forum is Esteban has provided more circuit details of obscure circuitry from present and antique devices than anyone else. Has anyone else shown as much detail where we can experiment for ourselves and tinker with circuits that he posts? Esteban has has shown component values and modifications he made with performance results of his field tests. The only time I have seen Esteban refuse to post details is in connection with proprietary technology that he does not own or have permission to disclose. If you think about it, nobody else has come close to his dedication to helping experimenters in the remote sensing section except perhaps Geo, or maybe Ivconic, for the short time he posted here.

And while we're on the subject, a big thank you to Esteban for his years of unrelenting service to the experimenters in this forum.

Best wishes,
J_P

[michael]

Hi to all especially to Morgan and Esteban.
first of all, Morgan, thank you for your humbly helps and sharing info here.
Dear Esteban, Please do this big favor and let to others have the schematic. like you did before in Zahori. let to Morgan put it here
as he observes and commits the moral rules. I'm sure other nice electronic experts here like Ivconic will do better things on it to promote it, this is a real corporation. and beneficial for all like as yourself. share us in your happiness.
and be shared in our future happiness. surely all people will be grateful and never forget your favor as happened before about Zahori.

[Qiaozhi]

Yes ozzy, I want to see you implore, beg on your knees for a working LRL schematic and shout it out loud: 'Please, someone, anyone hand me a working LRL schematic, I just can't wait longer in desperation banging my head on the wall everyday!!":lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol:
:shrug: Actually, going by past experience with the Remote Sensing Forum, I'm not expecting to ever receive anything useful here. However, this device recently posted by Morgan is an interesting gizmo. It would be a shame if we couldn't discover the "idea" behind its supposed method of operation.

[Morgan]

Because only small part of another ferrite has coil. In the first pistol (red of avatar) was 2 ferrites and coil only a portion of another ferrite. As Alonso has many variation and invention each day (he, he!!!) is difficult to know if there are important changes.
Some pictures of this circuits

[Qiaozhi]

Some parameters

This device is sensitive for interference in the cities. Strong sparks causes false alarms. Good for inland.
F in coil = 62kHz.
Morgan stated that the coil is from a Garrett Groundhog, which is a VLF/TR. If I remember correctly, this is a 15kHz machine. Is this still being used as an induction balance coil? With the other (ferrite rod based) oscillator tuned to the same frequency, it appears to be more like a BFO.

[Morgan]

I'm having some trouble deciding whereabouts the 6 boards are in this device.
Please see attached image. Am I correct?
Hello
After take note of all electronic components,i get this conclusion:
Its dificult to build a replica of this device because of two ferrit and antenna,but anyway i will try to make one for me...
I would like to share schematic with people here,and i think maybe someone here increase performance.I´m afraid to be acused to put public a registrated patent.Maybe i can put only elect.circuitry and not info about antenna and ferrit...
I make more tests with this device and it beeps also in old aluminium cokacola can at 5m,40cm deep,unfortunly not only GOLD...:nono:

[Fred]

Hi J_player,
All OK .


If I helped a friend with a series of projects, and I asked him not to reveal the details of the projects, then I would not feel good about my friend if I discovered he posted all the details on an internet forum. I see no reason to pressure Esteban to publish the circuitry under these circumstances, as it appears Alonso is the person to ask if you must have this circuit. Better yet, if he patented the circuitry, why not simply read his patent and see how it works there?

For the first time i see an interesting "LRL" circuit here.The construction is obviously genuine, unlike in other devices.Knowing more about it i could understand better all those pictures showing guys in Brazil with coins and pistols MD in their hands.So i am really interested by the principles, (not necessarily by the diagram), and everything that could help to decide Esteban , not to publish the circuit, but to authorize other to do it, seem logical to me :).
I obviously 100% respect his decision , i am sure he understand this is nothing personnal ,but real information about LRL has been scarce here, and he is one of the few that has provided some true information.

Thanks to Morgan for his efforts and the new pics.Força Esteban! :)
Regards!,
Fred.

[Morgan]

Hi J_player,
All OK .



For the first time i see an interesting "LRL" circuit here.The construction is obviously genuine, unlike in other devices.Knowing more about it i could understand better all those pictures showing guys in Brazil with coins and pistols MD in their hands.So i am really interested by the principles, (not necessarily by the diagram), and everything that could help to decide Esteban , not to publish the circuit, but to authorize other to do it, seem logical to me :).
I obviously 100% respect his decision , i am sure he understand this is nothing personnal ,but real information about LRL has been scarce here, and he is one of the few that has provided some true information.

Thanks to Morgan for his efforts and the new pics.Força Esteban! :)
Regards!,
Fred.
Hello
Yes,i hope Esteban decide something about publish schematic...
I try this device in my field test and get clear signal on medal buried 20 years ago,3m distance the first beeps,1m distance the last beeps,until stop,and than needs adjustment again, its dificult to pinpoint, but i find easy way to pinpoit.Once i get the signal and direction i turn the antenna to ground and walk until get the beeps again

[Qiaozhi]

Hello
After take note of all electronic components,i get this conclusion:
Its dificult to build a replica of this device because of two ferrit and antenna,but anyway i will try to make one for me...
I would like to share schematic with people here,and i think maybe someone here increase performance.I´m afraid to be acused to put public a registrated patent.Maybe i can put only elect.circuitry and not info about antenna and ferrit...
I make more tests with this device and it beeps also in old aluminium cokacola can at 5m,40cm deep,unfortunly not only GOLD...:nono:
Hello
Yes,i hope Esteban decide something about publish schematic...
I try this device in my field test and get clear signal on medal buried 20 years ago,3m distance the first beeps,1m distance the last beeps,until stop,and than needs adjustment again, its dificult to pinpoint, but i find easy way to pinpoit.Once i get the signal and direction i turn the antenna to ground and walk until get the beeps again.
Hi Morgan,

Are you planning to publish the schematic? First you said you would like to share the schematic, so that we can help improve the performance. Then you implied that you're waiting for Esteban to publish it. Now I confused...

In fact, I'm not going to be heartbroken if you don't publish it, even though you won't be infringing any patents if you do. As Fred said earlier, we are only really interested in the underlying principle. For example, with the coil arrangement as shown, this looks more like a compact (handheld) version of a two-box detector. A similar setup is shown in Charles Rakes' book (Balanced-Amplifier Locator) on page 101. This circuit uses an air-cored coil for the TX and a ferrite core for the RX. But, in the pistol detector, it looks more like a BFO, with the preset tuning performed by adjusting the gap between the two ferrite rods.
I don't doubt that this pistol detector works like a conventional detector, but whether it can detect anything at a great distance is another story.

[Morgan]

Hello
Its a question of some respect for people who work in this project for some decades,and i´m sure Esteban its envolved on this pistoldetektor technology.Anyway this is only the begining of the iceberg,he will teach to us the underlying principle of this device...

[J_Player]

I would like to share schematic with people here,and i think maybe someone here increase performance.I´m afraid to be acused to put public a registrated patent.Maybe i can put only elect.circuitry and not info about antenna and ferrit...If the circuit for the ferrite coil has been patented, then it is already published for the public in the patent disclosure. If the schematics are already available for the public to see, then there is no reason not to show the circuit which is already available.

You will find a lot of patented circuits for metal detecting already posted in the Geotech forums if you look here: http://geotech.thunting.com/cgi-bin/pages/common/index.pl?page=metdet&file=patents.dat

As you can see, there is no problem posting circuits which are patented and shown to the world from the diagrams in the patent office.

Best wishes,
J_P

[hung]

Configuration of the ferrite coil has nothing to do and it was not made in search of inductance or permeability.
It was made for a special 'Q'.

[J_Player]

Configuration of the ferrite coil has nothing to do and it was not made in search of inductance or permeability.
It was made for a special 'Q'.Really? What special Q was the ferrite made for?
Also, if "the ferrite coil has nothing to do", then what part of the circuit does have "something to do"?

Best wishes,
J_P

[Fred]

Really? What special Q was the ferrite made for?
Also, if "the ferrite coil has nothing to do", then what part of the circuit does have "something to do"?
Nothing, its just one more sentence to bring confusion.I think hung doesn´t even know what is a Q factor, there is no such thing as a "special Q."
Esteban has participated in building the detector,and he says ferrite position is very critical.Hung says its a lie?
Fred.

[Esteban]

Ferrite is critical and with essay and error find best point. Here there are peak voltage measurable with high impedance low capacitance tester and show 7,000 V at very low current. Of course, if you touch the ferrite the voltage go very low...

This is medium distance detector, not a real long range, but...

With high quality ferrite based in a kind of graphite type maybe will be better.

We have an instrument wich measure electricity on air, static in other words, and the range of the detection and sustentation deppend of the electricity on the air. Before rain, the voltage is near 1,400 V, normal 600, 800. At 400 V in air detection present reluctance.

I don't doubt that this pistol detector works like a conventional detector, but whether it can detect anything at a great distance is another story.

OK, but now Morgan present his experience.

Qiaozhi, If you think with the logic of normal detector, you're wrong. But yes, this system of coil and other things seems a MD. Remember, infrared pass through the coil... a "small" difference.

The holder of the Groundhog is a simple receptacle.

Morgan, respect the old Coke can, I had this bad experience with aluminium wich present oxidation, great corrosion, with white dust of aluminium oxide. But, in any way, detect a Coke can at 5 m is great or not!!! :lol:

[Esteban]

J_Player,

Thank you for the comprehension and the words.

I personally can't post this schematic in public for the simple reason that in few months will be in market at US$ 200!!! :lol:

[Qiaozhi]

Ferrite is critical and with essay and error find best point. Here there are peak voltage measurable with high impedance low capacitance tester and show 7,000 V at very low current. Of course, if you touch the ferrite the voltage go very low...
I guess you really meant to say trial and error. ;) So, from what you're saying, it seems that the ferrite forms part of a high voltage generator. In your original diagram I misread the 7KV as 7.000V.

Qiaozhi, If you think with the logic of normal detector, you're wrong. But yes, this system of coil and other things seems a MD. Remember, infrared pass through the coil... a "small" difference.
The holder of the Groundhog is a simple receptacle.
Yes - you are correct. I was considering the inner workings of this detector on the basis that it was using a Groundhog coil, but it seems to be a holder for something else. How important is the infrared part of this design?
I personally can't post this schematic in public for the simple reason that in few months will be in market at US$ 200!!! :lol:
Iconos??
Anyway, doesn't matter, because at that price someone will buy it, and we'll soon have the back-engineered schematics here for everyone to see. :rolleyes:

[Max]

I guess you really meant to say trial and error. ;) So, from what you're saying, it seems that the ferrite forms part of a high voltage generator. In your original diagram I misread the 7KV as 7.000V.


Yes - you are correct. I was considering the inner workings of this detector on the basis that it was using a Groundhog coil, but it seems to be a holder for something else. How important is the infrared part of this design?

Iconos??
Anyway, doesn't matter, because at that price someone will buy it, and we'll soon have the back-engineered schematics here for everyone to see. :rolleyes:

Hi,
don't wanna be polemic... here are just some little considerations:
if you remember the Iconos MD post ... where they said that their device get a large voltage spike as proof of lrl gold detection (they used a fake pictures to show that)...

It's not first time I see here that someone (not only Esteban) claim for strong voltage spikes at target detection by LRL.

That only means nothing , of course, but then I see again a germanium diode there ? Like in Mineoro's PDC "secret part" ???

Look by yourself. Another coincidence that could mean nothing, of course.

Then again I see a double 9V battery arrangement like in Mineoro again..., that , of course, means nothing... many MDs use 2 9v batteries today. :rolleyes:

Then again I see ferrite sticks like in some older TR design for 2-boxes (but this is not 2-boxes) , that of course, means nothing again... apart some evergreen radioworks approach to LRL (like old AM radio stuff).

Then again I see IR indication... maybe an IR-led emitter who knows ? Like in some Mineoro's devices again... that means nothing of course ! :lol:

Then again a round container on front like in other "pistols", and now last but not least Iconos MD... what a coincidence again ! That means nothing.

Then again the box is made of wood... like a number of other (mostly from South America) LRL stuff. Another coincidence ! That means nothing.

What to say... to me the unit pictures show an homemade radiowork of some kind... It's clear there is a tuned oscillator for rf emission with directive antenna (ferrite sticks) and somewhere (I think) must be a receiver coil (probably a flat round coil in the garrett container on front side). Then somethign about detection... germanium diode and transistor preamp etc etc etc like in regenerative am receivers ... but then something between an IB and BFO maybe etc etc etc.

Does it work ? Maybe "yes"... with some kind of metals but at few meters maybe and few depth. Maybe not at all.

Is there any ionic detection ? I think not. Device is surely electromagnetic based so no ionic bla bla bla. In few words it's not electric-zahori.

Is there any chance to get full schematic or design ? No.

It seems like older TR stuff... with separate emitter (a box to be positioned on soil) and handheld directive receiver: okantex told us about a similar MD in a previous thread. Just this is with tx and rx in the same wood box.

Anyway, I think possible detecting that way a coke can at 5 meters in ideal conditions... but there are a lot of problems in this kind of approach.

Kind regards,
Max

[mosha]

JI personally can't post this schematic in public for the simple reason that in few months will be in market at US$ 200!!! :lol:

Esteban,

If you can make real working LRL; why you do not sell them? I'll be first to buy from you,

regards,:)

[hung]

What I meant it is that as I see it, with the present configuration the coil is going for a wider IF at the expense of inductance and better Q. Capacitance may be higher, so is voltage as Esteban explained. Detection of an aluminum can, might be an indication of a wide IF. I bet it will also detect lead too.

Assuming the drawing Esteban provided is what the coil is and although the present configuration is critical as it is, maybe another kind of winding would improve metal discrimination also reducing capacitance.
If the schematic is released then maybe a better judgement can be made.

Well this is just my opinion.

If people wants to consider it, fine. If they want to discard it, fine too. I don't care. Just wanted to contribute.

Fred: You sound upset. Don't be. Coils are my passion. I believe it's not yours.

Max: The 2 battery arrangement has nothing to do with the device in this thread. Mineoro used to employ the extra battery just for the LCD battery display. This was used up to the PDCs. AFAIK in the new generation detectors it was discarded.

[Esteban]

don't wanna be polemic... here are just some little considerations:
if you remember the Iconos MD post ... where they said that their device get a large voltage spike as proof of lrl gold detection (they used a fake pictures to show that)...

Iconos claim that occurs for few nanosecond a HV peak. But in this other detector is generated a HV.

That only means nothing , of course, but then I see again a germanium diode there ? Like in Mineoro's PDC "secret part" ???
Look by yourself. Another coincidence that could mean nothing, of course.

Germanium is useful yet in many schematics.

Then again I see a double 9V battery arrangement like in Mineoro again..., that , of course, means nothing... many MDs use 2 9v batteries today. :rolleyes:

Of course. Most of LRL detector uses separates batteries. For example –for to give you an idea– what happens if you use a battery only for the transmitter section and independent battery for the receiver and other parts of an IB MD? Don't know. But in homemade two boxes I built is better a battery for Tr and another for Rec. Is not good to use in electronic LRL circuits and only pack of battery for all the stages.

Then again I see ferrite sticks like in some older TR design for 2-boxes (but this is not 2-boxes) , that of course, means nothing again... apart some evergreen radioworks approach to LRL (like old AM radio stuff).

Here is a HV generator.

Then again I see IR indication... maybe an IR-led emitter who knows ? Like in some Mineoro's devices again... that means nothing of course ! :lol:

The use of IR in LRL pistols is previous Mineoro.

Then again a round container on front like in other "pistols", and now last but not least Iconos MD... what a coincidence again ! That means nothing.

The round form on the front is very old, not a prerrogative of anybody. Old Alonso's pistol uses the round form, but in old models separate for shielded cable to the circuit. But modernity integrates in a box, like the previous DCH and DCH 85 by Mineoro. Maybe somebody has an elegant design? A round container is a round coil.

Then again the box is made of wood... like a number of other (mostly from South America) LRL stuff. Another coincidence ! That means nothing.

Metalic container for the HV gen and general for electronic LRL detector is not ideal. I use plastic in some container and regarding sensibility of some circuits the wind causes falses alarm. In some old BFO pistols you can use metalic enclosurtes, but, of course, the search coil independent, in plastic of wood.

What to say... to me the unit pictures show an homemade radiowork of some kind... It's clear there is a tuned oscillator for rf emission with directive antenna (ferrite sticks) and somewhere (I think) must be a receiver coil (probably a flat round coil in the garrett container on front side). Then somethign about detection... germanium diode and transistor preamp etc etc etc like in regenerative am receivers ... but then something between an IB and BFO maybe etc etc etc.

Is not radio, but there are modifications of two boxes circuit that works as a BFO, but with HV in the fix oscillator.

Does it work ? Maybe "yes"... with some kind of metals but at few meters maybe and few depth. Maybe not at all.

After 20 years of personnal experimentation there are devices wich works better than others, with several working principles. I start in experimentations because I saw hundreds of successfull long range detection made by Alonso.

Is there any ionic detection ? I think not. Device is surely electromagnetic based so no ionic bla bla bla. In few words it's not electric-zahori.

Yes, is an electromagnetic device. But all these phenomenoms (maybe) are electromagnetics.

Is there any chance to get full schematic or design ? No.

From my own decission, no. If the other inventor say "yes", no problem.

It seems like older TR stuff... with separate emitter (a box to be positioned on soil) and handheld directive receiver: okantex told us about a similar MD in a previous thread. Just this is with tx and rx in the same wood box.

Anyway, I think possible detecting that way a coke can at 5 meters in ideal conditions... but there are a lot of problems in this kind of approach.

In any way, you'll detect a Coke can with all types of MD, but no at 5 m.

[Fred]

Hung,
What I meant it is that as I see it, with the present configuration the coil is going for a wider IF at the expense of inductance and better Q.
IF means Intermediate Frequency.This is a HV generator, If has nothing to do with IF.
Assuming the drawing Esteban provided is what the coil is and although the present configuration is critical as it is,...
Do you know or not the circuit?
Fred: You sound upset. Don't be. Coils are my passion. I believe it's not yours.
I´m not upset.Electronics is my passion.And my profession.I believe its not yours.
When you make your posts you just retrieve some tecnhical information from the net,and you mix it with your own (desired) results,then you present this as a fact.

Esteban,thank you for explanations.There is so much yet to be understood :)

Regards,
Fred.

[hung]

Hung,

IF means Intermediate Frequency.This is a HV generator, If has nothing to do with IF.


Really?

[Fred]

Really?
Yes.Really.Now you know.

[hung]

Yes.Really.Now you know.

No.
You think you know.
Your time is up fred.

[Esteban]

Esteban,

If you can make real working LRL; why you do not sell them? I'll be first to buy from you,

regards,:)

Have not interest for to sell. Also I built classic MD, but only for me, and also don't sell these.

[Morgan]

Esteban,

If you can make real working LRL; why you do not sell them? I'll be first to buy from you,

regards,:)
Hello
You must understand something...
People who have LRL who realy works,no need to sell this technology to others,also no need other people on their territory using the same LRL devices,so Esteban and his team dedicate entire life to sucessful treasure hunting.
If he start sell this devices to others,maybe they will grow more than him.
Remember,Alonso make both,the GIZMO(for crazy and lunatic people)and as i presume,the LRL who works(for closed friends)for other people. This conclusion is based on the fact,of my friend the ouner of this device is Alonso friend and help him a lot.

Kind Regards

[Morgan]

Have not interest for to sell. Also I built classic MD, but only for me, and also don't sell these.
Hello Esteban

Sorry for this but i decide to put schematic here. I will put only the 6 circuits.
The Antenna and Ferrit i promise say nothing about this.I know Alonso will be mad if i put all this technology to forum.Dont worry.
I´m sure people here will ask you many questions about Ferrit and Antenna enigmas...You can help them or not...

Best regards

[Esteban]

Morgan...

... is your decision!!!

[Esteban]

Yes - you are correct. I was considering the inner workings of this detector on the basis that it was using a Groundhog coil, but it seems to be a holder for something else. How important is the infrared part of this design?

Iconos??
Anyway, doesn't matter, because at that price someone will buy it, and we'll soon have the back-engineered schematics here for everyone to see. :rolleyes:

IR is a way in wich "travel" the "phenomenon".

Regarding price, deppend in wich country is manufactured. Remember, for example, in China you can buy many things at very low price!!! :lol:

[Fred]

IR is a way in wich "travel" the "phenomenon"

Esteban, do you mean that IR for example "dry" the air so the device can work,or the HV doesn´t leak?
Fred.

[Morgan]

Morgan...

... is your decision!!!
LRL Pistoldetektor circuit 13673

3674

[Morgan]

Morgan...

... is your decision!!!
circuit 2 component list

[Morgan]

Morgan...

... is your decision!!!
1&23676

3677

[Morgan]

Morgan...

... is your decision!!!
7 cables+shielded cable to antenna3678

3679

[Esteban]

Esteban, do you mean that IR for example "dry" the air so the device can work,or the HV doesn´t leak?
Fred.

More easy for a coil access the phenomenon through the IR. IR warms the air (this is the way)...

[hung]

More easy for a coil access the phenomenon through the IR. IR warms the air (this is the way)...

Esteban, I think the IR work in conjunction with the IF wide bandwidth of the coil as a receving enhancer. I think I know what he had in mind. I still think that with another winding configuration for the coil there could be an improvement. I have several oscilator circuits at disposal which I could include the timer and try using another winding configuration. Do you allow me to do that if I have time?

Also I think I may know where this patent is.

Regards.

[Qiaozhi]

More easy for a coil access the phenomenon through the IR. IR warms the air (this is the way)...
Hi Esteban,

Are you saying that this device will not work as a medium range locator if the IR circuit is not included?

[michael]

Morgan and Esteban, Thank you for your big,great job to let us have the schematic.
Morgan, man! now you did this favor, why don't do as in best way?
fulfill your favor, I'm really unfamiliar to this language, what's the reason not put in English? please take a way people like me, can use it.
another thing; all these consist all the details of circuits? on the other hand is exact what you made and got satisfying results?

[Qiaozhi]

Morgan and Esteban, Thank you for your big,great job to let us have the schematic.
Morgan, man! now you did this favor, why don't do as in best way?
fulfill your favor, I'm really unfamiliar to this language, what's the reason not put in English? please take a way people like me, can use it.
another thing; all these consist all the details of circuits? on the other hand is exact what you made and got satisfying results?
Be patient. ;) Morgan has only posted 2 of the 6 circuits so far. Perhaps, after that, we can get a translation.
Anyway, all the resistor values are missing. :frown:

[Morgan]

Be patient. ;) Morgan has only posted 2 of the 6 circuits so far. Perhaps, after that, we can get a translation.
Anyway, all the resistor values are missing. :frown:
Note: In circuit 2,R13 yelow,violet,brown,golden.
Sorry for bad quality schematics.3682

[Morgan]

Be patient. ;) Morgan has only posted 2 of the 6 circuits so far. Perhaps, after that, we can get a translation.
Anyway, all the resistor values are missing. :frown:
3683

[Morgan]

3684Morgan and Esteban, Thank you for your big,great job to let us have the schematic.
Morgan, man! now you did this favor, why don't do as in best way?
fulfill your favor, I'm really unfamiliar to this language, what's the reason not put in English? please take a way people like me, can use it.
another thing; all these consist all the details of circuits? on the other hand is exact what you made and got satisfying results?

[Morgan]

3685Morgan and Esteban, Thank you for your big,great job to let us have the schematic.
Morgan, man! now you did this favor, why don't do as in best way?
fulfill your favor, I'm really unfamiliar to this language, what's the reason not put in English? please take a way people like me, can use it.
another thing; all these consist all the details of circuits? on the other hand is exact what you made and got satisfying results?

[Morgan]

3686Morgan and Esteban, Thank you for your big,great job to let us have the schematic.
Morgan, man! now you did this favor, why don't do as in best way?
fulfill your favor, I'm really unfamiliar to this language, what's the reason not put in English? please take a way people like me, can use it.
another thing; all these consist all the details of circuits? on the other hand is exact what you made and got satisfying results?

[Morgan]

3687Morgan and Esteban, Thank you for your big,great job to let us have the schematic.
Morgan, man! now you did this favor, why don't do as in best way?
fulfill your favor, I'm really unfamiliar to this language, what's the reason not put in English? please take a way people like me, can use it.
another thing; all these consist all the details of circuits? on the other hand is exact what you made and got satisfying results?

[Qiaozhi]

Note: In circuit 2,R13 yelow,violet,brown,golden.
Sorry for bad quality schematics.3682
Hi Morgan,

Thanks - so that's what it means. :cool:
R13 = 470 ohms, 5% tolerance.

Now - with circuit #2:
R2 = 82k, R3 = 27k, R5 = 12k, etc.
But - R1 has 5 colours (not including gold, which is the tolerance) and R4 only has 2 colours. Please can you recheck these? Either 3 or 4 bands + tolerance is normal.

[Morgan]

3688Morgan and Esteban, Thank you for your big,great job to let us have the schematic.
Morgan, man! now you did this favor, why don't do as in best way?
fulfill your favor, I'm really unfamiliar to this language, what's the reason not put in English? please take a way people like me, can use it.
another thing; all these consist all the details of circuits? on the other hand is exact what you made and got satisfying results?

[Morgan]

3689Morgan and Esteban, Thank you for your big,great job to let us have the schematic.
Morgan, man! now you did this favor, why don't do as in best way?
fulfill your favor, I'm really unfamiliar to this language, what's the reason not put in English? please take a way people like me, can use it.
another thing; all these consist all the details of circuits? on the other hand is exact what you made and got satisfying results?

[Fred]

PCB2 values.
R4 to be confirmed.
****************
PCB nº2

C1 1nF+6n8
C2 1nf + 1n8
C3 10nF
C4 10nF
C5 10nF
R1 …. (21208) ?
R2 82k
T1 BC558
T2 BC547
C6 100uF
C7 47nF
R3 27k
C8 22nF
C9 100uF
R4 1R
C10 100nF (?)
R5 12k
D1 1N4148
R6 2k7
T3 BC558
T4 BC548
R7 150R
R8 12k
C11 3n3
R9 1k
C12 1nF
R10 1k
R11 100k
R12 12k
R13 470r
R14 22R
R15 100k
R16 8k2

********************

[Morgan]

3690

3691Morgan and Esteban, Thank you for your big,great job to let us have the schematic.
Morgan, man! now you did this favor, why don't do as in best way?
fulfill your favor, I'm really unfamiliar to this language, what's the reason not put in English? please take a way people like me, can use it.
another thing; all these consist all the details of circuits? on the other hand is exact what you made and got satisfying results?

[Fred]

PCB1

**************
C1 1000uF
C2 470uF
R1 270r
R2 1k
R3 680r
c3 1nF
c4 1nF
T1 LM317
*************

[Fred]

PCB3
******************
T1 BC558
T2 BC558
T3 BC548
T4 BC548
T5 BC548
T6 BC558
C1 47nF
C2 10nF
C3 100nF
c4 10uF
c5 47nF
C6 100uF
c7 220uF
C8 100uF
c9 100nF
R1 4k7
R2 1k
R3 10K
R4 33K
R5 2/1/2/0/9 ?
R6 1K
R7 100R
R8 4K7
R9 510r
R10 10K
R11 100K
R12 3K9
R13 2K7
R14 560R
D1/D2 z2v4 (4v8?)
D3/D4 1N ???? (4148 )
***********************

[Max]

my 5 cents

enjoy!

****************
PCB5 List
--------
C1 = 22uF 25V tantalium
C2 = 100nF 100V poly
C3 = 22nF 400V poly
C4 = 100nF 100V poly
C5 = 1nF 63V poly
C6 = 220nF 63V poly
C7 = 10nF round ceramic
C8 = 10nF round ceramic
C9 = 4700pF round ceramic
C10 = 10nF round ceramic
C11 = 100nF 100V poly

All resistors 1/4W
R1 = 470 ohm 5%
R2 = 1200 ohm 5%
R3 = 470 Kohm 5%
R4 = 12 Kohm 5%
R5 = 820 Kohm 5%
R6 = 100 Kohm 5%
R7 = 1 Mohm 5%
R8 = 10 Kohm 5%
R9 = 1 Mohm 5%
R10 = 4700 ohm 5%
R11 = 100 Kohm 5%
R12 = 220 Kohm 5%
R13 = 12 Kohm 5%
R14 = 390 Kohm 5%

D1 = germainum diode type 1N60
D2 = germanium diode type 1N60

T1 = BC548C (npn small power)
T2 = BC558C (pnp small power)
T3 = BC548B
T4 = BC548B
T5 = BC558C
T6 = BC548B

****************************

[Max]

then other 2 cents

*********************
PCB6 List
--------
P1 = (bourns mod 3386 ) value is 10 Kohm linear

T1 = BC548B
T2 = BC548C

R1 = 19 Kohm 1% 50ppm/°K
R2 = 4700 ohm 5%
R3 = 4700 ohm 5%
R4 = 390 ohm 5%
**********************

[Max]

and last cent

*************
PCB4 List
--------
(K means 10% tolerance)
C1 = 100nF 63V poly K
C1 = 22uF 25V tantalium
C3 = 10uF 35V electrolitic

R1 = 680 Kohm 5%
R2 = 1 Mohm 5%
R3 = 68 Kohm 5%
R4 = 33 Kohm 5%
R5 = 220 ohm 5%
R6 = 470 ohm 5%

T1 = BC548B
T2 = BC548C

U1 = NE555N (general purpose timer, dip8 )

*************

[detectoman]

great effort guys! morgan is hard boy,fiuuuuuuuu my congratulations, very young pattiente

hoobyst detectoman mexicouuuuuuuuuuu

[Esteban]

Esteban, I think the IR work in conjunction with the IF wide bandwidth of the coil as a receving enhancer. I think I know what he had in mind. I still think that with another winding configuration for the coil there could be an improvement. I have several oscilator circuits at disposal which I could include the timer and try using another winding configuration. Do you allow me to do that if I have time?

Also I think I may know where this patent is.

Regards.

And this unbalances the equilibrium.

[Esteban]

Hi Esteban,

Are you saying that this device will not work as a medium range locator if the IR circuit is not included?

Can work, but IR helps a lot.

[michael]

Be patient. ;) Morgan has only posted 2 of the 6 circuits so far. Perhaps, after that, we can get a translation.
Anyway, all the resistor values are missing. :frown:
OK, Man, good work, very nice. our eyes is on your abilities to translate it to a usable and brief form. now I'm somehow confused that surely some others are so.
again especial thanks for Morgan, Esteban and thanks for other diligents; Qiaozhi, Max. god bless you all for your efforts.
If all details be reflected exact right and be combined with your efforts will become a great unforgettable memento from makers.

[Morgan]

3695

3696

3697OK, Man, good work, very nice. our eyes is on your abilities to translate it to a usable and brief form. now I'm somehow confused that surely some others are so.
again especial thanks for Morgan, Esteban and thanks for other diligents; Qiaozhi, Max. god bless you all for your efforts.
If all details be reflected exact right and be combined with your efforts will become a great unforgettable memento from makers.

[Morgan]

OK, Man, good work, very nice. our eyes is on your abilities to translate it to a usable and brief form. now I'm somehow confused that surely some others are so.
again especial thanks for Morgan, Esteban and thanks for other diligents; Qiaozhi, Max. god bless you all for your efforts.
If all details be reflected exact right and be combined with your efforts will become a great unforgettable memento from makers.
Before was 1,2,3,now its 4,5,6.3698

3699

3700

[Morgan]

Hi Morgan,

Thanks - so that's what it means. :cool:
R13 = 470 ohms, 5% tolerance.

Now - with circuit #2:
R2 = 82k, R3 = 27k, R5 = 12k, etc.
But - R1 has 5 colours (not including gold, which is the tolerance) and R4 only has 2 colours. Please can you recheck these? Either 3 or 4 bands + tolerance is normal.
Important note:
R1(circuit2)
R5(circuit3)
R1(circuit6)
are the same(red,brown,red,black,white,golden)
You can see one of them in the center of this photo.3701

[Morgan]

PCB2 values.
R4 to be confirmed.
****************
PCB nº2

C1 1nF+6n8
C2 1nf + 1n8
C3 10nF
C4 10nF
C5 10nF
R1 …. (21208) ?
R2 82k
T1 BC558
T2 BC547
C6 100uF
C7 47nF
R3 27k
C8 22nF
C9 100uF
R4 1R
C10 100nF (?)
R5 12k
D1 1N4148
R6 2k7
T3 BC558
T4 BC548
R7 150R
R8 12k
C11 3n3
R9 1k
C12 1nF
R10 1k
R11 100k
R12 12k
R13 470r
R14 22R
R15 100k
R16 8k2

********************
Hello Fred,i already put some corrections about resistors in PCB 2,3,6.
Unfortunly i dont have permition to open the antenna,but i think if we have some genius here,we can build and put to work this device.
I saw carefuly the Antenna and didnt find any Infra Red,maybe its inside...

[Fred]

I hope esteban can help about the "antenna".

Here is the PCB2 reverse-engineered.It may contain errors of course.
Regards,
Fred.

[detectoman]

max, you certified me?

circuit 1 regulator
circuit 2 modulation and filters?
circuit 3 amplifier?
circuit 4 sound tac tac
circuit 5 preamplifier?
circuit 6 oscilator

apologies my bad english
hups
detectoman

[Qiaozhi]

Important note:
R1(circuit2)
R5(circuit3)
R1(circuit6)
are the same(red,brown,red,black,white,golden)
You can see one of them in the center of this photo.3701
Hi Morgan,

Please could you make an in-circuit resistance measurement of this resistor? It's probably a 2.12K resistor. This particular colour coding is unknown to me.

[Qiaozhi]

Hello Fred,i already put some corrections about resistors in PCB 2,3,6.
Unfortunly i dont have permition to open the antenna,but i think if we have some genius here,we can build and put to work this device.
I saw carefuly the Antenna and didnt find any Infra Red,maybe its inside...
Hi Morgan,

Please could you also check the connectivity of the wiring to the antenna, i.e. what is the resistance measurement between the different wires?

[Qiaozhi]

I hope esteban can help about the "antenna".

Here is the PCB2 reverse-engineered.It may contain errors of course.
Regards,
Fred.
I have completed the reverse-engineering of circuit #5, but some visitors are coming to my home today. Hopefully I can post the result in a day or two. So far I cannot see any evidence of a 7kV generator. It looks more like a receiver to me.

Morgan - one more request -> please could you also do a connectivity test on the ferrite cores. i.e. what are the resistances between the wires that go to the coils?

[hung]

And this unbalances the equilibrium.

What equilibrium?

[hung]

LRL Pistoldetektor circuit 13673

3674

Hummm...

Clue#1: Sonalarme S3 30VIC 2.8Kz transducer.

[hung]

Clue#2: Some EPCOS electrolytic capacitors.

[hung]

I saw carefuly the Antenna and didnt find any Infra Red,maybe its inside...

Maybe there isn't... And it's in fact a second regenerative coil.
Maybe... There is...

[Max]

Important note:
R1(circuit2)
R5(circuit3)
R1(circuit6)
are the same(red,brown,red,black,white,golden)
You can see one of them in the center of this photo.3701

Hi Morgan,
from what I know that color scheme have no meaning :

red,brown,red,black,white,golden

You have to recheck it cause it's maybe as this:

red,brown,red,black,gray,brown

If so , resistor values are :

2120 ohm 0.05% (tolerance) 100ppm/°K (temperature coeff.)

Kind regards,
Max

[Max]

max, you certified me?

circuit 1 regulator
circuit 2 modulation and filters?
circuit 3 amplifier?
circuit 4 sound tac tac
circuit 5 preamplifier?
circuit 6 oscilator

apologies my bad english
hups
detectoman


Hi detectoman,
we need all schematics to say better ...but that's my idea...

I think:

PCB1 = voltage regulator based on LM317 IC
PCB2 = rf mixer
PCB3 = rf preamplifier ?
PCB4 = square wave oscillator (that probably drive TX coil)
PCB5 = regenerative crystal demodulator ?
PCB6 = threshold detector and led driver

Kind regards,
Max

[Max]

Hi,
this is pcb1 schematic and my calculation gives exactly 9volts output for it: so at middle of battery voltage when they are at full charge.

So know we know that circuit works at 9V stabilized supply.

Kind regards,
Max

[Fred]

Here:
http://www.samengstrom.com/nxl/10116/5_band_resistor_color_code_page.en.html
Imputing the code gives a value of 212 R./ 0.25%
Fred

[Esteban]

Maybe there isn't... And it's in fact a second regenerative coil.
Maybe... There is...

I speak with Alonso and he told me there are IR, maybe not in it, maybe in other variation/modification of same pistol. For the same reason old PDCs don't have IR and other modern PDC contain this.

In few time I'll have access the schematic.

About equilibrium, this is the adjustment in the best sensibility point capable to be dislocate for the signal received by the IR.

[Morgan]

Hi Morgan,

Please could you also check the connectivity of the wiring to the antenna, i.e. what is the resistance measurement between the different wires?
Hello
I take out resistor and the measurement 18.09 (using 20kohm),so its something like 18k or 19k.
I hope we discover all electronic mistery aroud this device...

[Morgan]

Hi Morgan,

Please could you also check the connectivity of the wiring to the antenna, i.e. what is the resistance measurement between the different wires?
Hello
This is more complicate because for acurate measurements i must take out all the 7 cables who goes to antenna,i already glued all the circuits into wood box...
We will see,i will do this if Esteban cant help us with the Directional Antenna.

Kind regards

[Morgan]

Hello
Its 18k or 19k

Kind regards

[detectoman]

max:?

circuit 1 regulator
circuit 2 modulation and filters?
circuit 3 amplifier?
circuit 4 sound bip bip ( correction ) may be i am novicie'
circuit 5 preamplifier?
circuit 6 oscilator (these early oscilator basif) for coil, tipe ch. rakes ha, may be

detectionman

[hung]

I speak with Alonso and he told me there are IR, maybe not in it, maybe in other variation/modification of same pistol. For the same reason old PDCs don't have IR and other modern PDC contain this.

Exactly. This one apparently ain't got one.
Thanks for your answer Esteban.
I already have my conclusions.



About equilibrium, this is the adjustment in the best sensibility point capable to be dislocate for the signal received by the IR.


As this may not have any IR, it's serving as a low Q and low induction receiver coil to match the front loop. It's working on the relative near field instead of a mid distance or far field.

[Qiaozhi]

Hi Morgan,
from what I know that color scheme have no meaning :

red,brown,red,black,white,golden

You have to recheck it cause it's maybe as this:

red,brown,red,black,gray,brown

If so , resistor values are :

2120 ohm 0.05% (tolerance) 100ppm/°K (temperature coeff.)

Kind regards,
Max
This resistor coding seems to be a mystery. Personally I would have thought it was 2.12k as well, although Fred showed that it may be 212 ohms.
Now Morgan has removed and measured it - and it's 18K. :shocked:
Perhaps the colours have been misread.

[Morgan]

this resistor its grey,and the colours -brown,white,black,red,brown,red...one of brown colours looks to me gold ,but its brown,sorry...
The measurment is 18.09k

[Qiaozhi]

this resistor its grey,and the colours -brown,white,black,red,brown,red...one of brown colours looks to me gold ,but its brown,sorry...
The measurment is 18.09k
Thanks!
In that case it's a 19K 1% resistor.

[Fred]

So its 6 colours!
Now its different,read backwards, using the calculator:
http://www.samengstrom.com/nxl/2020/6_band_resistor_color_code_page.en.html

It give 19 k 50PPM/ºC
Now that´s a high precision resistor,you should be able to calibrate your tester with it! :)
Fred.

[Max]

Hello
I take out resistor and the measurement 18.09 (using 20kohm),so its something like 18k or 19k.
I hope we discover all electronic mistery aroud this device...

Hi,
I think the puzzle of resistor is cause we read it at reverse:

red,brown,red,black,gray,brown

I think now it could be :

brown, gray, black, red, brown, red

That means:

18000 ohm (like you measured) 1% (tolerance) 50ppm/°K

What do you think ?

Kind regards,
Max

[Max]

So its 6 colours!
Now its different,read backwards, using the calculator:
http://www.samengstrom.com/nxl/2020/6_band_resistor_color_code_page.en.html

It give 19 k 50PPM/ºC
Now that´s a high precision resistor,you should be able to calibrate your tester with it! :)
Fred.

Hi,
I think it's 18K cause if it's 1% (as probably is) the multimeter cannot read more or less than 18K +- 180ohm, so from 17820 to 18180 ohm:
he reads a few above 18K (18.09K, so just about 90 ohm more) so it must be 18K.

Kind regards,
Max

[Qiaozhi]

Hi,
I think the puzzle of resistor is cause we read it at reverse:

red,brown,red,black,gray,brown

I think now it could be :

brown, gray, black, red, brown, red

That means:

18000 ohm (like you measured) 1% (tolerance) 50ppm/°K

What do you think ?

Kind regards,
Max
According to the colours given by Morgan, it's a 19k resistor. Where did you get the gray from?

[Max]

According to the colours given by Morgan, it's a 19k resistor. Where did you get the gray from?

Hi,
I suppose it's gray cause of value he measured... it's easy confusing gray with white on some kind of resistors ... colors can be not well defined or external protecting laquer can alter shine of bands.

He measured 18.09K... so if resistor is really 1% tolerance it must be 18K nominal... otherwise the multimeter read a wrong value.

Kind regards,
Max

[Fred]

Yes Max,you are probably right :18 K if it´s grey.
But in that case Morgan have to confirm if it´s grey,or white.Can be the multimeter too,or the hands :).
Fred.

[Max]

Yes Max,you are probably right :18 K if it´s grey.
But in that case Morgan have to confirm if it´s grey,or white.Can be the multimeter too,or the hands :).
Fred.

Hi,
yes, true, I supposed he measured resistor without touching both leads with fingers... so just resistor value and not parallel with his body resistance. :rolleyes:

But I think he did right measure.

Kind regards,
Max

[Esteban]

brown,white,black,red,brown,red...

19020 ohm 2%

[Max]

brown,white,black,red,brown,red...

19020 ohm 2%

Hi,
??? which code is it ? I don't know of any code that uses 5 bands just for value of resistance.

6 bands code I know is different:

first 3 bands are first 3 digits
4th band is multiplier
5th is tolerance
6th is temperature coeff. (ppm/°K) (that's optional band and is not present in 5 bands resistances color code ... they have just tolerance indicated)

for me it's 18K cause probably white... is actually grey.

Am I wrong ?

Kind regards,
Max

[Esteban]

I have resistors with the 5th band red and another orange. I pressume:

fifth band brown = 1% (of course, all know it)

fifth band red = 2%

fifth band orange = 3%

But for me isn't important here 18 or 19 K. This resistor maybe was used because is in "stock".

[Fred]

I have resistors with the 5th band red and another orange. I pressume:

fifth band brown = 1% (of course, all know it)

fifth band red = 2%

fifth band orange = 3%

But for me isn't important here 18 or 19 K. This resistor maybe was used because is in "stock".

That must be really a mess as you never know from wich side of the resistor to begin.

[Fred]

PCB4

[Fred]

PCB6
73! :lol:

[Morgan]

Yes Max,you are probably right :18 K if it´s grey.
But in that case Morgan have to confirm if it´s grey,or white.Can be the multimeter too,or the hands :).
Fred.
hello
the colour is white,not grey.
I´m more worry with antenna and ferrite,why a simple resistor is so important...
This device works,and it will be very good if Esteban help us to build antenna,because i can´t dismantle this one...

Kind regards

[Fred]

Hi Morgan,
On PCB3 , lower left corner, i need to know transistors
numbers,and the component in // with R11.
Regards,
Fred.

[Morgan]

Hi Morgan,
On PCB3 , lower left corner, i need to know transistors
numbers,and the component in // with R11.
Regards,
Fred.
Sorry for some mystakes...
TR5-CBC548B
TR6-BC558C3708

[Morgan]

3709Hi Morgan,
On PCB3 , lower left corner, i need to know transistors
numbers,and the component in // with R11.
Regards,
Fred.

[Qiaozhi]

Here's circuit #5 - the one that connects to the ferrites.

Morgan - Please can you double-check the component values, and in particular the component names. Your original diagram is difficult to read, and therefore some of the names (e.g. C3, C11, etc.) may be swapped over.

The RED and BLACK wires are most likely the power supply lines, but where does YELLOW go to?
Also, does anyone have any ideas about the correct connections for the ferrite coils? Morgan - if you can shed any light on this question, that would be great.

[Morgan]

3710

3711

3713Hi Morgan,
On PCB3 , lower left corner, i need to know transistors
numbers,and the component in // with R11.
Regards,
Fred.

[Morgan]

3715

3716

3717Here's circuit #5 - the one that connects to the ferrites.

Morgan - Please can you double-check the component values, and in particular the component names. Your original diagram is difficult to read, and therefore some of the names (e.g. C3, C11, etc.) may be swapped over.

The RED and BLACK wires are most likely the power supply lines, but where does YELLOW go to?
Also, does anyone have any ideas about the correct connections for the ferrite coils? Morgan - if you can shed any light on this question, that would be great.

[Morgan]

Here's circuit #5 - the one that connects to the ferrites.

Morgan - Please can you double-check the component values, and in particular the component names. Your original diagram is difficult to read, and therefore some of the names (e.g. C3, C11, etc.) may be swapped over.

The RED and BLACK wires are most likely the power supply lines, but where does YELLOW go to?
Also, does anyone have any ideas about the correct connections for the ferrite coils? Morgan - if you can shed any light on this question, that would be great.
Hello
The circuit 5,yellow wire connect with bar 2c.
The cicuit 5, black´D` wire connect with bar 2G.
The circuit 5,red wire connect with switch on-off,sensitivity.

[Fred]

Corrected!

[Fred]

Here's circuit #5 - the one that connects to the ferrites.
Also, does anyone have any ideas about the correct connections for the ferrite coils? Morgan - if you can shed any light on this question, that would be great.
Hi Qiaozhi,
I missed your post.
This looks for sure like a simple DC receiver.So the gap could be making the frequency tunning, but as it is not a HV generator, i dont know if we can believe the gap story.
regards,
Fred.

[Morgan]

Here's circuit #5 - the one that connects to the ferrites.

Morgan - Please can you double-check the component values, and in particular the component names. Your original diagram is difficult to read, and therefore some of the names (e.g. C3, C11, etc.) may be swapped over.

The RED and BLACK wires are most likely the power supply lines, but where does YELLOW go to?
Also, does anyone have any ideas about the correct connections for the ferrite coils? Morgan - if you can shed any light on this question, that would be great.
Fortunly,Esteban say will have this Pistoldetektor schematic very soon:thumb:

[Geo]

Hi Morgan.:)...Max.:)....Qiaozi:).
Thanks, very good work. Congratulation:)
But we need and the rest.......... The head.
What is inside the head (mayby 2 coils..... how many turns??? )
How many turns are on the ferrite???
Without the head we can't do anything.
Regards:)

[michael]

Yes, Really especial thanks to Morgan, Max, Qiaozhi and Fred.
our eyes is on your hands and efforts. god bless you.
Geo is right, Morgan, man, how about the search-head?
how about the ferrite turns?
please fellows, gather all these data in summarized workable type schematic.
I think if this works well, will become a memento for this forum or at least
in LRL subject.
it will remember one team; Esteban, Morgan, Max, Qiaozhi and Fred.
BTW; where is Ivconic, this great EE man? why isn't desired to interfere here?
I never forget his golden alterations in Zahori. when every time I and my team partners hear Zahori name, remembers us Esteban & Ivconic.

[roberts]

? This supposed to work??? This supposed to locate gold and stuff at long ranges??? Ha,ha,ha,ha!:lol::lol::lol:
This will NEVER locate nothing but various interferences! Trust me.:nono:
Not only that it is absolute bogus device, but i never saw such untidy hand made in my life! Horror! Like 8 year old kid played with it.:D
People!People! Please return some common sences! Once for all! Those "toys" and simillar BOGUS device WILL NEVER WORK! You only wasting your time!
What a funny place to be!!!? This forum!!! Bravo Carl!!:D

[Max]

? This supposed to work??? This supposed to locate gold and stuff at long ranges??? Ha,ha,ha,ha!:lol::lol::lol:
This will NEVER locate nothing but various interferences! Trust me.:nono:
Not only that it is absolute bogus device, but i never saw such untidy hand made in my life! Horror! Like 8 year old kid played with it.:D
People!People! Please return some common sences! Once for all! Those "toys" and simillar BOGUS device WILL NEVER WORK! You only wasting your time!
What a funny place to be!!!? This forum!!! Bravo Carl!!:D

Hi,
you are right being skeptic, I'm too... but Morgan is doing a good work with reverse engineering of device and also he reported detection of aluminium can (not just gold) that would be interesting to investigate.

Also, if this device is truly an Alonso's design I think all here have some curiosity about...cause of a number of threads reporting about him... and then circuit is really simple... can be replicated on one single PCB, stuff is easy apart some few resistors with higher precision required... but then I think anyone could mount one just using some components from e.g. old radio and see if it works or not.

It's waste of time !? Probably yes... who knows ?

And if it isn't so ? What if it can really detect some coke can e.g. at 1-2 meters away or more ? Then, I think could be really interesting stuff, at least for me.

In any case it's just another electronic project to have some fun with in snowy/rainy days here... bad weather requires some new project !:lol:

The difference between this and other cases is that we can reverse engineer it with Morgan's informations and study circuit and guess principle of operation , if any. Interesting I think if at the end we'll discover there's something in the background that need further investigations.

I think we have to leave out prejudices this time, and, as with zahori circuits, test it to know if it works and how... and what can really do:

- can it find just rf noise and sparks ?
- can it detect metals in some way ? if so, at which distance ? limitations ? etc

Do you understand my point of view ? I've already considered that could be a total waste of time... but don't worry about that at now... cause have some spare these days.

Kind regards,
Max

[Max]

Corrected!

Hi Fred,
very nice work... now we know detectoman was right about this PCB. It's audio section... so have nothing to do with transmitter part.

Kind regards,
Max

[Qiaozhi]

? This supposed to work??? This supposed to locate gold and stuff at long ranges??? Ha,ha,ha,ha!:lol::lol::lol:
This will NEVER locate nothing but various interferences! Trust me.:nono:
Not only that it is absolute bogus device, but i never saw such untidy hand made in my life! Horror! Like 8 year old kid played with it.:D
People!People! Please return some common sences! Once for all! Those "toys" and simillar BOGUS device WILL NEVER WORK! You only wasting your time!
What a funny place to be!!!? This forum!!! Bravo Carl!!:D
Hi Roberts,

The process we are going through is called "due diligence!. ;)
At the moment we cannot rule out this device as BOGUS, unless we test it ourselves. For me, it's more of a interesting reverse-engineering exercise. No doubt this device does something - interference locator? - but we need to check this ourselves. Even at this stage we can see that we've been fed some misleading information. For example - where is this 7KV generator? Circuit #5 appears to be some sort of DC receiver. And where is the IR circuit? So far it's starting to look like a more sophisticated version of the Gold Gun.

You should be behind us in this exercise. :D This project is the closest we have ever come to "understanding" these LRL claims. Although, to be fair, this is claimed to be a medium-range device.
Don't forget - we're also skeptics!

[Max]

PCB6
73! :lol:

Hi,
Ok... this seems really clear too.

It's threshold detector and led driver part as I guessed.

So if color is white we know now that it's 19K... then I think that resistor is that way (precision and low ppm/°K coeff) cause have to mantain threshold level at a knowing setting (turn) of trimpot (maybe to ease tuning of the circuit).

Also I strongly think that the low temp. coeff. is required to avoid thermal variations of threshold level (so have sense to me).

PS: from what I see it's kind of low battery alarm.

Kind regards,
Max

[roberts]

O.K. Both of you are right, Morgan did a job - it is true.
But i dont need to build it, to see it is bogus. For what, the world, i have my ee degrees??? For what i spend so many years in this bussiness???
It is to simple device to have any doubts in its accuracy. It is bogus, period.
But it is your choice, buil it if you want. God bless your good will!

[putrechigi]

Hi Morgan.:)...Max.:)....Qiaozi:).
Thanks, very good work. Congratulation:)
But we need and the rest.......... The head.
What is inside the head (mayby 2 coils..... how many turns??? )
How many turns are on the ferrite???
Without the head we can't do anything.
Regards:)


HI geo Learn from morgan to be serious!!!

Without malice Happy Christmas to all

[putrechigi]

Hi,
this is pcb1 schematic and my calculation gives exactly 9volts output for it: so at middle of battery voltage when they are at full charge.

So know we know that circuit works at 9V stabilized supply.

Kind regards,
Max


Hello everyone (max) someone could summarize all schemes with a more graphic 'clear and understandable (as in this figure) who is not' electronic guru thanks and happy holidays

[putrechigi]

Hi,
this is pcb1 schematic and my calculation gives exactly 9volts output for it: so at middle of battery voltage when they are at full charge.

So know we know that circuit works at 9V stabilized supply.

Kind regards,
Max


Hello everyone (max) someone could summarize all schemes with a more graphic 'clear and understandable (as in this figure) who is not' electronic guru thanks and happy holidays

[Qiaozhi]

Unless I'm mistaken, no-one has yet reverse-engineered Circuit #3.
Is anyone in the process of doing this?

So far, here's what I think we have:

1. Regulated power supply.
2. TR circuit for front-mounted coil.
3. - TBC -
4. Audio stage.
5. Receiver circuit connected to ferrites.
6. LED driver.

Once we have Circuit #3, then we can construct a block diagram showing the interconnecting wires ... and , by the way, can we do this in English?
After that we can fill in the detail, and start construction.

[Esteban]

Morgan and Esteban, Thank you for your big,great job to let us have the schematic.
Morgan, man! now you did this favor, why don't do as in best way?
fulfill your favor, I'm really unfamiliar to this language, what's the reason not put in English? please take a way people like me, can use it.
another thing; all these consist all the details of circuits? on the other hand is exact what you made and got satisfying results?

For my part, thanks, but Morgan is who do the "job", not me.

[Esteban]

Hi Roberts,

The process we are going through is called "due diligence!. ;)
At the moment we cannot rule out this device as BOGUS, unless we test it ourselves. For me, it's more of a interesting reverse-engineering exercise. No doubt this device does something - interference locator? - but we need to check this ourselves. Even at this stage we can see that we've been fed some misleading information. For example - where is this 7KV generator? Circuit #5 appears to be some sort of DC receiver. And where is the IR circuit? So far it's starting to look like a more sophisticated version of the Gold Gun.

You should be behind us in this exercise. :D This project is the closest we have ever come to "understanding" these LRL claims. Although, to be fair, this is claimed to be a medium-range device.
Don't forget - we're also skeptics!

Interference locator? Any detector can catch interference and produce it. Wich is your real point? Bogus? Isn't here 7 Kv generator? Where is the IR? Can exist modification of this pistol posted by Morgan? More sophisticated version of Gold Gun? As I see nobody believe in the Morgan's experience.

[Fred]

Hi Roberts,
Don't forget - we're also skeptics!
Absolutely.Skeptics, but with an open mind.

Hi,
Ok... this seems really clear too.
It's threshold detector and led driver part as I guessed.
So if color is white we know now that it's 19K... then I think that resistor is that way (precision and low ppm/°K coeff) cause have to mantain threshold level at a knowing setting (turn) of trimpot (maybe to ease tuning of the circuit).
Also I strongly think that the low temp. coeff. is required to avoid thermal variations of threshold level (so have sense to me).
PS: from what I see it's kind of low battery alarm.
Kind regards,
Max
Yes, battery tester with no doubt.But the 19k resistor is just here because it was at hand i believe.Almost any value work here, the adjustable pot is the weakest point here and the precision of the resistor is probably of no use-in my opinion-

O.K. Both of you are right, Morgan did a job - it is true.
But i dont need to build it, to see it is bogus.
Too soon to say.Esteban was saying there is IR inside-aparently there is not.He was saying the ferrite was for HV-aparently it is not.I dont think there is any HV in the head, unless there is a PCB inside, because the transistors are all low voltage, BC548 CE voltage is around 60V if i remember well.

Unless I'm mistaken, no-one has yet reverse-engineered Circuit #3.Is anyone in the process of doing this?

I was, but then i stopped ,missing some info and get bored :) , i wanted to finish all i could on my delta pulse-Now morgan has posted the info,i will continue later today.
What would be usefull, beside coil info, is detailed information from Morgan of the device behaviour in presence os metals.

Regards!,
Fred.

[Qiaozhi]

Interference locator? Any detector can catch interference and produce it. Wich is your real point? Bogus? Isn't here 7 Kv generator? Where is the IR? Can exist modification of this pistol posted by Morgan? More sophisticated version of Gold Gun? As I see nobody believe in the Morgan's experience.
Hi Esteban,

Please don't misunderstand. I was replying to Roberts, because he was dismissing this pistol detector out-of-hand, without any investigation. I am absolutely certain that Morgan has reported his experience in an honest fashion, and that is why I am interested to reverse-engineer this design. As I said earlier - it clearly does "something". What that "something" is, has yet to be determined by completing this project. The main reason for Morgan supplying these details at all, is that he wants to have a copy of this detector for himself. With your assistance, I think we can achieve this. :)

[Max]

Hi,
I think here we are... about boards.

Look... there could be mistakes. Also... there are "?" where things aren't clear to me... for example connection of C4 positive lead with R7 and D5... from picture of PCB seems there is connection... but maybe is better make another check; I've used dashed line there.

Same for some components value.

Sorry for the ugly schematic but have no time at now to make better.

Kind regards,
Max

[Qiaozhi]

Hi Morgan,

Do you have access to an oscilloscope or a multimeter that has a frequency range?
If so, please can you probe around on the connections that go to the front-mounted coil, and post the measurements here? I'm particularly interested in the frequency of operation.
If you have time, please can you do the same for the ferrite coils? Also, is there any evidence of a high voltage (~7KV) being generated there?

Thanks.

[detectoman]

hello guys
for my, these module,s ferrite and coil, are tipe inovated dual adaptation bfo: r.f ferrite input one discriminated balanced signal- coil plural dc low tension magnetic induction emision, ( balanced ) ( fhinished whit very filtred on capacitors) hugg
i am experience in early stuff bfo,s this like how hig sophistiqued circuit
very difficultous stabilize balance in this stuff in manner, nedded cientific man builders jajaja
i am confused for complicated circuit of diverse lines of front coil
the enormous difficulty is when balance both modules

aclaration i am novice in electronics, and english, jajajaja whitout studies, is very simplest my opinion
look these prototipe how personal experimental aplications whit sophistications
advanced little and modern mini circuits
free of ics amplifiers why?
is modern and antique jjajajajaja

apologies for my bad english hups
electronic hoobyst detectioman

[Morgan]

Absolutely.Skeptics, but with an open mind.


Yes, battery tester with no doubt.But the 19k resistor is just here because it was at hand i believe.Almost any value work here, the adjustable pot is the weakest point here and the precision of the resistor is probably of no use-in my opinion-


Too soon to say.Esteban was saying there is IR inside-aparently there is not.He was saying the ferrite was for HV-aparently it is not.I dont think there is any HV in the head, unless there is a PCB inside, because the transistors are all low voltage, BC548 CE voltage is around 60V if i remember well.



I was, but then i stopped ,missing some info and get bored :) , i wanted to finish all i could on my delta pulse-Now morgan has posted the info,i will continue later today.
What would be usefull, beside coil info, is detailed information from Morgan of the device behaviour in presence os metals.

Regards!,
Fred.
Hello

This device,not work very well in wet ground but works better in dry soil where its possible to find aluminium can 5m away and it was 40cm deep.After dig this aluminium can,i buried again and get beep only 1m away,so it happens the same with 0,5gr gold nugget,i get signal 2m away from antenna and today i buried 10cm into soil this little nugget and get signal only with antenna near the spot.So i believe in all Esteban information about energy field or eletromagnetic field around long time ago buried conductive metals...
Anyway,considering size of this antenna only 11cm diameter,with device very well adjusted,i have in air test distances superior to any MD that i know,i even cant adjust device at home,i must do it out side or it will be not sensitive because presence of metals near antenna.
Some curious test:
In air tests (using 3 position switch to normal search) reject only iron ,nail size,and its extremly sensitive to gold,much more than SD2200D!!!
Much better than russian prototipe( long range detector) who gets a lot of iron signals far away and with interferences because of power lines,with this detecktorpistol i never get iron targets when search in the fields.Unfortunly this one like very much aluminium and old batteries buried in ground maybe for some years,but he also likes GOLD!!!
So,my dear friends,even if we cant put this device working like LRL ,anyway if we put him to work as MD we have built an very sensitive device for GOLD HUNTING.And if we put biger coil,maybe we built some kind of LRL...
As i tell before,i´m a frustrating Mineoro client,i have DC2008 for sale,and i tell bad things about LRL Mineoro,i tell the true,you think this help me to sell this DC2008 device? No,but i like to tell the true about what i have experienced!!!
For all people in this forum,BELIEVE IT OR NOT,IT DOESNT MATTER FOR ME !!!
Merry Chrystmas and happy new year for everybody

[Max]

Hello

This device,not work very well in wet ground but works better in dry soil where its possible to find aluminium can 5m away and it was 40cm deep.After dig this aluminium can,i buried again and get beep only 1m away,so it happens the same with 0,5gr gold nugget,i get signal 2m away from antenna and today i buried 10cm into soil this little nugget and get signal only with antenna near the spot.So i believe in all Esteban information about energy field or eletromagnetic field around long time ago buried conductive metals...
Anyway,considering size of this antenna only 11cm diameter,with device very well adjusted,i have in air test distances superior to any MD that i know,i even cant adjust device at home,i must do it out side or it will be not sensitive because presence of metals near antenna.
Some curious test:
In air tests (using 3 position switch to normal search) reject only iron ,nail size,and its extremly sensitive to gold,much more than SD2200D!!!
Much better than russian prototipe( long range detector) who gets a lot of iron signals far away and with interferences because of power lines,with this detecktorpistol i never get iron targets when search in the fields.Unfortunly this one like very much aluminium and old batteries buried in ground maybe for some years,but he also likes GOLD!!!
So,my dear friends,even if we cant put this device working like LRL ,anyway if we put him to work as MD we have built an very sensitive device for GOLD HUNTING.And if we put biger coil,maybe we built some kind of LRL...
As i tell before,i´m a frustrating Mineoro client,i have DC2008 for sale,and i tell bad things about LRL Mineoro,i tell the true,you think this help me to sell this DC2008 device? No,but i like to tell the true about what i have experienced!!!
For all people in this forum,BELIEVE IT OR NOT,IT DOESNT MATTER FOR ME !!!
Merry Chrystmas and happy new year for everybody

Hi Morgan,
I belive your words about the aluminium can and all the rest. You have done really good work with reverse engineering of device and that's pretty cool we can see now complete schematic of its boards. We can make an idea of operations but some pieces are missed till now... expecially about coil arrangements and composition. I think that if there is really IR emitter it will be inside the round thing on top of device; I guess also there is one or more round coils there. But maybe it isn't ; personally I think high voltage generator is not present in this device cause the absence of shields show us that cannot be so: I'm sure of that. I cannot see any suitable HV generation process inside or outside device in relation to targets.

Probably device is a kind of BFO with directive transmitter and coaxial receiver ; usually BFOs aren't any good but maybe this arrangement of pistol make it find cans meters away... so well after normal BFO ranges.

But we need some more bits to get the picture and replicate the device to test ourself. I hope you'll continue posting details of device , expecially enclosed things we haven't seen till now.

Merry Christmas,
Max

[Morgan]

Hi Morgan,

Do you have access to an oscilloscope or a multimeter that has a frequency range?
If so, please can you probe around on the connections that go to the front-mounted coil, and post the measurements here? I'm particularly interested in the frequency of operation.
If you have time, please can you do the same for the ferrite coils? Also, is there any evidence of a high voltage (~7KV) being generated there?

Thanks.
Hello

Considering my very little knolenge about electronics,i make big sacrifice to put schematics here.Maybe there are some errors but i will chek everythyng carefuly before give LRL to my friend .I will meet with him during new year(he lives far away from me).
Until now i make long time ago some useless BFO detectors,from electronics magazins,some i put to work others not,so my knolenge about electronics is limited.Anyway i want to make a copy of this LRL who works,its not to produce in hig quantityes,i dont want to buy one of this,even the same,from Alonso,because i know many things,its possible to make the good and the gizmo,I already was informed during this week of other things...I receive anonymous letter from Paraguay,i dont know were they get my E-mail.
So,no problem,´FOR PEOPLE IN PARAGUAY :DONT WORRY I DIDNT OPEN THE ANTENNA OR FERRIT!!!
I´m positive about Esteban knoledge to give us some lights about This little hot antenna.

Kind regards

[Fred]

Hi Morgan,
thanks for info.
My skepticism goes to the device tecnhology explanations, not about you :)
Here goes the last circuit , PCB3.
I think there is small mistakes:
-near T4 collector a connection is probably missing, a wire maybe?
-the diode in parallel to c4/r7 etc has no reference

Thanks!
PS: i really dont see the point of the presence of R12 on thi PCB instead of PCB2....more wires for nothing?
One more thing: i think we can name the builder "Mr.Darlington" :-)

Regards.
Fred.

[Morgan]

Hi Morgan,
I belive your words about the aluminium can and all the rest. You have done really good work with reverse engineering of device and that's pretty cool we can see now complete schematic of its boards. We can make an idea of operations but some pieces are missed till now... expecially about coil arrangements and composition. I think that if there is really IR emitter it will be inside the round thing on top of device; I guess also there is one or more round coils there. But maybe it isn't ; personally I think high voltage generator is not present in this device cause the absence of shields show us that cannot be so: I'm sure of that. I cannot see any suitable HV generation process inside or outside device in relation to targets.

Probably device is a kind of BFO with directive transmitter and coaxial receiver ; usually BFOs aren't any good but maybe this arrangement of pistol make it find cans meters away... so well after normal BFO ranges.

But we need some more bits to get the picture and replicate the device to test ourself. I hope you'll continue posting details of device , expecially enclosed things we haven't seen till now.

Merry Christmas,
Max
Hello
When this device is working and detect something,its possible to ear sometimes the strange noise like when we have a AC transformer working with noise,maybe this comes from inside Antenna?...I ear some noise of vibration inside this device.
3 of the 7 wires who goes into Antenna,these 3 are for sure a search loop (Red,white,and the other named antenna in circ.2,its shielded cable,like in Faraday shied used for old BFO MD´s)
MY ADVICE : MAYBE IF THERE IS NEW MACHINES TIPE DETEKTORPISTOL FOR SALE,DONT BUY IT,MAYBE ITS MORE GIZMOS,USING THE REPORTS I MADE FOR THIS ONE WHO WORKS !!!

Kind regards

[roberts]

Hello

This device,not work very well in wet ground but works better in dry soil where its possible to find aluminium can 5m away and it was 40cm deep.After dig this aluminium can,i buried again and get beep only 1m away,so it happens the same with 0,5gr gold nugget,i get signal 2m away from antenna and today i buried 10cm into soil this little nugget and get signal only with antenna near the spot.So i believe in all Esteban information about energy field or eletromagnetic field around long time ago buried conductive metals...
Anyway,considering size of this antenna only 11cm diameter,with device very well adjusted,i have in air test distances superior to any MD that i know,i even cant adjust device at home,i must do it out side or it will be not sensitive because presence of metals near antenna.
Some curious test:
In air tests (using 3 position switch to normal search) reject only iron ,nail size,and its extremly sensitive to gold,much more than SD2200D!!!
Much better than russian prototipe( long range detector) who gets a lot of iron signals far away and with interferences because of power lines,with this detecktorpistol i never get iron targets when search in the fields.Unfortunly this one like very much aluminium and old batteries buried in ground maybe for some years,but he also likes GOLD!!!
So,my dear friends,even if we cant put this device working like LRL ,anyway if we put him to work as MD we have built an very sensitive device for GOLD HUNTING.And if we put biger coil,maybe we built some kind of LRL...
As i tell before,i´m a frustrating Mineoro client,i have DC2008 for sale,and i tell bad things about LRL Mineoro,i tell the true,you think this help me to sell this DC2008 device? No,but i like to tell the true about what i have experienced!!!
For all people in this forum,BELIEVE IT OR NOT,IT DOESNT MATTER FOR ME !!!
Merry Chrystmas and happy new year for everybody


Hey! This is in a way to much!:angry:
And dont worry, this will be my last post here. I just cant stand such nonsences any more.
I DONT BELEIVE A WORD TO YOU. SIMPLY, COSE I DO KNOW FOR SURE THAT YOU ARE SPEAKING RUBBISH HERE!


"Aluminimum can ...5 m away..." !?!?! With device you posted here???
B.S. ...Mega B.S.....Terra B.S......!!!!
NONSENCE! NONSENCE! NONSENCE!

I am not tacken aback with you nonsences here, no! I am really tacken aback with other peoples good will to pay you attention, to listen you!!!????
Peoples like Max and Quiaozhi?????
No wonder Esteban is here with his attitude...!
BUT YES, IT IS WONDER THAT MAX's AND QUIAOZHI's DO TAKE A PART IN THIS HUGE B.S. ????

Good bye world! Good bye sanity! Good bye common sence! Good bye Forum!

Finally "they" won!? I lost...

[detectoman]

these seems, how combination; bfos - radio filtred selectioned wave
why very much lines in the coil?

very ingenious

best regards these days, noooooooooot drink not drive
bay zzzzzzzzzummmmmmm deteccion circuitadict, detectoman

[Nihil Roma Maius]

Mr. Morgan

Please, don't open the coils. You have done a great job, but... there are many people who wish convert this in a business based on investigation of others. I read the thread and found that the device has been patented in Brazil.


Regards

Nihil Roma Maius

[Palamedes]

Mr. Morgan

Please, don't open the coils. You have done a great job, but... there are many people who wish convert this in a business based on investigation of others. I read the thread and found that the device has been patented in Brazil.

Good news..
Nihil you doubtlessly do not know the purpose of patent office..
If this circuit is patented - then it is also protected by international law.
No way to convert it into ''buisness'' without paying the fee to original investigators.
Please stop malesting Morgan..and better upload here the patent - if you have one...

[Nihil Roma Maius]

Good news..
Nihil you doubtlessly do not know the purpose of patent office..
If this circuit is patented - then it is also protected by international law.
No way to convert it into ''buisness'' without paying the fee to original investigators.
Please stop malesting Morgan..and better upload here the patent - if you have one...

Sure? Who copy and later pay by it? You? Morgan? Qiaozhi? Major MD industries? The Chineses?

Best regards

Nihil Roma Maius

[Qiaozhi]

Hey! This is in a way to much!:angry:
And dont worry, this will be my last post here. I just cant stand such nonsences any more.
I DONT BELEIVE A WORD TO YOU. SIMPLY, COSE I DO KNOW FOR SURE THAT YOU ARE SPEAKING RUBBISH HERE!


"Aluminimum can ...5 m away..." !?!?! With device you posted here???
B.S. ...Mega B.S.....Terra B.S......!!!!
NONSENCE! NONSENCE! NONSENCE!

I am not tacken aback with you nonsences here, no! I am really tacken aback with other peoples good will to pay you attention, to listen you!!!????
Peoples like Max and Quiaozhi?????
No wonder Esteban is here with his attitude...!
BUT YES, IT IS WONDER THAT MAX's AND QUIAOZHI's DO TAKE A PART IN THIS HUGE B.S. ????

Good bye world! Good bye sanity! Good bye common sence! Good bye Forum!

Finally "they" won!? I lost...
Roberts - be patient... ;)

Remember - Silence is wisdom...

[Palamedes]

Sure? Who copy and later pay by it? You? Morgan? Qiaozhi? Major MD industries? The Chineses?


No I'm not sure .. lots of dirty buisness here - I agree.
But you missed my point. -> If the device is really patented then it is also available freely to me, Morgan..and also chinese.

It would be nice to see the patent not guessing what does it do and painfully back-engeneering the device.
Do you have the copy of patent or patent No#?

[Nihil Roma Maius]

Never I said "I have the patent or #". Said: "I read the thread and found that the device has been patented in Brazil."

Regards

Nihil Roma Maius

[Qiaozhi]

Please see attached redrawn portion of Circuit #2.

This appears to be a oscillator that generates a series of high voltage (92V) pulses every 2.5ms. The pulses look very similar to those generated by a pulse induction detector.
The front-mounted coil has been assumed to not contain any tuning capacitors. If a tuning cap is fitted, then the output pulse decay rings at the frequency defined by the LC combination. I also tried various coil values, ranging from 2.5mH to 5.9mH, and these all gave the same results.

To the left-hand side of C9, the circuit (not yet redrawn) is quite possibly the receiver section. However, it's difficult to tell exactly, because of the uncertainty of the coil configuration.

Esteban - does this make any sense to you?

Anyone else - contructive comments welcome. :)

[J_Player]

Never I said "I have the patent or #". Said: "I read the thread and found that the device has been patented in Brazil."Is this device patented? Or is this just some information that was told to the people in this forum? If it is patented, then perhaps someone can produce the patent number to verify it is patented. With this patent number, we can easily see what the inventor considered to be the working part of the circuit by looking at his patent diagrams, the same as we do with patents for conventional metal detectors.

According to what we were told, negotiations are being made to produce this patented device for commercial sale to the public. If this is true, we can expect to see a cheap Chinese version that probably doesn't work as well shortly after the first commercial units are available. Is there any real danger that by understanding this device, we are causing the Chinese or other people to illegally manufacture this device in the countries where it is protected?

Best wishes,
J_P

[Fred]

Hi Morgan,
thanks for info.
I think there is small mistakes:
-near T4 collector a connection is probably missing, a wire maybe?
-the diode in parallel to c4/r7 etc has no reference
PS: i really dont see the point of the presence of R12 on thi PCB instead of PCB2....more wires for nothing?

I have made a mistaske on transistor T1,PCB3: part shown is bc548 should be 558.
Fred.

[Fred]

Max,
I was going back to search for PCB2 and i found your schematic of PCB3.So i made it for nothing ,i have missed plenty of posts. :frown:
Even found the pink wire etc.
However, i still think there is something missing at collector of T4,probably a connection...
Sorry,
Fred.

[Morgan]

Hey! This is in a way to much!:angry:
And dont worry, this will be my last post here. I just cant stand such nonsences any more.
I DONT BELEIVE A WORD TO YOU. SIMPLY, COSE I DO KNOW FOR SURE THAT YOU ARE SPEAKING RUBBISH HERE!


"Aluminimum can ...5 m away..." !?!?! With device you posted here???
B.S. ...Mega B.S.....Terra B.S......!!!!
NONSENCE! NONSENCE! NONSENCE!

I am not tacken aback with you nonsences here, no! I am really tacken aback with other peoples good will to pay you attention, to listen you!!!????
Peoples like Max and Quiaozhi?????
No wonder Esteban is here with his attitude...!
BUT YES, IT IS WONDER THAT MAX's AND QUIAOZHI's DO TAKE A PART IN THIS HUGE B.S. ????

Good bye world! Good bye sanity! Good bye common sence! Good bye Forum!

Finally "they" won!? I lost...
Hello sharky

For you i keep my silence
Silence is wisdom...

[Fred]

Please see attached redrawn portion of Circuit #2.

This appears to be a oscillator that generates a series of high voltage (92V) pulses every 2.5ms. The pulses look very similar to those generated by a pulse induction detector.
The front-mounted coil has been assumed to not contain any tuning capacitors. If a tuning cap is fitted, then the output pulse decay rings at the frequency defined by the LC combination. I also tried various coil values, ranging from 2.5mH to 5.9mH, and these all gave the same results.

To the left-hand side of C9, the circuit (not yet redrawn) is quite possibly the receiver section. However, it's difficult to tell exactly, because of the uncertainty of the coil configuration.

Esteban - does this make any sense to you?

Anyone else - contructive comments welcome. :)
Qiaozhi,
The R12 3K9 resistor that is on PCB3 but in fact goes from R15 to C4 on PCB2 doesn´t make any sense,(it´s in serie with R15/100K!) but may play an important role by sampling the pulse to the input.
Fred

[Morgan]

Max,
I was going back to search for PCB2 and i found your schematic of PCB3.So i made it for nothing ,i have missed plenty of posts. :frown:
Even found the pink wire etc.
However, i still think there is something missing at collector of T4,probably a connection...
Sorry,
Fred.
Hello
dont worry,when i have more time i will made better schematic of the 6 PCB´s
Regards

[detectoman]

morgan:

my congratulations for your effort
very thanks, for dedication, and perseverance
too for max and fred and all

the project is in advance
happy celebrations

hoobyst detectoman

[Max]

Max,
I was going back to search for PCB2 and i found your schematic of PCB3.So i made it for nothing ,i have missed plenty of posts. :frown:
Even found the pink wire etc.
However, i still think there is something missing at collector of T4,probably a connection...
Sorry,
Fred.

Hi Fred,
yes I see... sorry you had to make the work about it... anyway it's good cause we can compare our results now: for example what about C4 positive lead ? from picture of PCB it seems connected to R7 and D5 but I wasn't sure so putted dashed line.

I think there's something missing too at T4 untill we assume polarization of collectors occours just by R8 and other things there.

Other strange thing, as you stated, is R12 that is connected remotely to PCB2. Why that ? Keeping a resitor on another board and connect by two wires ?

This last thing seems without meaning unless we consider R12 as kind of a sensor placed on PCB3 (kind of a feedback I mean) ??? It's mounted hi and about over R14 and R15 and near T6.

The idea is strange but remember me thing I saw in old transistor based power amplifiers for audio: carbon resistors have positive temperature coeff. so their resistance increase with increase of temperature: but I don't understand why using such a kind of thing... variation is so few and there are plenty of things to use to gain same effect. Then R12 is connected to circuit2 at a particular position (look at picture).

Personally I think the purpose of author is giving some temperature driven stabilization of oscillator respect to amplifier section (kinda of "AGC").

But I still don't understand why using a carbon resistor ?????? Why the hell need of it there , a carbon resistor sensor ::crazy:: ??? ;)

Assuming the author of schematic is not seriously sick... then we need also coils data to go ahead now... and will Morgan provide them ? :lol:

I'm start thinking, after emails from Paraguay arrived to him, he'll stop posting other things as always happens in these threads of LRL, just to confirm Roberts thoughts and my initial dubts. :rolleyes:

Best regards,
Max

[Max]

Hello
dont worry,when i have more time i will made better schematic of the 6 PCB´s
Regards

Hi,
thanks Morgan... but but but...
we need also coils data :lol: otherwise Roberts is totally right and all this thread is just another large pile of BS like so many in all LRL section, but this time made by you my friend ;).

Merry Christmas,
Max

[Max]

R12 on PCB2 is like in this picture not the above.

Kind regards,
Max

[Geo]

Hi,
thanks Morgan... but but but...
we need also coils data :lol: otherwise Roberts is totally right and all this thread is just another large pile of BS like so many in all LRL section, but this time made by you my friend ;).

Merry Christmas,
Max

Hi Max:).
I agree.
Morgan made the difficult work (reverse the pcb to schematic) and now stop at the easy work who is the coils. Maybe he don't like to destroy the coils but he can give us a photo from the inner of the head.
Maybe Morgan afraid something:frown:...... who knows.
My Regards:) and
Merry Christmas:):)

[Qiaozhi]

Hi Fred and Max,

IMHO - we should not let us ourselves get confused by small details, such as "why is this a carbon resistor?" or "why is this resistor 1% tolerance?", etc.
At the moment we need to look at the bigger picture. Esteban has already made a comment that these components were probably only used because that's what was available at the time. No other "mysterious" reason. We can already see that is a prototype device, and the amount of loose wiring inside the box shows that the layout is not critical.

At the moment, it looks to me like we have the following:

A simple pulse transmitter (RH-side of PCB2) - see attached waveforms.
A simple receiver (LH-side of PCB2), although it is not clear how the coils are connected. This part is most likely designed for close range, and will act like a simple PI detector. This appears to be a balanced coil arrangement, and may actually be using the original Garrett Groundhog coil. Carl has offered to measure the inductance values of one in his collection.
There is a second receiver (PCB5) that is connected to the ferrites, which is arranged orthogonally to the front-mounted coil. This is (presumably) designed for medium range detection.
There is no evidence of either a 7KV generator or an IR element.What should we do next?

Try to understand how the front-mounted coil is connected to the receiver. Carl's data will help here.
Concentrate on understanding the purpose of PCBs 2, 3 and 5. PCBs 1, 4 and 6 are failrly straightforward.
Draw a top-level diagram (in English) showing all the inter-block connections.By the way, we should try to complete this project as quickly as possible. Firstly, because Morgan will have to return the device to its original owner in the near future, and any further queries will become impossible.
Secondly, because we will undoubtedly start to lose interest if this drags on for too long. :frown:

Initially - can I suggest that we pool our thoughts on the overall block diagram with the interconnections?

[Fred]

Hi max,
I see R12 connected like this, or i made some mistake?
I tha case, thermal compensation is not possible,because of the R15
high value and C5 .Only left i think is pulse pickup.As Qiaozhi says, its
obviously a prototype, but the PCB was made with the resistor already here.
Of course it may not be important, but i see this kind of details as clues to understand the real functionning principles of the device.
About Morgan,i know he will do all he can to get the coil data.

[Fred]

Hi Fred and Max,

Draw a top-level diagram (in English) showing all the inter-block connections.
By the way, we should try to complete this project as quickly as possible. Firstly, because Morgan will have to return the device to its original owner in the near future, and any further queries will become impossible.
Secondly, because we will undoubtedly start to lose interest if this drags on for too long. :frown:

Initially - can I suggest that we pool our thoughts on the overall block diagram with the interconnections?

Yes, i think a complete diagram is the next step,because of all the wiring it will look much simpler.But for this an electronic diagram would be much better.

Regards,
Fred.