Dell's complaints

[Dell Winders]

** Dell did this years ago, as well. So the Sniffex is not just garbage, it's old recycled garbage.

Huh? Was I selling or advertising them? How about posting a reminder photo? I don't recall ever manufacturing anything fraudulent.

Carl, Speaking of frauds, it's best you look in the mirror at a scientific pretender. Dell

[Carl-NC]

Dell VR800 report (http://www.thunting.com/cgi-bin/geotech/pages/common/index.pl?page=lrl&file=reports/vr800/index.dat)... Fig 11 shows dowsing rods that have wires attached to them, with a plug... Fig 7 shows two little black boxes which the rods plug into. Same concept as illustrated in the Sniffex patent.

[Dell Winders]

Dell VR800 report (http://www.thunting.com/cgi-bin/geotech/pages/common/index.pl?page=lrl&file=reports/vr800/index.dat)... Fig 11 shows dowsing rods that have wires attached to them, with a plug... Fig 7 shows two little black boxes which the rods plug into. Same concept as illustrated in the Sniffex patent.


No, you are wrong! That is a single rod concept illustrated in the photo, and your drawing. There is a difference in the use.

It's a fact that I did not manufacture the VR-800, or had anything to do with the design or creation of it.

It's a bald faced lie, and fraud, when you don't know what you are talking about and make false allegations under a scientific pretense.

Carl, you would be wise to retract your allegation and apologize, and not continue to follow the Randi, example of using more lies to cover up his deception. The consequences of your deception will catch up with both of you since your photo's and false allegations in support Randi's, slander to defame my honest reputation are appearing on the internet, and in a national publication.

For you to join in a lie about people without evidence of truth, is not ethical, or moral. Serious repercussions can eventually happen to anyone who choses that path in life and who has no remorse, or apology.

"The door to knowledge, truth or understanding is never open to a closed, or prejudiced mind" Dell

[Carl-NC]

I have no idea what you're complaining about... all I said is that the concept of adding do-dads to the antenna has been done (Kellyco, Afilani), and the concept of plugging dowsing rods into do-dad boxes has been done (Dell). I also have a Dell GS Pro which, I believe, has dowsing rods that plug into a do-dad box, so I'm pretty sure I'm correct in saying that you have employed the concept of plugging dowsing rods into do-dad boxes, the same as Sniffex shows in their patent.

[Dell Winders]

I have no idea what you're complaining about... all I said is that the concept of adding do-dads to the antenna has been done (Kellyco, Afilani), and the concept of plugging dowsing rods into do-dad boxes has been done (Dell). I also have a Dell GS Pro which, I believe, has dowsing rods that plug into a do-dad box, so I'm pretty sure I'm correct in saying that you have employed the concept of plugging dowsing rods into do-dad boxes, the same as Sniffex shows in their patent.

Your reference to "Dell" and old garbage, was to a product in which I had no involvement in the manufacture, and you have already been informed of that. Yet you persist.

If you don't want complaints, or repercussions. Keep your slandorus inferences to your self and present the facts. There is an obvious difference between the control box of a VR-800 and a Pro-GS that even an idiot can see. I don't see any plug-ins in the photo of the alleged sniffex Rod? Where is the comparison?

An apology is in order. Dell

[Carl-NC]

Good grief, what are you talking about? I don't even have a photo of the Sniffex device.

I only stated that the Sniffex device is described as a dowsing rod, with a handle that plugs into some kind of do-dad box, and said that was something you had done long ago. Are you telling me you've never sold LRLs that have dowsing rods, with wires that come out of the handles and plug into some kind of do-dad box?

[Dell Winders]

** Dell did this years ago, as well. So the Sniffex is not just garbage, it's old recycled garbage.

:mad: :mad: I don't appreciate your intention to defame my name with the inference that I am manufacturing garbage products. An apology is in order. Yes, or No?

[Carl-NC]

It was not an inference, Dell... you make garbage products.

[Dell Winders]

Are you as equally opinionated about the consumers who have already purchased my home made products?

How would Carl, build a product that I would not proclaim it to be garbage? Can you? Dell

[Dell Winders]

It was not an inference, Dell... you make garbage products.

Carl, I hope you are smart enough know better. customers wouldn't be sending letters of praise and providing word of mouth advertising if they thought they had invested their money in garbage.

I know you are never going to apologize to me no matter how much you have been wrong about me. That would betray your loyalty to the Skeptic cult agenda. You would loose your bn status and be frowned upon by your peers. Your ego and pride would would suffer if you ever lost favor and could no longer be of slander service to the Amazing lieing Randi.

It takes courage for a person raised with morals to deny the facts all these years and stand up for belief in an unscrpulous Skeptic Cult leader. I'm sure you will have Randi's praises. And Sam's. (the Watcher) for your efforts.

Enjoy for now! Dell

[Carl-NC]

Dell, if you want to discuss your products, please start a new thread.

[Dell Winders]

Dell, if you want to discuss your products, please start a new thread.

Nope! It was Carl, who started the subject of "Garbage", on this thread. Not me. I'm replying to your "Garbage".
It was not an inference, Dell... you make garbage products. Dell

[Leto]

customers wouldn't be sending letters of praise and providing word of mouth advertising if they thought they had invested their money in garbage.


Hi Dell. I have read some of those letters of praises from your website. That one about discovery of Noah's ark with your equipment is very interesting..

Do you really belive this is Noah's ark?

[michael]

I on my own, have used Dell Directional Rod (DDL). it's really different from L rods and strongly pulls to target. As I wrote here: http://thunting.com/geotech/forums/showthread.php?t=11046&page=9
Honesty to god all of my statements are true.
We could pass all of the double blind tests by DDL. When at first we saw and held it in our hands said "this was DDL?!! don't think can do more than other rods" , but no, honestly it was another thing.
It's unfair to name it garbage. As I had no experience with other Dell products can't emit statement about, but believe one thing; "A handful indicates a kharvar"

[Carl-NC]

Michael, if you're happy with your DDL, and it's putting the gold in your hand, then by golly, use it!

[Dell Winders]

I moved Dell's off-topic complaining to a new thread. This thread is for the discussion of the Sniffex device, if anyone is still interested.

Just deleting your derogatory comment, and a simple apology is suffecient. Dell

** Dell did this years ago, as well. So the Sniffex is not just garbage, it's old recycled garbage.

[Dell Winders]

Michael, if you're happy with your DDL, and it's putting the gold in your hand, then by golly, use it
Carl, there you go again with assumption. The DDL is not a Gold Locator. That is a fact. Dell

[sony]

:mad: :confused:
"For you to join in a lie about people without evidence of truth, is not ethical,
or moral. Serious repercussions can eventually happen to anyone who choses that
path in life and who has no remorse, or apology..."
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Look who's talking !? You should think twice about what you just said! The same measures
could be taken in your case....Is there any law there in Miami?
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
"Carl, I hope you are smart enough know better. customers wouldn't be sending letters
of praise and providing word of mouth advertising if they thought they had invested
their money in garbage..."
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
What customers you are talking about!? Those from TV Shop?Those who advertising all those
scum products every day,again and again....Make's me wanna puke of them!
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
"It was not an inference, Dell... you make garbage products. ..."
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Dell for sure is making garbage products! Everybody who had chance to test it, knows that!
Only morons still beleive in those! And morons are the strongest associates in any
advertising business whatever.
Who want to argue any more here? Me not, for sure! But please stop opening more threads
on one only subject here! We have here dozen threads about same stuff. LRL,dowsing,mineoro,
pseudo science,blah-blah, various bogus devices and projects. It is spreading like cancer.
One simple thread is enough. O.K. i can agree that those people can be here,can use this
forum, but give them one thread,their own thread.Do not let them to open a new thread every
day. Just look the forum,count threads by type or thema, and you'll see that they grow up
every day,more and more.But the very same people,same number.No more new names,same people
spreading everywhere,bugging and bashing more and more! They can persuade even a God to
visit hell by weekend, if continue like this!
One thing i do know for sure.Nobody can persuade me to beleive in nonsences.I am not moron.
Only thing,i am gonna leave from here for good. This supposed to be good news for them.But
so as i heared, the other people will leave too.Sooner or later this forum will be the place
just for them, and Carl...you'll be in a big trouble...
Why am i so "called" to mix here? I'll explain.
For a while, let's imagine this situation:
Let's put that you live in a small place.Year by year, you noticing more and more man from
your place turns to be a ***! So,you do not have problem with that, you are straight and
all's fine, at least more girls for you! But, you have a son! As he grows up, you became
afraid that he'll turn to a *** too if you do not undertake something! So, to preclude that,
you must start fighting against them! And,slowly, step by step, you became the great
antagonist against gays. You'll use any means to destroy them.God bless you!
The very same thing here. I know that it is impossible to turn those people to stop.But
i would like to preclude others to be catched in lies, prejudices and frauds!
When tissue is infected at that level that it can endager the rest of body, you simply
operate and cut it out.Simply as that!
So, at the end, since those kind of people exist, and they are already here,o.k. let them
be there, but give them just enough space and no more.Neither one step more! As administrator,
and very accountable person here, you have very serious responsibility, cose this supposed to
be public place.A lot of youngsters coming here.What are they goona learn here?LRL!? Dowsing!?
"Foolishing" and acting like idiot!? Think about that....
------------------------------------------------------------------

[Dell Winders]

Do you really belive this is Noah's ark?
Leto, Personally, I do not know if if it is, or isn't the remains of Noah's Ark. I will leave that answer to the historians and biblical scholars. As far as I know there may have been several large ships (Arks) and people that may have survived the great flood of that period, although the bible only relates the account of Noah.

A video documentary by G Edward Griffen, "The Discovery of Noah's Ark" http://www.realityzone.com does present some compelling evidence. It is Turkey's #1 archaeology site.

David Fasold, was my dearest friend and we had close communication of the events right up until the day he died. It is my opinion that if there ever has been a man that was chosen of GOD, for a specific purpose on this earth, David Fasold was one of those men. I am humbled and priveledged to have known him, regardless of what people wish to believe, or not to believe. Dell

[Dell Winders]

I on my own, have used Dell Directional Rod (DDL). it's really different from L rods and strongly pulls to target. As I wrote here: http://thunting.com/geotech/forums/s...t=11046&page=9 (http://thunting.com/geotech/forums/showthread.php?t=11046&page=9)
Honesty to god all of my statements are true.
We could pass all of the double blind tests by DDL. When at first we saw and held it in our hands said "this was DDL?!! don't think can do more than other rods" , but no, honestly it was another thing.
It's unfair to name it garbage. As I had no experience with other Dell products can't emit statement about, but believe one thing; "A handful indicates a kharvar"
Michael, thank you for your honesty, and kind words. Dell

[Carl-NC]

David Fasold, was my dearest friend and we had close communication of the events right up until the day he died. It is my opinion that if there ever has been a man that was chosen of GOD, for a specific purpose on this earth, David Fasold was one of those men. I am humbled and priveledged to have known him, regardless of what people wish to believe, or not to believe.

And what David Fasold's final conclusion about the site? Did he believe it was the Ark, or did he finally decide it was a natural geologic formation?

[Carl-NC]

Carl, there you go again with assumption. The DDL is not a Gold Locator. That is a fact. Dell

I know that, and you know that... but does Michael know that?

[hung]

I just visited Dell's products page and all his concepts sound sane to me. MFD's have been around for a long time. The only thing is that it requires skills from the operator since this method generally utilizes dowsing rods. And many people apparently don't have those skills and can't accept that.
Although in my opinion, a completely electronic device such as the Mineoro ionic detectors are much less prone to interferences and false signals,
I strongly disagree and blame who says Dell's products are garbage.
This, besides being a declared disrespect to forum etiquette, proves an offensive attack to a respected member with lots of experience in the field by who in my opinion should be the guardian of good manners as the moderator.

[Carl-NC]

I strongly disagree and blame who says Dell's products are garbage. This, besides being a declared disrespect to forum etiquette, proves an offensive attack to a respected member with lots of experience in the field by who in my opinion should be the guardian of good manners as the moderator.

I didn't say anything about Dell, I just said his products are garbage. I did so with the best manners possible.:)

Tell me Hung, based on your understanding of MFD, and based on Dell's web site, for what purpose do you think his products are useful? Specifically, what are his products supposed to do?

[Dell Winders]

And what David Fasold's final conclusion about the site? Did he believe it was the Ark, or did he finally decide it was a natural geologic formation? I'm sorry Carl, I can't speak for other people. Get the video, read the books and learn from that.

It appears to me that David's purpose was to show his research and evidence to allow the professionals, and the public to reach their own conclusions. He didn't seem to feel his personal belief was important

Of course, there will always be Scientific pretenders who will form their conclusion using a single piece of evidence to base their belief on nothing more than presumption and assumption.

"The door to understanding & knowledge is never open to a closed, or prejudiced mind" Dell

[Leto]

About those "Arks"..
The postcard you got from David Fasold is actualy Durupinar, dicovered by Llhan Durupinar, a captain in the Turkish army while reviewing Aerial photographs taken for NATO's geodetic survey of Turkey in 1974 and not by your friend David Fasold (may he rest in peace) equiped with your "instruments"....

It is Turkey's #1 archaeology site.


Durupinar also is NOT Turkey's #1 archaeology site. Where did you get this idea?

This are untrue informations Dell. Maybe even an apology is in order.

[Leto]

This is not for you Dell.

Geologists answer for Durupinar ark...

The metal traces that were interpreted as iron brackets were actually goethite, a hydrated iron oxide. This mineral was thoroughly mixed with clay, calcite, quartz, and anthophyllite particles, and it showed a large amount of chemical variability across the sample. Neither of these properties would occur in smelted iron.
The purported walls of the ark are limonite concentrations. Their boatlike shape is consistent with an eroded doubly plunging syncline. The stresses of such folding commonly cause fractures that cut across the layers. Water moving through these fractures would have produced the limonite concentrations that were interpreted as dividing walls.
In short, the structure is consistent with the following geological history:

Rocks formed when sediments eroded from nearby volcanic rocks and were compacted.
These layers were folded into a doubly plunging syncline.
A marine sea eroded a channel into the rocks and deposited fossiliferous limestone in it.
The land was uplifted, and erosion removed most of the limestone and exposed the fold.
A landslide carried blocks of rock and mud around the synclinal structure.
This interpretation is consistent with the structure itself and with the surrounding geology (Collins and Fasold 1996).

No fossilized wood or traces of wood, reed, or elemental carbon were found associated with the structure (Collins and Fasold 1996).

Biblical scholars answer for Durupinar and other "Ark sites"..

The Durupinar site is incompatible with the biblical account. Genesis 8:4-6 says the flood waters receded for two and a half months after the ark landed before other mountaintops became visible. The Durupinar site is almost 10,000 feet lower than the summit of nearby Agri Dagh. Agri Dagh would have been visible above water even before the ark landed (Standish and Standish 1999, 236).
The Bible describes a rectangular ark. Wyatt's ark is boat-shaped and about 50 percent wider than the dimensions given in the Bible (Standish and Standish 1999, 106, 230-231).
The "anchor" stones likely had nothing to do with Christianity or the ark. Such stones were known to have been crafted by pagans for their worship before Christianity came to Armenia. The "rope holes" were niches for lamps. When Christianity came to the region, the stones were Christianized by inscribing Christian symbols on them (Merling n.d.).

The rock from which the anchor stones are made is volcanic rock found around Mount Ararat where the anchor stones were found, but not found in Mesopotamia (Iraq) from which Noah is alleged to have departed (Collins and Fasold 1996). If the stones were crafted by Noah, they would have come from the region where Noah came from, not where he landed.

[Dell Winders]

Originally Posted by Dell Winders
Carl, there you go again with assumption. The DDL is not a Gold Locator. That is a fact. Dell

I know that, and you know that... but does Michael know that?

Carl, Michael's business, or mine, is none of your business!

Michael, is an intelligent person capable of speaking for himself. I don't speak for him.

If you have factual evidence that supports your allegation, and inferences about me or the products I build and sell then show it. Your attempt to rally support for your ego and skeptic cult agenda, appears neither scientific, or rational.

What business do you think it is of yours whether my website meets your expectations, or has your approval as long as I am truthful? What is your problem with folks being honest? Dell

[Dell Winders]

Leto, I am in no way in disagreeance with what you say. That, and much more both Pro & Con, has been written by many people about the subject. I was not there to witness the event (or at least I don't remember) so I do not know any of it for fact, and have no opinion.

It is a fact, that it was regarded as Turkey's No.1 archaeological site at the time of the photo. It is a fact, Turkey, did publicly proclaim the formation to be the remains of Noah's Ark, as a result of Fasold's report, followed by numerous scientific and archaeological survey's. It is a fact, that the MFD was used to plot the locations of probable deep buried Iron anomalies that were in a systematic pattern and appeared strategicly located throughout the entire formation. It is a fact, that the position of these anomalies was confirmed by GPR, and the near surface Iron anomalies, which also appear to be placed in a systematic pattern, were confirmed and ground truthed, with Whites metal detectors, which I supplied. The consistency of the spacing of these anomalies should at least raise questions as to the coincidence comparison of a natural formation to a manmade structure.The technical drawings and measurements relating to these Iron anomalies is illustrated in Fasold's book. A quick view is included in the video.

The wider breadth measurements of the formation can be accurately accounted for by the splaying of the ribs. A natural occourence over time of any ship wreck.

Leto, it's logical to assume this formation has existed for at least two thousand years, geologically speaking. Of course, Fasold, Wyatt, and even Capt.Durupinar, were not the original discoverers of the formation. That is a mute point. According to the description of events in the video documentary, in modern times the geological formation manifest itself to human scrutiny in 1946 or 1947, I forget which. Coincidently, the same year Israel became a nation.

I don't wish to spend time on this subject debating facts I could not possibly know. I apologize if you were somehow mis-lead by my earlier reply. Dell

[michael]

I know that, and you know that... but does Michael know that?Carl,it was rare for you as a moderator to put such a thread and allege in this way.
Why shouldn't I knew or know that?!!! That's right I am not electrician but I am experienced in detection and doing so much hard tests in field. We are very strict in approving any kind of detector and it never concerns to my electrical knowledge.
preparing useless Notsi LRL made us skeptic of LRLing. but after making that good transmitter our minds changed.
Carl, Where did I write it's gold detector?!
I didn't mention other angles of our tests. e.g. my partners continuously changed the location of gold, iron and silver plates and the transmitted Freq. I never knew each target place or what's freq. set.
As dell is honest from first told me it detects every EM (from near by its own) or far when charged by transmitter.
the accuracy depends on your transmitter be matched with DDL. He mentioned X-Scan is the best choice nevertheless we ordered DDL just to prove ourselves LRLing is subjective or objective , of course proved objective.
Dell frequently had mentioned it is not a gold detector. It's clear in his site and forum. When you take a look there see Goldbeam is being claimed as GD not DDL.
we used DDL with our here-built Tr and got those results. If here some people want not to believe, it's up to them and their problem. which kind of documents satisfies them? of course nothing. of course can't be presented here or if be presented who believes? again a new wave of humiliating, bashing, derogatory &..... starts.
Carl, When you state so, what's expectancy of other who audaciously here liken us to gays??
You should have been moral and ethical pattern.

[Carl-NC]

Carl, Where did I write it's gold detector?!

Ummm... you mentioned in this post (http://thunting.com/geotech/forums/showpost.php?p=43003&postcount=222) that you used it in a test to locate a gold target. Does it detect gold, or not?

Dell frequently had mentioned it is not a gold detector.

OK, I agree with Dell.

When you take a look there see Goldbeam is being claimed as GD not DDL.

No, I don't see any claim that the Goldbeam is a gold detector. Can you show me where this is claimed? Dell, is the Goldbeam a gold detector?

If here some people want not to believe, it's up to them and their problem.

I agree, beliefs are for those who don't know. I own two of Dell's LRLs, and I've tested a third on loan, so I know.

which kind of documents satisfies them? of course nothing.

Oh no, not at all... I have a $25,000 prize if someone, somewhere, can successfully demonstrate an LRL in a very simple test.

Carl, When you state so, what's expectancy of other who audaciously here liken us to gays??

Eh?

You should have been moral and ethical pattern.

Eh?

- Carl

[Dell Winders]

When you take a look there see Goldbeam is being claimed as GD not DDL.

http://treasureamerica.netfirms.com/phpbb/xx/nfphpbb/viewtopic.php?t=106&start=15

[Carl-NC]

Hmmm... interesting... a rather vague statement:

The GOLDBEAM DL ... can also serve as a Frequency broadcast transmitter (Gold) generating a discriminated Signal Line to Gold targets, that can be detected with the dual Rods, and nulled with the weight chek.

followed by a rather definitive alibi:

A limitation is that the GOLDBEAM DL reacts strongly to even miniscule amounts of flour Gold and the operator cannot distinguish the difference in the "Feel" or target lock, of a solid Gold target, or a small, insignificant Gold target.

This sounds to me like you would not be able to distinguish a desirable gold target--like a cache of coins--from the individual gold atoms that probably exist in all soil.

But, to nail this down, standard question...

Can the Goldbeam detect a 10-ounce solid gold bar, placed on the ground, at ANY distance more than, say, 5 feet?

- Carl

[Dell Winders]

[Can the Goldbeam detect a 10-ounce solid gold bar, placed on the ground, at ANY distance more than, say, 5 feet?

No! Of course not.

I thought you created this thread for Dell's complaints? Not stupid questions from Carl?

[michael]

Ummm... you mentioned in this post (http://thunting.com/geotech/forums/showpost.php?p=43003&postcount=222) that you used it in a test to locate a gold target. Does it detect gold, or not?
Have you perceived from the post that DDL only detects gold???!!!
Its meaning is obvious.
I mentioned and still repeat it ;
"We composed DDL with our transmitter and could detect every metal (gold ,silver & iron) in specific frequency was set for each; Gold 5.5 Khz, Silver 8.7 Khz , Iron 17.8 Khz"
I detected every place according to Freq. set whereas occasionally I went far from the test place, my partners changed the target places and freq and I came back and start detecting. I never knew what freq is or where is each target. Only by DDL could find the exact place.( of course should be mentioned targets were inserting at 15 feet depth.
By DDL can detect every field and metal or even a location of a well or tunnel in ground. It never classifies or detects specifically. When you hold it in your hand and close your eyes, other makes approach a metal, strongly swivels.
When hold in your hand and walking along and very near the house walls in some points or locations suddenly and strongly rotates and you survey there see oh , here is one of the house metal jamb or electricity cable.
Carl, have you done these tests by DDL? Of course some of your efforts in this field to disclose some fraudulent are appreciable (e.g. Electroscopes, Lectrasearch which are a real trash and I have experienced it) but can’t agree with you about Omnitrone (at least DDL) to be garbage, here you treat prejudicially.
an interesting thing for me was 1 week ago, a friend called me
and asked about omnitrone.... let it be, some bodies here slander me to making a fiction.
Meanwhile Carl, “Eh?” is not a logical answer.

[Carl-NC]

Can the Goldbeam detect a 10-ounce solid gold bar, placed on the ground, at ANY distance more than, say, 5 feet?

No! Of course not.

No, of course not... silly question.

[Carl-NC]

Have you perceived from the post that DDL only detects gold???!!!

Michael, I only said that if the DDL is putting gold in your hand, then use it! I really don't know what point you're trying to make here.

Dell said the DDL is NOT a gold locator. I happen to agree with him, it will not locate gold. I've offered Dell $25,000 if he could demonstrate that any of his LRLs can locate gold... he has consistently refused my offer.

Do you disagree with Dell? Do you think the DDL will locate gold?

Meanwhile Carl, “Eh?” is not a logical answer.

Your statements made no sense...

- Carl

[michael]

Michael, ... Do you think the DDL will locate gold?... CarlOf course not by its own, but when use with transmitter adjusted in frequency, yes, can. DDL itself can locate every existent field;
metal, cavity, electrical,... when you directly pass over or near them.
Is it obscure?

[Leto]

Hello Dell.

It is a fact, that it was regarded as Turkey's No.1 archaeological site at the time of the photo.
Maybe for non-Adventist evangelicals among whom Fasold's book has primarily circulated.

It is a fact, Turkey, did publicly proclaim the formation to be the remains of Noah's Ark, as a result of Fasold's report, followed by numerous scientific and archaeological survey's.

Turkey did proclaim this? Who is Turkey? Maybe some Tukish tourist agency. Yes there were scientific surveys some as a result of Fasold's report those primarily from ark-ologists as they call themselves.

Will not debate around ribs, strange positions of anomalies, and drawings of ark from Fasold's book.

Leto, it's logical to assume this formation has existed for at least two thousand years, geologically speaking.

You can assume that, geologicaly speaking 2000 years is NOW.


My view is that Darupinar ark is something like face on Mars, hollow Earth, Elvis alive,...

Sorry Dell I will bother you no more with this off-topic but I understand now how your products work. These are not made for us
Scientific pretenders
but for persons searching arks made some generations after expell from paradise.

Dissected LRL and other (DDL?) instruments on Carls page looks really like crap Try to use more components it will give people better impression (and harder work for Carl when dissecting it) or maybe you should fill whole electronics box with epoxi - you can state somewhere that light corrupts detection or somethin like that.. These are just some suggestions.

[Qiaozhi]

Dissected LRL and other (DDL?) instruments on Carls page looks really like crap Try to use more components it will give people better impression (and harder work for Carl when dissecting it) or maybe you should fill whole electronics box with epoxi - you can state somewhere that light corrupts detection or somethin like that.. These are just some suggestions.
If the LRL manufacturers start using more electronics, it will be more difficult for them to disguise their pseudoscientific mode of operation. When a device only consists of a couple of bent rods and a bit of flim-flam, then all sorts of claims can be made which are difficult to prove/disprove without double-blind testing. This is something that (conveniently) appears to easily upset the paranormal nature of this phenomena.
I do like your thought process though. :D

[Dell Winders]

O.K. Leto, back to the subject of this thread."Dell's Complaints",
Disrespectful, intellectual pretenders, and uncontrolled ideomotor response mouths.

Leto, you don't have to prove anything to me. I said I wasn't there when the Ark landed. I don't know the facts about the event. If you claim you do know, then there is nothing to debate (argue) about. Dell

[Carl-NC]

Of course not by its own, but when use with transmitter adjusted in frequency, yes, can.

OK, so let's see if I understand... if you use the DDL with a signal generator that is set to a proper frequency, it will detect gold, is that right?

Do you think it can detect a 10-ounce gold bar, laying on the ground right in front of you?

[michael]

OK, so let's see if I understand... if you use the DDL with a signal generator that is set to a proper frequency, it will detect gold, is that right? Do you think it can detect a 10-ounce gold bar, laying on the ground right in front of you?Yes, that's it. the 10 ounce will be more easy as we made test with 1- ounce gold plate (alloy; 750) at 15 feet depth in natural walls formed in ground. I easily could detect it from 40-60 feet distance. but with 2 L rods never got result.
If you can't believe it what can I do? you believe or not, what’s the benefit for me? make money? no, If you even want to settle 1000000 $ for me I can't receive it. Here situation is thoroughly different of your countries.
When I write these e.g. about DDL is just for the fact is so.

[Carl-NC]

Dell, have you used the DDL with a signal generator? (Maybe this is what the "X-Scan" is? I don't know.)

Would you agree... will the DDL, in combination with a signal generator, detect a 10-ounce gold bar laying on the ground, right in front of you?

[Dell Winders]

I don't know. I've never located a 10 ounce Gold bar with it. Dell

[Carl-NC]

Errr... let's try again...

Dell, have you used the DDL with a signal generator?

Would the DDL, in combination with a signal generator, have the ability to detect gold?

If so, would it likely detect a 10-ounce gold bar laying on the ground, right in front of you?

- Carl

[Dell Winders]

I thought this thread was placed here for the express purpose for "Dell's Complaints" not "Carl's already answered questions?" O.K. Now I'm complaining about Carl's repeated questioning. Dell

[Carl-NC]

If I'm not mistaken, this is the very first time we've ever discussed the DDL. So these questions have never been asked, by me.

Can you please answer them?

[Dell Winders]

Wake up Carl, Michael, just went out of his way to answer your questions. I provided you a link. Not even a thank you, or a retraction & apology for your derrogatory comment about, Dell, makes garbage products.

Are you going to honor my complaint about your harassing, or sit there and be a hypocrite? Dell

[Carl-NC]

I'm not asking Michael, I'm asking you. You are the manufacturer... will your DDL, combined with a signal generator, detect gold?

Why would you avoid answering such a simple question?

[Dell Winders]

Why would you declare Dell's products "garbage" without apology, and then want to know more about them? Are doubts being raised about your credibility?
Dell

[goldfvr]

I have read this entire thread...

Carl, can you just tell Dale your sorry, so we can move on to hear his answer to your question...

Dale, can you answer Carl's last question, If I say I'm sorry on Carls behalf...

JFC, You guys are worse than my kids

[goldfvr]

I meant "Dell", not "Dale"

[Dell Winders]

Dell, if you want to discuss your products, please start a new thread. - Carl

Goldfvr, I already informed Carl, I am not interested in discussing my products, but yet he persists.

They are what I use. My customers have not provided any complaints, and if my customers are satisfied with the product that is all that matters to me.

As far as the units Carl refers to as "garbage", the circuits were designed by an EE, the units were built by an EE, and I paid the EE $40 an hour and supplied him residence for nearly 4 years. Admittedly, for me to think that would matter, makes me the idiot. Dell

[goldfvr]

I hire contract software engineers routinely for a lot more than 40/hr, sometimes they produce garbage, but most of the time they produce product
that has proven value/worth and that can be consistently/repeatedly demonstrated to deliver a desired result. This is because to get that result I have to give them specifications and some idea of what the desired result should be.

So what did you tell your EE about the expected outcome of his/her effort ?
in otherwords how did he/she know when they were finished ?
Otherwise, it sounds like a pretty sweet deal with open ended contract, no expectations of results and free room... Where do I sign up ?

[Carl-NC]

Michael, I think the conclusion of this discussion, is that Dell will refuse to claim that the DDL has the ability to detect gold, even when you add a signal generator to it. I suspect that if you do a really good randomized blind test with the device, you will probably find that, indeed, it cannot detect gold, or do anything else that's useful.

But, like I said before, if you're happy with the product, and what it's doing for you, then use it, and don't worry too much about what I think about it.

- Carl

[michael]

Michael,... I suspect that if you do a really good randomized blind test with the device, you will probably find that, indeed, it cannot detect gold, or do anything else that's useful.At different times we made tests and got the same results. But important scale is not You can constantly find gold (in 5.5 Khz) by DDL + transmitter, as Dell himself had mentioned;
" you may not necessarily find extracted golds, you may find every concentrated natural gold particles."
This Dell honesty made us not to dare dig everywhere get signal. If you are interested to know; the latest thing we found by DDL was a medium-size tomb with some very old ceramics (plates, bowls, small jar,) but no metal. Next night we checked there by our PI MD, but not even a beep. Anyway it's a real locator and as I told you can detect every kind of fields.
At least is good for the guys want to know LRLing is a true concept or as your-alleged is a self-deception. We got it is true.
Of course I should add due to our situation and conditions, we have to do our serious searches only at nights. As an aside, using MFDs like as MDs for most terrains is impossible especially when is composed with night hunting, doubles limitations. That's the main reason we desire to prepare a detector like as mineoro (If be just the same is being advertised) that can scan hectares × hectares. Then we will be able to hunt some fantastic and incredible objects. At present waiting for Hung test results report.
But, like I said before, if you're happy with the product, and what it's doing for you, then use it, and don't worry too much about what I think about it.Why be worry???!!! Worry for what? does it endanger my business or work? It doesn't concern me & I never care or mind. I'm whether not its' producer or dealer.
I'm just an independent user, but as told before one strict user who not easily approves everything gets. We don’t sit at home and run our mind theories, rather go to hard fields and make some various tests and assessments. Carl, you should be worry for;
1-Depriving yourselves of an existing fact.
2- Doing unfair and prejudiced acts against one of your best compatriots, whereas he deserves to be adored.
Every thing I mentioned was only due to my conscience-sense nothing else. Of course I utterly agree with you about Lectrasearch, Electroscopes,… but not with Omnitrone. In Middle East unlike some MDs that are notorious omnitrone is a famous brand whereas the users don't even know producer name and most of times the people has not enough literacy , name it "Emetron" or " Emerton" and… by mistake.
Although I know here are some people have slandering habit . Past days slandered me as for mineoro personnel , maybe today as for Dell personnel and tomorrow…. You never know….;)

[robert]

:cool:
" Sony:....And morons are the strongest associates in any advertising business whatever...."

To rude...I would rather say "naives"....
Do not understand me wrong on this, like in the past...
Still, presented devices are scum products....since tested so many times by so many different peoples, and final reports are the same - non working at all!!!

regards
:cool:

[J_Player]

I only try to find amazing wealth hidden from view. I read geotech forum to see if I can find help. I have no complaint or apology for anybody. I only want to know how to find amazing wealth from treasure detector. Now I ask from manufacturer of DDL machine Dell Winders: can your DDL machine show me where to find amazing wealth or hidden treasures? (please answer yes/no). This is very important to me because of sick mother need money for buy food... we be starving if not for bean-field behind back yard. Very urgent find treasure now. Please help! Does DDL have the ability to detect gold?

[Dell Winders]

No! The DDL does not discriminate. Dell

[Lost in NC]

There is an obvious difference between the control box of a VR-800 and a Pro-GS that even an idiot can see.
An apology is in order. Dell



you are most likely correct dell only idiots can see the difference . hence, mostly idiots buy these machines without thinking of those famous woids ... Caveat Emptor.

[Dell Winders]

Another thread is needed called "Carl's nonsense & BS " For Carl, to post his made up facts extracted from his own imagination.

Is any one else here obsessed enough to want to own 20+ locators, and doesn't know how to use any of them? :p

Carl, I'll go as high as $40 to purchase the Raven from you, but I'm guessing your LRL obsession will not let you part with it unless you can make an even bigger profit on your $3 AM radio. Is Thomas, an EE, or tech and you thought you were going to reverse engineer his design? :p

Your history shows you will never allow the Raven, to work for you, but I think that with a couple of simple modifications I will be able to get the Raven, to work for me, and most any one else. Dell

[Kev]

Anyone who knowing sells, or promotes a pseudo electronic device, consisting of $40 worth of components and meagre R&D (evident by complexity or innovation) for $1600 is the lowest form of life.

Your unending character attacks Dell, on Carl’s integrity, unmistakably show that he has uncovered your game. I can assure you that Carl without question has the backing of any honest IEEE member, and in fact deserves a medal for all that he has been doing to expose this money making racket.

You Sir, by knowingly promoting this rubbish deserve only a prison cell, otherwise only pity for also having been duped.
Kev.

[hung]

Anyone who knowing sells, or promotes a pseudo electronic device, consisting of $40 worth of components and meagre R&D (evident by complexity or innovation) for $1600 is the lowest form of life.

Your unending character attacks Dell, on Carl’s integrity, unmistakably show that he has uncovered your game. I can assure you that Carl without question has the backing of any honest IEEE member, and in fact deserves a medal for all that he has been doing to expose this money making racket.

You Sir, by knowingly promoting this rubbish deserve only a prison cell, otherwise only pity for also having been duped.
Kev.

Your words above would be hylarious if not extremely worrying.
Man, now I believe in hypnosis.
You are the proof Carl/Randi really can hypnotize people to make them their disciples..
Thank god I'm imunne.

[Kev]

Your words above would be hylarious if not extremely worrying.
Man, now I believe in hypnosis.
You are the proof Carl/Randi really can hypnotize people to make them their disciples..
Thank god I'm imunne.

These are the thoughts of a dissipated mind.:(
Hung, can't you see that it draws into question everything you have ever said on this forum, its validity and its sanity.
Kev.

[hung]

Sorry Kev, I don't see it like that.
Dell is a respected researcher with years of experience on his back. I really feel it's a shame anyone can even suggest something nasty about him much less what you stated in your post above.
Although he builds and manufactures his LRLs, he was honest enough to come public and recognize the Mineoro detector worked. If he was dishonest, he could state the opposite due to competition.

Again, I urge people here and everywhere, not taking a single person's words for granted. There might be many working LRLs and concepts which really deserve experimenting. Otherwise it's better to erase Remote Sensing from this forum for good.
What purpose there is, if people just show up to discredit them?
Kev. I'm proud of my detector and I bet Dell is also regarding his own.
Unless you try both and make your own conclusions, don't get lost in conjectures as they will take you nowhere.

[Kev]

I've got nothing against people using LRL, and from Carl's comments nor does he. It would be fantastic if there was merit in these philosophies, but what makes me bloody wild is the rip offs, the exorbitant prices these outfits are charging for a few bits and pieces.

Sure the Mineoro units have a pretty box with some knobs on and a uC that makes it go beep in close proximity to metallic objects, but it's still not worth the price, you don't get the bang for buck you pay for. It has obviously not cost millions of $ in development, the complexity shows that, so there is no valid reason on earth to charge such inflated prices other than to fleece people of their money.

What is worse is the inflated claims of what these devices are meant to do, this is deception, once again tailored to relieve the gullible of their cash.

I've got nothing against people making and using home brew LRL, or buying realistically priced ones for that matter. I truly hope you find your pot of gold. But if you then start selling your contraption at over 1000% mark up, making claims that cannot be substantiated by logical reason, then you're nothing more than a con artist. :mad:


The truth sometimes hurts.
Kev.

[Jim]

Anyone who knowing sells, or promotes a pseudo electronic device, consisting of $40 worth of components and meagre R&D (evident by complexity or innovation) for $1600 is the lowest form of life.

Your unending character attacks Dell, on Carl’s integrity, unmistakably show that he has uncovered your game. I can assure you that Carl without question has the backing of any honest IEEE member, and in fact deserves a medal for all that he has been doing to expose this money making racket.

You Sir, by knowingly promoting this rubbish deserve only a prison cell, otherwise only pity for also having been duped.
Kev.

Well said...well said :)

[hung]

I've got nothing against people using LRL, and from Carl's comments nor does he. It would be fantastic if there was merit in these philosophies, but what makes me bloody wild is the rip offs, the exorbitant prices these outfits are charging for a few bits and pieces.

Sure the Mineoro units have a pretty box with some knobs on and a uC that makes it go beep in close proximity to metallic objects, but it's still not worth the price, you don't get the bang for buck you pay for. It has obviously not cost millions of $ in development, the complexity shows that, so there is no valid reason on earth to charge such inflated prices other than to fleece people of their money.

What is worse is the inflated claims of what these devices are meant to do, this is deception, once again tailored to relieve the gullible of their cash.

I've got nothing against people making and using home brew LRL, or buying realistically priced ones for that matter. I truly hope you find your pot of gold. But if you then start selling your contraption at over 1000% mark up, making claims that cannot be substantiated by logical reason, then you're nothing more than a con artist. :mad:


The truth sometimes hurts.
Kev.

What about 50 years of researching the phenomena which allowed them to build a device which it is today? Isn't it worth something?

Pal, take it from a popular short story among us audio engineers. A Sony technician was called to repair a 3348 digital recorder once. When he was finished he said the culprit was just a tiny resistor that had burned. When asked how much he would charge he said 1,000 dollars. The facility owner almost collapsed. What kind of resistor could possibly cost him 1,000 dollars?
The repairman said: "Actually the resistor is 50 cents. I'm charging $999.50 for discovering which one was it."

[Kev]

What about 50 years of researching the phenomena which allowed them to build a device which it is today? Isn't it worth something?

It will be enlightening to see what 50 years of researching has produced once the reverse engineering has been completed.


Pal, take it from a popular short story among us audio engineers. A Sony technician was called to repair a 3348 digital recorder once. When he was finished he said the culprit was just a tiny resistor that had burned. When asked how much he would charge he said 1,000 dollars. The facility owner almost collapsed. What kind of resistor could possibly cost him 1,000 dollars?
The repairman said: "Actually the resistor is 50 cents. I'm charging $999.50 for discovering which one was it."

Are Sony aware of this?
Where their ECOs or service manuals consulted?
Seems to me it's just another example of unscrupulous people taking advantage of others for monetary gain.:mad:

[Qiaozhi]

What about 50 years of researching the phenomena which allowed them to build a device which it is today? Isn't it worth something?

Pal, take it from a popular short story among us audio engineers. A Sony technician was called to repair a 3348 digital recorder once. When he was finished he said the culprit was just a tiny resistor that had burned. When asked how much he would charge he said 1,000 dollars. The facility owner almost collapsed. What kind of resistor could possibly cost him 1,000 dollars?
The repairman said: "Actually the resistor is 50 cents. I'm charging $999.50 for discovering which one was it."
Actually, this is one of those modern myths, like the one about the woman who tried to dry her dog in the microwave.

The usual version is this one:
The manager of a manufacturing plant who, unable to solve a mechanical breakdown, sent for the retired engineer who had installed the machinery. Following a brief inspection, the engineer took a hammer and hit a pipe which did the trick. The next day the engineer submitted a bill for $1,000 to a horrified manager. Above the protests at the charge for a solitary hammer-blow the retired engineer explained, "only $1.00 of it is for hitting the pipe. The other $999 is for knowing where to hit it." :D

As far as LRLs are concerned - well that's another modern myth. But in this case the charge should only be $1.00, as the "knowing" part is nonexistent.

[hung]

It will be enlightening to see what 50 years of researching has produced once the reverse engineering has been completed.


Kev, looose your hope. It can be reverse engineered. There's essential information missing which makes it impossible to work. Anyone who states the opposite will be lying as he simply don't know about it.

Bt the time of the ionic electrostatic phenomenon discovery, Damasio meet NASA scientists and they agreed it was a new phenomenon which derserved further investigation. He is writing a book about it.

[hung]

It can be reverse engineered.

Sorry, it should read 'it can't be'

[Qiaozhi]

Sorry, it should read 'it can't be'
Did you know that you can edit a previous message several minutes after it was posted? Just click on the "Edit" button below the post. :)
I note that only one minute had elapsed between your original and corrected versions.

[Jim]

Bt the time of the ionic electrostatic phenomenon discovery, Damasio meet NASA scientists and they agreed it was a new phenomenon which derserved further investigation. He is writing a book about it.

LoL...about tossed my cookies reading this song/dance routine.

I assume that by the mere mention of "NASA scientists" we (the casual observer) should be impressed. Nope.

Damasio should take Carl Moreland’s 25K challenge and prove his scam/fraud device REALLY works. ;)

[hung]

Did you know that you can edit a previous message several minutes after it was posted? Just click on the "Edit" button below the post. :)
I note that only one minute had elapsed between your original and corrected versions.

Thanks for the info. I did not know that.

[Qiaozhi]

LoL...about tossed my cookies reading this song/dance routine.

I assume that by the mere mention of "NASA scientists" we (the casual observer) should be impressed. Nope.

Damasio should take Carl Moreland’s 25K challenge and prove his scam/fraud device REALLY works. ;)
You shouldn't be eating while reading this forum. ;)
You're liable to do yourself an injury. :D :D

[Kev]

What about 50 years of researching the phenomena which allowed them to build a device which it is today? Isn't it worth something?

Pal, take it from a popular short story among us audio engineers. A Sony technician was called to repair a 3348 digital recorder once. When he was finished he said the culprit was just a tiny resistor that had burned. When asked how much he would charge he said 1,000 dollars. The facility owner almost collapsed. What kind of resistor could possibly cost him 1,000 dollars?
The repairman said: "Actually the resistor is 50 cents. I'm charging $999.50 for discovering which one was it."

Actually, this is one of those modern myths, like the one about the woman who tried to dry her dog in the microwave.

The usual version is this one:
The manager of a manufacturing plant who, unable to solve a mechanical breakdown, sent for the retired engineer who had installed the machinery. Following a brief inspection, the engineer took a hammer and hit a pipe which did the trick. The next day the engineer submitted a bill for $1,000 to a horrified manager. Above the protests at the charge for a solitary hammer-blow the retired engineer explained, "only $1.00 of it is for hitting the pipe. The other $999 is for knowing where to hit it." :D

As far as LRLs are concerned - well that's another modern myth. But in this case the charge should only be $1.00, as the "knowing" part is nonexistent.

Thanks Qiaozhi, I've not heard that one before. With the extra embellishment Hung provided, it all seemed plausible to me.
Goes to show, some just can't help themselves from blending the truth with fiction. All their expressions become totally unreliable.

Kev.

[UWLocator]

Actually, this is one of those modern myths, like the one about the woman who tried to dry her dog in the microwave.

The usual version is this one:
The manager of a manufacturing plant who, unable to solve a mechanical breakdown, sent for the retired engineer who had installed the machinery. Following a brief inspection, the engineer took a hammer and hit a pipe which did the trick. The next day the engineer submitted a bill for $1,000 to a horrified manager. Above the protests at the charge for a solitary hammer-blow the retired engineer explained, "only $1.00 of it is for hitting the pipe. The other $999 is for knowing where to hit it." :D

As far as LRLs are concerned - well that's another modern myth. But in this case the charge should only be $1.00, as the "knowing" part is nonexistent.
The first time I heard that story it was a 5 cent fuse and a $50.05 total charge. Guess I am getting old!

[Seeker]

The first time I heard that story it was a 5 cent fuse and a $50.05 total charge. Guess I am getting old!

When I heard that story in my place of Earth, then spoke for $0,10 nut and $100 work. The amount of charge not matter. More important is for what guys spend money. If the machine work good - OK , no problem! But if they buy the scam - this is indicative of stupidity . In last ages people can buy capricorn's horn for good health . Now we know that capricorn exist :) , the more so his horn :D
In every one culture or civilization live people, who grow rich by fraud.

[Dell Winders]

One skeptic defined an Ideomoter response for me. He said you can't see the Ideomoter response, you can't feel it, you can't hear it, you can't taste it. Yet, without ever meeting you, or seeing what you are doing, the skeptic cult has this uncanny ability to tell you exactly what you are doing, and how you are doing it. It's almost like they are practicing voodo, but more like harassment.

Since it hasn't been measured, The Ideomotor response appears to be sort of a "Faith" based Scientific theory, but I think there is enough anectdotal evidence to support the probability.

I "Believe" it exists and that I exercise a "Trained" Ideomotor response in my own Dowsing. The theory of an Ideomotor Dowsing response works well for me. It's pretty neat when you learn to understand how it works, and able to use it to your advantage. I have no complaint about my Ideomotor response, and I reccommend it. Everyone should have the priveledge of owning one. Dell

[Jim]

One skeptic defined an Ideomoter response for me. He said you can't see the Ideomoter response, you can't feel it, you can't hear it, you can't taste it. Yet, without ever meeting you, or seeing what you are doing, the skeptic cult has this uncanny ability to tell you exactly what you are doing, and how you are doing it. It's almost like they are practicing voodo, but more like harassment.

Since it hasn't been measured, The Ideomotor response appears to be sort of a "Faith" based Scientific theory, but I think there is enough anectdotal evidence to support the probability.

I "Believe" it exists and that I exercise a "Trained" Ideomotor response in my own Dowsing. The theory of an Ideomotor Dowsing response works well for me. It's pretty neat when you learn to understand how it works, and able to use it to your advantage. I have no complaint about my Ideomotor response, and I reccommend it. Everyone should have the priveledge of owning one. Dell

Shouldn't this post be in the Dell Winders Crybaby thread?

[Qiaozhi]

One skeptic defined an Ideomoter response for me.

"ideomotor response"

Ahh!
Dell uses an ideomoter response, which must be somewhat different. :rolleyes:
So that explains it!

[Qiaozhi]

Scientific tests by American psychologist William James, French chemist Michel Chevreul (http://www.findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m2843/is_4_25/ai_76881170), English scientist Michael Faraday (Zusne and Jones 1989: 111), and American psychologist Ray Hyman (http://www.quackwatch.org/01QuackeryRelatedTopics/ideomotor.html) have demonstrated that many phenomena attributed to spiritual or paranormal forces, or to mysterious "energies (http://skepdic.com/energy.html)," are actually due to ideomotor action. Furthermore, these tests demonstrate that "honest, intelligent people can unconsciously engage in muscular activity that is consistent with their expectations" (Hyman 1999). They also show that suggestions that can guide behavior can be given by subtle clues (Hyman 1977).

So there you have it... :)

[Jim]

You are trying to present logic to someone who sells a novelty dowsing rod (bent wire) for $300 that totally depends on the Ideomotor Effect.

That’s right…$300 for a bent piece of wire.

[michael]

Scientific tests by American psychologist William James, French chemist Michel Chevreul (http://www.findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m2843/is_4_25/ai_76881170), English scientist Michael Faraday (Zusne and Jones 1989: 111), and American psychologist Ray Hyman (http://www.quackwatch.org/01QuackeryRelatedTopics/ideomotor.html) have demonstrated that many phenomena attributed to spiritual or paranormal forces, or to mysterious "energies (http://skepdic.com/energy.html)," are actually due to ideomotor action....Now the discussion reached here , excuse me, the people who tell these things and get a scientific gesture really don't know anything about spiritual knowledge.
these closed minds have been raised from their absolute financial cogitations.
But in this world are things unacceptable for man thought & mind.
e.g. Who does believe that water molecules are intelligent?
surely at first you see this statement laugh and mock. please a little pause and ponder about.
you can see a japans professor (Dr.Emoto) research results about water reactions to every word in every language. water molecules
perceive words. see here you will get.
http://www.energetic-medicine.net/research/Conciousness%20of%20water.htm
And this is right about so many other things that physical or chemical sciences refute, so that can't analyze them. I before have pointed to 2 of them; jinn, UFO,...
Can you accept one day man be able to pass through a wall like air? NO?
Can you accept one day man won't need to any vehicle to go around world or even other planets? No? Why? cose physic can't accept?
These are all today impossible and even silly words, but I'm sure will occur, but not now. when man get high spiritual capacity not take advantage from the abilities (like what did with Nuke weapons) not to oppress, violate and impoverish his own-kind, will get these abilities. (all of these are foretells from one ancient book I own it and even most of nowadays advancements had been predicted in it) Admittedly all of these days advancements are indebted to physic, but physic is reaching to end way, is dying, maybe in future have some advancements, but not a significant transformation like previous and present century comparison. god founded Physic as an introduction for metaphysic, infraphysic and at last spiritual.... that man mind never can understand,..... then become SKEPTIC, the only thing can do,...

[Qiaozhi]

Now the discussion reached here , excuse me, the people who tell these things and get a scientific gesture really don't know anything about spiritual knowledge.
these closed minds have been raised from their absolute financial cogitations.
But in this world are things unacceptable for man thought & mind.
e.g. Who does believe that water molecules are intelligent?
surely at first you see this statement laugh and mock. please a little pause and ponder about.
you can see a japans professor (Dr.Emoto) research results about water reactions to every word in every language. water molecules
perceive words. see here you will get.
http://www.energetic-medicine.net/research/Conciousness%20of%20water.htm
And this is right about so many other things that physical or chemical sciences refute, so that can't analyze them. I before have pointed to 2 of them; jinn, UFO,...
Can you accept one day man be able to pass through a wall like air? NO?
Can you accept one day man won't need to any vehicle to go around world or even other planets? No? Why? cose physic can't accept?
These are all today impossible and even silly words, but I'm sure will occur, but not now. when man get high spiritual capacity not take advantage from the abilities (like what did with Nuke weapons) not to oppress, violate and impoverish his own-kind, will get these abilities. (all of these are foretells from one ancient book I own it and even most of nowadays advancements had been predicted in it) Admittedly all of these days advancements are indebted to physic, but physic is reaching to end way, is dying, maybe in future have some advancements, but not a significant transformation like previous and present century comparison. god founded Physic as an introduction for metaphysic, infraphysic and at last spiritual.... that man mind never can understand,..... then become SKEPTIC, the only thing can do,...
No comment ... :p

[ivconic]

:) :) :)
Ha,ha,ha....regards Dell!!!

I was trying to put some logic in all that fuzz...

But since you are much experienced in that stuff than me,please,why dont you explain here, step by step all the dowsing tips and hints...for us beginers?
How can you explain Hungs revelations with Examiner? It is stated and established before that Examiner is electronically speaking, junk. So it must be at least dowsing rod if nothing else?
I am interested for real,i am not jokin!
Come Dell and speak!
best regards
:) :) :)

[ivconic]

:) :) :)
Ha,ha,ha...
Why didnt you explain this before?
All this fuzz about nothing?
best regards Dell..
:) :) :)

[Dell Winders]

http://www.treasureamerica.com/photo/dellrod.jpg

You are trying to present logic to someone who sells a novelty dowsing rod (bent wire) for $300 that totally depends on the Ideomotor Effect.

That’s right…$300 for a bent piece of wire.

Jim, your exhibitions of childish ignorance are excusable.

The handle is made of Brass. The Rod is made of plastic. Some ideomotor response is required to wrap your hand and fingers around the handle and raise your arm to sweep in the direction of the "field" of an anomaly.

Unlike mental, ideomotor response Dowsing, the operator is unable to mentally discriminate to the anomalies of their choice with the Dell Directional Locator. It appears to operate according to physics of Earth Science.

All my customers have proclaimed the merits of this anomaly "Field" locating device and consider it the best available on the market. Now that a precedent has been set, I have no doubt that you, or any one of the forum viewers can duplicate, build and improve on it. The componnents are simple, inexpensive and the benefits are great.

When reception is good a novice operator can "Feel" the lock on to the "field" of an anomaly while "Blindfolded". According to the Skeptic cult, proclaimed experts, Dowsing cannot be accompolished without the use of vision. So, if this is a Dowsing Rod by Skeptic cult definitions, you have a contridiction.

"THE DOOR TO KNOWLEDGE & UNDERSTANDING IS NEVER OPEN TO A CLOSED, OR PREJUDICED MIND. Dell

[Dell Winders]

DOWSING: http://thunting.com/geotech/forums/showthread.php?t=11427

[Qiaozhi]

http://www.treasureamerica.com/photo/dellrod.jpg



Jim, your exhibitions of childish ignorance are excusable.

The handle is made of Brass. The Rod is made of plastic. Some ideomotor response is required to wrap your hand and fingers around the handle and raise your arm to sweep in the direction of the "field" of an anomaly.

Unlike mental, ideomotor response Dowsing, the operator is unable to mentally discriminate to the anomalies of their choice with the Dell Directional Locator. It appears to operate according to physics of Earth Science.

All my customers have proclaimed the merits of this anomaly "Field" locating device and consider it the best available on the market. Now that a precedent has been set, I have no doubt that you, or any one of the forum viewers can duplicate, build and improve on it. The componnents are simple, inexpensive and the benefits are great.

When reception is good a novice operator can "Feel" the lock on to the "field" of an anomaly while "Blindfolded". According to the Skeptic cult, proclaimed experts, Dowsing cannot be accompolished without the use of vision. So, if this is a Dowsing Rod by Skeptic cult definitions, you have a contridiction.

"THE DOOR TO KNOWLEDGE & UNDERSTANDING IS NEVER OPEN TO A CLOSED, OR PREJUDICED MIND. Dell
My goodness! :eek:
How innovative - a brass handle and a plastic rod. Whatever will they think of next? :rolleyes:
Oh well, if you can't make it work, then you could always use it as a paint roller. :D

[okantex]

gentleman
while talking about ideomotor.or ideot motor.whatever it is.
have you ever tried this L rods.
I still can not explain but I can find cavities.
do not you think,while you are holding a wire which has smooth surface.how could you turn it even with your desires or muscular movements.
which of you skeptic can explain ,how to turn round bar in side of hand .
sorry but human muscles are not like snake muscles.
and you do not have to contact to bar dirctly.use pencils between your hand and brass.
I agree we can not explain and even 1 dolar is to much for such a brass.but works when you pass over a cavity.
NOT FROM LONG DİSTANCE.JUST OVER İT.

[Qiaozhi]

gentleman
while talking about ideomotor.or ideot motor.whatever it is.
have you ever tried this L rods.
I still can not explain but I can find cavities.
do not you think,while you are holding a wire which has smooth surface.how could you turn it even with your desires or muscular movements.
which of you skeptic can explain ,how to turn round bar in side of hand .
sorry but human muscles are not like snake muscles.
and you do not have to contact to bar dirctly.use pencils between your hand and brass.
I agree we can not explain and even 1 dolar is to much for such a brass.but works when you pass over a cavity.
NOT FROM LONG DİSTANCE.JUST OVER İT.
There's plenty of explanation here -> http://skepdic.com/dowsing.html

On a slightly different tack - has anyone every tried using a ouija board?
If you have, then you'll probably agree that the first time you experience the glass moving across the board it scares the crap out of you! :eek:
But once you've done it a few times, had some nightmares in the process, and protested to everyone else that they're pushing the glass, it soon becomes clear that this has nothing to do with contacting dead relatives from beyond the grave. A few simple experiments, like swapping people around, can establish if anyone is moving the glass on purpose. One important point I discovered was that the ouija board can answer a question correctly only if someone at the table knows the correct reply. You can prove this by asking a question to which someone else in the room (but not sat the ouija board) knows the answer. After the board answers incorrectly, then get the missing person to join the group. Miraculously the board will answer correctly. You can carry on experimenting like this for a long time, but it's impossible to determine why the glass moves. It appears to be by magic, or by spiritual intervention.

What has this got to do with treasure hunting? Actually (like dowsing) absolutely nothing, except they they both demonstrate the power of the ideomotor effect. So in the same way that the people sat at the ouija board cannot understand why the glass moves, the dowser cannot understand why the rods move. It's the same underlying process.

The ideomotor response is very compelling, but at the end of the day it's an illusion, and a trick of the mind.

[Carl-NC]

It appears to operate according to physics of Earth Science.

A-yup. It's called "gravity."

[Dell Winders]

Gravity, can be some hinderance but technically is a comparatively weak force. You are grasping at straws of ignorance, Carl.

"THE DOOR TO KNOWLEDGE & UNDERSTANDING IS NEVER OPEN TO A CLOSED, OR PREJUDICED MIND.

[Dell Winders]

Qiaozhi, There's no need to go any further than the first paragraph of your reference to see the fallacy of the author's ridiculous imagination regarding Dowsing. Dowsing is neither "Divining" magical, occult, or paranormal. It's an inherhent ability in each of us that with learning, study and practice can be developed into a beneficial talent.

Be safe in displaying your ignorance about Dowsing, and stick with the explanation that Dowsing is the minds ability to manifest itself and convey it's information physically thru the use of a trained mind/muscle "Ideomoter response.

An eighteenth century Lutheran Biship wrote; "For those of you who are Dowsing in the streets and finding hairpins and bits of metal, you are fools.

For those who are Dowsing and finding great wealth, it is the work of the devil."

This hypocricisy and deception is carried on today by the Skeptic cult, by you and Carl, on this forum.

DECEPTIVE GARBAGE:Since dowsing is not based upon any known scientific or empirical laws or forces of nature, it should be considered a type of divination (http://skepdic.com/divinati.html) and an example of magical thinking (http://skepdic.com/magicalthinking.html). The dowser tries to locate objects by occult means.

"THE DOOR TO KNOWLEDGE & UNDERSTANDING IS NEVER OPEN TO A CLOSED, OR PREJUDICED MIND" Dell

[Qiaozhi]

"THE DOOR TO KNOWLEDGE & UNDERSTANDING IS NEVER OPEN TO A CLOSED, OR PREJUDICED MIND" Dell
It appears to me that you need to meditate on your own quotation, as your mind is clearly closed to any criticism, and shows a complete lack of knowledge or understanding of the real phyiscal world. Of course, some may say that you have a vested interest in propagating this mystical nonsense.

However, you have made good one point on which I do agree.

Dowsing is neither "Divining" magical, occult, or paranormal.
Quite correct - it's "phsychological".

[Jim]

It appears to me that you need to meditate on your own quotation, as your mind is clearly closed to any criticism, and shows a complete lack of knowledge or understanding of the real phyiscal world. Of course, some may say that you have a vested interest in propagating this mystical nonsense.

Well said.

[Qiaozhi]

Well said.
Unfortunately I wrote "phsychological", instead of "psychological". :o
Another trick of the mind. :)

I cdnuolt blveiee taht I cluod aulaclty uesdnatnrd waht I was rdgnieg. The phaonmneal pweor of the hmuan mnid aoccdrnig to rscheearch at Cmabrigde Uinervtisy, it deosn't mttaer in waht oredr the ltteers in a wrod are, the olny iprmoatnt tihng is taht the frist and lsat ltteer be in the rghit pclae. The rset can be a taotl mses and you can sitll raed it wouthit a porbelm Tihs is bcuseae the huamn mnid deos not raed ervey lteter by istlef, but the wrod as a wlohe. :D :D

[Dell Winders]

The Skeptic Cult's brainwashed non-sense explanation of Ideomotor response Dowsing.

"Dowsing only "appears" to work when there is
enough information leakage to allow the dowser to observe nearby
elements and then deduce through intuition where a likely target
could be. Now you know the TRUTH about dowsing. In thousands of
years, and for everyone who has ever used a dowsing wand, it
does not really work unless there are enough clues to make a
correct choice. When the clues are missing, then you dig an
empty whole or your rods simply don't even move. Dowsing is a
trick of the mind and works according to the ideomotor response
within you, which MUST be triggered first with your own thoughts. "

What clues? This idiot doesn't even have a clue to even know what he is talking about.

"THE DOOR TO KNOWLEDGE AND UNDERSTANDING IS NEVER OPEN TO A CLOSED, OR PREJUDICED MIND." Dell

[Jim]

The Skeptic Cult's brainwashed non-sense explanation of Ideomotor response Dowsing.

You have been banned from using the term "Skeptic Cult" on a few different forums. TreasureNet and Thunting are two that I know about. They have deleted your posts and reprimanded you for doing so.

Obviously, you have not been prohibited from using your derogatory term here on Carl's forum. However, on the other hand, Carl will also allow Skeptic's to post how you build and sell your fraudulent dowsing contraptions.

I guess that is a fair tradeoff. Woo-woo

[Carl-NC]

No, Dell is NOT allowed to call people names here, either.

OK, Dell, final warning.

[Dell Winders]

Who here have I called a name, Carl? Nobody! Yet I am falsely accused of selling fraudulent products.

I understand your hypocrisy. Dell

[Qiaozhi]

Shouldn't this post be in the Dell Winders Crybaby thread?
I see your request was granted. :D

[Dell Winders]

I didn't design this test "against you". I designed it to test people's ability to objectively detect signal lines with L-rods. Not sure why you take this so personally.

Cut the pretend crap, Carl. It's a matter of public record that you and the Skeptic cult have been attacking my honesty credibility for more than 15 years with negative inferences and down right lies.

All your questions have been honestly answered at one time or another during that period, Yet, you intentionally ignore the facts in order to protect the Skeptic agenda and self promoting advertising gimmicks. Pretending to be a Scientist, or scientific, and being untruthful has been a habitual trait for as long as you have been attacking my honesty and credibility.

Let's hear how you would conduct tests that are of scientific quality. I am not a scientist, nor do I pretend to be. I speak from personal experience only.

No I have never used Carl's ABX design, and never suggested that I did. Common logic would question the accuracy of tests using the electronic X factor until it was determined whether or not the added electronic components of the auto switching device would affect the integrity of the signal. But that's only one factor to be considered.

Unfortunately, Carl's prejudice, bias, and selfish personal agenda has clouded his ability for rational thinking and the use of common sense. Encouragingly, I have seen seen some excellent critical thinking by some of you who have not been nearly as well informed for years about the subject as Carl has been.

I am taken back by the mentality that would compare the analogy of using an LRL to that of using a metal detector. That argument is just plain egotistical meaningless garbage. Totally unrealistic thinking.

Carl, in light of thousands of people, including myself successfully using Frequency Discrimination, LRL, and Dowsing, as an aid to treasure hunting for at least 30 years, and your disregard for fact, or truth, you don't have a Scientific leg to stand on. It does not require a scientific study and it should be obvious to the lowest intellect that, "What has already been done, can be done again under the same conditions. Get Real!

Your self righteous belief that I am "Wallet Mining" and scamming my customers, and your stated intention to prevent folks from buying from people like me, you seem to think the use of any means, including lying, and false inferences justifies the end result. That is self delusional, and a dis-service to Science and the people that support you.

As I have said, If you would have devoted 1/3 of your time and electronic knowledge to developing a method to locate and discriminate deep buried treasures, that you have put into publicly attacking my honesty, and aiding Randi, in his efforts to cover up his own lies by attempting to destroy my credibility and put me out of business, you would have done a great service for Treasure hunters, including me.

I have never scammed any one in my life and your spread of malicious libel is totally wrong and you owe some big public apologies for the hurtful lies and damage you have perpetrated over the years. Dell

[Dell Winders]

The closed minded "one size fits all " mentality isn't going to work when testing LRL. You continue to doom yourself to failure. Dell

[Carl-NC]

The closed minded "one size fits all " mentality isn't going to work when testing LRL. You continue to doom yourself to failure. Dell

Once again, LRLs don't work, and it's all my fault! :lol:

[Dell Winders]

It has worked for me and thousands of others over the past 30 years, so if you are incapable of learning to use them, it can only be your fault. Of course, if you are born mentally handicapped, you can't be held responsible? Dell

HILLBILLY LOGIC: "What has already been done for 30 years, can be repeated under the same conditions. Right? But, it's obvious after years of lieing to the public about me, you aren't going to let facts, or truth interfere with your crusade. Dell

[Clondike Clad]

Dell what is the speaker coil for??????
is it a 8 ohm inductor or is it part of a transformer

[Dell Winders]

If you are referring to the photo Carl, posted, I have no idea? If you say it is a speaker coil, you know more about it than I do. Dell

[Clondike Clad]

If you are referring to the photo Carl, posted, I have no idea? If you say it is a speaker coil, you know more about it than I do. Dell
Someone is lying:nono:
Oh well all I wanted to know is how and what type of circuit it is.
Dell did Carl make this up or what?
If you build LRL you must know what a speaker coil looks like???
What is really going on.

[Dell Winders]

I am not lying. Are You? :nono:

[Clondike Clad]

I am not lying. Are You? :nono:
lying about what.
ALL I ASK WAS ABOUT THE SPEAKER COIL ANS SAID SOMEONE IS LYING.
NOW THE QUESTION TELL ME WHAT I AM LYING ABOUT????????????????
BETTER YET YOU DON'T NEED TOO.
DID YOU PUT THE SPEAKER COIL IN YOUR DETECTOR OR DID CARL DO IT.
ALL I WANT TO DO IS TO FIND OUT WHO IS LYING OR SCAMMING.
ANYONE OTHER THAN CARL LOOKED INSIDE YOUR DETECTOR.
ANYONE WHO HAS A DELL UNIT PLEASE CHECK YOUR DETECTOR.
CARL OR DELL SOMEONE IS LYING:nono:
WHY WOULD CARL LIE.
WHY WOULD DELL LIE
WHY WOULD CLONDIKE LIE BT ASKING ABOUT A SPEAKER COIL?

[Carl-NC]

I only reported what I found when I dissected a "Dell Systems GS Pro" LRL. I didn't design or build the device, so I cannot explain why it is there. If Dell wants to pretend that I didn't find what I found, then I will accept his evasive responses to be representative of his integrity, and move on.

- Carl

[Clondike Clad]

Who here have I called a name, Carl? Nobody! Yet I am falsely accused of selling fraudulent products.

I understand your hypocrisy. Dell


The Skeptic Cult's brainwashed non-sense explanation of Ideomotor response Dowsing
This look like name calling to me.:nono:
Calling someone a cult is not good and I am glad Carl ban on it.:)
No on to LRL talk.
How are signals lines picked up under water ????

[Dell Winders]

I don't know. I never tried to detect a signal line under water. Dell