Real Ion Detection

[Carl-NC]

EE Times (http://www.eetimes.com/news/latest/showArticle.jhtml?articleID=197800860)

[Alexismex]

Thanks Carl for the good info, this is real facts not fantasy.
best regards,
alexis

[Max]

EE Times (http://www.eetimes.com/news/latest/showArticle.jhtml?articleID=197800860)

Hi Carl,
very interesting. Seems that in air ion detection could be possible with hand-held instruments soon. It's a good news.
I think that if no wind present, with good detection trap and good number of ions in the air could be fine to for TH when prices will become "possible" to hobbists.
Think real problem could be e.g. gold ions not so easy to find in air. But for other things could be easy, in good conditions, to pinpoint targets and really useful.

At least it is science ! (and truth!)

Best regards,
Max

[J_Player]

:shocked: Hmmmm.... it says here that it takes less than a second to collect a sample and detect ions...
And they don't say anything about not working in high humidity or sunspots... Hmmmmm...
And it will only cost about $2000? What does this mean?

This raises a number of questions:

• Will Alonso buy one of these to calibrate his FG-80s?

• Will LRL proponents save a bundle by buying the $2000 ion/mass spectrometer instead of the $5000 mineoro LRL?

• Who will treasure hunters complain to if the new detector does not locate any gold ions in the air?

• Will Brazilian "scientists" formulate theories to prove that this new technology can't possibly work?

• Is it possible to program the new detector to recognize the compound that paper currency and inks are made of to locate lost money?

• Will the new detector be able to sniff the nearby presence of lost diamonds? Will it confuse diamond ions for coal ions?

• Dang, I am starting to get a headache... I must go back to sleep...

[Esteban]

"The detection is done in an ion trap—an RF (http://www.eetimes.com/encyclopedia/defineterm.jhtml?term=RF&x=&y=) device that traps ions, then lets them out on the basis of their masses, enabling you to be exactly sure what compound you are sensing,"

This is truth! We use all the time a kind of RF trapp, a simple very stable BFO detector, very fine, tandem adjustable with vernier mechanic reductor.

A secondary coil behind the BFO transmitter coil take the information of this primary coil. This secondary coil is the classifier.


* * * * * * * * *

Instead, a puff of ionized water vapor absorbs any trace substance on a scanned item and transfers the sample to the mass spectrometer's ion trap.

True!!! One time, I have this experience. We go to an historical site and start a very but very light rain. I have in my hand one of this device, not very sensitive, but obtain good detection in a place. I found an old bronze cartridge in the site. Later, I told Alonso that the thin rain actuates as a "bridge" or "way". This is before the rain to moisten all the air and soil.

I swear about this history. This experience I feel in 1989 or 1990. Our "mass spectrometer" was the coil of BFO.

Today I use a simple oscillator and detect via resonance off in the range of 300 Khz. At lowest frequency, variation of few hertz during detection can't produces audible signal in the beeper. Maybe is detecting, but can't "hear". At near 60-90 Khz is more selective, but more "hard" to show. Inherent problem at 300 Khz is the susceptibility to detect "silver paper" with incredible accuracy and sustentation.

Scientific American describes a device used for to measure the voltage produces in the drops of the rain when these falls...

During this type of rain, evident, this voltage produced by the rain ionizes the environment or air, as the ionized water vapor described in the article.

All this only confirm all I know or observe during this kind of detection, but don't know very well why.

Also I'm searching for explanation why a "special" object can be detected at 300 kHz very well, "geometry", "microresonance"?

[hung]

What I've read in that link is ordinary ion detection alone which now can be hand held, although 20 pounds is really heavy.
It does not detect ions at distance (or classify them).

Apparently it's not intended for metal detection as the phenomena which enables it it's still unknown to them (text does not mention anything about it) and the lack of electrostatics involvement makes the ion detection alone useless for metal detection. Good for food and health tough.

I'm working on a way to visualize ionic and electrostatic fields of long time buried gold. If it can be detected (Mineoro) they can be seen.

Maybe it will take sometime but I'll try.

[robert]

:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :razz: :razz: :razz:
"....I'm working on a way to visualize ionic and electrostatic fields of long time buried gold. If it can be detected (Mineoro) they can be seen......."


Ha,ha,ha,ha,ha,ha,ha,ha!!!!!! :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:


I see, after long time, nothing changes here....!?:lol: :lol: :lol:

[J_Player]

Let us not be so hasty in dismissing the possibility of visualizing ionic and electrostatic fields. Are you aware that there are ancient books written that explain the principles of locating gold ions through electrostatic fields at long ranges? Have you heard about the conspiracy to flood the modern textbooks with utterly useless science about nonsense like mass spectrometry and magnetism? Isn't it obvious that it was common knowledge among electical experimenters nearly a century ago that treasures send out ions that can be detected from many meters away using secret LRL principles?

Modern electronic technology has enhanced the early detectors, so we no longer need to rely on a simple bait-chamber to attract the elusive airborn gold ions. And the modern electronics allow us to plow through the static fields and follow a signal line straight to the location of a buried treasure, much like a heat-seeking missle finds it's target. So what if there are not videos of LRL operators tracking down mounds of recovered treasure to demonstrate how this works. Haven't you heard? it is a secret technology that must be protected from the rigors of evidence, facts and other annoying principles that would seek to topple their hidden secrets.

Who is to say there is no way to be able to visualize ionic and electrostatic fields? Is it not possible that the same technology that made so many LRL people wealthy can also be used to allow visualizing ionic and electrostatic fields?

While I can't pretend to be as advanced in these secret technologies as the inventors of the LRLs, I have discovered a very promising method that could theoretically be developed for visualizing ionic and electrostatic fields. Yes, it is true. We may be only a few steps away from accomplishing what Hung wants to do!

There is a cable testing company who used some of the principles from the same obscure books to develop a set of goggles that can view hidden objects buried beneath the surface layers. These goggles are typically used to locate bad connections and other problems inside cables. But these goggles operate in the X-ray spectrum, not in static mode. Before these goggles can be used for visualizing ionic and electrostatic fields, we must modify them to work in the near-DC portion of the spectrum... perhaps 1 cycle per day or longer. I am certain that the secrets of accomplishing this visualization of ionic and electrostatic fields are also locked up in the lost writings of ancient electricity books. Yes, lost in the conspiracy of modern technology.

See the goggles here: http://www.cirris.com/humor/x-ray_glasses.html
See demonstration: http://www.cirris.com/humor/april06-x-ray.html

I confess, I cannot accomplish what Hung aspires to do in visualizing these fields. Alas, I will never be able to accomplish any true original science, as I long ago sold out to modern sciences. Yes, it was so much easier to believe science that could be easily demonstrated and repeated. Sure I know that real science must be hidden in legends of lost lore and must never be demonstrated to a non-believer (or to a believer). Thus, I must leave this endeavor to the true scientists of the past, who so brilliantly brought us the LRLs that we are graced with today. I only hope that in my disgraceful allegiance to modern science, my short excursion to x-ray glasses can help in some small way to make ionic and electrostatic field viewing a reality.

[hung]

Sarcasms and ironies apart, I'm teaming up here to try to make visualization of those fields possible.
One must understand the phenomena before any electronics is applied. Not the opposite.

Due to this I have no hope or am I willing to discuss this here because I've had enough evidence I would only get ironies and discredit like yours above.

So good luck on your way, whatever that might be.
I will follow mine.
But always remember: 'Follow the path of least resistance'.